The E is clueless

[Lintyfresh85]

Re: The E is clueless

just to add more fuel to the fire...

Punk is currently in the doghouse, probably as he disagreed with the layout of the Elimination Chamber match with Arn Anderson and Michael Heyes who were the producers for it. For this weeks ECW TV Dave Lagana had written that Punk should get Holly in the vice and Holly should turn over, grab a rope and pin Punk. In the production meeting when the TV was being put together the whole room turned on Punk when Lagana told them his idea. Arn Anderson especially was against him, saying the Holly should make Punk pay his dues as he's just "Heyman' guy" and not any good so Holly shouldn't need to cheat to pin him. Anderson also said Punk was only over because Heyman fluked it and shouldn't be happening. Punk was personally told by Anderson that "after 14 years on being on WWE televison, Holly is the bigger star" as an explanation why the heel should pin the babyface clean. The actual finish was came up by Finlay.

Credit: Wrestling Observer Newsletter

But now for some semi-good news!

Vince has also suggest Punk should turn heel, saying "This straight edge stuff shows me he thinks he's better than everyone else." The funny thing is Vince has no idea that Punk's catchphrase when he first came into ROH as a heel was "Straight edge means I'm better than you!".

Credit: Wrestling Observer Newsletter

[Porschebenz2001]

Re: The E is clueless

LOL!!!

Punk is the greatest wrestler ever. He is the one man who could beat Tony Romo in a match.

I respect the guy a lot because he has been very successful on the indys. I've seen some of his ROH work and I was really impressed. I'd like to see him compete in a 15-20 minute match on a ppv with a wrestler as talented as him. I think the guy is over hyped, even though I am a big fan. How can a guy not be over hyped when he comes into the business with this much hype? His first match people were dying to call him overrated.

I hope the guy becomes a big success in the "clueless E" because I've become a big fan of his. But before we call him God's gift let's let him win a title, and not complain about the agents and bookers holding him down. Keep in mind this all came from the internet. If he's that big a star Vince won't bury him.

MassNole, as for Hardcore Holly I remember reading on wikipedia that guys like him will always have a spot in the company. They are good "hand" guys or something like that. They also mentioned Val and Scotty as being the same type of wrestler. Holly is just a midcarder who is gonna put Punk over. With the state of ECW right now, ratings declining, and RVD/Sabu possibly on the way out, they may have no choice to push him.

[CaptainZombie]

Re: The E is clueless

The way Big Show was being built over the summer, having Punk beat him wouldn't have been a good move. Here's a guy who could barely be beaten by The Undertaker, beat the crap out of dX, basically squashed Batista (though I doubt that was the original plan)...he was just booked as a huge monster the right the way. While that was happening, Punk was beating Shannon Moore and Mike Knox.

I agree, he's over enough to beat Holly, but if Holly loses, where does the heat go? Down the toliet, that's where. The face chasing the heel seems to be where they were going with the storyline anyway with Punk unable to win in five minutes that one week.

Big Show has been built up very well twice in his career with the WWE, because he was aligned with Paul Heyman as his manager both times. If it weren't for Heyman helping with the gimmick, he would be the same Big Show everyone complains about. With a good gimmick + wrestling talent (I think that Big Show does have talent for a big man) Big Show became the new ECW. I think that if someone else was given the title at that time, ECW would not have been as interesting to see the big man want to fight night in, night out.

On to CM Punk, I'm a big fan of his as many know. I think that the guy has already proven a few times on ECW SciFi how good of a wrestler that he can be if given the chance. Yes, Punk should have been beating Moore and Knox at the time as the guy needed to be built up. Did he deserve the title yet? No, I think he still has and needs time to develop to the WWE style since that is what they are trying to do with him.

Should Punk of lost to Holly? Not really imo. I really don't like Holly and anytime I see him in the ring, I think of Bob "Spark Plugg" Holly. I could have stomached if Punk lost to RVD, Test, Elijah Burke, or Sylvester Turkey than cool. Holly is a piece of **** if you ask me for being ultra stiff with people for no apparent reason.

Does Bobby Lashley deserve the ECW World Title? Hell NO! The guy has no mic skills and still needs development in the ring imo. I would have rather of seen TEST walk out with the title as he has really improved his in ring skills + better on the mic.

Holly is a piece of ****, he has been in the WWE for what, 14 years and now isn't even worthy of being a mid-card guy on their third tier promotion. Seriously, has he ever held a title besides the Hardcore Belt (as prestigious as that may be)? Good idea, job out one of your few young stars to a has been, correction never was, great way to try and get the talent to the top. Seriously, does Holly have incriminating pictures of Vince or something?

He held the tag titles with Crash, LOL!

Holly is a piece of **** again for the second time in my post. Before the Anti-Punk patrol comes along, if Punk were to lose as I stated above it would have been best to lose to someone more than Holly's stature.

[JiggidyJames]

Re: The E is clueless

I respect the guy a lot because he has been very successful on the indys. I've seen some of his ROH work and I was really impressed. I'd like to see him compete in a 15-20 minute match on a ppv with a wrestler as talented as him. I think the guy is over hyped, even though I am a big fan. How can a guy not be over hyped when he comes into the business with this much hype? His first match people were dying to call him overrated.

I hope the guy becomes a big success in the "clueless E" because I've become a big fan of his. But before we call him God's gift let's let him win a title, and not complain about the agents and bookers holding him down. Keep in mind this all came from the internet. If he's that big a star Vince won't bury him.

MassNole, as for Hardcore Holly I remember reading on wikipedia that guys like him will always have a spot in the company. They are good "hand" guys or something like that. They also mentioned Val and Scotty as being the same type of wrestler. Holly is just a midcarder who is gonna put Punk over. With the state of ECW right now, ratings declining, and RVD/Sabu possibly on the way out, they may have no choice to push him.

Good hands.

And yeah, you can't bury guys who are over like that. See: Van Dam, Rob

[ILLCHILL]

Re: The E is clueless

I was shocked watching that match when Holly pinned him. That being said, I truly don't think a guy loses his popularity when he loses clean to a heel (who I happen to like alot) in a very good match. It's not like he got squashed or anything. Just because 7/8 of this site is on CM Punk's nuts 24/7 it doesn't mean that WWE has to be. He is extremely over, and a loss in a good match to Holly shouldn't take that away. Plus, when they haver their final match, presumably the Rumble, Punk's presumed victory will be that much better. I like Punk and think he will be great very soon, but not yet. I hate when the fans wanna see a guy so talented and so promising pushed so early. I'm not comparing Punk's in-ring skills to Randy Orton's, but Orton has some great skills IMO and his push killed him for a while (granted, the face turn didn't help too much).

Bottom line is, I think the Holly win was better than if Punk won.

[MizzouBravesFan]

Re: The E is clueless

It's going to be tough for Punk to ever get over super huge in the E even though he's their brightest prospect and arguably the most over ECW wrestler.

It's just stuff like this and him being supposedly hated by HHH, Shawn Michaels, Stephanie McMahon, etc. that leads me to believe he'll ever by a huge star in the E.

I mean, I actually like the idea that was pitched for the EC with Punk choking out TBS with the Anaconda Vice. It was pretty obvious TBS wasn't coming out of that match with the title so why not throw in a wrinkle or two? That match was booked so horribly that it's not even funny...the fact that Punk and RVD were the first two out just goes to show how out of touch Vince is with the fans. But then again, it should've been obvious it would've went down like that considering Vince's ungodly fetish for huge, muscular men...I just thought it was ridiculous how he pretty much buried Punk and RVD in that match and gave a huge push to Lashley. It made no sense. He should've had RVD go over, turn Punk heel, and have him feud with RVD (you could even base it on Punk being straight edge and dabble into RVD's fondness of the sticky icky if you wanted) over the strap going into Wrestlemania where Punk could go over. To me that would've been a lot better than giving it to someone as bland as Lashley and then putting him in useless feuds with RVD, Test, etc.

I like seeing Punk do well and get over in the WWE but damn I wish he'd go back to ROH, he belongs there and for huge ROH marks like myself, it would be a welcomed sight.

[CaptainZombie]

Re: The E is clueless

I was shocked watching that match when Holly pinned him. That being said, I truly don't think a guy loses his popularity when he loses clean to a heel (who I happen to like alot) in a very good match. It's not like he got squashed or anything. Just because 7/8 of this site is on CM Punk's nuts 24/7 it doesn't mean that WWE has to be. He is extremely over, and a loss in a good match to Holly shouldn't take that away. Plus, when they haver their final match, presumably the Rumble, Punk's presumed victory will be that much better. I like Punk and think he will be great very soon, but not yet. I hate when the fans wanna see a guy so talented and so promising pushed so early. I'm not comparing Punk's in-ring skills to Randy Orton's, but Orton has some great skills IMO and his push killed him for a while (granted, the face turn didn't help too much).

Bottom line is, I think the Holly win was better than if Punk won.

I agree with you that Punk should not be pushed to the top for another year or so. The guy needs to pay his dues and be built up the right way. ECW is allowing WWE to slowly introduce him to people that aren't familiar w/ him.

Good Post

[MassNole]

Re: The E is clueless

I agree with you that Punk should not be pushed to the top for another year or so. The guy needs to pay his dues and be built up the right way. ECW is allowing WWE to slowly introduce him to people that aren't familiar w/ him.

Good Post

Meanwhile Umaga who debuted not all that much before Punk will be getting his second chance at the belt in the near future. I understand Punk needs to pay his dues whatever that means in the industry today, but given the craptastic ECW roster right now, he really should be in the thick of the title hunt, not jobbing to a never was like Holly.

[CaptainZombie]

Re: The E is clueless

It's going to be tough for Punk to ever get over super huge in the E even though he's their brightest prospect and arguably the most over ECW wrestler.

It's just stuff like this and him being supposedly hated by HHH, Shawn Michaels, Stephanie McMahon, etc. that leads me to believe he'll ever by a huge star in the E.

I mean, I actually like the idea that was pitched for the EC with Punk choking out TBS with the Anaconda Vice. It was pretty obvious TBS wasn't coming out of that match with the title so why not throw in a wrinkle or two? That match was booked so horribly that it's not even funny...the fact that Punk and RVD were the first two out just goes to show how out of touch Vince is with the fans. But then again, it should've been obvious it would've went down like that considering Vince's ungodly fetish for huge, muscular men...I just thought it was ridiculous how he pretty much buried Punk and RVD in that match and gave a huge push to Lashley. It made no sense. He should've had RVD go over, turn Punk heel, and have him feud with RVD (you could even base it on Punk being straight edge and dabble into RVD's fondness of the sticky icky if you wanted) over the strap going into Wrestlemania where Punk could go over. To me that would've been a lot better than giving it to someone as bland as Lashley and then putting him in useless feuds with RVD, Test, etc.

I like seeing Punk do well and get over in the WWE but damn I wish he'd go back to ROH, he belongs there and for huge ROH marks like myself, it would be a welcomed sight.

I agree w/ you about the EC being booked horribly and that a guy like Bobby Lashley that has no mic skills at all and still under developed in the ring should not be holding the ECW World Title. My choice would have been Test, he has improved all around. RVD and Sabu were both in the doghouse, Show was taking a break, Holly.................please, the guy doesn't deserve to even look at the World Title.

Punk has almost resigned with TNA when Joe came aboard and he wanted to wrestle another 1 hr match with him on PPV, but they wouldn't allow it. That's when he went the WWE/OVW route. For people that doubt his skills, I always say to check out his 60 minute draw match from ROH with Samoa Joe, classic match.

Back to WWE/ECW, pushing Punk to the World Title I think could be kinda risky. I always like to use Brock Lesnar and Randy Orton as example of pushed too soon and look at how they both have turned out. Orton still has a job because someone backstage really likes him ***cough VINCE cough***. Lesnar, I wish I knew what was going through his head leaving so soon. I wish the WWE would bring him back, one of the biggest guys that could actually wrestle.

[CaptainZombie]

Re: The E is clueless

Meanwhile Umaga who debuted not all that much before Punk will be getting his second chance at the belt in the near future. I understand Punk needs to pay his dues whatever that means in the industry today, but given the craptastic ECW roster right now, he really should be in the thick of the title hunt, not jobbing to a never was like Holly.

I really hate Holly as you guys can probably tell and Punk losing to him really boiled my blood. I don't mind Punk losing a match, but to Holly of all people. Just like everyone dislikes Umaga, I dislike Holly the most.

If anything, Punk should be wrestling to get to the title about now. He should be in feuds with guys like RVD, Sabu, Test after this feud with Holly ends. Then WWE should have someone from RAW or SD show up on ECW Punk is over with the crowd, but a few more feuds before he starts wrestling for the World Title won't hurt. I do feel pushing him too fast is kinda not good, and would like to see him go the Samoa Joe TNA route where they built him up like a monster and a World Title Contender.

[sven]

Re: The E is clueless

Arn Anderson has had it in for Punk since day one. He's a piece of ****.

[MassNole]

Re: The E is clueless

Arn Anderson has had it in for Punk since day one. He's a piece of ****.

Why does Vince hold onto these old timers in any useful capacity? Seriously, the WWE would be so much better off by hiring new blood for the positions these washed up geezers currently hold.

[CaptainZombie]

Re: The E is clueless

Arn Anderson has had it in for Punk since day one. He's a piece of ****.

Arn Anderson, Fit Finlay, Triple-H, Shawn Michaels, and Stephanie have had it in for the guy since day 1 according to rumors.

Why does Vince hold onto these old timers in any useful capacity? Seriously, the WWE would be so much better off by hiring new blood for the positions these washed up geezers currently hold.

Look at the crap young TV writers that they hire for storylines which have no clue about wrestling. I would go with some veterans for my staff since they know the business inside and out. I would throw in 1 or 2 writers from a TV show since they can bring in some neat ideas, and then mix it up with the rest of the writing team being knowledgeable people on the sport of pro wrestling.

[MassNole]

Re: The E is clueless

Dumb question, but if HHH, Steph, and HBK hate him so much, why did he team with DX at Survivor Series, and at that escape unpinned.

[CaptainZombie]

Re: The E is clueless

Dumb question, but if HHH, Steph, and HBK hate him so much, why did he team with DX at Survivor Series, and at that escape unpinned.

Thats the rumor that has been going on from the time he came to the WWE and many talk about it here on OS a lot.