Where will they end up in terms of "all time"

Collapse

Recommended Videos

Collapse
X
 
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • Dewie12
    Banned
    • Jul 2010
    • 787

    #16
    Re: Where will they end up in terms of "all time"

    Originally posted by ex carrabba fan
    I think it's because Nash is the best shooting PG ever and that his passing/feel for the game is right up there with any other PG in history.

    His defense isn't there we all know that.

    I'm interested in what people think about Stockton vs. Nash
    Stockton and Nash is like comparing apples and oranges as far as I am concerned. There is only one real comparison and it has nothing to do with basketball.

    Stockton was the most physical PG ever. Could run the break as well as half court (change in the nBA from 80's to mid 90's).

    Nash is only an allstar level PG in a wide open offense.

    Comment

    • TheMatrix31
      RF
      • Jul 2002
      • 52907

      #17
      Re: Where will they end up in terms of "all time"

      Originally posted by Dewie12

      Nash is only an allstar level PG in a wide open offense.
      Well thank goodness he's been in wide open offenses for most, if not all of his career then.

      Comment

      • 3bros1capcard
        Rookie
        • Dec 2010
        • 15

        #18
        Re: Where will they end up in terms of "all time"

        where wouuld you guys rank Iverson?

        Comment

        • Dewie12
          Banned
          • Jul 2010
          • 787

          #19
          Re: Where will they end up in terms of "all time"

          Originally posted by TheMatrix31
          Well thank goodness he's been in wide open offenses for most, if not all of his career then.
          He wasn't ever a top 5 PG with the Mavs.

          Nash's career is really strange. I never thought he was all that great until he got to Phoenix. I guess he did have 2 allstar years with Dallas but I don't ever remember thinking he was really all that worthy.

          Comment

          • Rawdeal28
            Swiitch U? lol
            • Oct 2007
            • 7407

            #20
            Re: Where will they end up in terms of "all time"

            Originally posted by 3bros1capcard
            where wouuld you guys rank Iverson?
            off the top of my head a top 15 SG.
            "on hoping there is a PSN flash sale before Valentine's Day"
            Man there are no flashers... now what are we going to do for vd
            I'm sure there's plenty of prostitutes you could pay if you really want vd.
            yea but will they take psn cards
            Depends on what area of a hooker you would use to redeem them.

            lol

            Comment

            • 3bros1capcard
              Rookie
              • Dec 2010
              • 15

              #21
              Re: Where will they end up in terms of "all time"

              Originally posted by Rawdeal28
              off the top of my head a top 15 SG.
              what about all time?

              Comment

              • Rocky
                All Star
                • Jul 2002
                • 6896

                #22
                Re: Where will they end up in terms of "all time"

                Originally posted by ex carrabba fan
                I even look at KG and think oh he's a PF for sure. But he and Duncan are the same size... so that's why I don't really care that much if people consider Duncan a PF.
                I think Duncan is a by the book PF in most cases. He rarely guards another true C, unless that C has an outside game or when he absolutely has to. He's like KG in that he prefers to fly around and play help D and can even guard PG's on the perimeter (obviously not for an extended time though). I think defensively a C is a guy who camps out in the lane and guards people who do the same. Rarely do you put a center on a guy who routinely floats around the perimeter or sets high picks, but you put Duncan on those guys (especially early in his career...not so much against a guy like Dirk now though, that's a tough cover).

                Offensively, I think he is mostly a PF too. He camps out on the low block, but other elite PF's routinely do as well. Hell, some big PG's do it too. But he's at his best on the elbow, a traditionallly PF spot.

                But he does play alot of center no doubt. He is at his best as a power forward, however, and plays that position better than anyone ever has. He can also be an all-time great center if you ask him to be.
                "Maybe I can't win. But to beat me, he's going to have to kill me. And to kill me, he's gonna have to have the heart to stand in front of me. And to do that, he's got to be willing to die himself. I don't know if he's ready to do that."
                -Rocky Balboa

                Comment

                • Rawdeal28
                  Swiitch U? lol
                  • Oct 2007
                  • 7407

                  #23
                  Re: Where will they end up in terms of "all time"

                  Originally posted by 3bros1capcard
                  what about all time?
                  thats what im referring too. if u only count the last 20 he would probably be in the top 5
                  "on hoping there is a PSN flash sale before Valentine's Day"
                  Man there are no flashers... now what are we going to do for vd
                  I'm sure there's plenty of prostitutes you could pay if you really want vd.
                  yea but will they take psn cards
                  Depends on what area of a hooker you would use to redeem them.

                  lol

                  Comment

                  • 3bros1capcard
                    Rookie
                    • Dec 2010
                    • 15

                    #24
                    Re: Where will they end up in terms of "all time"

                    Originally posted by Rawdeal28
                    thats what im referring too. if u only count the last 20 he would probably be in the top 5
                    o ok lol y bad

                    Comment

                    • HHHRVD55
                      Pro
                      • Jul 2004
                      • 522

                      #25
                      Re: Where will they end up in terms of "all time"

                      Originally posted by ex carrabba fan
                      Agreed with everything you posted. Except Nash probably to me isn't undisputed top 5 PG. He's top 7 or 8 to me.

                      And I wasn't really old enough to analyze Stock's best years compared to Nash's. So I can't say.

                      What makes you say that I'm curious and like I said I wasn't old enough for Stock.
                      I grew up watching Stockton so I'm probably a bit biased but...if you look at the numbers, Stockton's best years are better than Nash's MVP years. Stockton went to the Finals twice, Nash hasn't yet. Stockton could play defense and get under people's skins.

                      Comment

                      • The15thunter
                        MVP
                        • Mar 2003
                        • 1639

                        #26
                        Re: Where will they end up in terms of "all time"

                        Originally posted by capp34
                        Whats the infatuation with Steve Nash he is great player everything but he is not top ten on any all time list.
                        best shooting point guard of all-time and can make a claim to be the best overall proficient shooter (especially percentage-wise) in history. one of the best passing guards (only rivaled my magic johnson, john stockton and jason kidd) ever. an elite pick and roll guard, dictates tempo and increases the offensive output of his entire team every moment he's on the floor.

                        i don't think you can name ten point guards that are better. if you can, i'd like to see the list.
                        xbox gt - bmorerep87

                        Comment

                        • The15thunter
                          MVP
                          • Mar 2003
                          • 1639

                          #27
                          Re: Where will they end up in terms of "all time"

                          Originally posted by ex carrabba fan
                          I think it's because Nash is the best shooting PG ever and that his passing/feel for the game is right up there with any other PG in history.

                          His defense isn't there we all know that.

                          I'm interested in what people think about Stockton vs. Nash
                          stockton was really good for a really long time, but he was never great. however, his longevity and the fact that he was so efficient sets him apart. he's like the kareem abdul-jabbar of point guards, except instead of points he racked up assists. no personality to think of, not likable, but he just kept plugging along. for him, despite being a very good point guard, he never had a real peak season.

                          he was a solid scorer, and he racked up a lot of assists in part due to his system and also because he had one of the greatest finishers in nba history. was increasingly less good in the playoffs (aside from lighting up matt mahoney) and was devoured by dominant guards all of his career (magic johnson, isiah thomas, kevin johnson, gary payton, tim hardaway, etc.)

                          however, he just endured and survived while his contemporaries fell around him, and kept giving us 15 points and 11 assists every year. in the mid-90's, he's noticeably slower, but the game gets slowers (thanks knicks and heat for bastardizing the game), so he's still as useful as before, especially with no great point guards to exploit him.

                          my verdict - top 30 all-time. top 6 point guard (magic, cousy, isiah, kidd, nash). he's top 7 if you include oscar robertson as a point guard, but i like to think of him as a short small forward.
                          xbox gt - bmorerep87

                          Comment

                          • The15thunter
                            MVP
                            • Mar 2003
                            • 1639

                            #28
                            Re: Where will they end up in terms of "all time"

                            Originally posted by ex carrabba fan
                            Oh yeah, and if Kobe/Duncan are top 10 players so is Shaq. They are all even IMO.
                            since i think it was my controversial view that had shaq outside the top ten, i'll give you my ten.

                            jordan
                            russell
                            kareem
                            magic
                            bird
                            wilt
                            kobe
                            oscar
                            duncan
                            hakeem

                            west
                            shaq
                            elgin
                            moses
                            karl
                            xbox gt - bmorerep87

                            Comment

                            • The15thunter
                              MVP
                              • Mar 2003
                              • 1639

                              #29
                              Re: Where will they end up in terms of "all time"

                              Originally posted by 3bros1capcard
                              where wouuld you guys rank Iverson?
                              top 4 shooting guard (behind jordan, kobe and west). top 35 all-timer.
                              xbox gt - bmorerep87

                              Comment

                              • ex carrabba fan
                                I'll thank him for you
                                • Oct 2004
                                • 32744

                                #30
                                Re: Where will they end up in terms of "all time"

                                since i think it was my controversial view that had shaq outside the top ten, i'll give you my ten.

                                jordan
                                russell
                                kareem
                                magic
                                bird
                                wilt
                                kobe
                                oscar
                                duncan
                                hakeem

                                west
                                shaq
                                elgin
                                moses
                                karl
                                I don't mind that list, I just personally believe when comparing players across positions... you have to put Duncan/Kobe/Shaq all on the same tier. Just my personal opinion.

                                Originally posted by Dewie12
                                Stockton and Nash is like comparing apples and oranges as far as I am concerned. There is only one real comparison and it has nothing to do with basketball.

                                Stockton was the most physical PG ever. Could run the break as well as half court (change in the nBA from 80's to mid 90's).

                                Nash is only an allstar level PG in a wide open offense.
                                Since this sort of discussion [comparing players from different eras and different teams/systems] is all sort of unscientific, I tend to focus on skill sets.

                                All I can say is if you put Nash on that Utah team I think he would thrive just as well. The pick and roll with Malone would be just as devastating IMO and the team defense/personnel would mask Nash. Not even sure how Stock's defense ranked among PG's of his era, but I imagine it wasn't regarded as anything more than average.

                                Personally, I know Stockton from 1995 to his retirement. I really don't remember him before that...

                                I'm more making the argument that Nash is indeed a top 6 or 7 PG. Where do you rank him?

                                My list: Magic, Thomas, Kidd, Stockton, Payton, Nash. I don't count Cousy since he played too long ago. I don't consider Oscar to be a PG.

                                The other names out there: Strickland, Jackson, Cheeks.... I just don't put them ahead of Nash.

                                Comment

                                Working...