NEW Analog STRIKING mechanics (concept, ideas, discussions)

[SUGATA]

Started separate thread b/c for making not only discussion but new concept of analog striking.


Honestly, i like EA MMA and Boxing ANALOG STICK STRIKING for sim games much more than Face buttons striking (BUTTONS STRIKING). Why?

BUTTONS STRIKING:
- up to 4 inputs for one strike

- more inputs = more possible conflicts with other moves (like sways, for ex)

- more inputs = more % of wrong non controllable fail = more random / frustration

- harder to learn/ not intuitive

- not realistic feel

+ release Right analog stick for some one also like Swaying (but as a solution we can make RS Swaying through button modifier like Block button R2 for ex).


ANALOG STICK STRIKING
+ less inputs for one strike

+ less inputs = less problems in combining different elements of the game

+ less inputs = less % wrong non controllable fail = less random / frustration

+ easier to learn/more intuitive

+ can have more depth - by bringing analog value (full tilt = strong strike version, but tilt = weak version)

+ more variability - by not only directions but also quarter/half circle patterns for some unique types of strikes.

+ more realistic feel, b/c tilting/rotating Analog stick IS like trowing/arcing your Hand or Leg. not just press button.

+ more realistic results, b/c better and faster input skill (from training in practice) "feeling the flow of movement" will launch faster the strike/combo. More skill value

+ more fluidity of Combo from Sways for ex by R2+RS sway, then release R2 and keep holding RS as a correct strike.



ANALOG STICK STRIKE CONCEPT:

LS - Locomotion

RS - Striking (here may be different ideas of patterns, we could take it from other games or open to discuss here).

R2 - High block

R2+RS - Swaying (no Blocking during Sway)

L2 - Low modifier for Low Block (L2+R2) and Strikes

L2+ A/B/X/Y - appropriate Grapple block

L1 - Legs modifier:

L1 + LS - advanced Lunges and other Footwork special

L1 + RS - Kicks.

R1 - Special (Technique) modifier. Also dont forget that we could have 2 types for every strike directon - full or half tilted RS; also RS circling patterns (quarter circle, half circle) could become another strike types).

So it is possible to make MAX 2-3 input for the most difficult strike: Body Jumping Knee as L2+L1+RS
also
Not 2 buttons by ONE finger for Uppercuts - this is the MOST complaining thing.

X - SC Clinch attempt (holding for filling up TM, R1 makes a Powerful version)

Y - MT Clinch

A - SL TD

B - DL TD

On the GROUND:

RS - Striking

LS - Transitions/Grappling moves (instead of RS as we have now in EA UFC 3, now we use LS on the ground very few)


FighNight Champion Analog striking layout:




This is still a rough concept of Analog striking for the next EA UFC 4 game. If the idea will have enough attention from Devs, then here with community help we can summarize and finalize the Analog striking LAYOUT with ALL details and fixes.


There could be possible to 2 TYPES of SCHEME in the game, the same way as they already exists in OTHER EA Titles:

1. Classic - strikes on face buttons as we have now in EA UFC 3.

2. Alternative - Analog stick striking.

As i remember Fight Night has similar setting.

So, everyone could choose the best for him type of controls.

<iframe src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/OSjXMYwitig" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen="" width="560" height="315" frameborder="0"></iframe>


> Feel free to comment, complain, asking about any though issues and conflicts with this Analog types of Striking.

[The_Waterboy92]

Re: NEW Analog STRIKING mechanics (concept, ideas, discussions)

I like this idea just have 2 questions that come to mind right away.

1) how would targeting the body work? So if I want to throw a straight to the body or a body hook what would that control look like?

2) how would the more specialized moves work such as spinning back fist, elbows, Superman punch?

[SUGATA]

Re: NEW Analog STRIKING mechanics (concept, ideas, discussions)

I like this idea just have 2 questions that come to mind right away.

1) how would targeting the body work? So if I want to throw a straight to the body or a body hook what would that control look like?

2) how would the more specialized moves work such as spinning back fist, elbows, Superman punch?

R2 - High block

R2+RS - Swaying (no Blocking during Sway)

L2 - Low modifier for Low Block (L2+R2) and Strikes

L2+ A/B/X/Y - appropriate Grapple block

L1 - Legs modifier:

L1 + LS - advanced Lunges and other Footwork special

L1 + RS - Kicks.

R1 - Special (Technique) modifier. Also dont forget that we could have 2 types for every strike directon - full or half tilted RS; also RS circling patterns (quarter circle, half circle) could become another strike types).
So it is possible to make MAX 2-3 input for the most difficult strike: Body Jumping Knee as L2+L1+RS
also
Not 2 buttons by ONE finger for Uppercuts - this is the MOST complaining thing.

X - SC Clinch attempt (holding for filling up TM, R1 makes a Powerful version)

Y - MT Clinch

A - SL TD

B - DL TD

[Haz_____]

Re: NEW Analog STRIKING mechanics (concept, ideas, discussions)

No. No. No. No. Please god no.

I'm actually playing through FNC right now. Just finished the Champion mode a few days ago, and running a CAB through Legacy mode now.

I absolutely hate the stick control. It feels wildly imprecise.

[SUGATA]

Re: NEW Analog STRIKING mechanics (concept, ideas, discussions)

No. No. No. No. Please god no.

I'm actually playing through FNC right now. Just finished the Champion mode a few days ago, and running a CAB through Legacy mode now.

I absolutely hate the stick control. It feels wildly imprecise.

There could be possible to 2 TYPES of SCHEME in the game, the same way as they already exists in OTHER EA Titles:

1. Classic - Button striking, strikes on face buttons as we have now in EA UFC 3.

2. Alternative - Analog stick striking.

As i remember Fight Night has similar setting.

So, everyone could choose the best for him type of controls.


<iframe src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/OSjXMYwitig" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen="" width="560" height="315" frameborder="0"></iframe>

[LoveThisLife]

Re: NEW Analog STRIKING mechanics (concept, ideas, discussions)

There can be possible to 2 TYPES of SCHEME, the same way as they already exists in OTHER EA Titles:

1. Classic - strikes on face buttons as we have now in EA UFC 3.

2. Alternative - Analog stick striking.

As i remember Fight Night has similar setting.

So, everyone could choose the best for him type of controls.

This I disagree with.

There should be no alternate controls. This was a major issue within EA MMA.

FNC has extremely accurate and precise controls (analog) compared to EA UFC 3. There were no dropped inputs and no input delay. I am still on the top 100 leaderboard after not playing for about 7 years so I know.

That game was excellent with respect to control responsiveness and accuracy.

SUGATA,

What do you think of using the buttons for the ground game?

For example:

Triangle = Posture up

Square = move left

Circle = Move right

X = block transition/initiate sub or something

This is very similar to EA MMA but you could add modifiers for different positions on the ground.

[LoveThisLife]

Re: NEW Analog STRIKING mechanics (concept, ideas, discussions)

No. No. No. No. Please god no.

I'm actually playing through FNC right now. Just finished the Champion mode a few days ago, and running a CAB through Legacy mode now.

I absolutely hate the stick control. It feels wildly imprecise.

I respect you opinion. However, if you are having precision issues using the analog controls in that Masterpiece of a game... you need to try the skill games (which actually help A LOT).

[SUGATA]

Re: NEW Analog STRIKING mechanics (concept, ideas, discussions)

This I disagree with.

There should be no alternate controls. This was a major issue within EA MMA.

FNC has extremely accurate and precise controls (analog) compared to EA UFC 3. There were no dropped inputs and no input delay. I am still on the top 100 leaderboard after not playing for about 7 years so I know.

That game was excellent with respect to control responsiveness and accuracy.

SUGATA,

What do you think of using the buttons for the ground game?

For example:

Triangle = Posture up

Square = move left

Circle = Move right

X = block transition/initiate sub or something

This is very similar to EA MMA but you could add modifiers for different positions on the ground.

No, Transitions must to be performed on Analog sticks b/c of the feature PERFECT SWOOP - which allows to neglect Reversal and decrease Transition stamina costs (it require Skill = mor mastering in the game and depth) by swooping RS at the end time of holding it; with buttons holding we will loose this awesome feature!

[Reinfarcements]

Re: NEW Analog STRIKING mechanics (concept, ideas, discussions)

Yeah I'm not a fan of analog controls either honestly. Sounds kinda cool on paper, but at the end of the day the buttons feel way more consistent in my opinion.

So this is gonna have to be a no for me dog.

[RetractedMonkey]

NEW Analog STRIKING mechanics (concept, ideas, discussions)

The implication that the stick is in any way more accurate or intuitive to learn is total AIDS.

That guy who fought against a bunch of people about the button mapping in that last topic’s motives suddenly become a little more clear.

He was great at FNC and loved the stick controls, but failed to excel at UFC. Blames it on how not everyone has the time to learn all of it, but then claims to be top 100 on FNC to this day. Those dudes have thousands of fights at this point. That must have taken quite a lot of time.

Man, most complaints really do boil down to wanting to be good at a game they aren’t.

And he doesn’t want there to be buttons as well. Very transparent here.

I didn’t read this because Sugata’s posts are a formatting nightmare, so maybe he has some convoluted solution to this issue, but if head movement is tied to a modifier and the stick, how are you going to use head movement and then immediately strike with any sort of finesse?

Using half pushes on the stick for different punches? Are you insane? People complain about dead zones and the stick now. Oh my god.

Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[LoveThisLife]

Re: NEW Analog STRIKING mechanics (concept, ideas, discussions)

The implication that the stick is in any way more accurate or intuitive to learn is total AIDS.

That guy who fought against a bunch of people about the button mapping in that last topic’s motives suddenly become a little more clear.

He was great at FNC and loved the stick controls, but failed to excel at UFC. Blames it on how not everyone has the time to learn all of it, but then claims to be top 100 on FNC to this day. Those dudes have thousands of fights at this point. That must have taken quite a lot of time.

Man, most complaints really do boil down to wanting to be good at a game they aren’t.

And he doesn’t want there to be buttons as well. Very transparent here.

I didn’t read this because Sugata’s posts are a formatting nightmare, so maybe he has some convoluted solution to this issue, but if head movement is tied to a modifier and the stick, how are you going to use head movement and then immediately strike with any sort of finesse?

Using half pushes on the stick for different punches? Are you insane? People complain about dead zones and the stick now. Oh my god.

Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

I am not the best at ea ufc 3 but i am in the top 50....uhhh next please.

[RetractedMonkey]

NEW Analog STRIKING mechanics (concept, ideas, discussions)

I am not the best at ea ufc 3 but i am in the top 50....uhhh next please.

The top 100 leaderboard means absolutely nothing. Especially at this stage of the game where many of the top players quit playing ranked competitively. There is a massive discrepancy in skills between the top 100 and those in the ESFL. There is some overlap however, I don’t recall ever seeing you fight.

It’s irrelevant anyway seeing as that’s not really my point, how skilled you are in a vacuum. It’s the fact that you were better at Fight Night Champion and clearly want the UFC games catered towards that style so you can be better than you are now.

Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[LoveThisLife]

Re: NEW Analog STRIKING mechanics (concept, ideas, discussions)

The top 100 leaderboard means absolutely nothing. Especially at this stage of the game where many of the top players quit playing ranked competitively. There is a massive discrepancy in skills between the top 100 and those in the ESFL. There is some overlap however, I don’t recall ever seeing you fight.

It’s irrelevant anyway seeing as that’s not really my point, how skilled you are in a vacuum. It’s the fact that you were better at Fight Night Champion and clearly want the UFC games catered towards that style so you can be better than you are now.

Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

To some extent you are right, however, it is not for selfish reasons.

I can just recognize that the best striking experience I have experienced was FNC. I also found the TSC in EA MMA wonderful (after several patched which eliminated hook spam and other spam issues).

Once again, with TSC, there were no dropped inputs, no delay in response. Frankly, if you had an issue with the TSC you needed to up your skill by working with someone that knew what they were doing or practicing the skill games.

As Gameplay Dev already conceded, there are FAR TOO MANY modifiers in this game... there is no excuse for needing to press 4 buttons for 1 strike.

TSC is much more intuitive and will give us a more dynamic striking experience.

[SUGATA]

Re: NEW Analog STRIKING mechanics (concept, ideas, discussions)

I am not the best at ea ufc 3 but i am in the top 50....uhhh next please.

Dont waste your time on this person, his only hobby on this forum is to provoke and insult others personally, so the people paid attention to him and his empty posts. I dont remember any useful and helpful for the game or community infos from him here.

And i am not surprised that he criticize other ideas even W/O reading them.
Proof:

but if head movement is tied to a modifier and the stick, how are you going to use head movement and then immediately strike with any sort of finesse?

+ more fluidity of Combo from Sways for ex by R2+RS sway, then release R2 and keep holding RS as a correct strike.

W/O SWITCHING your finger from RS sway to face buttons as we have NOW.

_____________________________________________

Honestly, i dont think that adding 2 types (classic button and alternative analog stick) will be bad - everyone will have a CHOICE.

[LoveThisLife]

Re: NEW Analog STRIKING mechanics (concept, ideas, discussions)

Dont waste your time on this person, his only hobby on this forum is to provoke and insult others personally, so the people paid attention to him and his empty posts. I dont remember any useful and helpful for the game or community infos from him here.

And i am not surprised that he criticize other ideas even W/O reading them.
Proof:

W/O SWITCHING your finger from RS sway to face buttons as we have NOW.

_____________________________________________

Honestly, i dont think that adding 2 types (classic button and alternative analog stick) will be bad - everyone will have a CHOICE.

Thanks for the words.

It may work have two different configs, however, the issue we had before was that button config people were able to pull of hooks with ridiculous speed and those of us with the stick, obviously, had to go through the entire motion to pull off the hook