3/28 - 4/3 Game Discussion Thread

[23]

Re: 3/28 - 4/3 Game Discussion Thread

The problem is not the players in this case, its the inconsistency and the lack thereof, of fixing it, or making matters worse

[jeebs9]

Re: 3/28 - 4/3 Game Discussion Thread

How did you gather that Wilkins got beat up? Lol

According to insiders, Wilkins beat the crap out of that guy. And you can see in the mug shot that the ref had a huge black eye.

I was joking lol I saw that too.

[wwharton]

Re: 3/28 - 4/3 Game Discussion Thread

The problem is not the players in this case, its the inconsistency and the lack thereof, of fixing it, or making matters worse

I agree... but I don't see a solution. That's why I gave the NFL example. Their way of fixing this type of thing is to take the subjectivity out of as many calls as possible. Unfortunately that's a lot harder to do with basketball. Even something as cut and dry as a 3 second call is hard to pinpoint. And if refs were to call everything by the book we'd definitely be complaining about them putting their fingerprint on the game too much with all the fouls that would be called.

[23]

Re: 3/28 - 4/3 Game Discussion Thread

But they dont do either man

They wont consistently call it by the book nor will they let them play

With the rule changes you get all kinds of phantom whistles while guys like Dwight and LeBron get hammered inside, as if its a different set of rules

That doesnt even bring into account the way certain teams are treated
from eachother

[wwharton]

Re: 3/28 - 4/3 Game Discussion Thread

But they dont do either man

They wont consistently call it by the book nor will they let them play

With the rule changes you get all kinds of phantom whistles while guys like Dwight and LeBron get hammered inside, as if its a different set of rules

That doesnt even bring into account the way certain teams are treated
from eachother

That's identifying the problem (which I agree with) but not offering a solution... I'm just saying I don't think there is one. The nature of the game tied to everything else makes it real hard to figure out a way to "fix" it.

[The 24th Letter]

Re: 3/28 - 4/3 Game Discussion Thread

That's identifying the problem (which I agree with) but not offering a solution... I'm just saying I don't think there is one. The nature of the game tied to everything else makes it real hard to figure out a way to "fix" it.

Good post.

[King_B_Mack]

Re: 3/28 - 4/3 Game Discussion Thread

You don't consider complaining after every whistle as going overboard? I can't agree with that. And beyond that, players CLEARLY show up the refs. Even today, they still do because it happens so much that we say there are too many techs now and that's with letting a lot of crap go.

Nope. There were a handful of reactions that legit needed the quick tech rule. For the most part, guys would try to show what happened and I personally was fine with that cause the refs were missing a lot of calls. If a guy is in a ref's face cursing and screaming at him like a baseball manager to an ump, that's one thing, but that's not what we were getting. That kind of behaviour is overboard, not the **** NBA players were doing.

There is absolutely no sport that I know of (can't speak on anything outside of basketball, football and baseball but educated guess about others) that allows players/coaches to talk about officiating to the media. That's how it is, and imo how it should be. It serves no purpose. Whether or not they're allowed to voice complaints to the league is unknown but I'd be SHOCKED if they weren't. How effective is it? That's worth complaining about... but letting people "vent" is definitely not the solution.

Pretty sure they can do it in baseball. I'm not even talking about just going in the media and unloading on how much a guy sucks at his job, but you can't say ANYTHING, ANYTHING in the media without the Don swooping down for his cash pickup.

The style of the game is significant. Alot of NFL rules have changed to make it very clear what should and shouldn't be called. The subjective calls that still exist are the ones that we all argue about every day. Human interpretation of anything is a problem and unfortunately the nature of basketball leaves A LOT to individual judgment.

You have a legit beef with that, but it's something that pretty much can't be changed. It will always be a problem. The attitudes? That's a different issue, but again it's an issue on both sides. Everyone involved feel more entitled to act a fool than they should be. That also will never change. After all, this is entertainment... guess it's just harder for some to check when/how they should be animated or over the top and when they shouldn't.

For the most part, the players keep things respectful with refs cause they know what's up. The refs as we continue to see every year, don't operate the same way cause they know Stern is backing them in everything they do. If you have a guy like Joey Crawford who every single year has at least two or three games a year where he's gotta make sure he's gettin his shine in a game by going overboard with the techs and other calls, at what point do you suspend him a year? Send him to the D-League just something that will get through to him and if that isn't working why not fire him? You get so many techs as a player and you start get fined and missing games for it. Ron Artest put a mark on the league's integrity by brawling with fans and there was no hesitation to sit him for a year, however we can have refs who we know have gambling problems, Steve Javie was one of 16 officials brought up on tax evaison charges, the countless 'me' moments during games and just a general poor performance at they're job and all we do is sit them for one round of the playoffs and then act like the whole thing never happened? The NBA can and should be better.

[jeebs9]

Re: 3/28 - 4/3 Game Discussion Thread

I just wish the refs called it like in college. There is no BS. No dancing, no arguing.. maybe a player might yell "And1 one!!" once in a while. But it never gets out of hand. Giving the little guy the same fair chance as the big guy.

[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: 3/28 - 4/3 Game Discussion Thread

When you're playing in Mr. Stern's League, there is no "give the little guys a fair chance".

[wwharton]

Re: 3/28 - 4/3 Game Discussion Thread

Nope. There were a handful of reactions that legit needed the quick tech rule. For the most part, guys would try to show what happened and I personally was fine with that cause the refs were missing a lot of calls. If a guy is in a ref's face cursing and screaming at him like a baseball manager to an ump, that's one thing, but that's not what we were getting. That kind of behaviour is overboard, not the **** NBA players were doing.



Pretty sure they can do it in baseball. I'm not even talking about just going in the media and unloading on how much a guy sucks at his job, but you can't say ANYTHING, ANYTHING in the media without the Don swooping down for his cash pickup.



For the most part, the players keep things respectful with refs cause they know what's up. The refs as we continue to see every year, don't operate the same way cause they know Stern is backing them in everything they do. If you have a guy like Joey Crawford who every single year has at least two or three games a year where he's gotta make sure he's gettin his shine in a game by going overboard with the techs and other calls, at what point do you suspend him a year? Send him to the D-League just something that will get through to him and if that isn't working why not fire him? You get so many techs as a player and you start get fined and missing games for it. Ron Artest put a mark on the league's integrity by brawling with fans and there was no hesitation to sit him for a year, however we can have refs who we know have gambling problems, Steve Javie was one of 16 officials brought up on tax evaison charges, the countless 'me' moments during games and just a general poor performance at they're job and all we do is sit them for one round of the playoffs and then act like the whole thing never happened? The NBA can and should be better.

It probably isn't worth the digging but I'd need to see an example of this happening in baseball. I'm pretty sure it's not allowed.

As for everything else, I would say you must just not watch any of the games I've seen BUT I KNOW you watch more NBA games than me so all I can do is call you out, lol. Come on man... maybe take a closer look at this when you watch now. BTW, by the rules would say that no player besides the captains can even speak to the refs (same with coaches... only the head) so we can already say they go beyond that. But seriously, players get on refs WAY more than you're saying. And even questioning in a respectful manner every call is not cool.

I think you just are mad at refs and are only seeing things from that perspective.

[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: 3/28 - 4/3 Game Discussion Thread

Ex or anybody else, what you think about this? That sound about right to you?

Don’t be shocked if there is an upset in the first round of the Western Conference playoffs.
The top four teams — the Spurs, Lakers, Mavericks and Thunder — are all a notch above the teams below them. But the teams below them are hot. They each create some matchup problems and have been exploiting them well of late. They have been defending. There will be no easy outs.
Mark Medina at the Los Angeles Times Lakers blog was able to pry anonymous answers out of four Lakers players about who they want to avoid come the first round.
The answers: Portland and Memphis.
Portland because the Rose Garden has long been a place the Lakers have struggled to win. And even with Los Angeles 3-0 against Portland this season the Lakers are wary. Portland has some real talent at the forward spots with Gerald Wallace and LaMarcus Aldridge, they have Brandon Roy and Marcus Camby, too. They are dangerous.
Memphis, however, scares more than just the Lakers. People with one of the other top teams in the West have told me Memphis is the team they most want to avoid in the first round. Even without Rudy Gay.
Memphis brings to the table one of the best and biggest front lines in basketball with Zach Randolph and Marc Gasol. They have a good wing defender in Shane Battier, they have a solid point guard in Mike Conley.
All top four teams in the West can beat the Grizzlies, but it’s about getting it over with quickly. Not having to play extra games and take on an extra physical beating in the process. Memphis is going to make it hard on some team (it may well be the Spurs, who will need Tim Duncan back and healthy for that series).
Denver also is playing well, but without a star they don’t seem to strike fear into the top teams like Memphis and Portland do.
Since David West went down, the Hornets are the team the contenders should most want to face. Chris Paul is Chris Paul, but without West New Orleans isn’t the same threat.
As of today, the match ups would be Spur/Grizzlies, Lakers/Hornets, Mavericks/Blazers and Thunder/Nuggets in the West. However, with only one game separating 6-8 in the standings and Denver just 2.5 games ahead of that, things could shift dramatically

[LingeringRegime]

Re: 3/28 - 4/3 Game Discussion Thread

Mavs will lose of course. Shouldn't even be labeled an "upset" any more.

None of those other teams will have any trouble. Maybe the Denver/OKC series will go 6 or 7.

[BlueNGold]

Re: 3/28 - 4/3 Game Discussion Thread

http://tsn.ca/nba/story/?id=360261

ATLANTA -- A former NBA referee was charged with attacking Hall of Famer and Atlanta Hawks television analyst Dominique Wilkins in a dispute over a clothing bill.

Carlos Campos, an Atlanta police spokesman, said 36-year-old Rashan S. Michel was released early Thursday on US$1,000 cash bond after being charged with two counts of simple battery.

Michel confronted the former NBA star while he was wrapping up his broadcasting duties after Atlanta's 85-82 win over Orlando on Wednesday night. He claims Wilkins owes him $12,500 for custom-made suits.

"It appears the gentleman came down after the game. Mr. Wilkins was giving a live broadcast and he started yelling some things, confronting Mr. Wilkins," Campos said. "When Mr. Wilkins stepped away to de-escalate the situation, Mr. Michel pursued Mr. Wilkins to the point that he physically attacked him."

Wilkins, who was not injured, told officers that he didn't believe he owed Michel for the clothing.

"Apparently, Mr. Wilkins was under the impression it was a gift," Campos said.

The only blows in the altercation were apparently landed by Wilkins. A police booking photo showed Michel with a large welt under his left eye.

Michel was an NBA referee for four seasons beginning in 1997, according to league spokesman Tim Frank. Citing privacy issues, he couldn't discuss why Michel departed in 2001.

A video obtained by TMZ, apparently taken by a fan with a cellphone, showed a person identified as Wilkins throwing at least two punches at a man in the first row before he was pulled away. After yanking off his tie and tossing aside his suit jacket, the 6-foot-8 Wilkins tried to get back at the man before several people stepped in, pushing him onto the court in front of the Hawks bench.

The Hawks said Wilkins would not comment on the incident. Michel called into the "Frank and Wanda Morning Show" on V-103 to give his side, claiming Wilkins punched him first.

"I went down and said, 'Let's handle this like men, work out a payment plan,"' Michel said. "The next thing I know ... the security guard grabbed me and then (Wilkins) punches me."

Michel said he already filed suit against Wilkins three months ago to recover the money he was owed, but was hoping to make a suitable arrangement without going to court. Now, he implied, there will be more legal action.

"My attorney is going to subpoena it all," Michel said. "You'll be able to see it when it's all said and done."

The 51-year-old Wilkins is also a vice-president with the Hawks and perhaps the most famous player in team history. "The Human Highlight Film" scored nearly 27,000 points in his career and was induced into the Basketball Hall of Fame in 2006.

The Associated Press left a message with a number listed for Michel.

"I don't have any problems with guys owing me," he told V-103. "Just make arrangements to pay me."

The Human Beatdown Reel?

[ZB9]

Re: 3/28 - 4/3 Game Discussion Thread

Mavs will lose of course. Shouldn't even be labeled an "upset" any more.

lol who do the Blazers or Hornets or Grizzlies have on their rosters that have such great playoff careers? how many series have players on those teams won?

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: 3/28 - 4/3 Game Discussion Thread

Mavs will lose of course. Shouldn't even be labeled an "upset" any more.

None of those other teams will have any trouble. Maybe the Denver/OKC series will go 6 or 7.

I might have to co-sign this.

I think Dallas is very vulnerable without Caron. They don't have stable scoring outside of Dirk and JET.

As far as Memphis being a threat? Without Rudy Gay, no.

Portland is definitely a threat IMO. I've kept tabs on them since they've gotten Wallace, and they're the team in the last 4 seeds that has the best chance to upset. Denver/Memphis/whomever else will all be fighting uphill battles.

Portland has gritty defense [Batum/Wallace/Matthews/Camby], low post scoring/rebounding [Aldridge], and wing scorers in Matthews/hobbled Roy.

Denver doesn't have go to scorers, and their identity might be a bit mixed up when the playoffs hit. They don't have defense that scares anyone.

LA will not lose in the first round. OKC will not lose in the first round.

SA and Dallas seem vulnerable only because of injury.