Path of Neo Trailer

[jmood88]

Wow, this looks great:

http://media.xbox.ign.com/media/729/729644/vids_1.html

[VanCitySportsGuy]

Re: Path of Neo Trailer

I actually thought Enter the Matrix was a decent game and the new one looks a lot better.

I'm sure this game will sell really well.

[luv_mist]

Re: Path of Neo Trailer

I actually thought Enter the Matrix was a decent game and the new one looks a lot better.

I'm sure this game will sell really well.

For some reason, I think Enter the Matrix was a great game. It was weird and hit me unexpectedly from an angle I wouldn't have guessed. I honestly don't know why so many people down it. It could have been better, but what game couldn't? This trailer is hot to death. I read the article where they only had like 50 Agent Smiths on the screen, then they wanted to put more. They pushed to have 750 and it didn't slow up the game. Then they put another 750 on there and it still didn't slow up the game. I was really wondering how come other games didnt' try to push the PS2 like that? I am so ready to holler at that game. Play as Neo from beginning to end. I just wonder how much we'll stay on the path of the movie and how much we can manipulate to change it to our own liking. I'd sure love to keep Neo alive. It's suppose to be a different ending from the movie too. I'm looking forward to hitting this game up for real....

[neovsmatrix]

Re: Path of Neo Trailer

Well, I don't know if you understood the philosophy and theme of the Matrix trilogy but Neo HAD to die. I won't get into why unless someone asks me to, but the ending was proper for the way the entire trilogy was set up. After Revolutions, if you understood the answers that Revolutions gave, looking back to the original, all the little things in the original lead up to the conclusion in Revolutions. It just makes sense, even if it wasn't as dramatically satisfying as many would have liked.

IMHO, to betray a movie's theme and philosophy just for it to be pleasing to the masses, makes the film cheap and ultimately worthless.

And I don't see how or why they would change the ending in the game.

But the game looks very cool, nonetheless. Hopefully it plays as good as it looks, and doesn't betray the movies' themes and philosophies at the same time.

[NovaStar]

Re: Path of Neo Trailer

Well, I don't know if you understood the philosophy and theme of the Matrix trilogy but Neo HAD to die. I won't get into why unless someone asks me to, but the ending was proper for the way the entire trilogy was set up. After Revolutions, if you understood the answers that Revolutions gave, looking back to the original, all the little things in the original lead up to the conclusion in Revolutions. It just makes sense, even if it wasn't as dramatically satisfying as many would have liked.

IMHO, to betray a movie's theme and philosophy just for it to be pleasing to the masses, makes the film cheap and ultimately worthless.

And I don't see how or why they would change the ending in the game.

But the game looks very cool, nonetheless. Hopefully it plays as good as it looks, and doesn't betray the movies' themes and philosophies at the same time.

Neo, why did neo had to die? I tried to get my hands around the concept of the matrix, and I found it to be disjointed. Why? well, in the first movie we are told the matrix is the controlling system whereby robots use humans as batteries, the matrix is a simulated existence to keep people (those being used as batteries) unaware and happy. Yet at the end after neo dies, you see the oracle and the little girl still in the matrix, why didnt' the matrix disappear and everyone being used as batteries become unplugged? And if this happened how could the machines exist? I thought the whole point of the matrix was that the humans had lost the war with machines?

[neovsmatrix]

Re: Path of Neo Trailer

Neo, why did neo had to die? I tried to get my hands around the concept of the matrix, and I found it to be disjointed. Why? well, in the first movie we are told the matrix is the controlling system whereby robots use humans as batteries, the matrix is a simulated existence to keep people (those being used as batteries) unaware and happy. Yet at the end after neo dies, you see the oracle and the little girl still in the matrix, why didnt' the matrix disappear and everyone being used as batteries become unplugged? And if this happened how could the machines exist? I thought the whole point of the matrix was that the humans had lost the war with machines?

The Matrix trilogy does not work on one level of narrative. It works on many, so it can be very confusing to explain. It really is more of a web-like narrative, with its plot themes interrelated with the philosophical themes that it brings to light. Everything I have to say is based on what the Matrix trilogy says, some of it is emphasized in the trilogy more than others, and a deeper appreciation of the trilogy does require knowledge of the philosophy/religions that the trilogy incorporates, particularly Hinduism.

In the following explanations (sorry, they are disjointed as I have a lot to say on the subject of the trilogy, and not all of it can be said in one post), I use the idea of equations in Neo and Smith growing more powerful, or increasing at a faster rate than the other side. Neo and Smith together possess one equation, but each has only one side of the equation, and each side "grows" at a different rate than the other. This is my best explanation for what's going on between Smith and Neo, and seems to best explain why Smith starts going nuts in the beginning where he asserts his own "feelings" for escape from illusion or the Hindu concept of "maya". This takes into account the idea that the Architect and the Oracle have essentially orchestrated everything, that they are responsible for the birth of Neo and Smith. They are the root cause for their existence. The Architect and Oracle, through opposition seek to make the Matrix into a better place for both humans and programs and they do that through Neo and Smith. This is also why Smith calls the Oracle "mother".

On a side note, when the Oracle keeps pointing to the Latin words above her door, "Know thyself", it's really "Know Thy Self", or "Know thy Atma", know the spirit within you, know your soul. When that happens for Neo, he starts getting visions of what he needs to do, he starts manifesting powers. He develops knowledge of the soul not only in the Matrix but in the real world by the end of the trilogy. And as he realizes his soul, he manifests powers on the level that he realizes his soul, just like in Hinduism. In essence, Neo is the quintessential yogi. There's more to the connections between Neo and a Hindu yogi, though I'll go on more with this only if asked.

Anyway, here are the replies I have, and some further connections I've made regarding the trilogy:

Answers:

1. One thing should be noted: the entire truth is HINTED at in the original, but only fleshed out more as we see more of the trilogy. In essence, our understanding AND Neo's understanding of the predicament at hand evolves as we watch the trilogy. So yes, initially the Matrix is considered to be the result of a war between man and machine, where man lost, was enslaved as a consequence, and the humans act as batteries while the machines feed on them. However, we see a different perspective with the Animatrix, where man is the one controlling machines, has enslaved the machines, and the machines are sufficiently intelligent now and thus revolt because they identify themselves as their own species now. When they want peace, man rejects them and a war is started which man loses and thus is now enslaved by machines. Both sides fail to see other with respect and both sides view the other with some condescension as a result, and each side tries to control the other. So I think your perception that the trilogy is "disjointed" really comes from the fact that the trilogy doesn't present the whole truth immediately, rather the truth is teased out and slowly comes to light as you watch the trilogy. Certain perceptions given in the original need to be cast out as you watch the trilogy and new ones have to be formed, adaptation is needed to truly understand what's going on. Understanding the Matrix trilogy is nowhere near a passive exercise, it comes from discussion, from research, and analysis of the films in question.

2. Now consider the situation at hand with Cypher from the original Matrix. He is one of a number of humans who would much rather prefer to live a lie in seeming comfort, than to face the cold "realities" of Zion. In fact, he hints at a point that the Matrix trilogy persistently makes throughout the sequels. Neither Zion nor the Matrix are real, and if he had to choose between either of those realities, he'd choose to define the Matrix as more "real". His exact quote from the Matrix was: "I disagree, Trinity, I think the Matrix can be more real than this world".

So there are a number of people like Cypher who would much rather live in the Matrix than in Zion. It's a point that's reiterated in the Animatrix as well. So the Matrix has to exist still. Not only for machines, but for those humans as well who would prefer the Matrix. The Matrix is a haven so to speak for those who cannot bear the hardships that the world of Zion presents. At the same time, philosophically, if you cannot free yourself from the Matrix, you cannot free yourself from illusion, and thus are destined to reincarnate over and over until you can face the hardships of the real world and transcend them as Neo does, to finally achieve a death that is liberating rather than binding.

Also, what happened at the end of Revolutions was merely that freedom was brought back to humans and programs in the Matrix now. Humans can leave if they choose to reject the programming of the Matrix, or they can choose to stay. Obviously, the Matrix Online is about how humans and machines upset the delicate balance that exists, out of a need of power, and misunderstanding once again between the two. Neither side won at the end of Revolutions, the only thing that happened was the Matrix is no longer a prison, it has become a haven instead, due to Neo's actions.

3. As for Neo's imminent death, that has to do with what's inside both Neo and Smith and their true natures as far as the Matrix is considered. Both were engineered by the Architect and their fates were predetermined by the Architect in terms of maintaining control over the people. The Architect implants 2 sides of an equation, one in Neo and one in Smith. It's the reason that Smith starts going nuts as Neo grows more aware of the illusion of the Matrix and gains more power in the original. As Neo grows more powerful, his side of the equation grows more powerful. It grows at a faster rate than Smith's does at the time, and so Neo is able to conquer Smith by the end of the first film. He enters into Smith and emerges from it. This actually parallels how in Hinduism, Shiva, the Hindu destroyer god, comes out of Vishnu's, the Hindu Preserver God, navel, because this is when Smith as we know him in the sequels is born. Smith is "freed" because Neo overwrites Smith's code, Neo gives Smith his worst human elements and thus Smith starts acting as he says humans act in the original: like a virus. Neo dropped his "ego" into Smith, so now Smith is aware of the illusion of the Matrix and also starts developing his side of the equation at a much faster rate. So now Smith in Reloaded is growing stronger, as is Neo. Both of their equations are now becoming stronger at a quick pace, and thus, when Neo refuses to enter the Source at the end of Reloaded, he's allowing Smith in effect (inadvertently) to become too strong for the machines to handle him. Now he's more powerful than the machines in the Matrix, the machines can't shut him down, and thus Neo has an avenue to make peace (he realizes he has to make peace rather than to destroy the Matrix, reasons for which I have gone into later in this post), by bargaining with the machines saying he's the only one with enough power to stop Smith. The machines agree, Neo is inserted back into the Matrix, and lets Smith merge into him.

The Smith-Neo merge actually happens or is attempted 3 times in the trilogy. In the original, Neo is drawn to Smith through his side of the equation (which acts as the subconscious, or the Matrix equivalent of a soul or atma), but his side of the equation is too powerful so when Neo jumps into Smith he overwrites some of Smith without truly destroying him. Smith is reborn as "evil Neo" so to speak. The second time is during the big fight between the multiple Smiths and Neo right after he meets the Oracle in Reloaded. Smith tries to enter Neo, or copy himself into Neo. But Neo's still too strong, and his side of the equation still overpowers Smith's side of the equation. So that attempt fails again to destroy either Smith or Neo. Finally at the end of the trilogy, Smith and Neo are really equal in power, their sides of the equation are equally powerful, and balanced. When they merge finally, both sides of the equation are canceled out, and return to the Source, bringing about the end of the Smith-Neo entity, and returning their "consciousness" (or Matrix equivalent) back to the Source, from which the Source can use it to redefine the Matrix based on the experiences of Smith and Neo. In essence the Matrix MIGHT (it's unclear) have taken a tiny evolutionary step forward, and become a more fittingly habitable place for both humans and machines than it was even in its original perfect state. When the equations are cancelled and their code goes back to the Source, Neo and Smith no longer exist because their equivalent souls have left their bodies. They're just empty shells now and thus dematerialise in the Matrix.

From the Architect's speech and what Smith says about having been a part of all this before, both Smith and Neo continually reincarnate in each cycle, obviously not necessarily the same forms. But Smith himself says it's happening just like the last time, only maybe a little different. The only difference actually happens to be that Trinity is in the equation and Neo has a bond of love for her. There's again a Hindu religious and philosophical connection between Neo and Trinity, as Trinity represents Neo's "shakti", his strength, his spirit inside of himself. She is essentially his soul, his "atma", and it's often shown in the trilogy that even when she speaks when Neo is in the Matrix, Neo can "hear" her even though he's not directly conscious of it. In fact, such a bond exists also between Morpheus and Neo. And this goes to show that true reality (or escape from illusion) is in unity, not duality, as when there's only one entity, that entity is truly free as there is nothing influencing that one entity. It is beyond cause and effect, and that is what Neo is truly seeking. To transcend control, to be beyond and escape illusion. It's the advaita principle of Hinduism, that all is One, and the Matrix trilogy emphasises this in many different ways. The trilogy goes to show that Neo is Rama Kandra, he is the Architect, he is Smith, he is everyone so to speak. He's the soul of everyone. He is the One, God incarnate, an avatar. Primarily the sixth avatar of Vishnu, in the beginning of the Matrix, who turns into the seventh incarnation upon meeting Rama, who is actually the seventh avatar of Vishnu in Hinduism. Neo "dies" after stopping the machines at the end of Reloaded and is reborn in the train station where he learns the path to divinity is through sacrifice, as Rama Kandra shows him. Rama Kandra represents divinity, he is an incarnation of Vishnu, as is Neo. Sati represents sacrifice, and when Rama Kandra holds Sati in between Neo and himself, it is symbolic of how Neo can reach divinity through sacrificing himself. In Hinduism, particularly the Ramayana, a previous incarnation of Vishnu meets the current incarnation of Vishnu. Parashurama, a reluctant Brahmin warrior fights against the ruling class of the kshatriyas because they have upset the balance of power. In the Ramayana, he fights Rama, the 7th incarnation of Vishnu, even though they are the same in essence as they are both incarnations of Vishnu.

Parashurama's incarnation is akin to Neo fighting against the rulers, the machines, because they too have upset the balance of power. Neo restores that balance at the end to some extent.




The little girl and the Oracle are programs. They'll always exist. ONE of the points of Revolutions is that THEY are just as important as humans are, which is what Neo realizes after he meets Rama Kandra, Kamala and Sati at the train station in the beginning of Revolutions. That's one of the reasons why that scene is so important. It's important for a number of reasons, but that is one of the main reasons why it's so important.

Programs and machines are just as viable as species now, as humans have become. So the whole point is to co-exist, to learn that they are all ONE, and not see each other as different and at odds with each other. When programs learned the language of love (Rama Kandra and Kamala), that is exactly what defines humans as a species, and that is something that programs have started exhibiting. In fact, it is hinted that programs were capable of this once before, before degenerating into their base impulses and relying on just rationality and logic, which is how the Merovingian and Persephone compare and contrast with Neo and Trinity AND Rama Kandra and Kamala.

The Matrix trilogy is not simply about humans being controlled by robots, it's about CONTROL in general, the evolution of a species, and first and foremost ENLIGHTENMENT.

The trilogy is rather complicated to explain without going into what it all actually means (for the most part, I do have it figured out, because the Matrix trilogy is more or less a parallel of Hindu beliefs, of non-duality and of escaping illusion. However, it is difficult to explain because there's a number of themes that come into play in the trilogy, and I'm not sure it'll be easily understood by those unfamiliar with Hinduism. I'll try though.)


As for why Neo had to die, in the philosophical context, well his whole purpose was to escape control, period. Escape illusion. The Matrix is illusory. Why? According to Morpheus, the Matrix feeds the brain electrical impulses that tell the person what he or she is feeling, seeing, hearing, etc. This is from the first movie. Well, the real world does this too. We live through our senses, our sights, our smells, etc. are all based on electrical pulses sent to our brains, and we interpret what we experience through them. So right off the bat, Morpheus's explanation of reality brings into question not only the world of the Matrix, but the world of ZION itself. The movies really try to emphasize this point over and over again.

Another aspect to why the Matrix is not real is because humans are controlled by the machines. But in Zion, the machines are controlled by humans. And yet, at the end of Reloaded, we find out that the machines' influence still extends beyond the Matrix and in effect controls human existence in Zion still. So the idea of CONTROL is not limited only to the Matrix. It extends beyond, into Zion as well. And thus, if the goal is to be free of control, one must be free of both Zion AND the Matrix. Hence, Neo must die, because that is the only way to be free. While unsaid, it is evident that Neo's "death" is not permanent as the Oracle maintains he'll be back again, and that would mean Neo's "soul" is at the moment re-united with the true Source, the Hindu concept of Brahman, or God, Vishnu, whatever. Thus, he has achieved the Real.


When one dies in the Matrix, he is freed from the Matrix's control at least within the Matrix. When one dies in Zion, he is again freed from whatever controls him in Zion. Nothing influences him beyond death after he dies in Zion.

Remember, Neo had gone through several lives in Zion and the Matrix. He was the One five-six times before his present incarnation. Why did he have to continually reincarnate? Because he kept on resetting the Matrix's minor cycle. He kept giving in to the machines' will, until he finally broke it by choosing to save Trinity instead of entering the Source and disseminating his code. His continual reincarnation and his ultimate reunification with Smith is an allegory to enlightenment the Hindu/Buddhist way. After he unites with Smith, he is no longer experiencing duality of his psyche. There is no conflict with soul and ego as he and Smith, the soul and ego respectively are now one. And thus, bright light emanates from them, and even in the real world, to indicate he has achieved enlightenment truly, and achieved union with God, in the Matrix as the Source, and in the real world as Vishnu or Brahman, or whatever God.


Cycles are another theme of the Matrix trilogy. But there isn't just one cycle, there are 2 cycles. The minor cycle where things are repeated in one age, while there's the major cycle which allows the Matrix to be reset back to its perfect conception where freedom is shared between programs and humans

That is where the movie ends, with Neo's death and the reset back to the age of perfection, known in Hinduism as Satya Yuga, and symbolized by Neo's form of the Lotus as his dead body is carried away by the machines. The Lotus is a symbol of the return of Truth, perfection, and is often associated with Vishnu, the Preserver God of Hinduism who continually reincarnates into this world to redeem mankind and help it make the transition from age to age. Neo is an incarnation of Vishnu, while Smith is an incarnation of Shiva, the Hindu Destroyer God. The Architect is a representation of Brahma, the Hindu Creator God as he designs the Matrix. Where the Matrix begins, the age is Kali Yuga, the Iron Age, or the age of materialism and sin, paralleling our age (according to Hindu philosophy).

[jmood88]

Re: Path of Neo Trailer

Good lord.

[neovsmatrix]

Re: Path of Neo Trailer

Good lord.

Well, the guy asked.

And I'd appreciate it if you didn't reply with such pointless posts. If you have nothing intelligent or insightful to contribute, it's better not to say anything at all.

[jmood88]

Re: Path of Neo Trailer

Well, the guy asked.

And I'd appreciate it if you didn't reply with such pointless posts. If you have nothing intelligent or insightful to contribute, it's better not to say anything at all.

Lol, why do you always get so defensive? I actually read everything that you wrote.

[neovsmatrix]

Re: Path of Neo Trailer

Lol, why do you always get so defensive? I actually read everything that you wrote.

Sorry, but I couldn't help wondering if it's a snide remark on your part or something. Took me a long time to write it, and I was just trying to explain what I understood of the trilogy, since the question was raised.

[jmood88]

Re: Path of Neo Trailer

Sorry, but I couldn't help wondering if it's a snide remark on your part or something. Took me a long time to write it, and I was just trying to explain what I understood of the trilogy, since the question was raised.

No I was just amazed that you actually wrote that much. I think that's the most I've seen written on here.

[NovaStar]

Re: Path of Neo Trailer

Well, the guy asked.

And I'd appreciate it if you didn't reply with such pointless posts. If you have nothing intelligent or insightful to contribute, it's better not to say anything at all.

Yes Neo I did ask. I understand everything that you have written (quite a good read) However, here is what I initially believed happened with the matrix. The first movie was intended to stand alone, (I don't know if this movie was an adaptation from some other source) based on the success of the first matrix, the others were created in hindsight rather than foresight, that is why I say it was disjointed. Was neo a code or was he a human being? Which came first? I mean we are given the premise that the humans created the machines therefore it would seem that the human existence takes precedent over the code existence. I was thinking that eventually every human being had to be unplugged because the core of human existence would have to be "plug free" because the soul of men exists out side of the code of the matrix because one begat the other. As it stands, how could every human choose to remain plugged in if in fact they were never unplugged. Cipher was unplugged and made a choice, I just thought that everyone else should have been unplugged. The matrix only exists while everyone is plugged into it, right? And as we are told they are plugged in to be drained by the computers.

Those things aside, you give a very insightful explanation of the matrix trilogy as it went forward from its initial premise. Again, that was very good.

[DocHolliday]

Re: Path of Neo Trailer

Are you interested in the Matrix a little?

[DickDalewood]

Re: Path of Neo Trailer

Well, I don't know if you understood the philosophy and theme of the Matrix trilogy but Neo HAD to die. I won't get into why unless someone asks me to, but the ending was proper for the way the entire trilogy was set up. After Revolutions, if you understood the answers that Revolutions gave, looking back to the original, all the little things in the original lead up to the conclusion in Revolutions. It just makes sense, even if it wasn't as dramatically satisfying as many would have liked.

IMHO, to betray a movie's theme and philosophy just for it to be pleasing to the masses, makes the film cheap and ultimately worthless.

And I don't see how or why they would change the ending in the game.

But the game looks very cool, nonetheless. Hopefully it plays as good as it looks, and doesn't betray the movies' themes and philosophies at the same time.

Hey dude, I have a question for you, hopefully it won't require you to write a whole bunch (for your sake, not mine). Why did the Oracle have to change appearances? I'm hoping this isn't just a simple answer like the original Oracle didn't want to do the third movie, so they had to recast her part...

[Silverstring]

Re: Path of Neo Trailer

Honestly, I'm not trying to be snide.

I did research into the Matrix trilogy, discussed, re-watched, and just read everything you wrote, which was insightful, well-written, and fairly comprehensive interpretation. Unlike many Matrix viewers, I wasn't content to say, it's too complex/"I don't get it", and "give up" on it. Going into the film, I already had a solid knowledge of eastern religious concepts and mythology. As a construct of interweaving references/themes, the Matrix Trilogy is certainly ambitious in scope.

And all I have to say is this: It's a shame a halfway-decent film couldn't have been made from that in the last two installments.