3-4....NOBODY gets sacks, NEEDS FIXED!!!!

[unisol_us]

Re: EA needs to fix the 3-4 Defense!!!

I run with the Steelers and they are a 3-4 Defense. I get sacks with Harrison, Farrior and Woodley all the time. I get a few with Hampton and Keisel but not like I do with my LBs. Yeah, Aaron Smith gets his share as DE but he does in real life too. Maybe you should tweak your settings. I have no problem with the 3-4. I run it like they run it and get pretty genuine results. 2008 regular season - Harrison had 16, Woodley had 12 and in third.......Aaron Smith (DE) with 6. My leading sack leaders in my franchise is Harrison and Woodley. Farrior only had 4 last year.

I also get sacks with the OLB's. But I also have been playing 3-4 in Madden forever now well as long as the Steelers have been running the 3-4 so maybe that makes a difference. But I don't see any problem with the OLB's in the 3-4 this year.

[lil jon]

Re: EA needs to fix the 3-4 Defense!!!

people that say the team doesn't "know" football, are so annoying.

the one guy that went to community day could explain the difficulties with implementing the 3-4, but he's prob tired of doing so, so he just doesn't bother.(has to do with the branching animations)

+ how would they implement this?

say you have a 3-4 olb and a 4-3 olb..

you need the 3-4 olb to be able to rush the passer, and the 4-3 olb to be able to provide support in pass coverage..

as far as ratings go, what do you give the 3-4 olb in pass coverage? 45-50?

well what do you give the 4-3 to show a difference between the two(because if you're running a 4-3, why not just have 3-4 olb in your defense as they'll be better rushing the passer, if you don't have a difference?) 60-65? then you have the guys who are better than others, and they would be in the 70's, which would be cornerbacks territory, unless you bump all corners up, because surely they have to be better in coverage than linebackers, right?

and if you go the other way, you can't have 3-4 olb too low in pass coverage, or they'll just be falling all over themselves..


another thing, how do you market this to all the casual fans, and young teenagers( i'm assuming the bulk of madden sales)

i guess you could label each player with his possible position, and depending what defense you're running, have that come up on the depth chart/free agency screen


i would love for this to be fixed, but ea has a lot of steps to get us their, starting with re doing blocking logic(and i'm assuming adding in weight meaning something amongst other things) and ending with figuring out how something that would take a lot of time would be marketable to their biggest segment(casual/young teen), that wouldn't really care much about it

[imskykid]

Re: EA needs to fix the 3-4 Defense!!!

I also get sacks with the OLB's. But I also have been playing 3-4 in Madden forever now well as long as the Steelers have been running the 3-4 so maybe that makes a difference. But I don't see any problem with the OLB's in the 3-4 this year.

It isn't a problem with the 3-4 OLB that are already in the game. One of the main things it comes down to is CPU draft/free agent logic. Like I've stated, with the new position they would default to their correct spot, DE or OLB, based on the team.

The ratings system from Head Coach would be nice but it wouldn't completely reflect what happens in real life. There are hybrid DE/OLBs that come into the draft every year. I thought for sure that Aaron Maybin was going to a 3-4 team to play OLB, but he was swooped up by the Bills to play DE. We need to have players like this in the game.

[bigal093]

Re: 3-4....NOBODY gets sacks, NEEDS FIXED!!!!

guys im not talking about my team, because i play the games(although the in-game 3-4 needs adjusted too). Im talking about the CPU stats being generated, and i guess when i play a team with a 3-4(although idthink i have, but i assume the same problem is there). If I were to change the slider, i think the 4-3 teams would get too many. i haven't exactly studied the subject, but it seems like it needs work.
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[fourthreemafia]

Re: 3-4....NOBODY gets sacks, NEEDS FIXED!!!!

I just played GB vs. ATL (I was GB), and I sacked Matt Ryan 3 times in the first half with B.J. Raji. I had it set right between All-Pro and All-Madden (my skill all 13s).

But how are you doing getting to the QBs with your OLBs?

I dont mind having sacks with my DL once in awhile, but most should be coming from my OLBs, and its not happening.

[bigal093]

Re: 3-4....NOBODY gets sacks, NEEDS FIXED!!!!

I just played GB vs. ATL (I was GB), and I sacked Matt Ryan 3 times in the first half with B.J. Raji. I had it set right between All-Pro and All-Madden (my skill all 13s).

Thats not realistic AT ALL!!! have you ever seen a 3-4 D-Lineman get 3 sacks in a game. heck they hardly ever get 2 or 1. The D-Lineman get a decent amount of tackles, but are never gonna lead the league in sacks. They plug up the line so the LBs can get to the QB. EA should program the 3-4 lineman to like just bull rush or something. and i've been saying for a while, we need seperate positions. what i mean is for a 3-4 team when you scroll past RT, instead of LE, it should say 3-4 LE, and 3-4 RE, then 3-4 NT. and a then 4-3 LE, RE, DT. and the same for LBs. then they could adjust the overall for a 3-4 DE to be based more off of strength, tackling, and maybe awareness. and 4-3 would be based off of finesse/power moves, acceleration, then tackling/strength or whatever. and what would happen is that if you moved a 4-3 DT to 3-4 DE he would basically retain his rating(barring a slight awr drop for switching systems) this would also make it harder to switch a player from LB to DE and be a monster. He would probably get worse in a 3-4. The rating system for it needs to change a lot, and so does the actual gameplay/sim system.
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[aceoye]

Re: 3-4....NOBODY gets sacks, NEEDS FIXED!!!!

I get a good amount of sacks i play with the packers and i use 3-4, aaron kampman gets off the edge so sweet.

[bigal093]

Re: 3-4....NOBODY gets sacks, NEEDS FIXED!!!!

But how are you doing getting to the QBs with your OLBs?

I dont mind having sacks with my DL once in awhile, but most should be coming from my OLBs, and its not happening.

i've noticed more coming from LBs but barely any, like i said the LBs are getting basically 3-7 sacks. and DL are getting next to none in simmed games. when i play, i can basically make it work, but it still doesn't play as realistic as it should. they really need to focus on perfecting the 3-4, and really show the difference between a 4-3 and 3-4, especially when more and more teams are going to the 3-4.
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[JMD]

Re: 3-4....NOBODY gets sacks, NEEDS FIXED!!!!

I feel your pain, I'm playing as the Chiefs in a franchise. I'm in week 12 and have 1 sack. They have a 3-4 defense now, I'm starting to get quite frustrated because I changed the sliders to pass rush 100, CPU pass defense to 0 and my shed block to 100. Still it doesn't seem to make any difference.

I'm using the Chiefs as well and I'm getting sacks. I'm using Marino's Sliders right now. After 3 games Tyson Jackson (CPU controlled) has 4 sacks. Tank Tyle (CPU) has 1 , Demario Williams (user Controlled) Has 1 , and Ron Edwards (CPU) has 1.

Marino's slider set is pretty good. With the combination of the slow game speed and the slider settings the game feels real good. Very realistic feeling. My first game against the Ravens was a blowout. Flacco thew 4 INT's and I got out to a big lead and they could never come back. The next two games against the Raiders and Eagles were both nail biters. Chiefs are 3-0.

[parrothead]

Re: 3-4....NOBODY gets sacks, NEEDS FIXED!!!!

The OP is talking about games in Franchise played by the CPU teams. It does no good for us to get the right number of sacks, and the CPU to get like 5 a season.

[unisol_us]

Re: EA needs to fix the 3-4 Defense!!!

It isn't a problem with the 3-4 OLB that are already in the game. One of the main things it comes down to is CPU draft/free agent logic. Like I've stated, with the new position they would default to their correct spot, DE or OLB, based on the team.

The ratings system from Head Coach would be nice but it wouldn't completely reflect what happens in real life. There are hybrid DE/OLBs that come into the draft every year. I thought for sure that Aaron Maybin was going to a 3-4 team to play OLB, but he was swooped up by the Bills to play DE. We need to have players like this in the game.

I must agree with you about that. Haven't gotten very far in this years Chise but I think you may be right. That is good insight and I will be looking for it while I am scouting this year.

[imskykid]

Re: EA needs to fix the 3-4 Defense!!!

people that say the team doesn't "know" football, are so annoying.

the one guy that went to community day could explain the difficulties with implementing the 3-4, but he's prob tired of doing so, so he just doesn't bother.(has to do with the branching animations)

+ how would they implement this?

say you have a 3-4 olb and a 4-3 olb..

you need the 3-4 olb to be able to rush the passer, and the 4-3 olb to be able to provide support in pass coverage..

as far as ratings go, what do you give the 3-4 olb in pass coverage? 45-50?

well what do you give the 4-3 to show a difference between the two(because if you're running a 4-3, why not just have 3-4 olb in your defense as they'll be better rushing the passer, if you don't have a difference?) 60-65? then you have the guys who are better than others, and they would be in the 70's, which would be cornerbacks territory, unless you bump all corners up, because surely they have to be better in coverage than linebackers, right?

and if you go the other way, you can't have 3-4 olb too low in pass coverage, or they'll just be falling all over themselves..


another thing, how do you market this to all the casual fans, and young teenagers( i'm assuming the bulk of madden sales)

i guess you could label each player with his possible position, and depending what defense you're running, have that come up on the depth chart/free agency screen


i would love for this to be fixed, but ea has a lot of steps to get us their, starting with re doing blocking logic(and i'm assuming adding in weight meaning something amongst other things) and ending with figuring out how something that would take a lot of time would be marketable to their biggest segment(casual/young teen), that wouldn't really care much about it

This is accomplished by separating depth charts. The specific position rating qualifications for the 3-4 OLB would closely resemble that of DE (with there being a difference in coverage abilities). That way, when you try and plug a 4-3 OLB into a 3-4 their pass rush abilities wont be up to snuff and their rating would drop accordingly.

This wouldn't be an issue the other way around because if a 4-3 team were to pick up a 3-4 OLB they would make the switch automatically to DE.

And there are some 4-3 teams who have converted DE's in their defense... Brian Orakpo and Omar Gaither are some off the top of my head. If you wanted the hybrid DE/OLB to play OLB in your 4-3 you could just switch it manually.

I don't think this will confuse or frustrate the casual/teen market. It seems like a lot but when you take a tep back and look at it, it's not that bad.

Free Agency Categories:
LE
RE
DT
NT
DE/OLB (Hybrid)
LOLB
MLB
ROLB
CB
FS
SS

Depth Charts:

4-3

CB----------DE--DT--NT--DE----------CB
------------LOLB--MLB--ROLB------------
---------------SS-----FS----------------

3-4

CB------------DT---NT---DT------------CB
---------DE/OLB-MLB-MLB-DE/OLB---------
---------------SS------FS----------------

[CcAaRrSsOoNn3]

Re: 3-4....NOBODY gets sacks, NEEDS FIXED!!!!

You do know in traditional 3-4's DE do not usually rack up sacks?

[bigal093]

Re: 3-4....NOBODY gets sacks, NEEDS FIXED!!!!

The OP is talking about games in Franchise played by the CPU teams. It does no good for us to get the right number of sacks, and the CPU to get like 5 a season.

not just that though. everybody is posting here saying, i have no problem, tyson jackson has 4 sacks. THAT IS ONE OF THE PROBLEMS!!!! The DEs dont get a lot of sacks. It is too hard to get sacks with LBs. User or CPU. you can get user sacks with them, but its not as easy as when your a 4-3 DE. which is basically what it should be. In the 4-3 its easier to get sacks with LBs or DEs, which isn't realistic. James Harrison, and Demarcus Ware, are arguably the two best pass rushers in the league, and get like 5 sacks a year when simmed, and you have to work to get them the right amount user. the AI needs to be different for 3-4 teams. I want my Ends to plug up the OL, and only get sacks when the QB holds the ball, and they can break off and get to him, or just by fluke or whatever, but my DE's need to hold up the tackles so Harrison can go in untouched, or make one move. that is what the sytem is designed for!!! how can you pass the game off like this, when many teams are starting to switch to a 3-4.

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[bigal093]

Re: 3-4....NOBODY gets sacks, NEEDS FIXED!!!!

You do know in traditional 3-4's DE do not usually rack up sacks?

Exactly, and the DEs sack totals are pretty realistic simmed, but the LBs get only a few more, like 3-7, instead of 6-16.
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