Pass Coverage is STILL so broken

[threattonature]

Re: Pass Coverage is STILL so broken

All zones are playing too soft in my eyes. LB's are giving too much depth when they have no threats anywhere except underneath, safeties are backpedaling 30+ yards deeper than the nearest WR far too often, corners that are supposed to be playing the purple and baby blue zones are going way too deep like they are in cover 3 or 4.

It's like when you would play NCA 14 and use a coaching adjustment to make your zones play deeper. Take that and multiply it by 2 or 3 and that is zone coverage right now.

On top of all of that, man coverage is just a bit buggy at times like we've shown. Coverage isn't complete garbage, but it has its fair share of issues at the moment.

Before I read this post I was going to say I don't see why the game doesn't have a coaching adjustment like NCAA that gives the user more control over the depth of the zone your team plays. I think it would at least give the user more control of the situation instead of being at the mercy of the developers.

[xCoachDx]

Re: Pass Coverage is STILL so broken

Found this hysterical. This is man coverage when shaded inside.




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[xCoachDx]

Re: Pass Coverage is STILL so broken

And then on the next drive, this. I get the tuning down of LB’s, but you’re telling me that ball is out of my reach? I was even usering that from the start.




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[booker21]

Re: Pass Coverage is STILL so broken

And then on the next drive, this. I get the tuning down of LB’s, but you’re telling me that ball is out of my reach? I was even usering that from the start.




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I have to be honest, the first few games i didn't notice Coverage to be so bad, but the more i play the more i agree with you. Sometimes CPU/Teammates players do well but very often they do "broken" things. There is no excuse for this behavior on the field. I liked players to make mistake, i want to see this behaviors on low rated players but good and star players should not do this, but this is a common theme for all players no matter their rating.

I also believe that this was part of the fix for LB not playing balls where the WR was 8yds away, but instead of fixing the Ball trajectory they just make LB dumb like on this screen above.

I believe this is how they way EA fix things after all.

One way they could make this more bearable would be if the Defensive player at least make an attempt to play the ball, that would look 1000% better even thought the outcome of the play would be the same.

[King Gro23]

Re: Pass Coverage is STILL so broken

Anybody found a remedy to the quick out routes? Angled out routes? I'll have to analyze how they are played from press vs. Off..

Off coverage largely is bad due to poor alignment and positioning. AI lacks techniques and animations.

I've had some very positive things happen on most routes with a combination of lower reaction (25-40)

Interception slider of 52-62 (64+ gets more deflections surprisingly..but elite db's turn into Julio jones & odell in same body)
Coverage is still a work in progress but 56-75 range..

I was getting some really great animations I may try to replicate before work

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[Sphinx]

Re: Pass Coverage is STILL so broken

I'm just wondering if this is intentional at this point. Pass coverage is so loose, every game is either hugely one sided or a shootout. I play against the cpu on all pro and just can't for the life of me get them to play a tough competitive game on a consistent basis. I mean, I know teams have off days but I expect to have some good games and face some passing challenges.

[edgevoice]

Re: Pass Coverage is STILL so broken

And then on the next drive, this. I get the tuning down of LB’s, but you’re telling me that ball is out of my reach? I was even usering that from the start.




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I have repeatedly seen this happen. As illustrated, the defender doesn't even really need to leave his feet here. All he had to do is straighten up and he should have easily been able to reach to make a play on the ball.

The new pass trajectories are outstanding. It allows us to drop a ball over a zone defender. However, the addition of dumbed down defender play is over kill. I have called cover 2 many times in practice mode and fired a bullet post over the middle. The mike linebacker could have easily played the ball, but simply refused to do so. I've been able to learn to switch up and swat with reasonable success. However, the CPU is simply helpless in these situations. Slider tuning has failed to address this issue.

Hopefully the dumbed down reaction and ability to make a play on the ball are addressed soon, while leaving the pass trajectories as is.

[phillyfan23]

Re: Pass Coverage is STILL so broken

FWIW, this issue of defenders going the wrong way is at LEAST ratings based.

I went to practice mode ( eagles vs rams) , chose a play where the receiver consistently gets open against the cpu coverage ( nickel man to man ).

When it was Desean Jackson vs Aqib Talib, on this particular play, 8 times out of 10, Jackson would get open via the “broken” coverage.

Then I went to depth chart and switched out D Jakson with Shelton Gibson, 5th Wr talent. And not ONCE, did Talib get burnt on the same play using the same cpu coverage on default coverage sliders.

So I deduced perhaps this “broken coverage” issue could be somewhat alleviated with higher passing coverage slider. Went to play now game and put pass reaction at 50, interception at 50 and pass coverage at 100. The games were too stifling and you very very rarely saw any broken covg mechanics but the games were too low scoring so I settled at 85 pass coverage slider for me and cpu.

Yes this broken coverage still happens...but not as much as it did on default sliders. Perhaps others could test on prac mode as well and report what they see.


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[bcruise]

Re: Pass Coverage is STILL so broken

FWIW, this issue of defenders going the wrong way is at LEAST ratings based.

I went to practice mode ( eagles vs rams) , chose a play where the receiver consistently gets open against the cpu coverage ( nickel man to man ).

When it was Desean Jackson vs Aqib Talib, on this particular play, 8 times out of 10, Jackson would get open via the “broken” coverage.

Then I went to depth chart and switched out D Jakson with Shelton Gibson, 5th Wr talent. And not ONCE, did Talib get burnt on the same play using the same cpu coverage on default coverage sliders.

So I deduced perhaps this “broken coverage” issue could be somewhat alleviated with higher passing coverage slider. Went to play now game and put pass reaction at 50, interception at 50 and pass coverage at 100. The games were too stifling and you very very rarely saw any broken covg mechanics but the games were too low scoring so I settled at 85 pass coverage slider for me and cpu.

Yes this broken coverage still happens...but not as much as it did on default sliders. Perhaps others could test on prac mode as well and report what they see.


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I really like this approach - testing this stuff in a closed practice mode environment really is the best way to identify problems like this and find solutions. I tried this out with the same players and saw the same thing (although Gibson did manage to win 1 out of 20 attempts).

I'm more interested in the pass coverage slider actually doing what it says it does. I tried to make Talib worse so that he would botch the coverage on Gibson by zeroing coverage in practice mode, and out of 20 attempts against man with the Shotgun play "FL Dig" against Man he beat Talib 4 times whereas on the default coverage slider he only beat him once. When I say "beat" I mean that Talib appeared to hard commit on a fly pattern and ran way past the WR before cutting, making it a clear win for Gibson.

20 attempts isn't much of a sample size, but it's something at least, and it does support the conclusion you reached as well. It's worth mentioning that even raising the coverage to 100 wasn't enough for Talib to get the upper hand on Desean when he was the one running the route - Jackson got a clean cut every time I tried, although Talib seemed to react quicker and not get completely left behind on the play.

My opinion is that while it probably does have some effect on the gameplay, the coverage slider isn't powerful enough to dramatically affect wins and losses between DB's and WR's - ratings play a much bigger role.

Out of curiosity, what offensive play were you running for your test?

[Swagger Jack]

Re: Pass Coverage is STILL so broken

FWIW, this issue of defenders going the wrong way is at LEAST ratings based.

I went to practice mode ( eagles vs rams) , chose a play where the receiver consistently gets open against the cpu coverage ( nickel man to man ).

When it was Desean Jackson vs Aqib Talib, on this particular play, 8 times out of 10, Jackson would get open via the “broken” coverage.

Then I went to depth chart and switched out D Jakson with Shelton Gibson, 5th Wr talent. And not ONCE, did Talib get burnt on the same play using the same cpu coverage on default coverage sliders.

So I deduced perhaps this “broken coverage” issue could be somewhat alleviated with higher passing coverage slider. Went to play now game and put pass reaction at 50, interception at 50 and pass coverage at 100. The games were too stifling and you very very rarely saw any broken covg mechanics but the games were too low scoring so I settled at 85 pass coverage slider for me and cpu.

Yes this broken coverage still happens...but not as much as it did on default sliders. Perhaps others could test on prac mode as well and report what they see.


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Look I'm not trying to be rude. I'm really not, but first of all we're talking about testing in practice mode when anybody that has dealt with sliders over the past few years knows how vastly different the game plays in both play now & franchise mode and second of all....again not coming at you at all I'm really not, but do you think that in this 49 page thread you are the first person to say "hey lets try and put the pass coverage sliders all the way up?" They don't work dude.

[Swagger Jack]

Re: Pass Coverage is STILL so broken

Ok so let me shut this down real quick. Please pay attention. There's a lot of guys coming in the thread saying this or that is hyperbole, this or that works and this or that doesn't work. It's a gamebreaking bug. Period, end of story.

I actually went into practice mode (lol) and took Jalen Ramsey (97 MCV highest in the game) put him in the slot and lined him up against a 31 OVR rated Tight end with short, medium, and long route running attributes of 45, 40, and 35 respectively and with the pass coverage slider at 100 STILL was burning Jalen Ramsey. Ramsey was still making an illogical action towards the sideline/outside even though the receiver was running a quick slant.

Oh and for the people who think the reaction time slider is reversed, I tried that as well....no bueno at 0 or 100. As I've said countless times before in this thread, this is not something we can fix with sliders.....we need a patch or a tuning update from EA.

[ForUntoOblivionSoar∞]

Re: Pass Coverage is STILL so broken

Ok so let me shut this down real quick. Please pay attention. There's a lot of guys coming in the thread saying this or that is hyperbole, this or that works and this or that doesn't work. It's a gamebreaking bug. Period, end of story.

I actually went into practice mode (lol) and took Jalen Ramsey (97 MCV highest in the game) put him in the slot and lined him up against a 31 OVR rated Tight end with short, medium, and long route running attributes of 45, 40, and 35 respectively and with the pass coverage slider at 100 STILL was burning Jalen Ramsey. Ramsey was still making an illogical action towards the sideline/outside even though the receiver was running a quick slant.

Oh and for the people who think the reaction time slider is reversed, I tried that as well....no bueno at 0 or 100. As I've said countless times before in this thread, this is not something we can fix with sliders.....we need a patch or a tuning update from EA.

The reaction time slider doesn't fix stupid AI. It just closes the gaps faster after the ball is thrown or caught.

[phillyfan23]

Pass Coverage is STILL so broken

I really like this approach - testing this stuff in a closed practice mode environment really is the best way to identify problems like this and find solutions. I tried this out with the same players and saw the same thing (although Gibson did manage to win 1 out of 20 attempts).

I'm more interested in the pass coverage slider actually doing what it says it does. I tried to make Talib worse so that he would botch the coverage on Gibson by zeroing coverage in practice mode, and out of 20 attempts against man with the Shotgun play "FL Dig" against Man he beat Talib 4 times whereas on the default coverage slider he only beat him once. When I say "beat" I mean that Talib appeared to hard commit on a fly pattern and ran way past the WR before cutting, making it a clear win for Gibson.

20 attempts isn't much of a sample size, but it's something at least, and it does support the conclusion you reached as well. It's worth mentioning that even raising the coverage to 100 wasn't enough for Talib to get the upper hand on Desean when he was the one running the route - Jackson got a clean cut every time I tried, although Talib seemed to react quicker and not get completely left behind on the play.

My opinion is that while it probably does have some effect on the gameplay, the coverage slider isn't powerful enough to dramatically affect wins and losses between DB's and WR's - ratings play a much bigger role.

Out of curiosity, what offensive play were you running for your test?

Plays that I used were “shotgun bunch trail” with the play reversed so that Desean gets the deep post route. The rams I had playing “man double buzz” out of either nickel/dime.

I absolutely agree that ratings have a bigger role in determining these outcomes which if you think about it, is really a good thing. They just need to fix the animation where a CB gets beat clean on man on man coverage: instead of going the other way which looks HIDEOUS....have a delayed reaction or a slight slip for aesthetics.

The more I play the more I realize it’s an aesthetics issue instead of gameplay issue, because playing against good secondaries with a below average QB or below average receivers, you will NOT be able to take advantage of the cpu most of the time.

Im through 3 quarters right now trailing 20-7 with the Bills against the Jets. After 3 quarters Josh Allen is throwing 42 percent with 1 td,1int.

The game before, I beat the Rams 31-21 and Wentz threw 3 Td passes, 0 int on 68 pct passing. Both games were on the EXACT same sliders and settings. (85 pass coverage slider for both human/cpu and overall sliders tilted slightly for the cpu)




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[mtmetcalfe]

Re: Pass Coverage is STILL so broken

Plays that I used were “shotgun bunch trail” with the play reversed so that Desean gets the deep post route. The rams I had playing “man double buzz” out of either nickel/dime.

I absolutely agree that ratings have a bigger role in determining these outcomes which if you think about it is really a good thing. They just need to fix the animation where a CB gets beat clean on man on man coverage: instead of going the other way which looks HIDEOUS....have a delayed reaction or a slight slip for aesthetics. The more I play the more I realize it’s an aesthetics issue instead of gameplay issue, because playing against good secondaries with a below average QB or below average receivers, you will NOT be able to take advantage of the cpu.

Im through 3 quarters right now trailing 17-7 with the Bills against the Jets. After 3 quarters Josh Allen is throwing 42 percent with 1 td,1int.

The game before, I beat the Rams 31-21 and Wentz threw 3 Td passes, 0 int on 68 pct passing. Both games were on the EXACT same sliders and settings. (85 pass coverage slider for both human/cpu and overall sliders tilted slightly for the cpu)




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Philly, can you share your full slider set? All Pro?

[stinkubus]

Re: Pass Coverage is STILL so broken

Didn't learn until today that you can do press + over the top shade for 1/3 blue zones and fix the cushion problem without getting screwed by the press/bump animation getting you burned. Too often in a deep 3rd zone if you brought up a good CB with decent press he'd still get burned over the top by run of the mill WR. Pass coverage this year just requires some heady presnap adjusts

This boxes you into using Curl Flats or Cloud Flats.