Who Are Your Top 5 Players of the 21st Century?

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: Who Are Your Top 5 Players of the 21st Century?

Honestly Manning, Brady, Lewis and LT should be locks on EVERYBODY'S Top 5 list and i'll even throw in Tony G(even though he's not on my list) Especially how considering for most, if not ALL of the 00s these 4 have been among the top 2-3 at their position the entire time and in some cases still are.

Guys like Big Ben, Moss, etc....yeah that I don't get.

Ahh I see the "He's a Packer Fan so of course he's not gonna give Moss any love" card got played.

No it's not that at all. It's that you honestly "don't get" how Moss should be mentioned and discussed. Uh, yes he absolutely deserves to be mentioned in this thread.

It's fine if you don't think he's top 5, but what don't you get about him being in the discussion? That's a bit of a stretch to say you don't get why or how Moss would be brought up.

As has been said, the top 4 spots are solidified IMO. The 5th spot can be up for grabs. With this type of thread it's pretty impossible to cut it down to 5.

But overall yes I agree that Big Ben shouldn't be in the discussion. I saw Demarcus Ware? Some of these names don't deserve mention, but Moss isn't one of them.

[untrugby]

Re: Who Are Your Top 5 Players of the 21st Century?

Come again?? How does LT's numbers not stack up like theirs?? He is 2nd all time in rushing TD's, 3rd all time in total TD's, and 6th all time in rushing yards and yards from scrimmage. Plus he also has/held numerous NFL records. Not to mention his first 8 year run is arguably the greatest run for a RB in NFL history.

If you was to look at his numbers in comparison to his peers his stand out far more than Moss numbers do. Moss has TO and Harrison with very very close numbers to his in regards to receptions,yards, and TD's. LT's numbers are far and away better than any of his peers. The closest guy to LT is Portis and he is over 3,400 rushing yards and 69 TD's behind. That doesn't even begin to go into the huge lead LT has on him in recieving and total yards.

the better than competitors thing doesnt matter if the competitors are so good. Its like saying Peyton shouldnt make the list because hes only a little bit better than Brady. Moss' number look similar because hes played 3 less season than harrison and 4 less than TO. and LdT isnt as far ahead of his contemporaries as you think either Edge retired at 31 the same age as LdT now and hes only 1,200 yards behind him.

lets look at how they stack up

Gonzo 1st in rec, yards and TDs among TEs. 11 probowls, 9 all-pro

Moss 8th in rec, 5th in yards and 2nd in TDs. 7 probowls, 5 all-pro

LdT 5 in att, 6 in yards, 2nd in TDs. 5 probowls, 4 all-pro

maybe it was hasty to say he doesnt stack up as much but they all stack up well and should all be on the list IMO. thats why they were all on my list.

[PrettyT11]

Re: Who Are Your Top 5 Players of the 21st Century?

the better than competitors thing doesnt matter if the competitors are so good. Its like saying Peyton shouldnt make the list because hes only a little bit better than Brady. Moss' number look similar because hes played 3 less season than harrison and 4 less than TO. and LdT isnt as far ahead of his contemporaries as you think either Edge retired at 31 the same age as LdT now and hes only 1,200 yards behind him.

lets look at how they stack up

Gonzo 1st in rec, yards and TDs among TEs. 11 probowls, 9 all-pro

Moss 8th in rec, 5th in yards and 2nd in TDs. 7 probowls, 5 all-pro

LdT 5 in att, 6 in yards, 2nd in TDs. 5 probowls, 4 all-pro

maybe it was hasty to say he doesnt stack up as much but they all stack up well and should all be on the list IMO. thats why they were all on my list.

I don't know where you are getting your number of years from but TO has only played two more seasons than Moss and Harrison played the same amount. Also Harrison has played in less games than Moss and TO has only played in 17 more games than Moss (whichs equals to pretty much one season). So that throws that whole argument out the window.

As far as LT goes. James also played one more season than LT and is 64 rushing TD's behind and 68 total TD's behind. That is a huge difference. The only guy ahead of LT in rushing yards that has played less than him is Barry Sanders (by 3 games) and he is 45 rushing TD's behind and 50 total TD's behind. His seasonal averages are 1340 rushing yards and 14 TD's. Only Jim Brown has numbers close to that. So yeah his numbers crush his peers pretty easily.

Lastly LT has 6 all pro seasons not 4. He is also has something they don't have in an MVP award. Any way you slice it LT's numbers stand strong with any and everybody.

[ProfessaPackMan]

Not a stretch at all because the 5 I mentioned there was no question about whether or not they were one of, if not the best at their position because those would be the first names that would come up if you asked someone "Oh, who's the best QB?" or "Who's the best RB?", etc.

And believe it or not, there was a time when Moss' name wouldn't even be one of the first names brought up when asking "Who's the best WR". Or am I the only one who doesn't disregard his time in Oakland like everyone else has regardless of what went on there?

Consistency is the key and I don't think he's been as consistent as any of those 5 have been or even some of the honorable mentions. Not a slight or diss or is it "Me being a Packer Fan so of course I'm going to hate" like others are insinuating.

Something with Roethlisberger and Ware except I don't think they should be just for the fact it's still a bit early for them.

[ProfessaPackMan]

Not meant to be an "All Time" thread or a "Who's deserving of a HOF Spot" thread either.

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: Who Are Your Top 5 Players of the 21st Century?

Consistency? So he had two off years? A bit harsh, actually very harsh.

Outside of his last year where he had clearly lost a few steps, his 12 year window was simply exceptional.

10/12 years the guy was one of the best at his position, even as a rookie.

No it isn't that you're a Packer fan, it's that you're just plain reaching if you're seriously asking why Moss' name has been mentioned. It's really simple. His name belongs in this thread.

[TheMatrix31]

Re: Who Are Your Top 5 Players of the 21st Century?

His name belongs in the thread, but not on the list.

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: Who Are Your Top 5 Players of the 21st Century?

Really? That's debatable, which is why I'm puzzled as to how Big Ben and Moss were mentioned in the same sentence. And that has nothing to do with alliances or someone being a homer.

He's definitely honorable mention.

[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: Who Are Your Top 5 Players of the 21st Century?

Puzzled for what? It was already explained that Ben had no business being mentioned at all.

So hold up? It's now considered being harsh for asking for something that the other 5 clearly had and were?

Again, LT, Brady, Manning, Lewis and Reed: When have they EVER been questioned as to whether or not they're not one of the top 2 players at their position during the 00s? Not much.

THAT'S the difference between those 5 and Moss because they NEVER let circumstance or some personal pride affect their performance ON the field.

Honorable Mention? Sure go ahead and mention his name if it makes ya'll happy.

But Top 5(which is what I was asking for)especially over THOSE 5 players, who really should be EVERYONE's top 5(but that's just me)then yea, you better make a strong *** case for putting him in there and taking out one of those 5 names. But other than that, none of those spots should really be up for grabs.

[TheMatrix31]

Re: Who Are Your Top 5 Players of the 21st Century?

Ex-freakin-actly.

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: Who Are Your Top 5 Players of the 21st Century?

Yes I am still puzzled as to what exactly the discussion has turned in to. Ben simply doesn't belong anywhere in the discussion, while Moss clearly does. It can't get any more clear than that.

I consider it harsh for you to question Moss' consistency and mention Oakland. He had two "down" years out of 12. Seems harsh.

Comparing across positions is tough. I would say Moss' prime and the amount of years he was in his prime could vault him into the top 5.

I am not saying he is, I'm simply asking you how you would put Moss' and Ben's name in the same sentence, when clearly one belongs in the other doesn.t

[TheMatrix31]

Re: Who Are Your Top 5 Players of the 21st Century?

He didnt have two down years because of "whatever, just two down years". He had two down years because he made himself have two down years.

Then what happened last year was totally inexcusable.

[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: Who Are Your Top 5 Players of the 21st Century?

Again, it is not harsh when you look at the others and see how consistent they've been and still are to this day, which is why they are in the Top 5. Hell, 2 of the players mentioned could and probably will go down as the 2 best defensive players of this decade.

Only difference is you and others want to exclude years just because.... or in this case "bad circumstance" like he's the only player to ever go thru that.

Again, Honorable Mention? I'll let him slide into there.

Top 5 however? Don't know about that.

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: Who Are Your Top 5 Players of the 21st Century?

He didnt have two down years because of "whatever, just two down years". He had two down years because he made himself have two down years.

Then what happened last year was totally inexcusable.

Right. And that's totally fine opinion to have IMO. I feel the same way.

The main point is, I can understand why others and/or a lot of people still think he is top 5. Which some have still put him on their lists.

Because he acted up for two years doesn't overshadow a decade of historic skill and production. Once again if anyone doesn't have him in the top 5, that's completely understandable. What isn't understandable is how you would question why his name being mentioned.

PackMan, I get what you're saying completely. I have understood and agreed with every post you've made since the one I quoted initially. It's all besides my point though.

[USCstreets]

Re: Who Are Your Top 5 Players of the 21st Century?

I would say reciever is one of if not the most dependant positions in all of sports. It wouldntve mattered if Moss dogged it or not he was never going to put up numbers in Oakland with such an awful team. For all we know he came in with the mindset of contributing but found himself on a dead end team.

I will say this for Randy Moss back when Mike Tice was head coach in Minnesota and established the Moss rule, essentially Randy Moss gets targeted in 40% of the offenses plays. The team went 5-11 that year but when Randy was targeted 40% of the time they were 4-1 when they failed to target Randy they didnt win a single game.

Every player has their flaws T.O. has his divisive personality, Manning struggles in winable playoff games, Polomalu gets burned deep, Brady's inconsistent season to season play. Randy doesnt give full effort but he did what he did on the field and I think its incredibly evident that inspite of personal shortcomings he is one of the greatest recievers of all time and one of the top five players of the 21st century.

My list would be:

Offense: Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Randy Moss, Walter Jones, LaDanian Tomlinson or Tony Gonzalez

Defense: Ray Lews, Troy Polomalu, Derrick Brooks, Darelle Revis, Ed Reed but Suh will knock him or Brooks off this spot.

Weve still got 89 seasons to go