The community wants better sideline models in Madden vote for it here

[Matt10]

Re: The community wants better sideline models in Madden vote for it here

Agreed for sure but I guess I am looking at upgraded sidelines as a separate aspect since it seems to require a graphical tradeoff. So I am thinking upgraded sidelines, even the interactive part, would fall more so under art and visuals then game play, if that makes sense.

I know we are always being told "time" was the key issue why something didn't get done but I view the available art "time" as separate from available game play "time", even though it's a strong possibility that view is completely wrong. lol

Good post - and that makes sense. If we think of a trade-off for the same value of what is being replaced, then that is exactly what would be preferred.

At this point - the "outrage" if you will, stems from these so called trade-offs not matching up to the value of what is being replaced (ex franchise user control versus only controlling one team; where's the trade-off there?).

Eitherway, I'm pretty much on board with Madden 13. I have accepted that EA are listening - and the guys are fairly new. I hope CCM packs a punch - I like idea of an RPG of sorts, but I will stand firm in regards to the missing priorities.

[mrprice33]

Re: The community wants better sideline models in Madden vote for it here

How so? Again I am no programmer but after a little discussion with a poster that seems to have programming knowledge and going by what Ian Cummings stated, upgraded sidelines come down to sacrificing overall graphics. So as far as priorities go on that, some people, including myself, would make that tradeoff.

Your post seems as if upgraded sidelines equates to diminished game play but there has been no evidence shown of that considering APF on the same console, had living sidelines without any noticeable loss to on field game play. Also, APF did not even look graphically terrible to some and that was in 2007.

You are of course entitled to your opinion about whatever but I don't agree with the priorities being jacked up for those that would sacrifice graphical detail, wish is arguably next-gen Madden's most advanced aspect, to upgrade sidelines, arguably its' worst.

If we went from this...



to this...



But added dynamic sidelines, there would be a REVOLT.

[Big FN Deal]

Re: The community wants better sideline models in Madden vote for it here

But if we went from this...



to this...


Madden 08

for added dynamic sidelines, that revolt likely doesn't happen. lol

[mrprice33]

Re: The community wants better sideline models in Madden vote for it here

I just don't get the logic of going way backwards on what you spend the bulk of the game looking at for something you'll see every once in a while.

But whatever. It'll never happen, so...

[Rhudey]

Re: The community wants better sideline models in Madden vote for it here

My 2 cents, active/better sidelines are completely irrelevant, I couldn't care less, don't think it adds anything to the game for me. I would think once everything regarding gameplay is perfected and there's nothing left to do, then worry about it. Not saying those who want it are wrong, I personally think it's a waste of resources for my personal preferences.

[Evan_OS]

Re: The community wants better sideline models in Madden vote for it here

I'd much rather keep the graphics than have an interactive sideline. The graphics are really nice, you get to see them all the time. If we trade the great graphics for interactive sidelines then seems like a loss to me. We would be trading something we get to see all the time for something we get to see only sometimes.

[Rhudey]

Re: The community wants better sideline models in Madden vote for it here

Most fans definitely would not like this one bit. However, I get your point, but it's not the most accurate. We're coming up on the release of Madden 13, but the earliest we would see any sideline improvements would be Madden 14. That's 6 whole years after 2k8 was released. Technology, compressing techniques, all of that would be way more advanced than back in 2007. The graphics would take a hit, but they wouldn't go all the way to 2k8's standards, nor even Madden 08's.

The question is basically, do you want a more realistic environment with a bit worse graphics, but everything still looks great and life like. Or do you want the graphics we have now, that still have their share of problems with lifeless sidelines that kill any emotion or immersion on plays along the sidelines.

So say the graphics take a bit of a hit, but the game still looks as good, if not better than Madden 10 or 11. You pick off a pass down field late in the 4th quarter. You follow your blockers out to the sidelines and see nothing but open space. As your running down the sidelines you see an actual offensive player or a group of them running down the sidelines, jumping up and down, cheering you on as you take back the pick 6 to extend your lead to 9 with 1:02 left.

Would you not enjoy that more than having the graphics we have now, picking off the ball, going wide to the sidelines and seeing three different 00's, four 01's, and a few more players all standing there clapping or on a knee not even following the play, all with their helmets on showing no emotion.

That's just one example.

But unless you are a Madden programmer you can't make this claim, we have no idea what would have to be scaled back to do this. If there is any negative effect to the on field game itself then I wouldn't want it, it just doesn't add anything to me, I just don't care what they are doing. For your last question, no I wouldn't, I likely wouldn't even notice.

[mrprice33]

I think it's pretty clear that there would be some negative effect to the on-field product. What that is really doesn't matter, IMO.

[bichettehappens]

Re: The community wants better sideline models in Madden vote for it here

I personally downvoted this idea. I would not want to see development resources allocated to this until other aspects of the game have been perfected.

I pay 0 attention to the sidelines and what's happening on them when I play a game of Madden. If the more glaring issues and necessary improvements are added into the game, then I would consider voting for something like this in future years when there aren't other options that deserve more attention, but right now it would be counterproductive for the EA team to spend time on trying to improve sideline player interaction when on-the-field interaction still has room for improvement.

[speedy9386]

Re: The community wants better sideline models in Madden vote for it here

Just played the nhl 12 demo and the crowd looks really good in that game.

[MattIntellect]

Re: The community wants better sideline models in Madden vote for it here

Sorry for posting this late. I meant to post this a week ago, but for some reason I was unable to connect to the site. I'm back now so...

Didn't Ian once say that they would have to sacrifice on the field graphics to make sideline graphics better? Then again he also said it wasn't possible to use physics in Madden so...

Yes and no. I'm sure that RTP is something that was years in the making. Ian likely had something to do with it considering he left just last year. In regards to interactive sidelines...

Read post #5:

http://www.operationsports.com/forum...post2039288579

As I think everyone is well aware, EVERY company that moved to 360 / PS3 went nuts on graphics. Well when the planning was done for graphical level of detail here at Tiburon, it was done to get the a.) absolute maximum amount of detail on 22 players on the field and b) insanely high-res stadiums. Extra characters really weren't considered because the player detail was so important, which is why it's been so hard getting new stuff in. That's why you haven't seen coaches in realtime on the sideline, or refs or chain gang either. All the initial planning and asset creation for the transition was done for 22 guys (at 30fps btw)...so it's been extremely difficult to make big global reductions as well as maintain 60 fps. Also, now that people are used to the visual fidelity of the game, we would take a lot of heat if the game started looking much worse graphically. I only wish that we had accounted for like 50 full-res guys.

The above is a good explanation that Ian gave years ago on why the sidelines and other off the field characters haven't been improved to match the quality of the players on the field. I don't think that it is something that can be accomplished in this generation of consoles. However, I have seen minor improvements in their graphics over the years.

[Segagendude]

Re: The community wants better sideline models in Madden vote for it here

It is a tad of an eyesore when I make a great INT near the opponent's sideline and all they do is stand and clap in unison.....

Or my player runs out of bounds near his teammates and runs right thru them like they're ghosts.

At least NHL 12, the players on the bench tried to get out of the way when a player got checked...