Madden please dont mess with the falling forward animation

[edaddy]

Re: Madden please dont mess with the falling forward animation

I agree, I don't mind the falling forward which is what runners do 90% of the time IRL. The problem is that in Madden ball we've become accustomed to tacklers knocking runners backwards and sideways and that rarely happens. Most tackles in the NFL are not solid hits, especially if the runner adjusts his body. But that requires use of physics and I don't think Madden will ever be capable of that.
I think they've accidentally stumbled on a positive here and knowing the track record I think the patch will just mess things up.

I agree my man this is exactly what I am talking about when I say watch what you wish for with EA..I am worried that they dont have a remedy for the tackling the way it is now other than to revert it back to pre patch..I like others an not seeing a big problem with the falling forward animation as its a realistic part of football..does it play out everytime with a realistic animation no but we have had quirky animations tackling and otherwise since the game launched..I would take this tackling alonng with the better man coverage this patch put in than revert to how it was..hopefully we are both wrong..

[ccdeville]

Re: Madden please dont mess with the falling forward animation

I agree my man this is exactly what I am talking about when I say watch what you wish for with EA..I am worried that they dont have a remedy for the tackling the way it is now other than to revert it back to pre patch..I like others an not seeing a big problem with the falling forward animation as its a realistic part of football..does it play out everytime with a realistic animation no but we have had quirky animations tackling and otherwise since the game launched..I would take this tackling alonng with the better man coverage this patch put in than revert to how it was..hopefully we are both wrong..

I also think alot of complaints come from people who play online and now they cant stonewall runners anymore. But now if you play against the CPU the runners actually try to avoid you now, they juke, spin, stiff arm etc. something they didn't do pre-patch. It makes the game more of a challenge that did not exist before.

This year Madden has the nasty habit of situational tackling. Example of what i mean by that. You run the ball and have a clear path for a first down or touchdown with momentum on your side, all of a sudden a defensive player speeds up and knocks you sideways(no matter his size or angle) just so you conveniently miss your goal by an inch.

Although the ball happens to be on the yellow line it's still 3rd and inches (another problem with this game not calculating yardage properly).
You can guarantee that on third or fourth and inches the defensive line will overpower the offensive line as they perform mass blockshedding and drop you for a loss.
This is the game we've become accustomed to in Madden and IRL it's very difficult to stop a surging offensive line and a running back with forward momentum.

[83evans]

Re: Madden please dont mess with the falling forward animation

Im glad people are actually seeing that this isnt a bad thing. It emulates fighting for has, for the first time in madden history,RBs always look live. That pancake animation now only happens after a missed tackle or a huge momentum gain for the Defense


I do agree though, at times it looks strange. But c'mon, even in the weirdest circumstances its still nice

[83evans]

Re: Madden please dont mess with the falling forward animation

Even in the worst animations, you could realistically attribute it to a player fighting. Thats why idc. Madden sometimes isnt about being realistic intentionally, sometimes you have to think about how real players interact.

[Hammerhunker]

Re: Madden please dont mess with the falling forward animation

I agree, I don't mind the falling forward which is what runners do 90% of the time IRL. The problem is that in Madden ball we've become accustomed to tacklers knocking runners backwards and sideways and that rarely happens. Most tackles in the NFL are not solid hits, especially if the runner adjusts his body. But that requires use of physics and I don't think Madden will ever be capable of that.
I think they've accidentally stumbled on a positive here and knowing the track record I think the patch will just mess things up.

You hit on something with the "accidentally stumbled on a positive here" comment. We all talk about the need for physics based results, when in reality it's the animation that exhibits the perception of physics. This animation is a good start, but needs honed.

[Shosum13]

Re: Madden please dont mess with the falling forward animation

You hit on something with the "accidentally stumbled on a positive here" comment. We all talk about the need for physics based results, when in reality it's the animation that exhibits the perception of physics. This animation is a good start, but needs honed.

We need something between what we had before and what we had now. The problem is now the falling forward animations trigger too often. I'm even hitting a ball carrier as they juke back away from my defender or sacking the QB as they run away from the rush only to have them somehow fall forward 3-5 yards. The worst part about it happening on a sack is when it triggers and the QB falls forward the defender is not getting credited for the sack. In today's madden where progression is pretty much purely stat based it could have an effect.

[jfsolo]

Re: Madden please dont mess with the falling forward animation

We need something between what we had before and what we had now. The problem is now the falling forward animations trigger too often. I'm even hitting a ball carrier as they juke back away from my defender or sacking the QB as they run away from the rush only to have them somehow fall forward 3-5 yards. The worst part about it happening on a sack is when it triggers and the QB falls forward the defender is not getting credited for the sack. In today's madden where progression is pretty much purely stat based it could have an effect.

This. Unfortunately I don't think that they can find the right balance in the short amount of time that they are taking(rightful so) to get the next patch out.

Although I'm not hopeful, what we have now should be the base for M20 with all the impossible animation sequences removed.

[roadman]

Re: Madden please dont mess with the falling forward animation

What are people setups? I haven't played since the update came out, but when I did, just like TrojanMan and a few others, I didn't see the animation frequently, more so, infrequently, and yes, that is a bit much, too.

I'm playing AP with sliders close to default on everything.

As Edgevoice mentioned, sliders don't make any programming issues/bugs, but at the very least, able to minimize the issue(s) somewhat.

Still, should be fixed, but I keep repeating it's needs to be balanced or bust and based on past experiences and history, I'm guessing it will be a bust.

[edgevoice]

Re: Madden please dont mess with the falling forward animation

What are people setups? I haven't played since the update came out, but when I did, just like TrojanMan and a few others, I didn't see the animation frequently, more so, infrequently, and yes, that is a bit much, too.

I'm playing AP with sliders close to default on everything.

As Edgevoice mentioned, sliders don't make any programming issues/bugs, but at the very least, able to minimize the issue(s) somewhat.

Still, should be fixed, but I keep repeating it's needs to be balanced or bust and based on past experiences and history, I'm guessing it will be a bust.

I'm playing on All Pro with "user-only" evenly defeated sliders to make the experience a bit more difficult and realistic for me. However, even when I played the game post-patch on All Pro default, the tackling animation was every bit as present. Sliders can help make something either more difficult or easy in certain areas and does this at times by changing the actual duration or effectiveness of an animation. However, I've never known sliders to prevent an animation from triggering.

To repeat, the issues we are experiencing are based on animations that are triggering before the actual tackle begins. In head on tackle attempts, the defensive player's momentum towards the ball carrier hits an imaginary force field, stops and then drifts slightly backwards before the collision occurs. What also happens at times is that the ballcarrier suddenly takes many quick short steps to gain unrealistic momentum. When a quarterback does this just before he is being sacked, your defender will often times not be awarded the sack. When the odd sideways tackle occurs, it appears to be simply suction. We have all seen that before so it needs no further explanation. The "throw ballcarrier forward" animation that I did not notice before the patch, usually plays out fairly in my eyes.

As we wait for the patch, I feel we all need to keep in mind that, unless they forgot to mention it in the patch notes, what we are all experiencing is likely due to the attempt to address another issue. They may have to figure out how to address that issue in a different way, while cleaning up the bug that is now present.

For folks that want to experience the ability for the CPU running backs to gain more yardage, simply tune your user tackle slider down. This will not trigger a magical fall forward animation, but you will notice, besides not being quite as effective at tackling, that the CPU backs will attempt to use special moves a bit more to gain extra yards. If you feel you're not getting a fair shake with regards to momentum, turn up both user run blocking and fumble slider and that should help. I am in the minority but I am not a fan of tuning sliders on the CPU side. That would take a research paper to explain, although maybe someday I just might get around to doing it. Finally, the "get skinny" mechanic is essential in short-yardage situations. I use it almost all the time on dive plays, so a defender can't get a clean knock back hit on the ballcarrier.

With much respect towards those of you who wish the game to stay in it's current state, this bug makes the game extremely difficult to play and enjoy. Although the mid-read zone is still somewhat buggy, there are times when I like to play cover 2, rally to the ball and tackle. When I fly full speed at a receiver who just caught a stop route and attempt to blow him up dead on the spot, having my momentum suddenly cease as the receiver at the same time magically drives me back for 3-5 yards is not my idea of sim football.....

[Shosum13]

Re: Madden please dont mess with the falling forward animation

What are people setups? I haven't played since the update came out, but when I did, just like TrojanMan and a few others, I didn't see the animation frequently, more so, infrequently, and yes, that is a bit much, too.

I'm playing AP with sliders close to default on everything.

As Edgevoice mentioned, sliders don't make any programming issues/bugs, but at the very least, able to minimize the issue(s) somewhat.

Still, should be fixed, but I keep repeating it's needs to be balanced or bust and based on past experiences and history, I'm guessing it will be a bust.

In my online 32 user franchise we play on All pro with default sliders. I definitely notice the animation a lot more in that league than my solo franchise I run offline on All Madden with sliders. I feel like you can cut down on it triggering somewhat with the right sliders.

[roadman]

Re: Madden please dont mess with the falling forward animation

Edge, I like to keep sliders as close to default as possible. I feel that altering the sliders in one direction or another triggers other animations in the game.

I don't know if they will be able to get rid of the animation and keep forward progress going when it's appropriate.

I like the premise of forward progress, but not to the detriment of an animation triggering. And that is why I don't feel with a title update they will be able to produce this, which in my opinion, is disappointing.

[MizzouRah]

Re: Madden please dont mess with the falling forward animation

In on AP defaults and I'm not noticing it enough anymore to really give it much thought. I still see plenty of TFL and I don't really think it's made the running game much different than before, but maybe there's a tad more offense.

[edgevoice]

Re: Madden please dont mess with the falling forward animation

Edge, I like to keep sliders as close to default as possible. I feel that altering the sliders in one direction or another triggers other animations in the game.

I don't know if they will be able to get rid of the animation and keep forward progress going when it's appropriate.

I like the premise of forward progress, but not to the detriment of an animation triggering. And that is why I don't feel with a title update they will be able to produce this, which in my opinion, is disappointing.

Yup, you gotta be really careful with sliders or you can open up a can of worms in areas you never thought possible, which is the main reason why I do not touch CPU side of things.

I have a formula I use to evenly bring down user sliders only on All Pro, with the main focus being on making both run and pass blocking more difficult. Since I am sitting on my couch and capable of quickly reading the entire field, I figure that's only fair. I tone down my defense and notice the CPU being much more aggressive, which I like.

Having said that, the sliders are nowhere near as effective as they were in Madden 12, whereas you could tune game completely organically, to the point that you could slide to All Madden level in Custom Slider set up, without the dice roll effect.

We shall soon see what happens with the next update. Right now, the game is playing really, really loose for me. I shelved it for awhile, except for working on gameplans. Just finished playing the Redskins and it felt like Arena League Football.

[Armor and Sword]

Re: Madden please dont mess with the falling forward animation

Looks like my timing was impeccable:

Hi Madden Community,
We wanted to give you all a quick update on the falling forward bug that players have been experiencing since the February Title Update.
This is a top priority for the team and we're actively working on a fix for the problem. We are targeting an update in the second half of next week and will provide updates when we have more concrete details.
The Madden Team

I'm sure they will continue to update because now there is a target date and if that target date is passed without a fix, watch out for the interwebs.

Thank the heavens. Shelved the game after 1.19

Look forward to playing Madden 19 again once this is fixed.

[ccdeville]

Re: Madden please dont mess with the falling forward animation

I understand what everyone is saying on both sides, I just feel that this game suffers offensively in so many areas already that i'm liking the advantage that this "bug" poses. For example, when was the last time you've seen a CPU punt returner break off a decent return much less a touchdown?.

It's practically impossible because the blocking and defensive speed is so ill programmed. Half the blockers get shed after barely making contact and all 11 seem magnetized to the ball carrier, and the other half of blockers wander around looking lost. I don't feel threatened by the CPU on punt returns for this reason. At least the fall forward bug gives them some semblance of life.

Madden tries to balance this out by making the passing offense easy (no matte the QB) and the pass defenders look silly most of the time. It's a miracle when they decide to cover anyone, even a mediocre WR or TE. So the scores and stats end up looking reasonable, but the way the game arrives at it is strange.

I think overall EA has yet to find the right balance between offense, defense and special teams and I think everyone can agree on that.