Madden NFL 15 Trailer - See The Transformation This June, Releases on August 26th

[FaceMask]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Trailer - See The Transformation This June, Releases on August 26th

All you ever need to know about the developers of this game was stated by themselves when Madden 13 was released. Being able to throw the football OVER a defender was actually touted as an accomplishment in the game. Imagine not being able to hit the cutoff man in a baseball game or throw a bounce pass in an NBA game. This is what was actually touted as an "advancement" for this game. Not to mention, it STILL has issues. If you've had a chance to play the Show, you will realize how incredibly inept the development strategy for Madden is.

I hate Baseball, and I mean HATE it. But I love MLB The Show. How does that happen? Because when a game is that well done it can't be denied. The game is amazing.

Comparing MLB The Show's development progress to Madden's is like comparing the modern Homosapien to the Pre-Historic Man dragging his knuckles and still trying to walk upright.

We've gone 10 years and have a silly game. Paper folding bodies...

Here is Aaron Rubber, er, I mean Rodgers @ 9:16 of this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UGXQR2svoTs&index=2&list=FL7xk5szFqjtqjF-fb02zD3w

It's all very sad and depressing. I will always continue to hold out hope that as a die hard football fan, I can get a realistic, simulation game that actually blows me away. Nothing in Madden blows you away. Instead, you find yourself saying, "are you serious?", "what the hell was he doing there?", etc. etc. Especially after seeing the same ridiculous spin and fall forward for 5 yards animation that the RBs do about 20 times a game, even when their momentum and the laws of physics say otherwise.

Exactly, man. I don't understand what all this spinning around is supposed to be. Players in this game get hit and start barrel rolling, even during tackles where clearly the guy should just go down clean. There is just too much extra movement where it shouldn't be.

And then sometimes a guy will get hit from the side or behind, but they'll go down so immediately that it's like it skips a ton of frames and they're suddenly down. This is a deficiency you commonly see in indie-level games and I give that a pass, but at the AAA level?

I also don't understand why ball carriers get blown up so much in this game, it's too arcade in that regard. Even players who in real life have never been seen getting blown up ever, get blown up in Madden easily and constantly. If players got blown up that much in real life, there wouldn't be an injury report after every game, there'd be an obituary roll.

[TheRealHST]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Trailer - See The Transformation This June, Releases on August 26th

@GiantBlue76 its still damn near impossible to throw over a defender. That has been one of my biggest gripes for years

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[Hooe]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Trailer - See The Transformation This June, Releases on August 26th

With respect to comparisons between Madden NFL and The Show with respect to strategic depth - it's my opinion that the average professional baseball fan (and also the average professional basketball fan) is by-and-large more intelligent with respect to the strategies of the sport than the average football fan. As such there's a profound difference in the target audience from where I sit.

The average football fan doesn't understand things like one-gap vs two-gap defensive assignments, motion TE vs a Y tight end, split end vs flanker, etc. etc. I'm not sure the average NFL fan is even aware of these things as concepts because the first-party NFL media and ESPN do not do a great job teaching how the game is played strategically, beyond a 4-3 front vs a 3-4 front (and even then these aren't explained very well either). There's no explanation as to how Wade Phillips' 3-4 is different from that of Dom Capers or Dick LeBeau. That Madden NFL is regarded as the premier football teaching tool for the masses - even though it is missing a good number of football fundamentals - is demonstrative of how greatly the NFL and ESPN have failed in this regard.

Further expanding on that, the NFL TV broadcast camera doesn't even show the play developing down the field during the live action. This is unlike basketball - which shows all ten players on the floor in the half court offense and thus things like pick-and-roll, pick-and-pop, off-ball screens, elevator screens, hedging screens, etc. must be explained because the user can see them - or baseball - where the audience can see the movement of the pitch thrown, and there's enough dead time between live ball moments to show the positions of the runners, what batter is on deck, and so on, so different types of pitches and offensive strategies (hit-and-run, sacrifice bunt, base-stealing strategies, infield alignments, etc.) must be explained. For baseball in particular, this doesn't even begin to account for that there are only eight possible configurations of runners, the game is on the pre-play level strategically simpler. By contrast, since the NFL broadcast by-and-large never shows the live downfield action and is always focused on the quarterback until he throws the ball, so a lot of defensive nuance in particular is left unexplained. The market for the "all-22" camera views offered by NFL's online services only exists because there's a segment of hardcore fans not satisfied by the baseline coverage of the sport the NFL offers.

Basically, I'm arguing that the NFL dumbs down its own product to maximize its target audience. As such, Madden NFL must be dumbed down by Tiburon to capture that dumbed-down target audience - as well as the even more general video game buying audience more interested in the Call of Duty and Battlefields of the world who may not even watch football (these games which EA Sports views as Madden's direct competition nowadays) - so said audience can reasonably understand how to play Madden the video game and succeed at it. As realistic as The Show is, no version of it has cracked 1 million units sold per VGChartz; the accuracy of that source notwithstanding, Madden sells multi-millions compared to The Show's 1 million (generous). The Show doesn't sell enough for anything it does to move the needle at EA Tiburon in any manner.

It's unfortunate for 90% of the population of this message board (if not more) which generally has more of a clue as to what's going on in a given football game beyond how many points their fantasy team's players have accumulated in a given week. Even having said all of the above, however, EA Tiburon could and indeed should take some initiative in progressing their game strategically, to progress Madden NFL as a game and a football teaching tool. I hope they do so, personally, because that's what it is going to take to keep me interested in the series.

[SageInfinite]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Trailer - See The Transformation This June, Releases on August 26th

I can only speak for myself and say the good sports games made me understand and appreciate their respective sports more. EA/Tiburon just don't see the payoff in making a more realistic game.

[Chiefsfan881129]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Trailer - See The Transformation This June, Releases on August 26th

No disrespect to anyone but I laugh at all the people saying the lack of news is Concerning or not good..

Well I disagree in fact I actually take it as a positive I say this because it means the devs are putting more effort into making a better product for not only the nfl and ea but for the fans in general. .

I remember everyone wanting a better improved product..

Well this may be the year yea some of u might be skeptical but think about it..

In years past ea put out Information early and did interviews and stuff early hyping up a game it wasn't. .

Well we all know how that played out old saying goes the more time u spend hyping up something the less time u have to work on it..

Making it a bad product. Now I info is slow to come out this year and everyone assumes no news is bad news I rather they wait till game is finished and no longer in ea hands b4 talking about the game and hyping it up this way it allows them to make a better game and make fans happy..

Yes no game will ever be perfect or bug and glitch free and none should ever expect it to be..

But all the silence this year I say is a great thing cuz perhaps it's a sign there getting serious and a better product will be made with less bugs and glitches then past few years but to accomplish this ea needs all the time they can get and the less time they spend talking and hyping up a game the more time they have to make a better product. .

Besides it's what we want and it's likely what we will get people can't have it both ways

Either ask for information early get a bad product or wait and have patience and receive a fun enjoyable product.

I take all this silence as the best thing that could of happened because it a sign ea has gotten serious for once and will finally deliver a better product. .

I don't care if we don't get info till June or July every year from now on as long as there using that time to improve the quality of the product.

So no news is good news and hopefully that's a new sign of things to come for the better of everyone. .

Hope this helps explains another reason for a delay have a great day. . Go Chiefs!

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[N51_rob]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Trailer - See The Transformation This June, Releases on August 26th

You do know that marketing not developers control the flow of information right? Devs could be making the worst madden in years and marketing would be hyping it up for all to see. The developers don't market the game. There has been no information because its not June. That is when the marketing team for madden will start to make their money. It even says as much in the title of this post.

Only thing that is weird to me, is the lack of chatter from the Game "Changers". Those guys are usually talking somewhere and it doesn't seem to be the case this year. That could be good or bad.

[GiantBlue76]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Trailer - See The Transformation This June, Releases on August 26th

I don't think you can compare sales of the Show to a game like Madden. It's apples to oranges. First off, Madden has been around FAR longer than any of the other major sports games. Madden has 25 years of name recognition. Furthermore, NFL football is, by far, the most popular sport in America... by a landslide. Lastly, the Show is an exclusive title to playstation users. If the Show were a multi platform title, it would still not outsell Madden because it is baseball, but it would be in the ball park of games like NBA 2k.

As far as understanding concepts - there are plenty of ways to make a game accessible to players of all levels of understanding. Not to mention, providing football concept tutorials and leaving some of the learning up to the user are all things that could be a part of the game. Madden still has yet to provide settings to adjust the level of complexity and the sliders are broken. So instead, we get one game for everyone - which is never going to work well. These are all things that require effort and talent. Other studios have managed to accomplish them - even Tiburon managed to do some of this with madden during the ps2/xbox era. Some of the franchise management in old maddens was downright awesome. NFL head coach was impressive beyond belief.

Also, let's not kid ourselves... The NFL shield on the OUTSIDE of the box sells Madden, not the quality of what is actually inside the box.

[N51_rob]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Trailer - See The Transformation This June, Releases on August 26th

With respect to comparisons between Madden NFL and The Show with respect to strategic depth - it's my opinion that the average professional baseball fan (and also the average professional basketball fan) is by-and-large more intelligent with respect to the strategies of the sport than the average football fan. As such there's a profound difference in the target audience from where I sit.

The average football fan doesn't understand things like one-gap vs two-gap defensive assignments, motion TE vs a Y tight end, split end vs flanker, etc. etc. I'm not sure the average NFL fan is even aware of these things as concepts because the first-party NFL media and ESPN do not do a great job teaching how the game is played strategically, beyond a 4-3 front vs a 3-4 front (and even then these aren't explained very well either). There's no explanation as to how Wade Phillips' 3-4 is different from that of Dom Capers or Dick LeBeau. That Madden NFL is regarded as the premier football teaching tool for the masses - even though it is missing a good number of football fundamentals - is demonstrative of how greatly the NFL and ESPN have failed in this regard.

Further expanding on that, the NFL TV broadcast camera doesn't even show the play developing down the field during the live action. This is unlike basketball - which shows all ten players on the floor in the half court offense and thus things like pick-and-roll, pick-and-pop, off-ball screens, elevator screens, hedging screens, etc. must be explained because the user can see them - or baseball - where the audience can see the movement of the pitch thrown, and there's enough dead time between live ball moments to show the positions of the runners, what batter is on deck, and so on, so different types of pitches and offensive strategies (hit-and-run, sacrifice bunt, base-stealing strategies, infield alignments, etc.) must be explained. For baseball in particular, this doesn't even begin to account for that there are only eight possible configurations of runners, the game is on the pre-play level strategically simpler. By contrast, since the NFL broadcast by-and-large never shows the live downfield action and is always focused on the quarterback until he throws the ball, so a lot of defensive nuance in particular is left unexplained. The market for the "all-22" camera views offered by NFL's online services only exists because there's a segment of hardcore fans not satisfied by the baseline coverage of the sport the NFL offers.

Basically, I'm arguing that the NFL dumbs down its own product to maximize its target audience. As such, Madden NFL must be dumbed down by Tiburon to capture that dumbed-down target audience - as well as the even more general video game buying audience more interested in the Call of Duty and Battlefields of the world who may not even watch football (these games which EA Sports views as Madden's direct competition nowadays) - so said audience can reasonably understand how to play Madden the video game and succeed at it. As realistic as The Show is, no version of it has cracked 1 million units sold per VGChartz; the accuracy of that source notwithstanding, Madden sells multi-millions compared to The Show's 1 million (generous). The Show doesn't sell enough for anything it does to move the needle at EA Tiburon in any manner.

It's unfortunate for 90% of the population of this message board (if not more) which generally has more of a clue as to what's going on in a given football game beyond how many points their fantasy team's players have accumulated in a given week. Even having said all of the above, however, EA Tiburon could and indeed should take some initiative in progressing their game strategically, to progress Madden NFL as a game and a football teaching tool. I hope they do so, personally, because that's what it is going to take to keep me interested in the series.

As usual you make some great points.

The one are where the show continues to be the best sports game out there is in their ability to allow users to make the game their own. They provide OPTIONS AND WORKING SLIDERS that allow each user to craft the game to play the way they want. You can literally make the show as sim or arcade as you want. You have working sliders that control everything from how fast a 95 mph fastball gets to the plate, to his often the CPU will foul off pitches to how quickly relief pitchers get tired to the am strength of defenders and on and on. Not only that but they work. You bump one slider up or down you will instantly notice the effect it had.

They have an option to only have the pitcher throw strikes for goodness sake. I get that the level of knowledge for most football fans I'm one of those guys who had spent the entire off-season watching all-22 in my free time. But there is no excuse for me not to have the options to tune the game to be as hard or ready as I see fit.

That is what bugs me about madden they want me to play their game and won't allow me to make the game "mine" which for a sports game is just wrong. Madden makes it easier to have a 77-70 game than they do a 13-9 game because that is how they want the game to play.

I've had games in the show where the score was 12-10 with 22 combined his and I've had 1-0 games with a combined 4 hits, all in the same sliders and difficult level.

I didn't spend that much time with NBA2K but I got the same feeling in my time with that game.

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[splff3000]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Trailer - See The Transformation This June, Releases on August 26th

You do know that marketing not developers control the flow of information right? Devs could be making the worst madden in years and marketing would be hyping it up for all to see. The developers don't market the game. There has been no information because its not June. That is when the marketing team for madden will start to make their money. It even says as much in the title of this post.

Only thing that is weird to me, is the lack of chatter from the Game "Changers". Those guys are usually talking somewhere and it doesn't seem to be the case this year. That could be good or bad.

I don't really think you will be seeing much from the game changers this year or any other year for that matter. I'm pretty sure the cat is out of the bag in regards to them. I'm sure those guys will still probably go down and give their input but I doubt you see them hyping the game up like they usually do. I'm sure a lot of people know by now that a lot of that was marketing. The game changers program credit rating is most likely at an all time low with the hardcore fans so it probably wouldn't do much good to have them ranting and raving about how good madden is like they're normally doing around this time.

The absence of ANY substantial news by this time is pretty odd to me. I wouldn't say I'm concerned, but I AM quite curious as to what's going on. My gut tells me that they are waiting til E3 to show off a polished version of madden instead of showing crude mock ups throughout the year to tell us what they're working on. I also don't think it's a coincidence that NCAA isn't coming out this year and we haven't gotten any news. Over the years, there were a lot of times that I thought madden was just releasing info because ncaa was releasing info and they didn't want the fanboys wondering where the Madden news is. No NCAA this year so no need to rush madden news. That's just my take tho.

[Ueauvan]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Trailer - See The Transformation This June, Releases on August 26th

i don't want a game that requires the customers to spend months of effort to find a combination of sliders and penalties to actually get a decent game of football, and then change those depending if they want to be a superstar, play as a team in a game in ccm, coach only or sim.

[ch46647]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Trailer - See The Transformation This June, Releases on August 26th

I hope the Madden team can finally get the crowd noise right this year. It is amazing how engaged you become with a game when the atmosphere/presentation is on point. MLB The Show and NBA 2k do a great job of this.

HOWEVER, I will say that the best crowd atmosphere I have ever heard in a videogame was that brief gameplay clip EA UFC presented yesterday. This gives me hope that EA titles will really start nailing this aspect of their games.

CANNOT WAIT TO SEE THE EA NHL NEWS!

[jmurphy31]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Trailer - See The Transformation This June, Releases on August 26th

i don't want a game that requires the customers to spend months of effort to find a combination of sliders and penalties to actually get a decent game of football, and then change those depending if they want to be a superstar, play as a team in a game in ccm, coach only or sim.

Games should have sliders. Not all players are of equal skill. I always believe the more customization the better. Give us more options (presentation, skill level, penalties, etc). But also make them work correctly...

[Ueauvan]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Trailer - See The Transformation This June, Releases on August 26th

i agree about the presence of sliders but having to manipulate penalties to make the actual skill work is just wrong on so many levels

have sliders for skill/competency but as you say make em work properly

[Aggies7]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Trailer - See The Transformation This June, Releases on August 26th

The more and more I read over that list and look at the way halftime presentation is mentioned. I really believe it's just going to be like NCAA with highlights of your own game.

Obviously I would love to see highlights from other games during halftime, but don't see that happening. I would at least like to see updates from other games with score like 2Ks weekly recap show minus highlights.

[johnnyg713]

Re: Madden NFL 15 Trailer - See The Transformation This June, Releases on August 26th

After seeing all the UFC footage, I'm a little optimistic about this years game. I know they are two completely different games but what they've done with UFC is pretty impressive. Maybe this gen is what ea has been waiting for.