After the Last Patch, the Game is a Cheating Machine

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  • sonofthedude777
    Rookie
    • Nov 2014
    • 63

    #61
    Re: After the Last Patch, the Game is a Cheating Machine

    Originally posted by 4thQtrStre5S
    I have commented on the theory of the AI being programmed to comeback, or whatever anyone wishes to call it, in recent threads, and from that I decided to do my own tests as follows:

    In practice mode, I used a based 4-3 defense and then 3-4 in Cover 2 Man; I then ran an I-Form fade route play, the play name escapes me, but I believe it is in many playbooks under I-Form Pro, with both WR's doing fades on either side, and the TE doing a fade down the seam...

    The reason I ran this play was because the CPU, which was running the offense consistently, without failure, would throw to the primary WR.. I ran through 10 plays, and then I would switch the next lower rated CB over to the primary side and do another 10 plays, on so on..

    The results were, generally as follows:

    For relatively equal CB's in ratings to the WR, the win to loss, catch being a win and incomplete, interception, etc being a loss, after 10 plays they were even, or within 1 either in favor of WR or CB...But as I rotated out to lesser rated CB's the wins for the WR increased steadily as the DB ratings got worse; the last CB was rated 64 against a WR at OVR 89, with a 7-4 advantage for the WR..

    A couple of things I noticed within the experiment: the difference between wins and losses didn't deviate until I got to the 64 rated CB, all staying essentially 5-5 or 5-4 WR advantage against a 70's rated CB, but what changed was how well the CB prevented further progress by teh WR after the catch; so there is more to the win/loss scenario within the ratings besides just a catch or no catch...

    ALso... Ratings DO MATTER....These people running videos showing how Zero rated blockers at 5'6" tall and 160 pounds can block like players rated 99 are proving nothing, and it is my opinion that they are merely breaking the game formulas as I assume the formulas were never meant to work with such ridiculously low numbers, even though they are available - my other opinion would also be that even though the pass protection in these videos appears to hold up, in the overall balance and performance of the other players are affected and the real results would be seen when attempting to run a full game.

    I regards to OL; I was running an offense against the Packers Defense in 2-4-5 formations, and DE Mike Daniels was blowing up the LG on every play, on this one play I was running over and over; I looked at my LG and noticed he had an AWR of 80, so I introduced another lineman with 89 AWR, and all of a sudden, Mike Daniels was not getting the game block shed and spin moving around my LG...

    These ratings, and the game programming are meant to be run within a specific range, and results, positive or negative, can only be truly identified as a part of the whole of a teams' performance..

    Another interesting event I noticed was when I was testing playbooks..My initial idea was that maybe plays within different playbooks, even if its the same play, may have slight variations in logic. Again, I was testing the Cover 2 Man defense because I am obsessed with trying to figure out how to use Man Coverage effectively and consistently. I ran the Cover 2 Man against Quick Slants out of the I-Form..When I tested the Bills Defensive Playbook I noticed that about 5 out of 10 plays, CB Stephon Gilmore was actually beating, jumping in front of the slant route; I looked at Gilmore's ratings, and he is good but not great in relation to other CB's, so I tested the Bills playbook, and that specific play with other teams, and there appears from my tests, to be something about that play in that playbook that allows for the #1 CB to jump the slant route about 50% of the time...

    As of now I see this as something interestingly enough to mention and to continue testing...It would be interesting to find out that certain playbooks are different, and/or better than others, or maybe have certain plays which are better or worse than the same play in other playbooks..
    Did you ever try to do the same thing in game?

    Also do you guys think there is some kind of boost in division games? I can beat all madden 99% of the time thanks to cover zero mostly. Some games though against division rivals mostly it is just pic city. I am throwing passes in coverage that are mostly completed under normal conditions. The CPU has average rated players making Herculean plays to pick them off. For example I run a flat curl vs cover 2 the 75 rated cb will dive 5 yards and intercept the flat route. Most often that is a completion for a few yards. That **** annoys me. It has also happened to me in the playoffs a lot, even against users. 2 seasons in a row I dominated my buddy in our head to head games blowing him out by 3 scores. I went 16 and 0 both years. Then in the playoffs against him it was fumble and int city. The reciprical happened in my favor against him so it is not sour grapes. I think the game makes it extremely difficult to go undefeated, which is fine but user vs user it should not be that way.


    Sent from my SM-A710K using Operation Sports mobile app

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    • ForUntoOblivionSoar∞
      MVP
      • Dec 2009
      • 4682

      #62
      Re: After the Last Patch, the Game is a Cheating Machine

      Originally posted by cable guy
      I just don't have comebacks like these though.

      I've gone into another teams house, in which these things happen. Minus blocked FGS and Punts. Some here and there. But not multiple in one game.

      And games this happens to me is places like Green Bay, Seattle, Pittsburgh, New England, and of course division rivals. Mainly Washington for some reason.

      Again, this has been from the get go. Not Cpu comebacks. It's From the kickoff, till the final whistle. I just know its going to be a LONG game. Not one thing goes right. Penalties, fumbles, big plays given up. Not... One... Single... Thing... Goes right. And the thing is....I've watched my Cowboys IRL have many, many games like these. Way too many.

      Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
      You mean like this?

      <iframe src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/kvKHtA4Dg7c" allowfullscreen="" width="854" height="480" frameborder="0"> width="480" height="295"</iframe>
      Originally posted by Therebelyell626
      I am going to create a team called "the happy town fundament rapscallions" and hurt your already diminishing image
      https://forums.operationsports.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2049813056

      Last edited by your mom; 06-06-2006 at 6:06 PM.

      Comment

      • ForUntoOblivionSoar∞
        MVP
        • Dec 2009
        • 4682

        #63
        Re: After the Last Patch, the Game is a Cheating Machine

        Originally posted by cable guy
        I just don't have comebacks like these though.

        I've gone into another teams house, in which these things happen. Minus blocked FGS and Punts. Some here and there. But not multiple in one game.

        And games this happens to me is places like Green Bay, Seattle, Pittsburgh, New England, and of course division rivals. Mainly Washington for some reason.

        Again, this has been from the get go. Not Cpu comebacks. It's From the kickoff, till the final whistle. I just know its going to be a LONG game. Not one thing goes right. Penalties, fumbles, big plays given up. Not... One... Single... Thing... Goes right. And the thing is....I've watched my Cowboys IRL have many, many games like these. Way too many.

        Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
        You mean like this?
        <iframe src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/kvKHtA4Dg7c" allowfullscreen="" width="854" height="480" frameborder="0">width="480" height="295"</iframe>



        Originally posted by roadman
        I play all pro without adjusting any sliders and I don't see blocked kicks in comeback mode much at all. The way it's being reported is that it happens every time one has a lead.

        I'm not saying it doesn't happen on the all madden level, I would think it does. All I'm saying is I don't see it nearly as enough as you are Niner's fan on the all pro level.

        However, Charter, a slider guru that utilizes all madden has changed his sliders to all pro without adjustments to sliders and keeps everything on and he hasn't experienced comeback mode, either.

        I'm not saying it doesn't happen, folks, especially on the higher level, but I don't think you can deny me that same courtesy of what I'm reporting on the all pro level I am playing on.

        If you want to call out the developers that all they are doing is PR/Marketing, your prerogative. I doubt they ever stay in touch with the programmers that they work with.

        I do agree with Muk that Madden needs better animations across the board. Also, I agree the CPU needs to be much smarter on the play calling end, that system needs an overhaul.

        Let's all hope that Madden goes the route of NHL with the slider system they developed.
        The more I've thought about this after reading the thread, the more I'm convinced it might just be clutch/fatigue, except on All Madden those factors are unfairly weighted against the player (as in, the AI fatigue doesn't really affect them, and their clutch ratings outweigh your own players).
        Originally posted by Therebelyell626
        I am going to create a team called "the happy town fundament rapscallions" and hurt your already diminishing image
        https://forums.operationsports.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2049813056

        Last edited by your mom; 06-06-2006 at 6:06 PM.

        Comment

        • sonofthedude777
          Rookie
          • Nov 2014
          • 63

          #64
          Re: After the Last Patch, the Game is a Cheating Machine

          Originally posted by ForUntoOblivionSoar∞
          You mean like this?
          <iframe src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/kvKHtA4Dg7c" allowfullscreen="" width="854" height="480" frameborder="0">width="480" height="295"</iframe>




          The more I've thought about this after reading the thread, the more I'm convinced it might just be clutch/fatigue, except on All Madden those factors are unfairly weighted against the player (as in, the AI fatigue doesn't really affect them, and their clutch ratings outweigh your own players).
          Same here man. I created Fran Tarkenton and was messing around trying to play his style. When he was fresh I could run around. When he wasnt I fumbled threw bad passes or got sacked way more easily. I always thought fatigue affected injury and if ur player could stay in the game. But it seems to affect play a lot. I dont think I would have ever thought about it without this thread. Thanks guys.

          Sent from my SM-A710K using Operation Sports mobile app

          Comment

          • Qcsports4
            Rookie
            • Feb 2017
            • 165

            #65
            Re: After the Last Patch, the Game is a Cheating Machine

            I don't think the CPU just "cheats" late in the game(at times). I've noticed that in both Madden and the NHL series that whenever I play a game after first turning on the system, the CPU plays maxed out and whatever can go wrong to me will go wrong. Yet, I quit that game, play a second game, and the CPU plays more to the slider settings I've made. Anyone else notice that? As for as the CPU "cheating" late in the games to either comeback or make the game close, I have noticed the CPU does do that. It's like the CPU team all of a sudden is both John Elway and the 1992 Buffalo Bills coming back from 32 points down to Houston combined lol Maybe there is a setting that can help prevent that. I remember that in NHL 14, the CPU team ALWAYS scored a fluke goal very late in the game unless you adjusted a certain slider to keep that from happening.

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