Why dont players improve over the offseason?

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  • tehova
    b**-r*y
    • Mar 2003
    • 3694

    #1

    Why dont players improve over the offseason?

    Anybody notice how scouting reports stay consistent from year to year? Can't create his on shot, can't shoot of the dribble, needs to add strength, not a good ballhandler, no midrange game etc...

    I remember "the media" telling me Jordan would add something to his game every summer, and i've heard that Kobe does the same thing. Are only the elite players concerned with adding nuances to their games? Do lesser players work on their games but like the confidence to pull it off during actual games and muscle memory takes over?
    Ericmaynor3.com
  • Bornindamecca
    Books Nelson Simnation
    • Jul 2007
    • 10919

    #2
    Re: Why dont players improve over the offseason?

    It's from player to player. Guys improve. David Lee is a great example. He came in with zero game aside from hustle and athleticism. First he raised his free throws from the 50s to the 70+ percent range. Then he added a spin move on his drives. Then he added better cuts off of the pick and roll as well as a 15 footer which is still improving.

    There are a bunch of guys around the league that do these things, they just don't get a lot of noise about it until they become near All Stars.
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    • Cebby
      Banned
      • Apr 2005
      • 22327

      #3
      Re: Why dont players improve over the offseason?

      Originally posted by tehova
      Are only the elite players concerned with adding nuances to their games?
      I don't think it's that, but given the nature of their responsibilities, I think upper level guards and small forwards benefit far more by expanding their games than do other positions. Since a Jordan, Kobe, or Lebron is supposed to score from any place on the floor, the mid and long range jump shots, ball handling, driving, finishing, and so on will all be on display far more than other people on the floor.

      On the other hand, do you really ever see a coach drawing up a play that ends with a mid range jumper for Dwight or Bynum? Letting a bad ball handler run with it now that he's achieved mediocrity? Want Steve Nash finishing at the rim?

      I think for most of these guys, it's better for them to focus on what they do well rather than trying to necessarily improve part of their game that they might not even get to show. With some like creating your own shot, I think there's an element of God given talent required that people with that label lack regardless of how much they work on it. I'd think with the big men moving out, there has to be some fear of players falling in love with a shot instead of getting to the basket, as seen sometimes with Dirk.

      Last, sometimes you just can't improve. I doubt Shaq and Howard just don't practice free throws. Even Jordan was a terrible 3 point shooter who managed to take his long range shooting from Tim Duncan level to almost Chris Webber level.

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      • sportyguyfl31
        MVP
        • Nov 2005
        • 4745

        #4
        Re: Why dont players improve over the offseason?

        You also get to a point where guys "are what they are".

        Once a guy has been in the league 4 or 5 years, you pretty much know what you are going to get out of him, each and every single year, barring injury.

        Guys do work though., and some guys completely transform their game.

        I went to College with Donyell Marshall, and if you told me back then, that he would have a 12 year career as a spot up, corner 3 point shooter, I would have thought you were drunk.

        A lot of players figure out they will never be stars, come to a realization of what their role is going to be and bust their tail trying to be the best they can at it, because they know its the only way they are going to stay in the league.

        IT's the guys who arent willing to make that sacrifice, who wash out
        Last edited by sportyguyfl31; 05-28-2009, 08:20 PM.

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        • ProjectRipCity
          Banned
          • Aug 2008
          • 2395

          #5
          Re: Why dont players improve over the offseason?

          Originally posted by sportyguyfl31
          You also get to a point where guys "are what they are".

          Once a guy has been in the league 4 or 5 years, you pretty much know what you are going to get out of him, each and every single year, barring injury.

          Guys do work though., and some guys completely transform their game.

          I went to College with Donyell Marshall, and if you told me back then, that he would have a 12 year career as a spot up, corner 3 point shooter, I would have thought you were drunk.

          A lot of players figure out they will never be stars, come to a realization of what their role is going to be and bust their tail trying to be the best they can at it, because they know its the only way they are going to stay in the league.

          IT's the guys who arent willing to make that sacrifice, who wash out
          Couldnt of said it better.

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          • dopeboy206
            Banned
            • Oct 2007
            • 1471

            #6
            Re: Why dont players improve over the offseason?

            Good example of players who don't workout in their offseason

            Vin Baker
            Shawn Kemp
            Eddie Curry

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            • ProjectRipCity
              Banned
              • Aug 2008
              • 2395

              #7
              Re: Why dont players improve over the offseason?

              Originally posted by dopeboy206
              Good example of players who don't workout in their offseason

              Vin Baker
              Shawn Kemp
              Eddie Curry
              All fat...COUGH COUGH fat

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              • dopeboy206
                Banned
                • Oct 2007
                • 1471

                #8
                Re: Why dont players improve over the offseason?

                Originally posted by ProjectRipCity
                All fat...COUGH COUGH fat

                Besides Curry. Kemp and baker weren't fat before.

                Btw I seen Kemp a few months back playing in the 3BA. A 3 on 3 BBall league on Fox Sports Northwest. He trimmed a lot of pounds and looked really in shape. You guys got Fox Sports Northwest too out there don't you?

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                • MaddenMan
                  Tebow is Chuck Norris
                  • Jul 2002
                  • 5632

                  #9
                  Re: Why dont players improve over the offseason?

                  It's a job.

                  If someone wants more money they work on improving, if they are fine where they are at they don't try - it's a very simple equation.

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                  • str8stuntin03
                    Rookie
                    • Feb 2003
                    • 446

                    #10
                    Re: Why dont players improve over the offseason?

                    You just have to be great at one thing and you can stick in the league. Everyone can't be a jack of all trades
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                    • tehova
                      b**-r*y
                      • Mar 2003
                      • 3694

                      #11
                      Re: Why dont players improve over the offseason?

                      I think twitter might expose people more than they think about, normally we had no idea what they did all summer but if we see "just got back from vegas had a ball" and not enough "heading back to the gym for my afternoon workout". We will know why they are stuck at that level.


                      Rudy Gay improved his ballhandling over the summer, but he would only feel confident enough to pull off some moves if everything else was already working for him. Jumper was on, got some transition buckets, and then he would hit a nice move to get to the basket. And even then you can tell that he was using the exact sequence he practiced, it wasnt just natural (but sometimes effective)
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                      • ehh
                        Hall Of Fame
                        • Mar 2003
                        • 28962

                        #12
                        Re: Why dont players improve over the offseason?

                        Originally posted by sportyguyfl31

                        I went to College with Donyell Marshall, and if you told me back then, that he would have a 12 year career as a spot up, corner 3 point shooter, I would have thought you were drunk.
                        Man, most dudes on this board don't have the first clue as to how nice Donyell was in college. Dude was absurd back in the day, until he ultimately became a lazy POS and the reason the rookie scale came into affect

                        Originally posted by dopeboy206
                        Good example of players who don't workout in their offseason

                        Vin Baker
                        Vinny Baker has some dreaded alcoholic issues, bout as bad as you can imagine. Damn shame too.
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                        • HMcCoy
                          All Star
                          • Jan 2003
                          • 8212

                          #13
                          Re: Why dont players improve over the offseason?

                          Who will LeBron hire to help him beef up that post up game?
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                          • yvesdereuter
                            Banned
                            • Jun 2007
                            • 1688

                            #14
                            Re: Why dont players improve over the offseason?

                            Did Shaq really ever improve his game? For him scoring was fouling his way to within a foot of the basket where he could dunk it. Plus his FTs have always been bad. One of his most polished areas was his passing. But still, FT shooting is a big area where some guys are exposed for their lack of offseason work.

                            I also think that this observation, to some extent, is a reflection of a period that the league went through (and is still going through) of drafting rawer players. At some point guys with raw talent were valued guys who were more refined. In that regard it goes as far back as what is going on in HS. This is one way where the Jordan era was bad for basketball. So much of his game is overlooked in favor of various snap shots of dunks.

                            Has anyone also noticed that guys dont seem to use the glass as well when shooting...or is that just me?

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                            • KG
                              Welcome Back
                              • Sep 2005
                              • 17583

                              #15
                              Re: Why dont players improve over the offseason?

                              Originally posted by ehh
                              Man, most dudes on this board don't have the first clue as to how nice Donyell was in college. Dude was absurd back in the day, until he ultimately became a lazy POS and the reason the rookie scale came into affect
                              Donyell was nasty @ UCONN. Much better than Donny, LOL.

                              Guys add little wrinkles to their game but you're not gonna see a drastic improvement after 4-5 years in the league besides a jumper. When you start to lose your athleticism you develop a jumper. Look at Mike Miller. He was considered pretty athletic coming out of FL and now he's a knock down shooter.
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