Summary of what sliders do_Oraeon

[SwaggerCoach]

Re: Summary of what sliders do_Oraeon

I agree that CPU vs CPU isn't affected at all. I didn't button mash at all with either of the pass rushers I used.



What really was the kicker for me was Armstrong winning on several of the rushes w PBK at 100. I think that not only would he never win against Smith irl but it also throws the ratings out the window.



I beat Smith 3 times by using a quick finesse move one button press all 3 times. Just way too unrealistic & also makes ratings almost useless imo

I'll fire up practice mode and see what I come up with too.

[tyler28]

Re: Summary of what sliders do_Oraeon

Ive been researching sliders for a while now and thought i had a good set. Then I came across your thread and was shocked to see pass rec. lowered to 0 I wouldn't have thought of that. I noticed that passing lanes actually opened up like they should and that there was a difference in a top tier wr vs average cb and vice versa. Awesome. However, i kept my others sliders the same because when i lowered them they just didnt work the way they should.

Here are my base set with changes in ( ) hum/ comp

Qb 7 (30)/ 1 (18) big drop but it works with lowered pass reac.
P. blocking 15 / 100 sacks still too easy
wr 47/44 didt really notice a dif. so i kept them the same
rblocking 53/53 when lowered the run game is not there
fum 44/44 anything lower i was seeing way too many fumbles
pdrt 0 (95)/1 (85) big change in gameplay and fun factor
int 37 (44)/ 44 still not too many unrealistic int. could still be adj.
pc 99 (95)/100(85) makes passing still competitive w rec. at 0
tak 90/80 cpu was breaking too many takles through lb. unrealistic.

Here are my sliders I have spent many hours working on them Hope you like them and pull from them to make them your own. I tweaked the penalties but i dont see it affecting gameplay too much but i can post them if you want. T. hold is at 15 and i played these on All madden and All pro.

[lujer]

Re: Summary of what sliders do_Oraeon

Ahhh. Your mistake is your threshold slider. Set it to 50 and the game will be harder.


From when they first instituted this slider (damn I'm old) I remember all their developer post. It has a set value of average (likely 88). At 50 all players are at their default + whatever boost/penlaty your difficulty level applies. When you decrease the threshold it measures the difference between each player against that norm and effectively increases the gap by a multiple. For instance:


LB speed is 88: 88-88 stays the same
RB speed is 95: 95-88 = 7, now with threshold at 0 it multiples 7 X 1.5 giving 10 it then adds 10 to 95 giving a new speed to that player of 105.


Now the running back is much much faster than the LB.


The reason the slider doesn't help the deep ball is because:

CB speed 94: 94-88 = 6 X 1.5 = 9
WR speed 95: 95-88 = 7 X 1.5 = 10


There is now still a negligible difference between the WR and CB.


Things get wonkey on Madden level difficulty because it applies a bonus.


CPU CB speed 94 + 5 -88 = 11 X 1.5 = 17
HUM WR speed 95 - 5 -88 = 2 X 1.5 = 3


Now the CPU CB has a speed advantage over the WR and thus computer defense looks better with threshold lower.

So are you suggesting to use all-pro then? For more accurate control over the sliders?

I guess I tend to think that all madden is the only way for veteran players. Perhaps I need to reconsider?

Great thread btw

[tyler28]

Re: Summary of what sliders do_Oraeon

i was pure all madden till this year. Ive spent the last few week refusing to play on all pro, till now. with my sliders i can have just as a competitive feel with out the frustration of ridiculous games. All pro is definitly the way to go this year. All madden needs a patch or something to get it right.. Also i have never played on slow speed, till this year. Seems more fluid and the game speed is the same. You should also try that out.

[lujer]

Re: Summary of what sliders do_Oraeon

i was pure all madden till this year. Ive spent the last few week refusing to play on all pro, till now. with my sliders i can have just as a competitive feel with out the frustration of ridiculous games. All pro is definitly the way to go this year. All madden needs a patch or something to get it right.. Also i have never played on slow speed, till this year. Seems more fluid and the game speed is the same. You should also try that out.

Cool. Thanks.
I seem to have read that normal speed was the best setting this year? Does speed effect the sliders in anyway?

[SwaggerCoach]

Re: Summary of what sliders do_Oraeon

I'll fire up practice mode and see what I come up with too.

I have to side with Oraeon on this...spent a good hour today testing pass blocking slider.

From 0 to 50 to 100, I saw really no changes at all for the CPU.

I was Carolina controlling Greg Hardy up against the 49ers (Joe Staley). Pretty even match up.

I was able to get past him with the exact same success rate at every level. In my opinion, CPU pass block slider is completely broken.

[KingV2k3]

Re: Summary of what sliders do_Oraeon

@Oraeon1224:

I always enjoy your enlightening threads / observations, so I'll be following this project with great interest...

I'm interested in "Actual Default" as opposed to EA Default or sliders that are intended to influence the engine...

Looks like that's what you may uncover here, so best of luck!

[tyler28]

Re: Summary of what sliders do_Oraeon

the speed only affects the graphics on field.

[kip_kasper]

Re: Summary of what sliders do_Oraeon

I have to side with Oraeon on this...spent a good hour today testing pass blocking slider.

From 0 to 50 to 100, I saw really no changes at all for the CPU.

I was Carolina controlling Greg Hardy up against the 49ers (Joe Staley). Pretty even match up.

I was able to get past him with the exact same success rate at every level. In my opinion, CPU pass block slider is completely broken.

Sub in a lb w low moves & block shed & see how he does against Staley... That's when I really noticed the difference in the test I did

[Oraeon1224]

Re: Summary of what sliders do_Oraeon

So are you suggesting to use all-pro then? For more accurate control over the sliders?

I guess I tend to think that all madden is the only way for veteran players. Perhaps I need to reconsider?

Great thread btw

You can play on Madden just remember displayed player stats don't mean much. Just play whatever works for your. I would be cautious with aggressive threshold changes combined with Madden since it can result in odd things like DLinemen running down HBs.

[NINJAK2]

Re: Summary of what sliders do_Oraeon

Oraeon--Do you think that where you have the skill sliders can also have an effect on how the penalty sliders work?
For example if your pass/run blocking slider is raised to promote great blocking you may rarely see any holding,clippiping, false start penalties no matter where you have it due to the players almost always being smarter or in great position to block due to the high pass/run block slider....?


Or high coverage and pass reaction may equate to very few DPIs due to players always being in ideal position due to high coverage and high ball awareness due to pass reaction....? Maybe a high coverage (db in position) coupled with lower awareness (reaction) and high DPI may result in more DPIs..?


Hope I didn't take your thread off topic..

[Oraeon1224]

Re: Summary of what sliders do_Oraeon

Oraeon--Do you think that where you have the skill sliders can also have an effect on how the penalty sliders work?
For example if your pass/run blocking slider is raised to promote great blocking you may rarely see any holding,clippiping, false start penalties no matter where you have it due to the players almost always being smarter or in great position to block due to the high pass/run block slider....?


Or high coverage and pass reaction may equate to very few DPIs due to players always being in ideal position due to high coverage and high ball awareness due to pass reaction....? Maybe a high coverage (db in position) coupled with lower awareness (reaction) and high DPI may result in more DPIs..?


Hope I didn't take your thread off topic..

I don't know but I have never found that penalty sliders actually effect gameplay anyway (though I do understand the argument for why they might if animations are linked to actions).

The problem with DPI is unique. There is DPI however DPI is actually a specific call for a ball thrown to a player who is interfered with. That is why it is rare. CPU avoids throwing there and humans avoid throwing there, whereas NFL quarterbacks may see this and specifically target the situation. You will see it in the game if you target the interfered with player. Here is EAs mistake:


1) DPI should occur when the ball is in the air in route to a receiver not during the initial part of the route before the throw. That is illegal contact or holding which they haven't bothered coded. Change the code to have the CB who is beaten interfere wit the receiver after the throw button is pushed or AI passes.


2) PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD CODE IN HOLDING AND ILLEGAL CONTACT.


There I had my tirade against their incredibly shoddy programming.

[bcruise]

Re: Summary of what sliders do_Oraeon

Nice breakdown, particularly the relationship between the Pass Coverage and Reaction time sliders. I'm definitely seeing a big difference in the CPU's throwing decisions with coverage lowered (because guys are getting open more often, obviously) - they're not holding the ball nearly as long and making good decisions. And if they get time to stand in the pocket, it's probably going to be a big play because coverage WILL break down. I've been trying to "break" the CPU/coach mode game to have overpowered offense instead of defense, and zeroing that slider may just have done that by itself.

I'm a big believer in having a large sample size before coming to any real conclusions, but even from a few quarters of watching the CPU play I can tell that it's very different.

Edit: Yep, sure enough I spoke too soon in thinking this would fix the sack problem...6 sacks in the first quarter of my second game with the same settings

The difference is that these aren't coverage sacks, but rather blown O-line assignments against 5+ man rushes, which are resulting in pressure before anyone can get open. Unfortunately, if the Pass Block slider only affects the user difficulty of getting past the O-line, we're kinda SOL on this until a patch.

[RogueHominid]

Re: Summary of what sliders do_Oraeon

If I wanted to see tighter coverage in man and zone and more contested throws/catches, which sliders should be adjusted and in which direction?

Thanks in advance.

[John_Taffer]

Re: Summary of what sliders do_Oraeon

Nice breakdown, particularly the relationship between the Pass Coverage and Reaction time sliders. I'm definitely seeing a big difference in the CPU's throwing decisions with coverage lowered (because guys are getting open more often, obviously) - they're not holding the ball nearly as long and making good decisions. And if they get time to stand in the pocket, it's probably going to be a big play because coverage WILL break down. I've been trying to "break" the CPU/coach mode game to have overpowered offense instead of defense, and zeroing that slider may just have done that by itself.

I'm a big believer in having a large sample size before coming to any real conclusions, but even from a few quarters of watching the CPU play I can tell that it's very different.

Edit: Yep, sure enough I spoke too soon in thinking this would fix the sack problem...6 sacks in the first quarter of my second game with the same settings

The difference is that these aren't coverage sacks, but rather blown O-line assignments against 5+ man rushes, which are resulting in pressure before anyone can get open. Unfortunately, if the Pass Block slider only affects the user difficulty of getting past the O-line, we're kinda SOL on this until a patch.

Maybe this is just coincidence, but I was in my 2nd week with the Cardinals playing the Giants. Eli only had 2 sacks through 3qtrs with 1 pick, and a 70% completion. Running was ok for both sides. I was down 17-14. Then just into the 4th qtr, my Xbox 1 freezes up. Had to restart the whole game. Same settings as before, and I had a total of 8 sacks on Eli with 2 picks. I was also getting sacked like crazy it seemed. Running was very easy this time around too. I won 24-17

Can't remember my exact sliders, but here are some.

Runblocking - CPU 60 Me 55
Pass Coverage - CPU 45 Me 65
Reaction Time - CPU 65 Me 35
Passblock - CPU 85 Me 85
QB Accuracy - CPU 20 Me 15

Kinda strange how with the exact same settings, and I get almost completely different type of games. I don't know. I just think EA really doesn't care on making a great football game anymore, and just focus more with Madden Ultimate Team, and having the sheep spend money on that. Just my opinion.