Data On Revamped Playcalling

[tdogg097]

I did slow sim on the first 16 games of the season. 32 different playbooks. The run-pass ratio was 37:63. While it seems close to the NFL average of 43:57 , over the course of a season that is a big difference. The highest run percentage by any team was 50.8%, the lowest was 23.5%. Is it better than 24 or 25? If so, only slightly. EA sold a revamped playcalling system based on years of data, I'm not seeing it.

One team that was particularly frustrating to watch was the Eagles. They had 52 drop backs and 22 rushes, it was a close game throughout. EA has a lot of work to do under the hood with the sacks and robo QB issues. Like last year, I doubt EA will even acknowledge this as a problem. Guess I'll be testing playbooks again for better ratios. Or maybe I should just stop getting suckered into buying this game

[Kramer5150]

This is what I was kind of afraid of TBH, in my time with the beta the playcalling was definitely improved from last year so much so in fact that the cpu actually kept me on my toes, and now since the full release it's definitely become more predictable.

[cch99]

It has seemed a bit better but I mentioned this before. Part of me feels like they added the coach pic, little write up and now it’s one play but the play calling seems eerily similar to last year.

Almost how like at default penalties they tell you it’s based on NFL averages.


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[WiiMaster]

You people always love to speculate about this stuff but on PC we can actually find tangible evidence one way or the other, so zero need for speculation.

The system is indeed new and revamped using an actual ML model. Not just a buzzword. It does have issues but it is definitely not the old system (which can still be turned back on in config files).

This is what I was kind of afraid of TBH, in my time with the beta the playcalling was definitely improved from last year so much so in fact that the cpu actually kept me on my toes, and now since the full release it's definitely become more predictable.

They did tweak all the models from beta to launch, presumably to fix some of the issues like the extreme 4th down aggression. But also, naturally as you play the game more you will get used to it. That's a given any year.

[cch99]

That’s great. I believe you that it’s different. I’m on console. It still sucks that a person can run slow sim for all week 1 games and have a 37-63 run/pass split.

Or that I can personally play week 1 Eagles/Cowboys and have the eagles throw 20 times and have 2 called runs in the first half.

Why is it still such an issue? It’s frustrating.


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[Cycloniac]

That’s great. I believe you that it’s different. I’m on console. It still sucks that a person can run slow sim for all week 1 games and have a 37-63 run/pass split.

Or that I can personally play week 1 Eagles/Cowboys and have the eagles throw 20 times and have 2 called runs in the first half.

Why is it still such an issue? It’s frustrating.


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I'd be curious about how the teams were doing success-wise when they ran the ball. What was the YPC? Were they doing well passing?

All of that you have to factor in. It's not so simple as the run-pass ratio should be this. You want a smart system that will lean into what is working as well.

[djflock]

WE dont need to factor in anything. The dev team should be testing their game, in franchise, to diagnose and find the reason why teams dont run enough. If its because of the success, as you mention, then they should figure that out and increase the success of the run.

We pay 75-100$ for this game. We shouldnt have to identify and find these front facing issues that would take a dev 3 hours of playing in franchise to see.

[tdogg097]

I've had games where the CPU finished with 200 yards rushing on less than 30 attempts and they still finish with 45+ pass attempts. The last 16 game slow sim I ran using every team and playbook, the run-pass ratio was 33:67. Average yard per carry was 4.0. It's not a success problem. The playcalling is worse the more you pay attention. It looks and feels exactly like m24 and 25..

[cch99]

Maybe they have improved play calling based on success since last year. I haven't played enough to know for sure but I can't imagine that it mattered at all last year or if so very slighty.

I can't tell you the numbers of times the last couple years where the CPU is average 5+ per carry and the QB was under 50% with three picks and in a tight game still not leaning into the run.

Or how many times I'd be trailing by 10+ points with under 4 minutes to go in a game and the CPU proceeds to go 3 and out with 3 straight passes.

Their deep dives say that they are taking more account of the coach and game situations for playcalling. I know WiiMaster said that the play calling has actually changed under the hood. I do believe it's definitely better but their new system hasn't fixed all the issues in my opinion.

[tdogg097]

I have absolutely seen the same thing as last year. I just watched a game where the Commanders were up 23-13 under 2 minutes with the Packers having less than 3 timeouts. Daniels proceeds to throw 3 incompletions to force a 3 and out. I have also seen games where teams are averaging 8+ ypc and they have a 25:75 ratio. If there was improvement from last year it is minimal at best

[tdogg097]

Another slow sim game. Bengals win 43-7. The game was 20-0 at the half. 37-0 after the 3rd quarter. They had 50 pass drop backs to 26 rush attempts. 34:66 run-pass ratio by a team that dominated another. To me, what I'm seeing the more I test is the same from the last couple of years. Plays called based on down and distance only, no influence from the actual game situation.

[cch99]

This is what it feels like when I am playing. That's kind of what I was saying before. So according to a person who can see the code they changed playcalling in the coding yet it feels so much like previous years. At his point it's a bust. They still can't figure out how to get the CPU to call plays like you would expect a coach to do even with an entirely new system ??

They've also not been able to figure out how to have a team that is really succeeding at one aspect (run or pass) to stick with it.

Did a quick search online. This was an AI response but here goes. With a one-score lead teams run 65% of the time in the 4th quarter. With a 2 score lead 75% of the time they run in the 4th. That's not getting into the minutia of under 2 minutes. I generally do not see this. I've played games where I am getting killed and the CPU almost refused to run.

Disappointing to say the least. I still think the game feels better than last year but if a team is killing me on the ground I want them to run it down my throat, especially if they aren't moving the ball through the air. I also want them to take out a QB who is playing terrible, especially a lower rated on but I think that's a pipedream at this point.

[tdogg097]

I've pretty much come to the conclusion the only way to achieve this is to pickup a 2nd controller and play against yourself. Just playing offense is also an option.

[cch99]

Had a great game Panthers Vs Jags (me). I lost in OT but the Panthers really mixed it up. Hubbard had 20 for 83 and the backups had a couple carries.

Then go to next game Cardinals Vs Saints(me) First Half Arizona had 29 drop backs and 4 called runs. They are leading 6-3 at Half.

Good times.


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[cch99]

Cardinals ended up with running a bit more in the second half. Not great but better. On a side note: if you are a Saints fan. They are going to struggle in Madden. Rattler was 6-15 for 40 yards in 1st half. I couldn’t do anything. Brought in Shough. He was around 50% but threw 2 picks. List 30-13.


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