What the heck are the Mavs thinking?

[hipster.doofus7]

When the 2008-9 season ended, it was clear the Mavericks had a number of gaping holes on the roster. They needed a solid pivot man, so their season won't have to depend on the erratic and foul-prone performance of Eric Dampier. And they also needed a shooting guard who can create his own shots. That was a role previously held by Jerry Stackhouse, and Michael Finley before him.

What the Mavs didn't need was another forward. Both forward positions are already occupied by the Mavericks' two best players.

So what did the Mavs do to improve their team this offseason? Well, they spent a ton of money adding more natural forwards. I guess in Mavsland can never have too many of 'em:

• Dirk Nowitzki
• Shawn Marion
• Drew Gooden
• Tim Thomas
• Josh Howard

This roster is going to be a disaster this season, and a lot of these guys will be playing out of position. The roster looks sexy on paper, if only because of all the big recognizable names on it. But most of these guys play the same game --- offensive minded tweeners who aren't much good with their backs to the basket. None of them can be considered defensive enforcers.

Haven't we seen this before? This roster is reminiscent of that ill-fated experiment in Dallas six years ago: Antoine Walker, Antawn Jamison, Dirk Nowitzki, Eduardo Najera, and Josh Howard crowding the forward positions. It didn't work then, and it's not gonna work now.

[AlexBrady]

Re: What the heck are the Mavs thinking?

First of all, Jason Kidd was the Mavericks 2nd best player last season. Josh Howard is still a choke artist who keeps finding ways to make crucial errors at innoportune times. Jason Terry is likewise short armed in the clutch, defenseless, shot happy, and no where to be found when the going gets tough. Kidd sees the court beautifully, always throws precise passes, gives his all on the defensive end, and can generally do much in the clutch.

With that out of the way, the Mavericks are 'lead' by a guy who is heartless. When opposing teams are running away with the game a teams best player is supposed to dent the opposing team's run. Dirk will rush shots, be late on closeouts, fail to see wide open players, and hang his head when the going gets tough. In other words, Dirk will turn sure wins into losses with his ineptitude in the end game. That is the biggest reason why the Mavericks will never win anything of true value.

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: What the heck are the Mavs thinking?

Cue the here. we. go. gif

[ZB9]

Re: What the heck are the Mavs thinking?

With that out of the way, the Mavericks are 'lead' by a guy who is heartless. When opposing teams are running away with the game a teams best player is supposed to dent the opposing team's run. Dirk will rush shots, be late on closeouts, fail to see wide open players, and hang his head when the going gets tough. In other words, Dirk will turn sure wins into losses with his ineptitude in the end game. That is the biggest reason why the Mavericks will never win anything of true value.

you couldnt be more wrong Alex. You sound clueless to those that actually have followed the Mavs during the Dirk era. You are right about Howard usually disappearing in the 4th. It is uncanny. However, Dirk and Terry have been the opposite. Overall, Nowitzki and JET have been a couple of the best closers in basketball over the last number of years.

The Dirk and Terry pick and roll has been money at the end of games for years. That is usually the Mavs bread and butter in the 4th. Teams usually know it's coming, but they usually cant stop it anyway. Dirk and/or Terry have been at the top of 4th quarter scoring most years and the Mavs are among the league leaders in close victories most seasons. Last season for example, Dallas was 20-4 in games decided by 5 points or less (I know you dont like facts though because they probably get in the way of your agenda)

The team battled through injuries all of last season, but Dirk picked up the slack. Nowitzki's play was incredible down the home stretch to get Dallas to a 6th seed. He scored at least 20 pts in 28 straight games down the stretch. That was the longest such streak in the league last season and he did it to CLOSE OUT the season. Many of the front runner players in the league would have folded up their tent, but that isnt Dirk.

I asked you earlier to provide a list of players that have been more "clutch" than Nowitzki, but of course you wouldnt. If you do provide such a list, there shouldnt be more than a small handful of players ahead of him on your list. I recommend 82.games.com if you want some facts to help you make your list, but I dont think you really care about backing up any of your drivel with actual facts. Those pesky facts can get in the way of your BS.

I had season tickets in the 90s when the Mavs were the worst franchise in sports and would struggle to win 25 games in a season. Since Dirk and Cuban arrived, the Mavs have averaged 56 wins a season and had the most postseason success in franchise history. They have won at least 50 games in 9 straight seasons and the one constant on the court has been Nowitzki. Before he arrived, it was one of the worst pro franchises in all of pro sports, but he has helped put the Mavericks on the map.

[ZB9]

Re: What the heck are the Mavs thinking?

When the 2008-9 season ended, it was clear the Mavericks had a number of gaping holes on the roster. They needed a solid pivot man, so their season won't have to depend on the erratic and foul-prone performance of Eric Dampier. And they also needed a shooting guard who can create his own shots. That was a role previously held by Jerry Stackhouse, and Michael Finley before him.

What the Mavs didn't need was another forward. Both forward positions are already occupied by the Mavericks' two best players.

So what did the Mavs do to improve their team this offseason? Well, they spent a ton of money adding more natural forwards. I guess in Mavsland can never have too many of 'em:

• Dirk Nowitzki
• Shawn Marion
• Drew Gooden
• Tim Thomas
• Josh Howard

This roster is going to be a disaster this season, and a lot of these guys will be playing out of position. The roster looks sexy on paper, if only because of all the big recognizable names on it. But most of these guys play the same game --- offensive minded tweeners who aren't much good with their backs to the basket. None of them can be considered defensive enforcers.

Haven't we seen this before? This roster is reminiscent of that ill-fated experiment in Dallas six years ago: Antoine Walker, Antawn Jamison, Dirk Nowitzki, Eduardo Najera, and Josh Howard crowding the forward positions. It didn't work then, and it's not gonna work now.

they are stacked everwhere except for center, but I agree with you that they arent going to be a contender until they upgrade in that area. There is a hole at that spot obviously, but I dont think they are done yet trying to upgrade. In September, Buckner's contract will become eligible to be packaged in a trade for another piece, probably a center from a team looking to clear cap space.

but even if they do bring in a center, I imagine the Mavs are going to be playing a lot of small ball this season regardless. I agree that there are going to be two or three power forwards together on the court much of the time. I dont know if I would compare it to 6 years ago though, because 1. The Mavs perimeter defense should be much better, keeping teams out of the lane...2. Dirk/Dampier/Gooden/Hollins/Humphries is better and gives them more options at center than Dirk/Antoine Walker/Najera....and most of all because there arent many teams with great true center rotations right now, especially in the west. When Dallas does go up against traditional centers, it will be Dampier, Dirk, and probably a player to be named later.

Dallas needs to add one more piece to become contenders, but it will be interesting to see what they can do with their small ball. At least their small ball will be bigger and longer than it was last season

[AtlantaFalconFan]

Re: What the heck are the Mavs thinking?

i think mavs should trade terry but there decisions arent that bad they lost out on gortat....gooden is a good back up for this for a 1 year deal u act like tim thomas is a make or break for the team.

they had to have kidd back and hes still a serviceable player who is good.

[ZB9]

Re: What the heck are the Mavs thinking?

.gooden is a good back up for this for a 1 year deal u act like tim thomas is a make or break for the team.

Gooden is the 8th best player on the roster, but he will be an upgrade over Bass imo, especially against players like Nene. Im not saying he will be able to cause problems for Nene, just deal with him moreso than 6'7 Bass did. Gooden will have a nice one year expiring contract also that might come in handy at the trade deadline.

as far as Tim Thomas, I hated the addition also, but it isnt a big deal considering it was an end of the bench signing for the vet minimum. He is certainly an upgrade over Devean George, and a better three point specialist than Matt Carroll.

[AlexBrady]

Re: What the heck are the Mavs thinking?

you couldnt be more wrong Alex. You sound clueless to those that actually have followed the Mavs during the Dirk era. You are right about Howard usually disappearing in the 4th. It is uncanny. However, Dirk and Terry have been the opposite. Overall, Nowitzki and JET have been a couple of the best closers in basketball over the last number of years.

The Dirk and Terry pick and roll has been money at the end of games for years. That is usually the Mavs bread and butter in the 4th. Teams usually know it's coming, but they usually cant stop it anyway. Dirk and/or Terry have been at the top of 4th quarter scoring most years and the Mavs are among the league leaders in close victories most seasons. Last season for example, Dallas was 20-4 in games decided by 5 points or less (I know you dont like facts though because they probably get in the way of your agenda)

They battled through injuries all season long, and Nowitzki's play was incredible down the home stretch to get Dallas to a 6th seed. He scored at least 20 pts in 28 straight games down the stretch. That was the longest such streak in the league last season and he did it to CLOSE OUT the season. Most front runner players in the league would have folded up their tent, but that isnt Dirk.

I asked you earlier to provide a list of players that have been more "clutch" than Nowitzki, but of course you wouldnt. If you do provide such a list, there shouldnt be more than a small handful of players ahead of him on your list. I recommend 82.games.com if you want some facts to help you make your list, but I dont think you really care about backing up any of your drivel with actual facts. Those pesky facts can get in the way of your BS.

I had season tickets in the 90s when the Mavs were the worst franchise in sports and would struggle to win 25 games in a season. Since Dirk and Cuban arrived, the Mavs have averaged 56 wins a season and had the most postseason success in franchise history. They have won at least 50 games in 9 straight seasons and the one constant on the court has been Nowitzki. Before he arrived, it was one of the worst pro franchises in all of pro sports, but he has helped put the Mavericks on the map.

Players that are more reliable than Nowitzki down the stretch? Bryant, Lebron, Wade, Pierce, Ray Allen, Tim Duncan, Tony Parker, Ginobli, Chauncey Billups, Carmelo Anthony, and Brandon Roy. All are poised, make smart decisions with the ball, make shots, and raise their teammates levels of play down the stretch.

This is what Nowitzki really is. In game 3 of the Western Conference Semifinals against the Nuggets Dirk could not miss all game. Fadeaways, drving layups, step throughs were going down for Dirk until the last 6 minutes of the game where Nowitzki did what he has done his whole career: choked.

Here is what Nowitzki did in the last 6 minutes of the most important game of the year for his team:
-Pathetically contested a Billups driving layup
-Off of an awful gamble by Anthony Carter, Dirk aggressively drove to the basket and was fouled ( he split the free throws)
-Badly rushed and bricked a 3 point attempt
-Left his man Kenyon Martin wide open under the basket
-Caught the ball at the 3 point line and opted for a fadeaway jumper which caught front rim
-Came down with an important rebound off a Billups missed layup
-Posted Kenyon Martin and opted for a difficult fadeaway jumper that bricked
-Made a feeble swipe and offered little resistance on a driving Nene layup
-Caught the ball outside the 3 point line, drove right, spun left, and threw an accurate and alert pass to a wide open Jason Terry
-Caught the ball just outside the free throw line, dribbled in and hoisted another fadeaway that caught front rim.
-Threw up a prayer that never had a chance since the game was all but lost

Dirk's line in the last 6 minutes: 0-4 1 point, 1 assist,

Here is the video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFD4CDIKyrU

[ZB9]

Re: What the heck are the Mavs thinking?

on the rare occasion that Dallas goes against a team with a great traditional center i imagine we are going to be seeing this lineup...but I bet the Mavs are going to add another frontcourt player when the Buck chip becomes eligible.

PG: Kidd, JET, Barea, Beaubois
SG: Howard, JET, QRoss
SF: Marion, Howard, QRoss
PF: Dirk, Gooden, Marion, Thomas, Humphries
C : Dampier, Dirk, Gooden

but we are probably going to be seeing this small ball rotation much of the time

PG: Kidd, JET, Barea
SG: Howard, JET, Barea, QRoss
SF: Marion, Howard, QRoss, Singleton
PF: Dirk, Marion, Singleton, Thomas, Humphries
C : Gooden, Dirk, Humphries

if nothing else, it should be entertaining lol. They definitely need to tweak some more though, and I think they will starting in Sept/Oct

[ZB9]

Re: What the heck are the Mavs thinking?

Players that are more reliable than Nowitzki down the stretch? Bryant, Lebron, Wade, Pierce, Ray Allen, Tim Duncan, Tony Parker, Ginobli, Chauncey Billups, Carmelo Anthony, and Brandon Roy. All are poised, make smart decisions with the ball, make shots, and raise their teammates levels of play down the stretch.

I give you all of those except for Anthony, Wade, and Roy. The rest of the players, and a couple others, are pretty much the only ones that I would say have been better than Dirk down the stretch overall in their careers. Dirk is certainly in the "top 10"

This is what Nowitzki really is. In game 3 of the Western Conference Semifinals against the Nuggets Dirk could not miss all game. Fadeaways, drving layups, step throughs were going down for Dirk until the last 6 minutes of the game where Nowitzki did what he has done his whole career: choked.

Here is what Nowitzki did in the last 6 minutes of the most important game of the year for his team:
-Pathetically contested a Billups driving layup
-Off of an awful gamble by Anthony Carter, Dirk aggressively drove to the basket and was fouled ( he split the free throws)
-Badly rushed and bricked a 3 point attempt
-Left his man Kenyon Martin wide open under the basket
-Caught the ball at the 3 point line and opted for a fadeaway jumper which caught front rim
-Came down with an important rebound off a Billups missed layup
-Posted Kenyon Martin and opted for a difficult fadeaway jumper that bricked
-Made a feeble swipe and offered little resistance on a driving Nene layup
-Caught the ball outside the 3 point line, drove right, spun left, and threw an accurate and alert pass to a wide open Jason Terry
-Caught the ball just outside the free throw line, dribbled in and hoisted another fadeaway that caught front rim.
-Threw up a prayer that never had a chance since the game was all but lost

Dirk's line in the last 6 minutes: 0-4 1 point, 1 assist,

Here is the video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFD4CDIKyrU

lol you cherry pick game 3 and ignore game 4 when Dirk scored 19 of his 44 points in the 4th quarter. Game 3 is more rare than game 4 for Nowitzki. You can cherry pick a bad playoff game from Dirk here and there, but every great player in the league has had bad playoff games, including the ones on your list.

If you want to talk about important playoff games, all playoff games are important, but I would say elimination games are the most important and most "clutch" situation in pro basketball. Here is a complete sample for you of Dirk's career averages in playoff elimination games, no cherry picking:

Points per game: 30.25
Rebounds: 12.5
Assists: 2.4
Blocks: 1.3
Steals: 1.1
FG%: 49.4%
3pt%: 43.6%
FTM: 8.9
FTA: 9.9
FT%: 89.3

Nowitzki is also 4-0 in game sevens thus far in his career, with great performances in each...but dont let the facts get in the way of your agenda Alex.

[AlexBrady]

Re: What the heck are the Mavs thinking?

I give you all of those except for Anthony, Wade, and Roy. The rest of the players, and a couple others, are pretty much the only ones that I would say have been better than Dirk down the stretch overall in their careers. Dirk is certainly in the "top 10"



lol you cherry pick game 3 and ignore game 4 when Dirk scored 19 of his 44 points in the 4th quarter. Game 3 is more rare than game 4 for Nowitzki. You can cherry pick a bad playoff game from Dirk here and there, but every great player in the league has had bad playoff games, including the ones on your list.

If you want to talk about important playoff games, I would say elimination games are the most important and most "clutch" situation in pro basketball. Here is a complete sample for you of Dirk's career averages in playoff elimination games, no cherry picking:

Points per game: 30.25
Rebounds: 12.5
Assists: 2.4
Blocks: 1.3
Steals: 1.1
FG%: 49.4%
3pt%: 43.6%
FTM: 8.9
FTA: 9.9
FT%: 89.3

Nowitzki is also 4-0 in game sevens thus far in his career...but dont let the facts get in the way of your agenda Alex.

The series was already over when Dirk had the terrific game 4. That performance, while impressive, had no real impact on the outcome of the series. Indeed, his numbers in elimination games are quite good.

[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: What the heck are the Mavs thinking?

But I guess that's not "clutch enough" for you though, right?

[ZB9]

Re: What the heck are the Mavs thinking?

The series was already over when Dirk had the terrific game 4. That performance, while impressive, had no real impact on the outcome of the series. Indeed, his numbers in elimination games are quite good.

you cherry picked one game out of 5 to fit your agenda. Game 1 and game 2 "mattered", and so did game 4. One out of five is actually probably close to the percentage of games that would fit with your agenda.

People that have followed the Mavs during the Dirk era, know that he has been one of the best players down the stretch overall in his career. Like I said, your comments seem clueless to those of us that actually have followed the team.

[ZB9]

Re: What the heck are the Mavs thinking?

Alex, you say Bryant, Lebron, Wade, Pierce, Ray Allen, Tim Duncan, Tony Parker, Ginobli, Chauncey Billups, Carmelo Anthony, and Brandon Roy have been more "clutch" players than Dirk. You are right about Bryant, Pierce, Duncan, and Billups, and maybe Allen, Parker and Ginobili. However, it's close with Allen, Parker, and Ginobili. I would also add Iverson and Shaq to the list.

However, you are wrong about Lebron, Anthony, Wade, and Roy. Dirk has been better down the stretch in his career than all of those four. It's interesting that you couldnt list more players Alex. Like I said, there are only a handful of players that have been better "clutch" performers overall in their careers, yet you act like Nowitzki has been terrible.

anyway, enough with this BS...back to the topic of this thread.

[JBH3]

Re: What the heck are the Mavs thinking?

Players that are more reliable than Nowitzki down the stretch? Bryant, Lebron, Wade, Pierce, Ray Allen, Tim Duncan, Tony Parker, Ginobli, Chauncey Billups, Carmelo Anthony, and Brandon Roy. All are poised, make smart decisions with the ball, make shots, and raise their teammates levels of play down the stretch.

W T F is the point to this?

...and exactly who of the SAS three "raises the level of play" higher?

Regardless of this "clutchness" you speak of, Dirk brings other nuances and intangibles to his team.

Nowitzki is also 4-0 in game sevens thus far in his career, with great performances in each...but dont let the facts get in the way of your agenda Alex.

Nice.