Do you think that ONLY 4 Attributes is going to limit the player dynamics?

[mgoblue678]

Re: Do you think that ONLY 4 Attributes is going to limit the player dynamics?

Why would they go out of their way to make certain attributes invisible, except for the ones we've been hearing about all along? Too farfetched for me.

And why would they state or release info saying there were position specific ratings if they weren't in the game? That doesn't make any sense either.

We don't know that they went out of there way to make them not viewable by the user. Maybe they are only visible in certain menus in the full game as well.

[kehlis]

Re: Do you think that ONLY 4 Attributes is going to limit the player dynamics?

And why would they state or release info saying there were position specific ratings if they weren't in the game? That doesn't make any sense either.

We don't know that they went out of there way to make them not viewable by the user. Maybe they are only visible in certain menus in the full game as well.

Yea, I see no reason at this point to doubt the information they have given us up to this point.

It certainly seems a little suspect, but I have no reason to doubt them at this point and I'm sure there are good reasons why something like this wouldn't be viewable/obtainable in the demo...

[Clemalum2007]

Re: Do you think that ONLY 4 Attributes is going to limit the player dynamics?

Of course 4 is limited, however they have the 2 biggest attributes down perfectly, unlike madden, strength, and focus(awr). It's odd how they have all the hard attributes, but the easy to implement ones like catching and throw power are missing.

Catching is an easy one?? Check out Rick Noankles some time and see how easy that other game not to be named got the catching rating correct.

[NDirishMV]

Re: Do you think that ONLY 4 Attributes is going to limit the player dynamics?

On the fact about only showing us 4 ratings in the depth chart and not position specific ones. Could also be that they show just four to help you make a quick decision on who is better. Maybe when you have a franchise and go to your roster screen outside of a game, you will beable to view all of the other ratings he is talking about to further see how each player is.

[coconut267]

Re: Do you think that ONLY 4 Attributes is going to limit the player dynamics?

well if the attributes does the game well than no , but if the attributes aren't
noticable in the game then yes
.

[StormJH1]

Re: Do you think that ONLY 4 Attributes is going to limit the player dynamics?

Why are guys not sure that the other attributes are just not viewable in the demo?

The devs have stated at least a couple times that there a position specific ratings as well like throwing power and accuracy. Until we play the full game I am just going with the notion that they were simply left not viewable in the demo but are still in the full game.

Possible. If they aren't there, I don't think it will be a "dealbreaker" necessarily. For example, I'm already seeing wideouts dropping passes...if somebody's focus rating has some relationship to how often they hold onto balls, why do I need a specific catch rating?

That said, the lack of any ratings whatsoever in 2k8 destroyed that game, I don't care what anyone says. 2k8 had a ratings system, but basically elected to "hide" it from the gamer, how was that a good idea?

[LeonM]

Re: Do you think that ONLY 4 Attributes is going to limit the player dynamics?

Just curious to get your opinion about how you all feel about having only 4 attributes to differentiate between all the players in the game? Do you think this a bit too limiting to distinguish all the subtlies and distinctions that we've come to expect from various players around the league?


btw, I am just loving this demo....for all the things that you could argue that are limited or rudimentary from a football perspective, is more then compensated by the fact that every single play, hit, tackle is always a little different. This just keeps the game so fresh and exciting to continue to play and almost makes up for all the minor shortcomings of a first year sports title.

Good question.

The biggest key to the Backbreaker player ratings system is that the ratings are position specific.

For example, If a Quarterback has a 90 strength rating. It doesn't mean that he is stronger than an offensive lineman that has an 80 strength rating. It is all in relation to the players position.

Since the physics in this game are second to none to any other sports game. Since weight and momentum and angles matter. The ratings should then matter as well.

In theory, Here is how the 4 key atributes would work.

Focus would cover a player's awareness, intelligence and technique. Technique being the key because good technique requires excellent focus. You can't have great technique without having a high focus level. It's impossible.

Strength is self explanatory. All in relation to the position that the player plays.

Speed is also self explanatory. Again all in relation to the player's position.

Agility covers alot. That's the ability to turn and move and accelerate and jump. Once again, This area is all in relation to the player's position.

You have these 4 key atributes. Then you have a numbered ratings system for each main atribute and then you have the player's overall grade. Which would determine whether he is gold or silver level etc

This could all really work. It all comes back to the the ratings being position specific.

[hatisback]

Re: Do you think that ONLY 4 Attributes is going to limit the player dynamics?

Good question.

The biggest key to the Backbreaker player ratings system is that the ratings are position specific.

For example, If a Quarterback has a 90 strength rating. It doesn't mean that he is stronger than an offensive lineman that has an 80 strength rating. It is all in relation to the players position.

Since the physics in this game are second to none to any other sports game. Since weight and momentum and angles matter. The ratings should then matter as well.

In theory, Here is how the 4 key atributes would work.

Focus would cover a player's awareness, intelligence and technique. Technique being the key because good technique requires excellent focus. You can't have great technique without having a high focus level. It's impossible.

Strength is self explanatory. All in relation to the position that the player plays.

Speed is also self explanatory. Again all in relation to the player's position.

Agility covers alot. That's the ability to turn and move and accelerate and jump. Once again, This area is all in relation to the player's position.

You have these 4 key atributes. Then you have a numbered ratings system for each main atribute and then you have the player's overall grade. Which would determine whether he is gold or silver level etc

This could all really work. It all comes back to the the ratings being position specific.

True but I was thinking today that the four main ratings might have sub ratings that make up that number. For instance:

QB
FOCUS
Awareness
Throw Accuracy

AGILITY
Spin Move
Juke
Stutter Step

SPEED
Speed
Acceleration

STRENGTH
Trucking
Stiff Arm
Throw Power
Tackling (On fumbles and INT's)

Those sub ratings could make up the four main ratings with some kind of formula, and the four main ratings through a formula would give us the overall.

[gr18]

Re: Do you think that ONLY 4 Attributes is going to limit the player dynamics?

True but I was thinking today that the four main ratings might have sub ratings that make up that number. For instance:

QB
FOCUS
Awareness
Throw Accuracy

AGILITY
Spin Move
Juke
Stutter Step

SPEED
Speed
Acceleration

STRENGTH
Trucking
Stiff Arm
Throw Power
Tackling (On fumbles and INT's)

Those sub ratings could make up the four main ratings with some kind of formula, and the four main ratings through a formula would give us the overall.

good thinking,that would be great if this was the case.

[CreatineKasey]

Re: Do you think that ONLY 4 Attributes is going to limit the player dynamics?

Position specific ratings = important. I was getting worried when I saw LB's with 90's in the STR category while DE's had 70's in the STR category.

[hatisback]

Re: Do you think that ONLY 4 Attributes is going to limit the player dynamics?

good thinking,that would be great if this was the case.

That would especially come in use when it comes to evaluating and drafting. If a guy has 88 focus might mean his throw accuracy is good but his awareness is horrible.

Im only thinking this because I see major differences between Wagoner and Greathouse even though their four ratings are very similar.

[gr18]

Re: Do you think that ONLY 4 Attributes is going to limit the player dynamics?

That would especially come in use when it comes to evaluating and drafting. If a guy has 88 focus might mean his throw accuracy is good but his awareness is horrible.

Im only thinking this because I see major differences between Wagoner and Greathouse even though their four ratings are very similar.

yeah,Wagoner is definitely more accurate.

[Lisa_Bonami]

Re: Do you think that ONLY 4 Attributes is going to limit the player dynamics?

Yes if these actual 4 ratings are just GLOBAL ratings that have many sub ratings underneath each of them, then I would have more confidence in the game's ability to create more diversity among all the different players

However, by the same token, Im not so sure I prefer to only be able to see 4 global categories versus more broken out categories that are viewable. From a marketing standpoint alone, I would think if the game had all these sub ratings in the game that made up a players abilities, they'd certainly want to advertise that rather than hide it....and from a gameplay standpoint, its better to see the different ratings in more categories to better understand what makes a player perform the way they do

And finally, Im not so sure how I feel about Ratings being POSITION SPECIFIC rather than just being TRUE ratings. For example, when you have a LB with a 90 STRENGTH and a DE with a 80 STRENGTH, you have to constantly perform all these mental conversion in your head. And when you have all these positions with different ratings that are position specific, it can get quite confusing to decipher, ie, is my QB with a SPEED of 95 faster than the opponents LB with a SPEED of 85? etc.


Why not just have true ratings that are global across all positions for example.....RB's with 90 Speeds are faster than DE's with 88 speeds?....Im just curious why this wouldnt work?

[hatisback]

Re: Do you think that ONLY 4 Attributes is going to limit the player dynamics?

Yes if these actual 4 ratings are just GLOBAL ratings that have many sub ratings underneath each of them, then I would have more confidence in the game's ability to create more diversity among all the different players

However, by the same token, Im not so sure I prefer to only be able to see 4 global categories versus more broken out categories that are viewable. From a marketing standpoint alone, I would think if the game had all these sub ratings in the game that made up a players abilities, they'd certainly want to advertise that rather than hide it....and from a gameplay standpoint, its better to see the different ratings in more categories to better understand what makes a player perform the way they do

And finally, Im not so sure how I feel about Ratings being POSITION SPECIFIC rather than just being TRUE ratings. For example, when you have a LB with a 90 STRENGTH and a DE with a 80 STRENGTH, you have to constantly perform all these mental conversion in your head. And when you have all these positions with different ratings that are position specific, it can get quite confusing to decipher, ie, is my QB with a SPEED of 95 faster than the opponents LB with a SPEED of 85? etc.


Why not just have true ratings that are global across all positions for example.....RB's with 90 Speeds are faster than DE's with 88 speeds?....Im just curious why this wouldnt work?

One thing is size and weight which do factor into this game. I cant think of anyone else. You will at least be able to compare each position.

[MSOADE54]

Re: Do you think that ONLY 4 Attributes is going to limit the player dynamics?

I can deal with only 4 ratings. It's better than 20 ratings that mean nothing.

took the words out of my mouth.