5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

[JackSL97]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

What facts have you used to back up your opinions?

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Well it is a fact that player progression and game prep were broken in 2k5...guess you didn’t read my post very well


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[canes21]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

Well it is a fact that player progression and game prep were broken in 2k5...guess you didn’t read my post very well


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What made both of those broken? You didn't really go into detail. You mentioned Larry Fitzgerald was guaranteed to become a superstar. How does that mean the entire system was broken?

How was the game broken? It was imbalanced as the CPU didn't get to use it if I remember right, but it worked when the user used it.

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[Hooe]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

What made both of those broken? You didn't really go into detail. You mentioned Larry Fitzgerald was guaranteed to become a superstar. How does that mean the entire system was broken?

How was the game broken? It was imbalanced as the CPU didn't get to use it if I remember right, but it worked when the user used it.

From my recollection, player progression and weekly prep weren't broken per se, but they were obtuse to use.

Weekly prep being obtuse is obvious. Setting up the schedule of activities was a chore akin to setting up a Microsoft Excel document, and configuring it in such a way where the list of activities would result in a net positive benefit for your team was extremely challenging in the worst possible way. There was little to no prior guidance or after-the-fact feedback as to why certain results from weekly prep occurred given the list of activities one passed in. It was a mechanic which suffered greatly from poor communication and poor user interface, and while well intentioned it was probably too smart and too detailed for its own good. It was not engaging to use and it didn't intelligently reward the user for experimenting with it. I remember a lot of passing around of weekly prep set-and-forget templates on this forum back in the day.

Player progression was similarly obtuse at best (possibly influenced by weekly prep? it was unclear) and predetermined at worst. My personal experience with this was having a second-year quarterback make the Pro Bowl and win Super Bowl MVP only to regress below OVR 70 entering his third year. Regardless whether such a flash-in-the-pan career arc is realistic or "sim", it was quite simply frustrating as a person playing a video game to watch the game outright punish my achieving successful results. That lone memorable outcome soured me on the game's franchise mode entirely and I never touched it after that.

The more memorable bugs and issues in NFL 2K5's franchise mode centered around CPU team management AI, specifically trade logic and draft logic. CPU teams only took very specific positions with first-round picks, and the trade logic was aggressively fuzzy at best. Additionally, in a couch multiplayer setting, games could only be played in the order they appeared on the schedule, which in that specific gaming setting was a crippling shortcoming compared to Madden 2005's play-the-weekly-games-in-any-order flexibility.

[canes21]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

I agree that the weekly prep was not intuitive at all. It was an idea I would have liked to see get fleshed out if the series had continued, but it was confusing to use more often than not. I wouldn't say it was broken, but I turned it off personally since the CPU did not also use the feature.

As for progression. I actually really enjoy things like what you gave an example of with your QB. I personally hate the way Madden works with the XP system right now. I think it is the worst progression system in all of sports gaming.

I understand it is built to reward the user and create a satisfying gameplay loop where the user achieves success on the field and sees their players improve because of it. I totally get why it is why it is, I simply am not a fan of that style of progression in my sports games.

What 2k was going for from a progression standpoint was more of my style. My favorite progression/regression system in all of sports is what Out of the Park does. You get a scouting report for every single player. It shows their current ratings and their projected ratings. This updates regularly for all players.

It gives the user insight on what to expect from a player year after year. It seems 2k was aiming for a realistic progression system similar to what Out of the Park has now, but 2k5 lacked any sort of insight tool, so it was basically a guessing game as to what a player would be, which while realistic in a sense, the user needs some sort of guide like a scouting report to help them understand the process going on.

Had you had a scouting report showing your QB wasn't projected to be much, then it would have been much more clear that the guy had a magical season, but don't expect that from him regularly. It would have been better, but the lack of guidance from the game did make progress and regression in that game feel frustrating at times.

I wouldn't call the progression system broken, however. It was just unclear and wasn't a strictly performance based system like what Madden has these days. It desperately needed something akin to scouting reports to give the users some insight into what was going on so that they could better understand the results.

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[speedy9386]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

You're criticizing a game that came out like 100 years ago

[JackSL97]

5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

What made both of those broken? You didn't really go into detail. You mentioned Larry Fitzgerald was guaranteed to become a superstar. How does that mean the entire system was broken?

How was the game broken? It was imbalanced as the CPU didn't get to use it if I remember right, but it worked when the user used it.

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Progression wasn’t COMPLETELY broken as utilizing game prep in the complicated manner it was designed to work in could give certain players attribute boosts week to week but the fact that particular players were guaranteed to progress into the 90s even if they were bench warmers proves it was broken...ps2 madden’s progression system was far from perfect but it was much better than what 2k5 did


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[canes21]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

How does that prove it was broken?

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[TheShizNo1]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

How does that prove it was broken?

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You just like feeding the troll, huh?

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[JackSL97]

5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

You just like feeding the troll, huh?

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lmao some of you guys are so childish, I mean HOW DARE I challenge the notion that 2k5 is the greatest football game of all time, right? Its kinda like when a rapper dies and everyone calls them “the greatest of all time”, but 2k5 is the rapper in this situation lol


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[Keirik]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

How does that prove it was broken?

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Because he used all caps. That makes it official.

[canes21]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

You just like feeding the troll, huh?

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It can be entertaining.

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[canes21]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

lmao some of you guys are so childish, I mean HOW DARE I challenge the notion that 2k5 is the greatest football game of all time, right? Its kinda like when a rapper dies and everyone calls them “the greatest of all time”, but 2k5 is the rapper in this situation lol


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I never called 2k5 the greatest football game of all time. I just asked how that proved the progression system was broken because it just sounded like you're not a fan of the system, not that it is broken.

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[JackSL97]

5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

I never called 2k5 the greatest football game of all time. I just asked how that proved the progression system was broken because it just sounded like you're not a fan of the system, not that it is broken.

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I literally proved to you already that the progression system was broken by giving you the example with Larry Fitzgerald always becoming 90+ overall...progression isn’t supposed to be FIXED in franchise mode yet it clearly was in 2k...Gameprep itself is heavily tied in to in-season progression and that’s broken as well hence progression for the most part is simply broken in 2k5...



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[JackSL97]

5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

Funny thing is that if in an alternate reality 2k got the exclusive license people would be proclaiming madden 05 to be “the greatest football game of all time”...they’d be creaming themselves over “the relocation options, the hit stick, the training camp drills, the Tony Bruno show, Al Michaels and John Madden doing commentary, the tattoos in edit player, etc” ...2k actually did get their hands on an exclusive license for baseball and look how that turned out...on the other end of the spectrum you have people proclaiming mvp baseball to be the greatest baseball game of
all time...some of you are simply drowning in nostalgia and not taking reality into account


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[JackSL97]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

I agree that the weekly prep was not intuitive at all. It was an idea I would have liked to see get fleshed out if the series had continued, but it was confusing to use more often than not. I wouldn't say it was broken, but I turned it off personally since the CPU did not also use the feature.

As for progression. I actually really enjoy things like what you gave an example of with your QB. I personally hate the way Madden works with the XP system right now. I think it is the worst progression system in all of sports gaming.

I understand it is built to reward the user and create a satisfying gameplay loop where the user achieves success on the field and sees their players improve because of it. I totally get why it is why it is, I simply am not a fan of that style of progression in my sports games.

What 2k was going for from a progression standpoint was more of my style. My favorite progression/regression system in all of sports is what Out of the Park does. You get a scouting report for every single player. It shows their current ratings and their projected ratings. This updates regularly for all players.

It gives the user insight on what to expect from a player year after year. It seems 2k was aiming for a realistic progression system similar to what Out of the Park has now, but 2k5 lacked any sort of insight tool, so it was basically a guessing game as to what a player would be, which while realistic in a sense, the user needs some sort of guide like a scouting report to help them understand the process going on.

Had you had a scouting report showing your QB wasn't projected to be much, then it would have been much more clear that the guy had a magical season, but don't expect that from him regularly. It would have been better, but the lack of guidance from the game did make progress and regression in that game feel frustrating at times.

I wouldn't call the progression system broken, however. It was just unclear and wasn't a strictly performance based system like what Madden has these days. It desperately needed something akin to scouting reports to give the users some insight into what was going on so that they could better understand the results.

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you’re forgetting madden is a video game and performance-based progression was and always will be the best way to simulate what happens in real life because of the limitation of video games themselves, which are dealing with artificial intelligence and not living breathing human beings...your not taking into account that there will never be a such thing as virtual PEDs and virtual steroids ie Laron Landry/David Boston to account for why certain players had monster seasons and then fell way off the radar just a few years later...your not taking into account guys having 3 great years, then they sign a huge contract and they get lazy and never perform at that level again...madden’s NEVER gonna truly duplicate what you see in real life because of the limitations of AI and the nfl itself not wanting certain things depicted in their game as they love to hide behind their pretentious “clean” public image



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