Spider-Man: No Way Home (December 17, 2021)

[Smallville102001]

Re: Spider-Man: No Way Home (December 17, 2021)

At a 94 on Rotten tomatoes may drop down to like a 91 with more reviews but great either way. Also almost 600 million opening weekend without china!

https://deadline.com/2021/12/spider-man-no-way-home-50m-preview-easily-pandemic-record-all-time-for-sony-100m-friday-likely-1234898486/

[Blzer]

Re: Spider-Man: No Way Home (December 17, 2021)

I honestly can't wait to see this again, although it may not be until a couple of weeks from now unfortunately. I'm still so pissed at my situation for going into the film staler than even the trailers offered.

Anyway, as many positives as there are with the flick, I did have some issues overall as well. For one, I don't think the CGI was as good as in Far From Home. Obviously a lot of attention was spent on the de-aging characters like Ock, and maybe it came at the cost of the rest of it. It's just sad though that I see some Spidey action in a movie that is fourteen years older in Spider-Man 3, and I think it looks better than in this movie. Visual effects does not a movie make, but it is part of the appeal. Hell, it's the only reason any of us like any part of Michael Bay's Transformers movies (which can also come with bad CGI, mind you).

Now onto some story- and character-based ones. Don't let these statements make you think I did not like this movie, because it is absolutely fantastic. I think these are things that are more than nitpicks though that prevent me from claiming it a top SM or MCU film overall though, combined with the fact that I never got a good first fresh absorption of this movie because of what I was spoiled (which I guess was my doing):

Spoiler

- The catalyst to the plot. I think this was just all kinds of silly and stupid, and could've completely been prevented. There is no way that I am steps ahead of a smart kid like Peter, either in making the demands (easiest one is don't let anyone who just found out from the news know about it) for the spell or not interrupting it along the way. On that note, Doctor Strange was done way dirty in this film. First of all, he was right. Send them back, let the villains die, seal the rift, and save your own universe. Or don't fulfill a kid's wish because he is too dumb to appeal a university's admission decision. Of course for cinematic purposes we want Peter to accomplish heroic duties, but being in their world he really couldn't have made a worse decision for himself, and Strange never should have allowed it.

- I don't understand the whole "forgetting a person" thing. Okay, so Wong forgot some event or something... I can take that, kind of like being drunk and forgetting the night before. But to forget a person? You share moments and memories with that person, and that person helps shape your future (hence one reason Peter stayed dark to his friends afterward knowing he did that). Let's say that Aunt May survives that one attack and is a part of the people who forgets Peter exists... um, how? That's several years of her life with voids virtually all over the place. I know she didn't give birth to him or anything, but you're not going to erase driving a kid to school every day or doing homework with him, or having him live with you and eat meals with you. This doesn't make any sense as to exactly how this works.

- Not to mention... I'll go with it if it goes this way, but does this erase all media and other content that contains Peter connected with others as well? The news story that broke about Spider-Man's identity, photos/video Peter would have with Ned and MJ, text messages, handwritten documents (notes, assignments), etc.? All of it is gone as well? If Peter ultimately did want Ned and MJ to remember him, they couldn't pull a 50 First Dates and whip out their phone and record something saying: "Remember dis?" Obviously it seems the spell would eradicate all of this stuff, but it just goes back to the whole void thing again that begs to wonder what happens to anything that Peter has ever touched in life, or bought, or anything of that sort. Should any remnants have ties with the character as to provide people remembrance of that particular individual, then I guess they should be restored to their original place, yeah? This would include... oh, I don't know... MJ's broken Black Dahlia necklace?? Flash Thompson's book?? If things like videos are erased, these should be as well.

Venom 2 spoilers:

Spoiler

- Why was Eddie brought into this universe? I'll have to watch this again, but I seem to remember Doctor Strange saying that only people who know Peter is Spider-Man would be brought into the universe. Eddie didn't even know who Spider-Man was as a hero in the Venom 2 end credit scene. This is obviously going to be big going forward as the symbiote will likely latch onto Peter at some point (giving that spidey logo later) and/or just introducing a new Eddie Brock in the MCU, but Tom Hardy never should've been there. When you put your entire plot on the crux of an idea and it falters here, it is an automatic "what the hell movie?" kind of moment.

EDIT: I just rewatched TASM 2, and I don't think Electro knew who Spider-Man's identity either (unless Dane DeHaan's Harry told him off camera). I was also thinking about Flint Marko, but I guess since Topher's Eddie had him join up and since they captured Mary Jane, I guess he may know. Obviously he had scene his face, but that doesn't therefore mean he knew his name. But with that Eddie there, I suppose it's possible. Tom Hardy's Eddie, though? I don't see how.

- I wish that Flash's character had more to do in the beginning of the film as well. Don't get me wrong, they included him, but after the end of Far From Home when we see him being picked up by his driver without his mother, I wanted to see some character growth from an emotional bottom to having Peter be an iconic beacon of inspiration and not just become a "best friend" to the media whom he can mooch off of and reap the benefits from (including a swing promise that we never got, not that I'd want to see that haha) and back to being a little snobbish after being accepted to MIT (though I'll admit he seemed remorseful the others didn't get in).

Now just some other thoughts:

Spoiler

I'm also going to find out what I actually think about this movie after watching it a few more times. Everyone else gets to ride the high of being able to see Tobey and Andrew fresh, whilst I walk right into the theater with Tom Holland crying with his friends, Tobey and Andrew swinging down and saying that they're sorry about May. Holy ****, of all places to walk into a movie that was the part that I hit. To make matters worse, I was convinced still that I went into the right theater and they just didn't do previews, so when I requested a time change for my ticket I figured this occurred within the first 15-20 minutes of the movie. Nope. After watching more of the movie, the only thing on my mind was "these things will happen" and everything seemingly "dragged" until then. Nothing was of substantial impact for me anymore, even though I didn't know what would lead up to it or what would happen beforehand. It was unnerving, and I can't do anything about it.

This sets a realistic bar for me now, though. I don't go in next time with some unrealistic high of the film in realizing that I might just think this movie is perfect because of the movies that set it up beforehand. I love Doc Ock because of Spider-Man 2. I love Tobey and Andrew because they were our Peter Parkers. You know, things like that. Nostalgia kicks in very heavily, and although everything after was fresh and new that will also be a good test. Will the banter and dialogue exchanges between all three Peters remain frickin' awesome like it was this first time, whether or not there is an audience around? Because it sure was the first time, so I hope it is again. Will I feel like this movie is trying to give me feels more than advance plot, and will those feels remain going forward? Unsure, but I am optimistic that it will. They are relying on the past to make it happen though, so in a way I feel it enhances those movies just as much as it makes this movie good. That's not a problem, but that is the narrative I think I need to provide this.

And there is one thing this movie does really well: gives closure to characters, especially Andrew Garfield's Peter. I didn't get a chance to cry for May's death knowing it was going to happen, and I don't know how impactful it was for others... but I did cry when Andrew saved Tom Holland's MJ. Best moment of the movie, by far. I'm weeping just typing about it. He never got his closure for his character, and I'm sure when they asked him to come back, the nail in the coffin that brought him on board was bringing up this moment. Anyone would be stupid not to sign on after hearing about that. Whatever rating I would've given this movie before that moment, that brought it up a full letter grade as a result. If it was an A, now it's an A++. I'll give it a grade and ranking later after seeing it more, though.

Willem Dafoe was amazing in this. This is the Goblin that we needed. I find SM1 way too dated and campy to enjoy today, but getting this really made amends for it. I died laughing at the "You know, I'm something of a scientist myself" callback. I wish we got more Doc Ock as a good guy in this one. I was fine with Sandman and Lizard being in the background, but it would've been nice to see more THC in human form. Electro changed from some character named Max to Jamie Foxx, which one can accept in terms of improving the guy I guess but is very inconsistent with TASM 2. The villains did not seem overcrowded, which is a huge compliment to this film.

[Blzer]

Re: Spider-Man: No Way Home (December 17, 2021)

Okay, the heavens above graced me with a fortunate opportunity to catch it again before I go away for a couple of weeks to see family (and can't watch anything in theaters then).

For one, my previous theater had a poorly calibrated projector. I noticed it then, but I was reminded here immediately. It looked much better this time. No reddish tint with all pink skin tones. Audio was also much more immersive. This was a LieMAX screen which would probably help with that. Sadly they cropped the sides to fill the height, but I'll take the tradeoff from what I had last time.

Secondly, this was a full audience that was rather engaged. These two things combined with me kind of resetting my experience overall really helped the impact of everything. This second viewing was much more enjoyable on my end. I didn't get to have something happen for the "first time" in some more important aspects, but I'll take this one.

I don't know if I can blame the CGI anymore compared to say Far From Home, because it's unfair what one had to do versus the other in juggling the different villains. However, I will say that I'd think after fifteen years that I figured we would've advanced farther technologically, that's all. This was a visually pleasing film overall, and the de-aging was fantastic.

I think the MCU Spider-Man films trounce pretty much anything that is not named Spider-Man 2 and Into the Spider-Verse, but I don't know how to compare one to the other yet. My only real qualms with Far From Home are kind of quibbles: the very unrealistic drone technology fooling the world and being made the way that it was, and the villain toast scene (I also don't know why Peter suddenly started digging MJ, but time had passed and they are friends so we can connect dots). My main problem with Homecoming was too much Iron Man influence, not so much that he was in the film (I actually liked that) but we really saw Spider-Man become Iron Man Jr. of sorts (and full on Iron Spider from Infinity War onward). I've given most of my negatives on No Way Home (and they still stand) but this wins on the emotional levels that the other two don't ever hit.

Spoiler

There are two things that I really started to appreciate about the ending. One is that Peter now appears to just be Spider-Man with no Iron Spider suit, no Karen, etc. The other is that with nobody knowing who Peter is, they can literally do anything with the story that they want to, including if Sony brings him back to their universe. They are no longer tied down by anything at all.

I'm going to re-watch Into the Spider-Verse again to figure out where I want to place it. Now that we have two movies with multiverses in existence, I'd like to differentiate what makes one more special than the other. I know that I like Into the Spider-Verse's characters a hell of a lot and the story involved with Miles, so we'll see if that remains to be true.

This was a major win overall, especially for the movie theater industry.

[Jr.]

Re: Spider-Man: No Way Home (December 17, 2021)

This movie was great. Nostalgia, payoffs long overdue, and hope for the future. It was great all around.

However

Spoiler

The first end credits were so disappointing. The possibilities just shut closed after the tease in V2. I didnt want a MCU Venom. I wanted to see Tom and Tom on screen together. Oh well. I will watch whatever omes next regardless.

Regarding your spoiler

Spoiler

I really think we'll see Holland appear in a future Venom movie. In a way, he's been removed from the MCU. None of the Avengers/other heroes know who he is, so he really doesn't have to play a role in any other MCU movies. I'm sure he will, but it opens up space for him to participate in the Tom Hardy Venom-verse. As we saw with the little splooge of symbiote, Venom will appear in the MCU version of Spiderman assumingly with a different host.

Could be a lot going on with Holland's Spider-Man, and I'm here for all of it.

[TripleCrown9]

Re: Spider-Man: No Way Home (December 17, 2021)

I thought the movie was perfect.

My only gripe after sitting on it a couple days, before my second viewing...

Spoiler

I didn't really like people forgetting Peter completely. I thought they would still know Peter, just not that he was Spider-Man.

Like, I thought he would just have to tell MJ and Ned again. But they had absolutely zero idea who Peter was. It just went a different direction than I had assumed the whole time.

[Yeah...THAT Guy]

Re: Spider-Man: No Way Home (December 17, 2021)

Great movie. Not my favorite Spider-Man movie but it's definitely up there. Some theorizing for the future/thoughts:

Spoiler

Kinda bummed they seem to be setting Ned up to go bad. I know it happens in the comics but their friendship has been so sweet and enduring through these films; I hope they surprise and have Ned end up being a hero instead.

Curious to see what becomes of Venom in MCU; I think I vaguely remember Flash turning into Venom from what I read while I was playing the Spider-Man PS4 game so could be that.

Maybe it was nothing, but Dr. Strange holding his stomach at one point early in the movie made me think that it was the What If version of him rather than the regular one. What If version of him appears in the trailer at the end, so perhaps we'll find out in that movie.

I was kinda expecting a glimpse of Miles Morales walking around/working at FEAST at some point but he's obviously coming at some point.

I'm just absolutely over the moon that Charlie Cox is back as Daredevil. Curious to see if anyone else comes over from the Netflix MCU.

Potential Spoiler re: Hawkeye

Spoiler

There's definitely some references between the Hawkeye show and the Spider-Man movie and they appear to be happening at basically the same point in time, so I'm curious if anything pops up in the Hawkeye finale to further that connection.

[Smallville102001]

Re: Spider-Man: No Way Home (December 17, 2021)

Saw the movie a second time last night and loved it even more just an incredible movie. People talk about fan services but it just works in this movie and don't fell like over kill here and just a lot of emotion in the movie. The pacing is great movie is 2 and a half hours but fells more like 2. Easily my second favorite of all the spiderman movies. Only 10 months and we get across the spider verse and than likely not long after spiderman 2 ps5 so great time has a spiderman fan right now. Finally movie rankings now.

1.Spiderman 2
2. No way home
3. Far from home
4. Into the spider verse
5. Home coming
6. Amazing spiderman 2
7. Spiderman 1
8. Amazing spiderman 1
9. Spiderman 3

[Majingir]

Re: Spider-Man: No Way Home (December 17, 2021)

I thought the movie was perfect.



My only gripe after sitting on it a couple days, before my second viewing...

Spoiler

I didn't really like people forgetting Peter completely. I thought they would still know Peter, just not that he was Spider-Man.



Like, I thought he would just have to tell MJ and Ned again. But they had absolutely zero idea who Peter was. It just went a different direction than I had assumed the whole time.

Ned knew him before he was spiderman, and MJ was really only on to him once he became spiderman, but now it seems like they're not even in the same school or something like that.

I hope for the next movie they entire arc isn't just Peter doing what he can to get people to remember him again.

I just wonder how it all works. So who helped the Avengers? Did all that happen except nobody knows or remembers him, or did he get completely wiped from the avengers timeline?


Either way, this was my fave of all the spiderman movies. I loved getting to see Tobey Maguire back.