What does the game industry have against innovation?

[Flawless]

It's tempting to look at the process and say the qualities that made reviewers love the game were the same qualities that made Vivendi gun-shy about publishing it, but Pole says the biggest problem was actually the game's platform.

"The biggest challenge for us was that the lead SKU was the Xbox," Pole says. "So when you look at the unit volumes and you look at the genre of the product, that was a little bit challenging because there weren't a lot of character action games that had done well on Xbox."

http://www.gamespot.com/news/6141519.html

[fishepa]

Re: What does the game industry have against innovation?

Innovative games usually don't sell really well.

[Graphik]

Re: What does the game industry have against innovation?

Innovative games usually don't sell really well.

And thats because publishers are afraid of wasting money marketing them. Like the discussion that took place a few weeks ago, companies usually go for guaranteed sellers and games with an already established fanbase. If the innovative games were marketed like the best sellers were, I'm sure more innovative games would be made. Take God of War for example.

Fact is, gaming companies are pretty much like Hollywood nowadays. They'd rather market a remake or typical slasher/horror/comedy film since they know it will do well than some of the more creative movies out. Movies and gaming are pretty much at a dead end if you ask me.


EDIT: Damn, I just read the article and they pretty much proved my points.

"Inovation's dead," Pachter laments. "Dying. Every once in a while, somebody will slip something in that will shock us, but for the most part there's no money in innovation, even if it's great."

In most cases, the risks of attempting to do something new simply outweigh the benefits, according to Pachter. With next-generation development costs skyrocketing, publishers want proven sellers, safe choices that they can be assured will provide a reliable return on their investment.

"The best business for a publisher is to give people what you know they want," Pachter says. "And what you know they want is a sequel to what they wanted last time. So we don't see a whole lot of innovation."

[ODogg]

Re: What does the game industry have against innovation?

I don't think the game industry has anything against innovation, it's just not often lauded simply because it's quite risky and when there are millions and millions of dollars on the line the idea has to be not only unique but projected to do very well without very much uncertainty or the idea never lives to see the light of day.

And speaking of innovation, does anyone remember the game called B.C. which Peter Molineaux was working on for the Xbox 360 and PC? That was the game where you were a cave man and basically had an open environment in which to live and attempt to survive, not only dinosaurs but also freezing to death and etc..the goal was to live, thrive and eventually have a family, evolve..etc.

That game was highly innovative IMO but it eventually got shelved...I sure hope they bring it back because to me I think it would have been a very good seller and a very fun game to play. Why do I think it would have sold well? Well in addition to being something never done before it was a game that was done in the vein of Grand Theft Auto it seemed very open as to what to do. Combining those two things would have resulted in a blockbuster IMO if the gameplay was done right...

[jmood88]

Re: What does the game industry have against innovation?

It's tempting to look at the process and say the qualities that made reviewers love the game were the same qualities that made Vivendi gun-shy about publishing it, but Pole says the biggest problem was actually the game's platform.

"The biggest challenge for us was that the lead SKU was the Xbox," Pole says. "So when you look at the unit volumes and you look at the genre of the product, that was a little bit challenging because there weren't a lot of character action games that had done well on Xbox."


http://www.gamespot.com/news/6141519.html

How many games tried to be different and failed? It seems like the games not selling is just a lame excuse to keep making the same ol sequels(nothing wrong with some sequels though), or licensed games.

[Erv]

Re: What does the game industry have against innovation?

Most people who buy games get maybe 2-5 per year. They have no desire to play these "weird" games because they aren't sick of what they got, and furthermore don't have perspective to recognize innovation.

[Jistic]

Re: What does the game industry have against innovation?

There's plenty of NON innovative games that DON'T sell. Innovative and stupid aren't the same thing. I'm sure someone could make an innovative football game if they tried hard enough.

I still believe a good game will always sell. Regardless of subject matter.

[Graphik]

Re: What does the game industry have against innovation?

There's plenty of NON innovative games that DON'T sell. Innovative and stupid aren't the same thing. I'm sure someone could make an innovative football game if they tried hard enough.

I still believe a good game will always sell. Regardless of subject matter.

Good point, but like I said, good games are'nt marketed at the same rate sequels and licensed games are and thats the problem. They dont find it beneficial to market a innovative game that may be good because of the unfamiliararity. It makes sense if you're a business person but it sucks for the hardcore crowd who often get tired of the same ol.

[Ice Cream Truck]

Re: What does the game industry have against innovation?

Maybe EyeToy will bring some new games to the table.

[ODogg]

Re: What does the game industry have against innovation?

Maybe EyeToy will bring some new games to the table.

Yeah and maybe i'll wake up a millionare and good looking tomorrow too

[Hooe]

Re: What does the game industry have against innovation?

The other thing is that developing costs in gaming are rising with the release of better hardware; it takes more time and money to produce quality games that will sell. Companies in this day and age simply can't afford to make a game that won't sell; one miss and they may have serious financial issues.

[burnwood]

Re: What does the game industry have against innovation?

Another thing right about that article. Psychonauts is a good game. But how would you market it in this culture?

[HMcCoy]

Re: What does the game industry have against innovation?

My .02


I think that the industry uses the concept that innovation doesn't sell as a lame excuse. Create something compelling!! Example...Beyond Good and Evil, Voodoo Vince, and Otogi were all hailed as vastly underrated A-quality titles that got zero love at the registers...but how interesting or memorable were those characters? They were all well written, but was their anything we haven't seen before? Was the technology far advanced from current statndards? Did they innovate entirely new game experiences? No, no and no.

There will always be a hardcore segment that is willing to discover the depth that these games have, but lets be realistic, no ground was broken.

Now when Driver and GTA were released, driving games in open world environments modeled after real cities were a brand new concept on consoles. Soooo sweet. I remember playing the first Driver demo for weeks(quick police chase in Miami) I was completely blown away. I remember picking up a prostitute for the first time in GTA...moral issues aside, that gameplay raised the bar for "crime" gaming. Same thing with Metal Gear/Splinter Cell...those games all did something either new, or implemented so perfectly it seemed new. Of course the industry is gonna ride those to death...they hit the ground with something awesome, not mediocre. Prince of Persias level design, Grand Turismo's depth and immersion...do something SPECIAL, not just new-ish.

I guess these developers need to step out of the norm, and really implement something fresh, utterly compelling and dynamic...and stop complaining about the industry favs that have. Dude was right, character platformers haven't done well...none of them has done anything spectacular, IMO.

[CarryTheWeight]

Re: What does the game industry have against innovation?

NOTE: This long "novella" relates to (mostly) sports titles, because sports titles make up at least 95% of my collection and my gaming time.

Yeah, I remember popping in games like Tony Hawk 1 and SSX for the first times. Say what you will about these games and how popular they've gotten, but, IMHO, they were unlike anything I'd ever played at their exact time of release. I mean, THPS's gameplay...(most) gamers know it by heart now, but the first time I played THPS, I was hooked because it was so simple and yet posessed a quality that could keep you "tricking" for hours on end. I still play the THUG series the same way, aimlessly skating around and pulling off combos.

For me, SSX was almost the same type of feeling...I mean, a lot of games in the PS1's day didn't use the shoulder buttons much until SSX debuted with the PS2, and, at first play, it was truly a breath of fresh air, pulling off tricks with combos of the L1, L2, R1, and R2 buttons. That was a "next-gen experience" I'd never forget.

I agree with all of your comments about games keeping on the "status quo" much too often (especially with games like Madden that fail to improve and sequels in the gaming world that feel too much like the original), but with the next gen consoles, I feel that many developers will try to use the potentials of the 360, the PS3 and the Revolution to their advantage. With the new technology comes new ideas for head developers to improve their games greatly...I mean, it was barely ten years ago (in 1995) when we'd drool over a sports game that had real players' names in it, when now, ten years afterward, we drool over virtual, sweaty b-ballers and their trademark tattoos, headbands, and kicks. In the '90s, we couldn't touch player ratings or appearances..now, we have games like NHL 2K6 where we can edit almost anything about a player we want to edit, including combining first and last names (one of the most innovative features in sports games in the past TEN years, IMO), appearances, equipment, body size, and ratings. Look how far we've come since the '90's. It seems that the last generation of sports titles ushered in a new era of creativity in console video games...and for a gamer like me who spends hours perfecting a created team's uniform or a created player's tendencies, it's amazing.

Then again, there's a lot of genres that need revamping. Take a look at the wrestling game genre, for example. It's in need for a truly original console game that will capture the authenticity of a real wrestling event. Several games came close in the past (such as the current SmackDown vs. Raw 2006, and, of course, WM2K and No Mercy), but the next generation for Wrestling Games, IMO, should be huge if developers decide to capitalize on it, especially with Midway having the TNA license and giving THQ and the WWE a little bit of competition in the virtual ring. I'm just hoping that THQ does the right thing for the 360 instead of hiring inexperienced developers and making terrible decisions like they did for the normal Xbox. It's such a disappointment that Xbox wrestling gamers had to suffer through the Raws, the Legends series, and the terrible rushjob that was WM21...I know John Tobias himself worked on the game, but that doesn't enter into it. John's a pretty innovative developer, judging on how groundbreaking a little game called Mortal Kombat once was...I just don't see what happened with the disasterous WM21.

That post was a novel, I know, but I'll sum it up quickly right now: Innovation feels good, looks good, plays good, and needs to happen with the next-gen, especially in the sports genres such as wrestling. We need some change, and we all know how good change feels. It's just the devs' choice. Something head devs should do is study (not copy or steal ideas off of) other innovative titles for older consoles, and see what made the titles so groundbreaking in the first place. Smarter developers have noticed that, and we've gotten titles like NBA Street (which combined the Tony Hawk system with SSX's, for example) and Forza Motorsport (which websites have compared to games like Pokemon), both of which have sold well.

I realize there was a ton of innovation in the past, but I believe, due to the slip in sales, that gamers are now expecting more from developers in the next generation. I say expect good years from EA and 2K, because through all of the reviews they've gotten from the internet press and disgruntled gamers about their handling of the launch (EA's removing features and 2K's porting), we may see some innovative sports games this coming year for 360, PS3 and Revolution.

Sorry about the size once again, and I hope I relayed some messages through this post...I hope.