Jack's Record Is Safe

[DivotMaker]

Re: Jack's Record Is Safe

Hi Tim
Sorry that wasn't more clear

When I said "the first point Matt makes", I meant literally the first line about Tiger

(I just couldn't figure out how to screen shot only that part)

Got it, thanks!

[ImTellinTim]

Jack's Record Is Safe

I'll beg to differ. Short-term, Eldrick is good for ratings. But long term, the incredible amount of media attention paid to his fits and starts at age 42 detract the focus from the INCREDIBLE amount of young talent on the Tour right now.

Spieth, DJ, JT, Fowler, Rahm, Rose, Hideki, Koepka, Day, Fleetwood, et al are all better than Eldrick. Yet he inhales so much of the media oxygen that everyone's first question at a tournament becomes, "How did Tiger do, and oh, yeah, who won?"

It's time for a changing of the guard. I don't mind it when the old guard like Lefty wins a tournament. It's fine for Tiger to be competitive. But his era atop the golf world is done, and it's time for the media and fans to focus more on the rising superstars in the ranks who are actually playing great golf every damn week instead of once every six weeks.

They focus on those guys all the time when he isn't playing. But you can't force people to care about them. Like it or not Tiger brings the eyes. He's the greatest golfer of all time on top of bringing golf into a new stratosphere in how much prize money became available to those that came after him. Those guys you listed should thank their lucky stars for Tiger. And he can still beat all of them on his day.

[Cusefan]

Re: Jack's Record Is Safe

I'll beg to differ. Short-term, Eldrick is good for ratings. But long term, the incredible amount of media attention paid to his fits and starts at age 42 detract the focus from the INCREDIBLE amount of young talent on the Tour right now.

Spieth, DJ, JT, Fowler, Rahm, Rose, Hideki, Koepka, Day, Fleetwood, et al are all better than Eldrick. Yet he inhales so much of the media oxygen that everyone's first question at a tournament becomes, "How did Tiger do, and oh, yeah, who won?"

It's time for a changing of the guard. I don't mind it when the old guard like Lefty wins a tournament. It's fine for Tiger to be competitive. But his era atop the golf world is done, and it's time for the media and fans to focus more on the rising superstars in the ranks who are actually playing great golf every damn week instead of once every six weeks.

Since Tiger's 2009 meltdown, there are 3 million fewer golfers in the US. I get what your saying, I can tell you're a purist who loves the sport but none of the guys you mentioned are growing the sport. Think about all the obstacles Golf has to get people playing: Its really expensive, huge learning curve, and in this fast paced world, it can be boring to some. Tiger added that excitement, who cannot get pumped up watching This

If you love the sport and want to see more people playing then you need to root for Tiger. Only time will tell if he really is "back" and if him being back would mean more people playing.

[scagwi]

Re: Jack's Record Is Safe

In case anyone still thinks golf going mainstream wasn't all about Tiger, I present to you the Sunday TV ratings.

NCAA Selection Show on TBS averaged 2.497 million viewers per minute from 6-8P ET.

Sunday 3-6P ET coverage of final round of PGA Tour at Valspar averaged 6.913M.

[pk500]

Re: Jack's Record Is Safe

He's the greatest golfer of all time

OK, you lost me right there. Jack Nicklaus is the greatest golfer of all time. Just look at the list of majors won. Just look at the title of this thread.

Plus Sam Snead remains the player with the most PGA Tour career victories, not Eldrick.

[ImTellinTim]

Jack's Record Is Safe

OK, you lost me right there. Jack Nicklaus is the greatest golfer of all time. Just look at the list of majors won. Just look at the title of this thread.

Lots of other things to consider. But we won't change each other's minds and that's fine.

[scagwi]

Re: Jack's Record Is Safe

Lots of other things to consider. But we won't change each other's minds and that's fine.

Agreed - It's somewhat akin to the "best QB ever" debates when players from the distant past are included.

It's really difficult in all the sports to account for changes in the game, the competition level and depth and sometimes even literal changes to the sport itself over time (rules, equipment, etc).

I just know that, in his prime, it's hard to beat the fear of having that Red Shirt coming down the stretch and bearing down on your score on a Sunday.

[lowpaiddonkey10]

Re: Jack's Record Is Safe

It appears as if Tiger has figured it out and can compete with anyone on his best day now. Not good enough to dominate so I would have to say at his age Jack's record is safe.

[pk500]

Re: Jack's Record Is Safe

I just know that, in his prime, it's hard to beat the fear of having that Red Shirt coming down the stretch and bearing down on your score on a Sunday.

Let me ask you one question: Were you alive and following golf during the Golden Bear's prime?

[pk500]

Re: Jack's Record Is Safe

Lots of other things to consider. But we won't change each other's minds and that's fine.

Yeah, like winning The Masters at age 46. When Tiger does that, we can talk about comparisons.

[kehlis]

Re: Jack's Record Is Safe

Let me ask you one question: Were you alive and following golf during the Golden Bear's prime?

Serious question for you. Were you? I've been to both your facebook page and twitter page and it certainly doesn't look like you would have been of age to actively be following him through his prime through newspapers (since there weren't regular golf presentations when that was occurring).

On a separate note, I'm not a racing fan but it looks like you have a pretty cool gig.

[scagwi]

Re: Jack's Record Is Safe

Let me ask you one question: Were you alive and following golf during the Golden Bear's prime?

Alive - but I'd have to say not following it like now, as it just wasn't possible in any way close to the same way as it has been the last 2 decades or so.

I think you know what I mean.
All sports have changed that way.

The coverage, the type, the amount, what you had to count on anecdotally in the far past vs seeing it more for yourself now, etc

As an aside..

Do you just really dislike Tiger?
I'm kind of getting a touch of that vibe coming through.

[pk500]

Re: Jack's Record Is Safe

Serious question for you. Were you? I've been to both your facebook page and twitter page and it certainly doesn't look like you would have been of age to actively be following him through his prime through newspapers (since there weren't regular golf presentations when that was occurring).

On a separate note, I'm not a racing fan but it looks like you have a pretty cool gig.

I'm almost 53; I was born in 1965.

Thanks for the compliment, mate, but I was alive and well during the 1970s when The Golden Bear ruled golf. I also followed the sport because my dad watched golf every weekend on TV. He still does, nearly at age 90.

Yes, I'm very grateful for my job. I have no problem getting up and going to work each day.

[pk500]

Re: Jack's Record Is Safe

Do you just really dislike Tiger?
I'm kind of getting a touch of that vibe coming through.

Yes. Admire him as a competitor. Dislike him as a human being. A philandering prick. And I'll admit that definitely colors my opinion of him.

Tiger's class couldn't fill a thimble compared to Nicklaus.

[scagwi]

Re: Jack's Record Is Safe

Yes. Admire him as a competitor. Dislike him as a human being. A philandering prick. And I'll admit that definitely colors my opinion of him.

Tiger's class couldn't fill a thimble compared to Nicklaus.

I do appreciate your honesty…

I have a hard time even worrying or considering that personal side of things.

How much do we honestly really know about any of these guys personal lives in that regard?
(Way too much usually and likely still not even close to all of it)

I get even more suspicious in that regard when one considers the different social norms and far less visible public presence in previous decades, especially when getting back towards the 70's.

It was way way way easier to hide everything about your personal life in the past.

For me it just doesn't impact how I look at them as golfers for the most part. We all have some strange personal demons and I just don't hold them to some higher standard than I would anybody else in that regard.

I just compartmentalize with that I guess.
It sounds like you try to do that also with your comment about him as a competitor and your admiration for that side of things.