Pretty Boy Floyd vs. Corey Spinks looks to be on...

[utexas]

Re: Pretty Boy Floyd vs. Corey Spinks looks to be on...

Might need to go back and do some research. Tyson paid Lennox millions to step aside and also went after Seldon to avoid Lennox. There is not one educated boxing fan on the planet that believes Lennox ducked Tyson. In fact, because of the corruption of boxing post-Ali, Lennox was the most ducked fighter in heavyweight boxing.

Iwould love to know where you got that info from. Please present "the research" and I will gladly educate myself. When Tyson was on his rise and dominating Holyfield nor Lennox were angling to fight him.Holyfield was still a middleweight for most of that time.

Back on topic, Mayweather doesn't have a legit threat in front of him, therefore he can fight whomever he wants. There seems to be some youg fighters coming up so maybe that will change in the next year or so.

[thelwig14]

Re: Pretty Boy Floyd vs. Corey Spinks looks to be on...

Iwould love to know where you got that info from. Please present "the research" and I will gladly educate myself. When Tyson was on his rise and dominating Holyfield nor Lennox were angling to fight him.Holyfield was still a middleweight for most of that time.

Back on topic, Mayweather doesn't have a legit threat in front of him, therefore he can fight whomever he wants. There seems to be some youg fighters coming up so maybe that will change in the next year or so.

First, Evander never fought at middleweight. He was the Light Heavyweight Bronze medalist, unified Cruiserweight Champion, and recognized heavyweight champ during his career.

Second, just go on google. It is common knowledge that Tyson paid $4 million to Lewis to step aside and let Tyson fight Seldon for the WBA title.

And Lennox and Evander avoided Tyson when he was on his rise? Well, it would have been tough for them to fight Tyson "when he was on his rise," as Lennox had not turned pro yet and Evander was still a cruiserweight.

It is not a big deal. You talked about something you had no background knowledge on. Lennox was ducked via actions or words by Foreman, Evander, Tyson, Bowe, and many others. Foreman said he could not beat him, Bowe did not want to lose again embarrassingly to Lennox, Evander dragged his feet, and a broke Tyson paid him millions.

[aholbert32]

Re: Pretty Boy Floyd vs. Corey Spinks looks to be on...

No one on this board had given me one good debate for Floyd to fight Margarito. Margarito has barely any named opponents on his record. On top of that his top named opponents wouldnt beat Floyd's average opponents. As much as you say you like Margarito, he has done nothing in boxing in the name of beating top opposition.

Some argue that Floyd is taking safe opposition and thats not true. Its just that Floyd is that good. Its the same way I feel about RJJ. For years, no one went the distance with him. RJJ was that good. Floyd is that good.

If Floyd fought Margarito and beat him to a pulp or dominated a UD, you all would find some other exscuse for him not to be on top.

I can give you 8 million reasons. Thats the amount PBF was offered to fight Margarito and if Margarito is such a pushover PBF should whup his *** and collect his 8 million. My question is why would PBF fight Spinks for much less if he isnt worried that Magarito would give him a tough fight. When did you ever here of a fighter choosing the fight where he would make less money?

With that said, why do you only focus on Margarito? He isnt the only fighter being ducked by PBF. Baldomir is too.

[Money99]

Re: Pretty Boy Floyd vs. Corey Spinks looks to be on...

First, Evander never fought at middleweight. He was the Light Heavyweight Bronze medalist, unified Cruiserweight Champion, and recognized heavyweight champ during his career.

Second, just go on google. It is common knowledge that Tyson paid $4 million to Lewis to step aside and let Tyson fight Seldon for the WBA title.

And Lennox and Evander avoided Tyson when he was on his rise? Well, it would have been tough for them to fight Tyson "when he was on his rise," as Lennox had not turned pro yet and Evander was still a cruiserweight.

It is not a big deal. You talked about something you had no background knowledge on. Lennox was ducked via actions or words by Foreman, Evander, Tyson, Bowe, and many others. Foreman said he could not beat him, Bowe did not want to lose again embarrassingly to Lennox, Evander dragged his feet, and a broke Tyson paid him millions.

I 2nd all of this. Tyson did pay Lennox millions to not fight him so he could get an easier fight. This has been well documented and you CAN do a search on google or email any writer at maxboxing.com or doghouseboxing.com to give you undisputable evidence of such.
And Evander NEVER ducked Tyson one bit. During Tyson's reign of terror Evander would attend Tyson fights and then taunt him after the fight to finally go him.
And I've read enough Tyson biographies to know that Evander's people were constantly calling Mike's to get a fight with him. Tyson's people finally agreed to fight Evander after the Douglas bout.

And fighting DLH will be a challenge but lets face it, the Golden boy has spots of rust. PBF is taking the safe fights. Baldomir is the consensus guy to fight. Not more pretenders or contenders in the division.
Also, Ricky Hatton has said he would move up to 147 to fight him too.

[thelwig14]

Re: Pretty Boy Floyd vs. Corey Spinks looks to be on...

I 2nd all of this. Tyson did pay Lennox millions to not fight him so he could get an easier fight. This has been well documented and you CAN do a search on google or email any writer at maxboxing.com or doghouseboxing.com to give you undisputable evidence of such.
And Evander NEVER ducked Tyson one bit. During Tyson's reign of terror Evander would attend Tyson fights and then taunt him after the fight to finally go him.
And I've read enough Tyson biographies to know that Evander's people were constantly calling Mike's to get a fight with him. Tyson's people finally agreed to fight Evander after the Douglas bout.

And fighting DLH will be a challenge but lets face it, the Golden boy has spots of rust. PBF is taking the safe fights. Baldomir is the consensus guy to fight. Not more pretenders or contenders in the division.
Also, Ricky Hatton has said he would move up to 147 to fight him too.

It is actually quite comical. I have all of Tyson's fights on dvd (and Evanders good ones) and there are many fights where they pan to Evander on the first row of a Tyson fight shaking his head and doing other actions.

[Money99]

Re: Pretty Boy Floyd vs. Corey Spinks looks to be on...

It is actually quite comical. I have all of Tyson's fights on dvd (and Evanders good ones) and there are many fights where they pan to Evander on the first row of a Tyson fight shaking his head and doing other actions.

Hahaha. Yeah. I still remember when Tyson leaned over the ropes and was pointing at him like he wanted to kill him.

I would have LOVED to see a prime Evander fight the same Tyson that entered the ring vs. Spinks.
What is scary is that Kevin Rooney and the other trainers said that Tyson still had so much more to learn. Rooney once said that the Tyson that fought Spinks was only 50% of what he was capable of.

I think that would have been the greatest fight in heavyweight history. Tyson still had heart and trained properly. Evander had immense heart and courage (as well as an iron chin). It would have been a war.

[marq]

Re: Pretty Boy Floyd vs. Corey Spinks looks to be on...

No one on this board had given me one good debate for Floyd to fight Margarito. Margarito has barely any named opponents on his record. On top of that his top named opponents wouldnt beat Floyd's average opponents. As much as you say you like Margarito, he has done nothing in boxing in the name of beating top opposition.

Some argue that Floyd is taking safe opposition and thats not true. Its just that Floyd is that good. Its the same way I feel about RJJ. For years, no one went the distance with him. RJJ was that good. Floyd is that good.

If Floyd fought Margarito and beat him to a pulp or dominated a UD, you all would find some other exscuse for him not to be on top.

Agreed with all stated here. There is nothing that either of those fighters could do in the eyes of people on this board. These two are SO DOMINATE that it was a joke when they fought ANYBODY. There is no way Baldomir beats Floyd, so why would you think Floyd is ducking him. As a matter of fact, Baldomir's deliberate punching style is "tailor made" for Floyd's quickness and accuracy. That fight would be a joke. Baldy beat Judah and Gatti, so what. Floyd DESTROYED both of those guys and everybody said he was taking the "easy way out." whatever. and about RJJ, do your research and you will see that most experts thought he would lose to Ruiz. He also took a huge punch from Ruiz (a 240 pound heavy with punching power evidenced by 28 kos, with his only loss prior in 7 years was a controversial one to Holyfield). And what reason would RJJ give rematches to JT or B-Hop when he completely dominated them as well. Those fights weren't controversial or close. As a matter of fact, B-Hop was beaten by a one-handed Roy as he injured his right hand early in the fight.

Just seems to me that when you are THAT good, people hate and say they duck this one and that one, blah blah blah. I mean, to be a fighter, you have to be smart. Even Leonard, my all time favorite, waited YEARS to fight Hagler. He waited until the time was right and schrewedly negotiated terms of the fight that benefited him and his gameplan. It worked, but is still one of the most controversial decisions ever and he never gave Hagler a rematch and Hagler was so upset he never laced them up again and moved to Italy. Everybody should be realistic, remove the drapery of hate from your eyes and appreciate the skill that Floyd and Roy exhibit in the ring...

[aholbert32]

Re: Pretty Boy Floyd vs. Corey Spinks looks to be on...

Agreed with all stated here. There is nothing that either of those fighters could do in the eyes of people on this board. These two are SO DOMINATE that it was a joke when they fought ANYBODY. There is no way Baldomir beats Floyd, so why would you think Floyd is ducking him. As a matter of fact, Baldomir's deliberate punching style is "tailor made" for Floyd's quickness and accuracy. That fight would be a joke. Baldy beat Judah and Gatti, so what. Floyd DESTROYED both of those guys and everybody said he was taking the "easy way out." whatever. and about RJJ, do your research and you will see that most experts thought he would lose to Ruiz. He also took a huge punch from Ruiz (a 240 pound heavy with punching power evidenced by 28 kos, with his only loss prior in 7 years was a controversial one to Holyfield). And what reason would RJJ give rematches to JT or B-Hop when he completely dominated them as well. Those fights weren't controversial or close. As a matter of fact, B-Hop was beaten by a one-handed Roy as he injured his right hand early in the fight.

Just seems to me that when you are THAT good, people hate and say they duck this one and that one, blah blah blah. I mean, to be a fighter, you have to be smart. Even Leonard, my all time favorite, waited YEARS to fight Hagler. He waited until the time was right and schrewedly negotiated terms of the fight that benefited him and his gameplan. It worked, but is still one of the most controversial decisions ever and he never gave Hagler a rematch and Hagler was so upset he never laced them up again and moved to Italy. Everybody should be realistic, remove the drapery of hate from your eyes and appreciate the skill that Floyd and Roy exhibit in the ring...

Seriously...shut up with that ''hate" crap. No one hates Floyd. Honestly, he's one of my favorite fighters but I call it like I see it. No one here has said that they think Baldy or Margarito could beat PBF but those are the two fights that the fans want to see. No one wants to pay to watch him fight Spinks. When the fans want a fight, you are lined up to make the most money you have ever made in a fight, you say you could easily beat the guys lined up and you still refuse to fight them...thats a duck, plain and simple.

And what you describe by Sugar Ray was a duck too. He DUCKED Hagler for years and I say that as a huge fan of Sugar.

[thelwig14]

Re: Pretty Boy Floyd vs. Corey Spinks looks to be on...

Seriously...shut up with that ''hate" crap. No one hates Floyd. Honestly, he's one of my favorite fighters but I call it like I see it. No one here has said that they think Baldy or Margarito could beat PBF but those are the two fights that the fans want to see. No one wants to pay to watch him fight Spinks. When the fans want a fight, you are lined up to make the most money you have ever made in a fight, you say you could easily beat the guys lined up and you still refuse to fight them...thats a duck, plain and simple.

And what you describe by Sugar Ray was a duck too. He DUCKED Hagler for years and I say that as a huge fan of Sugar.

He also ducked Pryor.....

[marq]

Re: Pretty Boy Floyd vs. Corey Spinks looks to be on...

Seriously...shut up with that ''hate" crap. No one hates Floyd. Honestly, he's one of my favorite fighters but I call it like I see it. No one here has said that they think Baldy or Margarito could beat PBF but those are the two fights that the fans want to see. No one wants to pay to watch him fight Spinks. When the fans want a fight, you are lined up to make the most money you have ever made in a fight, you say you could easily beat the guys lined up and you still refuse to fight them...thats a duck, plain and simple.

And what you describe by Sugar Ray was a duck too. He DUCKED Hagler for years and I say that as a huge fan of Sugar.

Whoa admin, relax with "shut up." Now, I never said that Sugar never ducked Hagler, that was exactly the reason I brought him up. PEople here always use him as an example with saying that fighters in the '80's never "ducked" anyone. I just said boxing is a business first and Leonard treated the sport as such. But, what I say about hate is not crap. You may be one who "calls it like he sees it" but it is still a no win situation even from your mouth. Ducking to me means you are avoiding fighting someone who can/will beat you. Baldomir cannot beat Floyd yet you say Floyd is ducking him. Margarito has beaten nobody worthy enough to make the best pound for pound fighter in the world have to fight him, yet you say he is ducking Margarito. When Floyd beats these people, you will say he beat no one. Also, if others will come here and say the same thing, or that Floyd was exposed, etc.

What I see in many sports, especially boxing, is that if a person dominates (Jones, Mayweather, early Tyson, etc.) people say they didn't fight anyone, they ducked this person, they were afraid of that person, they should give so and so, who they completely dominated, a rematch, they were exposed when they lost (completely ignoring other important factors leading up to the loss), etc. You're an admin, you see the posts, you know what I'm talking about. That's why I said "hate" because people want to see them lose. That's fine, but when you take away their accomplishments because there was a time in their careers when they chose a different path than one you would've liked that all of the crap comes out. If you look at this post objectively you'll understand what I'm talking about.

[aholbert32]

Re: Pretty Boy Floyd vs. Corey Spinks looks to be on...

Ducking to me means you are avoiding fighting someone who can/will beat you. Baldomir cannot beat Floyd yet you say Floyd is ducking him. Margarito has beaten nobody worthy enough to make the best pound for pound fighter in the world have to fight him, yet you say he is ducking Margarito. When Floyd beats these people, you will say he beat no one. Also, if others will come here and say the same thing, or that Floyd was exposed, etc.

What I see in many sports, especially boxing, is that if a person dominates (Jones, Mayweather, early Tyson, etc.) people say they didn't fight anyone, they ducked this person, they were afraid of that person, they should give so and so, who they completely dominated, a rematch, they were exposed when they lost (completely ignoring other important factors leading up to the loss), etc. You're an admin, you see the posts, you know what I'm talking about. That's why I said "hate" because people want to see them lose. That's fine, but when you take away their accomplishments because there was a time in their careers when they chose a different path than one you would've liked that all of the crap comes out. If you look at this post objectively you'll understand what I'm talking about.

If Floyd beats Baldomir or Margarito I will say he beat the best of whats available. Is Baldomir the best welterweight in the world? No, but he's the champ. and he's offering Floyd more than he's ever made in a fight to fight him. Same with Margarito. Hatton isnt an option for Nov. Neither is Cotto. Neither is DLH. Neither is Mosley. So the three best fights out there are the Baldomir, Margarito and Spinks fights in that order.

Baldomir is #1 because he is the welterweight champ, he is offereing PBF a ton of money and its who most boxing fights want to see him fight. Margarito is #2 because of the money he is offering and because alot of boxing fans would like to see this fight. Spinks is #3 because no one wants to see the fight and he will make much less money fighting him than he will the other two.

Question: If the other two fights are against people you call "easy" opponents and they will make him the most money in his career, why would PBF choose the Spinks fight? Maybe those two fighters arent as easy as you and others seem to think. Would I put money on them to beat PBF? No. But i dont think either of them will be pushovers.

I dont want to see Floyd lose. I just want to see him fight the best available fighters and right now they are Baldomir and Margarito.

[marq]

Re: Pretty Boy Floyd vs. Corey Spinks looks to be on...

If Floyd beats Baldomir or Margarito I will say he beat the best of whats available. Is Baldomir the best welterweight in the world? No, but he's the champ. and he's offering Floyd more than he's ever made in a fight to fight him. Same with Margarito. Hatton isnt an option for Nov. Neither is Cotto. Neither is DLH. Neither is Mosley. So the three best fights out there are the Baldomir, Margarito and Spinks fights in that order.

Baldomir is #1 because he is the welterweight champ, he is offereing PBF a ton of money and its who most boxing fights want to see him fight. Margarito is #2 because of the money he is offering and because alot of boxing fans would like to see this fight. Spinks is #3 because no one wants to see the fight and he will make much less money fighting him than he will the other two.

Question: If the other two fights are against people you call "easy" opponents and they will make him the most money in his career, why would PBF choose the Spinks fight? Maybe those two fighters arent as easy as you and others seem to think. Would I put money on them to beat PBF? No. But i dont think either of them will be pushovers.

I dont want to see Floyd lose. I just want to see him fight the best available fighters and right now they are Baldomir and Margarito.

Cool, I understand what you are saying. Well, it is a good thing that he is fighting Baldomir now as it is the most fan-pleasing of available fights. It just seems to me that everything is being directed at the DLH fight which is why I didn't see too much of a problem with Spinks IF the DLH fight was going to be at 154. That is also why money wasn't an issue here because the DLH fight will most likely end up being the most lucrative fight in history, so I could see why he would take the Spinks fight as a tuneup for DLH for less money at 154 if they were to fight at 154. Maybe DLH will go back down to Welterweight which will make the fight even more enticing if Floyd has the undisputed title. And for the record, I don't think DLH can beat him...

[utexas]

Re: Pretty Boy Floyd vs. Corey Spinks looks to be on...

First, Evander never fought at middleweight. He was the Light Heavyweight Bronze medalist, unified Cruiserweight Champion, and recognized heavyweight champ during his career.

Second, just go on google. It is common knowledge that Tyson paid $4 million to Lewis to step aside and let Tyson fight Seldon for the WBA title.

And Lennox and Evander avoided Tyson when he was on his rise? Well, it would have been tough for them to fight Tyson "when he was on his rise," as Lennox had not turned pro yet and Evander was still a cruiserweight.

It is not a big deal. You talked about something you had no background knowledge on. Lennox was ducked via actions or words by Foreman, Evander, Tyson, Bowe, and many others. Foreman said he could not beat him, Bowe did not want to lose again embarrassingly to Lennox, Evander dragged his feet, and a broke Tyson paid him millions.

I was wrong about Lenox Lewis, you are right about when his career started in relation to Tyson's. I haven't been able to find anything about a 4 million dollar payment not to fight though.

[thelwig14]

Re: Pretty Boy Floyd vs. Corey Spinks looks to be on...

I was wrong about Lenox Lewis, you are right about when his career started in relation to Tyson's. I haven't been able to find anything about a 4 million dollar payment not to fight though.

You must have gotten a late start as a boxing fan as the "duckage payment" is common knowledge. Try keywords in google and all the info you need will come up. Some are:

Tyson paid Lennox
Lennox is a bad mother so I don't have a chance
I wish I had a belt so I could take Riddick's route and throw it in the trash can
My niece could whup Seldon
Lennox owned me when we were 16 too
I can beat him if I can grow 8 inches in the next week and fight like Ali

Any of those should bring up whatever you need on google.

[utexas]

Re: Pretty Boy Floyd vs. Corey Spinks looks to be on...

I finally found it on Wilkepedia, I seriously didn't know that. i appreciate the education. However according to what I just read this was right after he got out of prison and he had only fought McNelly. Fighting Lennox at that point would have been a worse beating than when they finally fought years later. Tyson fighting Lennox at any point would have lead to loss simply because of the styles and size difference. With the size of some of these guys, I wonder if we will ever see a super heavyweight dicision.