Am I the only one starting to get really FRUSTRATED with this PHYSICS ENGINE???

[bucky60]

Re: Am I the only one starting to get really FRUSTRATED with this PHYSICS ENGINE???

You dont want to trip? then dont run into anything.
Its pretty simple isnt it ? But I'm trolling because i'm saying something so fundamentally basic, I suppose?

OR, how about accurately representing running into something? Instead of falling down 5 yards away.

You wanted realism? you got it baby !

This is really funny. I think what you are really saying is, if you want realism, don't run into anything, cause if you do, it ends up being unrealistic. The rest are saying, we want realism.

The bold seems very ironic.

[bucky60]

Re: Am I the only one starting to get really FRUSTRATED with this PHYSICS ENGINE???

its a toy, this is a gaming forum. Its not a social political discussion. Its not breaking an atom. Its football gaming funtime.

That people want to be realistic.

Remember "you wanted realism, you got it baby"?

If you really don't want realism, why are you in this thread?

[Big FN Deal]

Re: Am I the only one starting to get really FRUSTRATED with this PHYSICS ENGINE???

People complain they didn't get physics last year. Get it this year and complain about it.

Sent from my SCH-I500 using Tapatalk

Why do people do this, take reasonable issues others have and try to over simplify them into being trivial?

Yes people asked for physics but just because they stick something like physics in Madden and market it as "physics you can feel" does NOT mean they gave people what they were asking for. You go to a restaurant, order a tender juicy steak and they bring you out a poorly butchered tough flank steak, you shouldn't complain because they gave you steak right?

The stuff that gets added to Madden reminds me of the monkey paw that would grant wishes but manipulate what the person asked for to make them better off not wishing, lol. Come to think of it, my girlfriend does the same thing, if I ask her to do something, like cook for me, she will make it terrible, in hopes that I won't ask again. Maybe that's EA Tiburon's plan, give us what we asked for but "fun" it up so bad, we never ask for it in Madden again, lol.

I am just joking around but the IE in it's current state, is obviously NOT what most people envisioned when asking for physics in Madden.

[therizing02]

Re: Am I the only one starting to get really FRUSTRATED with this PHYSICS ENGINE???

People complain they didn't get physics last year. Get it this year and complain about it.

Sent from my SCH-I500 using Tapatalk

A simplistic, well though out contribution. Thanks.

At this point, I think a lot of us are having a tough time believing that there are actual "physics" in the game. No one is complaining that they put it in the game or the about the idea of putting it in the game.

It's like a lot of other situations over the years in Madden and countless other sports games in that it's not the idea, but the implementation.

The positives that I can see at this point are very few and far between. Finally, when a player makes contact with another player, they lose momentum and slow down and gang tackling is finally in the game. But, I have a hard time calling it a true physics based engine when there is no foot planting, the players skate all over the field with that weightless feel and 180lb DBs can stand up Brandon Jacobs.

This engine is what it is at this point. A work in progress, but it would be a major stretch and would require a huge imagination to call this a "new physics engine".

[roll2tide]

Re: Am I the only one starting to get really FRUSTRATED with this PHYSICS ENGINE???

People complain they didn't get physics last year. Get it this year and complain about it.

Sent from my SCH-I500 using Tapatalk

We complain because basic, fundamental aspects of the game not only do not work properly, they often barely function at all.

We still have that same complaint.

[Mr_truthman.com]

Re: Am I the only one starting to get really FRUSTRATED with this PHYSICS ENGINE???

I think people need to know what the Infinity Engine is and what it really does to the game. EA throws around the term "real time physics". Even Trey Wingo says it when you go online in Madden 13. But the IE DOES NOT USE REAL TIME PHYSICS. This is a qoute from the Madden dev team given to Jay Robinson from ESPN.com. "This is a physics-driven animation engine that layers on top of “Madden’s” older animations and augments every outcome you’ll see in the game." What the IE does is takes all of Madden canned, mo-cap animations, and determines which animation will play out according to what situation your're in. In a conversation with EMMDOTFRISK, a community manager from EA sports, he confirmed on another thread that this is indeed the case. Here is his quote.

100% Physics has No animations and no motion capture.

The term "real time physics" really applies to the only other football game to feature a physics engine, Backbreaker. This is what the Euphoria engine does."Euphoria is a game animation engine created by NaturalMotion based on Dynamic Motion Synthesis, NaturalMotion's proprietary technology for animating 3D characters on-the-fly "based on a full simulation of the 3D character, including body, muscles and motor nervous system". Instead of using predefined animations, the characters' actions and reactions are synthesized in real-time; they are different every time, even when replaying the same scene". The reason why Madden 13 tackles and gameplay seem awfully familar is because it is. All the animations are the same, the IE just does a better job of picking out which ones play out and when. Until the IE reaches the level of Euphoria, then it can never be called "real-time physics". Hopefully, they can make the IE into a beast of a physics engine, but I would not be shocked if EA scraped the IE after 3 years of working on it. Time will tell, all we can do is hope for the best.

Here are the links where I got all my info...ESPN Jay Robinson interview:http://espn.go.com/blog/playbook/tec...cs-career-mode

.Euphoria info. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euphoria_(software)

[huskerwr38]

Re: Am I the only one starting to get really FRUSTRATED with this PHYSICS ENGINE???

And this is what bothers me -- they technically already had a 'test dummy'. Why would we, as football gamers, have to go through those same trials and errors as the previously titles if they have already figured away around them? Will NCAA have to start from where Madden is this year? That makes no sense to me at all.

This was rushed -- instead of something that really could have made this game special once it was perfected, it was used as a back of the box feature.

Spot on, I was thinking the same thing. I'm just thinking its either two things or both, the foundation of the game is just so not easy to work with or the Madden development team just lacks the skills to be able to produce a product on par with FIFA. The madden dev team implemented the FIFA locomotion system in Madden 11, but you would never know it. I have just come to realization we will never have a fundamentally correct football game. It's just sad.

[SageInfinite]

Re: Am I the only one starting to get really FRUSTRATED with this PHYSICS ENGINE???

The thing about all this is, for all the lip service I feel we have been given over the years, I do have confidence in this new team to make a solid NFl simulation, just not on these consoles. Some people are comparing FIFA's three year plan for physics and I would agree to a certain extent but I think Madden on these consoles is the "test dummy" for Madden on the next consoles.

I just don't believe this anymore. If Tiburon has never done it, I don't believe they have it in them to produce an NFL Sim type game. New team or not, Madden has never been that. They talked about how big they were going this year and this game is what we got. I just don't believe it. These systems have more than enough to create an accurate game, they don't need more powerful hardware, they need to focus on details and stop taking shortcuts. Stop taking the easy route. They can tell me they know what to do all they want, but if it still doesn't show in the game, that only tells me they CANNOT do it. They just don't have the talent.

[GiantBlue76]

Re: Am I the only one starting to get really FRUSTRATED with this PHYSICS ENGINE???

I just don't believe this anymore. If Tiburon has never done it, I don't believe they have it in them to produce an NFL Sim type game. New team or not, Madden has never been that. They talked about how big they were going this year and this game is what we got. I just don't believe it. These systems have more than enough to create an accurate game, they don't need more powerful hardware, they need to focus on details and stop taking shortcuts. Stop taking the easy route. They can tell me they know what to do all they want, but if it still doesn't show in the game, that only tells me they CANNOT do it. They just don't have the talent.

I couldn't agree more with this.

[Big FN Deal]

Re: Am I the only one starting to get really FRUSTRATED with this PHYSICS ENGINE???

I just don't believe this anymore. If Tiburon has never done it, I don't believe they have it in them to produce an NFL Sim type game. New team or not, Madden has never been that. They talked about how big they were going this year and this game is what we got. I just don't believe it. These systems have more than enough to create an accurate game, they don't need more powerful hardware, they need to focus on details and stop taking shortcuts. Stop taking the easy route. They can tell me they know what to do all they want, but if it still doesn't show in the game, that only tells me they CANNOT do it. They just don't have the talent.

I can't argue with you about the promises that have repeatedly fell short, imo, but I do believe next-gen Madden is built on a foundation not conducive for realistic football. I think it will take new consoles for this current team to set a solid football foundation. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if Kolbe from The Show is heading up the next console effort for Maddenas we speak.

I think at this point it's mainly about milking all they can out of current gen Madden and it's FUBAR foundation, then releasing a quality sim for the new consoles. I look at it like this, it's not like Weber and the current team can come out and state current Madden is a lost cause, wait for the new consoles but they have hinted at it. Now I will concede that for whatever reason, the realistic things it seems Madden could currently accomplish now, its' not being programmed to do so but again I believe that has more to do with keeping it "fun" to sell, than this team can't do better.

My belief about Madden on the new consoles is also fostered by my belief that the exclusive will be ending and this team can focus on making a quality NFL simulation versus some football hybrid with mass appeal for a ROI on the cost of the exclusive. If somehow the exclusive gets extended, which I highly doubt, then I suspect the new consoles will just be more of the same.

[BaNanaFi5h]

Re: Am I the only one starting to get really FRUSTRATED with this PHYSICS ENGINE???

I just don't believe this anymore. If Tiburon has never done it, I don't believe they have it in them to produce an NFL Sim type game. New team or not, Madden has never been that. They talked about how big they were going this year and this game is what we got. I just don't believe it. These systems have more than enough to create an accurate game, they don't need more powerful hardware, they need to focus on details and stop taking shortcuts. Stop taking the easy route. They can tell me they know what to do all they want, but if it still doesn't show in the game, that only tells me they CANNOT do it. They just don't have the talent.

Could not agree more. IMO, they just can't do it. Just look at NBA live for example. They still can't figure out.

[Mr_truthman.com]

Re: Am I the only one starting to get really FRUSTRATED with this PHYSICS ENGINE???

Could not agree more. IMO, they just can't do it. Just look at NBA live for example. They still can't figure out.

Correct, Live cant figure it out, but 2k has. Their product has a strong foundation and now, they're just layering the game with the details that Madden can only dream of. The little things. For example, if you notice in Madden the PA announcer never call anyone's name out. For instance if you run with Frank Gore for a 3yd gain, the PA announcer says "number 21 runs for a gain of 3 yds". In what NFL game does the PA announcer never uses a players,name. They do that on the high school level, even the middle school level. But in madden, it doesn't happen. In NBA2k, not only does the PA announces all the players names, but they even say your created players first and last name. The details count. Things like this may not seem like a big deal, but they are. And these are the details EA fumbles ever since coming to next gen. Because guess what, last gen madden, the PA announced players names. Even guys that were in the madden generated draft classes.

[Major9]

Re: Am I the only one starting to get really FRUSTRATED with this PHYSICS ENGINE???

Personally I enjoy the new physics engine. It is far from perfect (i didn't expect it to be) but it is MUCH better than what it used to be. I may run into an offensive lineman 1 or 2 times a game and get a funny animation or even fall down but that isn't enough for me to not like it.

[tril]

Re: Am I the only one starting to get really FRUSTRATED with this PHYSICS ENGINE???

A simplistic, well though out contribution. Thanks.

At this point, I think a lot of us are having a tough time believing that there are actual "physics" in the game. No one is complaining that they put it in the game or the about the idea of putting it in the game.

It's like a lot of other situations over the years in Madden and countless other sports games in that it's not the idea, but the implementation.

The positives that I can see at this point are very few and far between. Finally, when a player makes contact with another player, they lose momentum and slow down and gang tackling is finally in the game. But, I have a hard time calling it a true physics based engine when there is no foot planting, the players skate all over the field with that weightless feel and 180lb DBs can stand up Brandon Jacobs.

This engine is what it is at this point. A work in progress, but it would be a major stretch and would require a huge imagination to call this a "new physics engine".

thats what I was going to say. The physics engine wont work until they implement foot planting in the game. That would make a world of difference.
In addition a hit stick and dive button, isnt really a tackle button. tackling someone should involve wrapping someone up.
If Madden had added these 2 basic features and the physics engine, then I think you would have a more organic feeling and looking physics engine.

Thast one thing I liked about the other companys football game. I dont know if it was footplanting, but every step felt like step, every cut felt like a cut. Because of this player momentum was better represented.

I like Madden 13 but I believe we were hoodwinked with this physics engine and the total control passibng, cause laste years worked alot better. or I just dont understand how the tcp is suppose to work this year.

[RLaguna]

Re: Am I the only one starting to get really FRUSTRATED with this PHYSICS ENGINE???

I like what you said and agree with alot of these faults in the game....

In my opinion, and I consider myself very well groomed in video sports games (been playing almost every single one since the days of 4th & Inches on the Commodore 64 and Intellivision's Football) This game is a MAJOR BUST!.....My earlier prediction that this game would recieve some of the lowest Madden scores we've seen in quite some time hasnt quite come to fruition BUT I consider it right down there with some of the worst. And its a shame because the actual gameplay is a bit more wide open and dynamic this year which actually DOES do a good job of generating the realistic RESULTS and STATS but it just looks and feels terrible doing it

And the irony of the whole thing is that the feature many of us begged for the most is what is sinking this game fast. The Physics Engine is just so unpolished its a distraction when playing the game. I cannot take the game seriously because there simply is no sense of realistic contact between players.

For one, they feel hollow and have no sense of physical bodies colliding.

They momentum is all just completely off at times. Players will be running full speed outside on sweeps and come to a full stop when a defender cuts them off at an agle and then it goes into this mini standstill physics struggle game that just looks completely off.

Players bounce weirdly off each other into different directions at times

I seen a few plays where the RB gets tripped up going over a low tackler but doesnt go down (good ea) but then freezes in that stumble animation and just glides about 3 yards past and over the tackler while in that frozen stumble stance as if he was one of those electric football magnets from back in the day! (bad EA!)

The whole lack of immersion on almost every single contact truley makes this feel like a completely unfinished product that needs several years...YEARS, not weeks of tweaking to address.

There are some tackles that look good but I honestly think the ratio is like 4 bad, weird or just off for every 1 that looks right.

And it doesnt just end there with the contact. RBs juke left and right awkwardly and unrealistically as if they have metal rods underneath them and someone is yanking them left or right during the juke with absolutely no sense of weight shifting or momentum change. They will moonwalk or glide to the outside on sweeps and punt returns.

In my opinion, EA really went backwards...REALLY backwards with this years version. It lacks smooth fluid realistic and natural gameplay. I actually forced myself to finish 3 demo games just to convince myself that what I was seeing wasnt a mistake.......I actually rather go back and play Madden 10. Its much more grounded and feels better then this. Actually 09 does!

Its truely disappointing for me because I had such high stock that the new physics engine would shoot some much needed gameplay and dynamics into this game.....It Just doesnt! Its actually a big distraction for me.