Take down denials and transition counters..

[mannyonelover]

Is it me but I’m having extreme difficulty denying takedowns and timing counter transitions...UFC 3 that was my bread and butter on the ground game and reversing transitions and takedowns something here is not clicking.?
Please tell me that the transition windows for counters will be back to normal..!?


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[Good Grappler]

Re: Take down denials and transition counters..

When you say “reversing transitions” what do you mean? Are you referring to the ground reversals you get when you deny a transition? Those work the same as in UFC 3 as far as I’m aware: deny early enough, get a sweep.

If you’re referring to something else lemme know.

As far as takedowns being hard to deny, 100% agreed with you there. When it comes to shoot TDs from striking range, they just feel way too fast, especially when they are attempted randomly in the middle of an exchange. It’s like my opponent is carrying me over their head doing a victory lap around the octagon before I even know what’s happening.

I have a theory that part of the issue is the denial input being temporarily “deactivated” during certain animations. Like, if I shoot and miss a takedown, and my opponent shoots a takedown while the animation of me missing a TD is still happening, it feels undeniable. Would need to test it more of course.

The clinch TDs (trips/slams) are frustrating to deny, but for different reasons. It’s not that they’re too fast - in fact you can even deny them quite late, and still get a nifty scramble escape. Hell you can deny a clinch trip towards the end of the animation and still scramble free (it’s pretty cool looking). The problem with the clinch TDs is that if you’re blocking strikes, waiting to deny a backpack transition, or trying to deny a standing sub attempt, it’s extremely difficult to suddenly switch to denying the TD.

All that being said, I do like the extremely heavy “wrestling vibe” of the game. It’s like, in any situation, at any time, you have to be thinking about wrestling. You have to be ready to sprawl. Any random exchange can result in a takedown attempt. I find myself being weary about a takedown attempt for basically the entirety of a match, especially when I’m fighting a wrestler.

I mean, that’s sort of how it is in real life, right? If you’re fighting a wrestler, every element of your strategy should be revolved around being prepared to defend a takedown. Every strike, every kick, every exchange, you should be thinking about wrestling.

Again, though. Problem is that even when you ARE thinking about the TD, they still come so quick, it’s almost impossible to deny.

I definitely think shoot takedowns - ESPECIALLY the power takedowns - could use a nerf. There should be a much larger window to deny, and these late denials should result in clinch positions where the defender has a “second chance”, if you will. I love when takedowns turn into clinch exchanges, and as the offensive wrestler, I love when I score a takedown on that second attempt that comes after failing the initial shot. It’s almost a buzzkill when my shot results in an immediate takedown, because I WANTED that chain wrestling, clinch exchange/reshoot battle. I mean, obviously getting a successful TD on the initial shot is fine too, I just think it’s too easy RN.

I’d like to see shoot TDs be more like clinch TDs, where late denials are still viable.

[mannyonelover]

Re: Take down denials and transition counters..

When you say “reversing transitions” what do you mean? Are you referring to the ground reversals you get when you deny a transition? Those work the same as in UFC 3 as far as I’m aware: deny early enough, get a sweep.



If you’re referring to something else lemme know.



As far as takedowns being hard to deny, 100% agreed with you there. When it comes to shoot TDs from striking range, they just feel way too fast, especially when they are attempted randomly in the middle of an exchange. It’s like my opponent is carrying me over their head doing a victory lap around the octagon before I even know what’s happening.



I have a theory that part of the issue is the denial input being temporarily “deactivated” during certain animations. Like, if I shoot and miss a takedown, and my opponent shoots a takedown while the animation of me missing a TD is still happening, it feels undeniable. Would need to test it more of course.



The clinch TDs (trips/slams) are frustrating to deny, but for different reasons. It’s not that they’re too fast - in fact you can even deny them quite late, and still get a nifty scramble escape. Hell you can deny a clinch trip towards the end of the animation and still scramble free (it’s pretty cool looking). The problem with the clinch TDs is that if you’re blocking strikes, waiting to deny a backpack transition, or trying to deny a standing sub attempt, it’s extremely difficult to suddenly switch to denying the TD.



All that being said, I do like the extremely heavy “wrestling vibe” of the game. It’s like, in any situation, at any time, you have to be thinking about wrestling. You have to be ready to sprawl. Any random exchange can result in a takedown attempt. I find myself being weary about a takedown attempt for basically the entirety of a match, especially when I’m fighting a wrestler.



I mean, that’s sort of how it is in real life, right? If you’re fighting a wrestler, every element of your strategy should be revolved around being prepared to defend a takedown. Every strike, every kick, every exchange, you should be thinking about wrestling.



Again, though. Problem is that even when you ARE thinking about the TD, they still come so quick, it’s almost impossible to deny.



I definitely think shoot takedowns - ESPECIALLY the power takedowns - could use a nerf. There should be a much larger window to deny, and these late denials should result in clinch positions where the defender has a “second chance”, if you will. I love when takedowns turn into clinch exchanges, and as the offensive wrestler, I love when I score a takedown on that second attempt that comes after failing the initial shot. It’s almost a buzzkill when my shot results in an immediate takedown, because I WANTED that chain wrestling, clinch exchange/reshoot battle. I mean, obviously getting a successful TD on the initial shot is fine too, I just think it’s too easy RN.



I’d like to see shoot TDs be more like clinch TDs, where late denials are still viable.

Yes I’m referring to the transition reversals when timed right...
And during a take down I could reverse reverse the takedown by timing it and end up in side control in UFC 3..
It just seems that the windows four transition reversals and takedowns are much smaller...?


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[Seymorslash]

Re: Take down denials and transition counters..

I got the TD reversals semi consistently, being ready helps, but they are possible on pure reaction. I'm not exactly if inputs had anything to do with it but I sprawl position from denying a TD by holding L2+R2 and holding back on the left stick. I got over under by Holding R2+L2 and holding up on the left stick. There were some where I'd get taken down but then immediately pop back up like you'd see in real life, not quite sure how I did those though.

[Find_the_Door]

Re: Take down denials and transition counters..

Yes I’m referring to the transition reversals when timed right...
And during a take down I could reverse reverse the takedown by timing it and end up in side control in UFC 3..
It just seems that the windows four transition reversals and takedowns are much smaller...?


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We do NOT need wider transition reversal windows. Work on your timing - goodness

[Irish0331]

Re: Take down denials and transition counters..

I played against the AI on easy in an effort just to try and learn what the hell to do with the news button schemes (which I'm still clueless about)...but I had fair success in defending TD's and denying transitions (no reversals yet).