What is Nex gen and what are you expecting from it?

[23]

Just reading alot of posts here I began to wonder. I've seen a good amount of complaints about innovation and ports, followed up with comments like "The 360 and PS3 are just machines with graphical upgrades, same games" or, "nothing is innovative about any of these games", and " they have all of this crap in them that I dont want in a gaming machine"


Considering paying what comes to an extra 10 bucks per game , and
the high expectations of gamers now, what do you actually think is a realistic expectation of nex gen games?

What is Nex Gen in the first place since it hasn't really been defined.

Games nowadays don't seem to hold peoples attention for more than a month anymore. Seems like people buy games looking for flaws instead of having fun with them now. Not only that, but also seems people buy games to beat them in a week and trade them back in for another game release.

Should or can game companies even release games within the given time range without bugs? Is it still worth the 60 bucks being just a so called graphical upgrade?

In all honesty, what is it

How can you ever be pleased if your expectations are unrealistic and too high not even defining what nex gen means?

I know I don't just rush out to buy any old thing without carefully considering what Im about to purchase. To me the higher price has to be justified in my own eyes.

[aukevin]

Re: What is Nex gen and what are you expecting from it?

What I expect from next gen is better graphics obviously, but also more indepth games in terms of how long a game can be, and the depth of statistics dealing with not only sports games but also RPGs, and fast load times. I don't ever want to see lag on a screen with lots of graphics. I expect more content with next gen stuff not just pretty graphics. I can't tell you the last time I watched a cutscene during a sports game. It does nothing for me when they release these screenshots of next gen games and all it is of is a cutscene.

[born_bad]

Re: What is Nex gen and what are you expecting from it?

To me, the only games I've seen so far that are what I expected from next gen are Gears of War, Oblivion, and GRAW. Not because they have really innovative gameplay, but because they improved on what had come before in more ways than just visuals.

I've been disappointed with next gen sports titles. NBA2k7 and NHL 07 are the best I've played and those still fall a little flat with what I wanted from next gen sports. Sure the graphics are better in the sports games, but with the exception of Fight Night Round 3, nothing really mind-blowing in the visuals and there's no real "next gen" upgrades to gameplay, IMO. I was hoping for good jump in things like presentation, AI, physics, animations, etc. NBA2k7 did a great job with signature animations, but I'm still somewhat disappointed in the graphics, presentation, gameplay, AI, etc.

Basically, the sports games, so far, have been what I was worried they might be - better graphics but minimal improvements anywhere else.

Games like Oblivion and Gears have really stepped up and those are the games I have no problem dropping $60 for.

[SPTO]

Re: What is Nex gen and what are you expecting from it?

I expect games to be more immersive, longer and the AI to have adaptive properties. Is that too much to ask?

Personally I think the industry is headed towards another Crash.

[funky_chicken]

Re: What is Nex gen and what are you expecting from it?

It feels like we are writing an essay. What next gen means to me is... Anyway, to me next-gen means game companies being able to take the new hardware and get the most out of it. It seems like many companies really don't do it though.

New ideas in games is another thing also. A game like Gears of War for example. Most shooters are run and gun (I must admit that is what I was expecting with the game) fests but with GOW if you don't use cover you are toast.

When companies make games whether new ideas of sequals to games gamers are expecting something new. Gamers look for the WOW factor. I have to agree with the born_bad when he said GOW and Oblivion are next-gen games. Those games have the WOW factor. Those games are the kind of games that make you go out and buy a new system.

[born_bad]

Re: What is Nex gen and what are you expecting from it?

I expect games to be more immersive, longer and the AI to have adaptive properties. Is that too much to ask?

Personally I think the industry is headed towards another Crash.

Not possible for a crash. The situation is a lot different now than when the industry crashed in the 80s.

Can sales slow down? Sure. But you won't see a crash like that with 3 huge companies making consoles now.

[SPTO]

Re: What is Nex gen and what are you expecting from it?

Not possible for a crash. The situation is a lot different now than when the industry crashed in the 80s.

Can sales slow down? Sure. But you won't see a crash like that with 3 huge companies making consoles now.

There would certainly have to be a different trigger mechanism for it to happen. I think it's going to be through apathy from the buyer and the utter lack of creativity from the game makers. I believe it's like 70% or more of current games are part of a franchise of some sort.

At some point the average consumer is going to throw up his hands and say "screw it". Do we really need to see an industry banking so much on sequels and cloning formulas that proved successful in the past?

[born_bad]

Re: What is Nex gen and what are you expecting from it?

There would certainly have to be a different trigger mechanism for it to happen. I think it's going to be through apathy from the buyer and the utter lack of creativity from the game makers. I believe it's like 70% or more of current games are part of a franchise of some sort.

At some point the average consumer is going to throw up his hands and say "screw it". Do we really need to see an industry banking so much on sequels and cloning formulas that proved successful in the past?

I dunno... the fact that the latest Madden game was the fastest selling one its history gives me no idication that people are sick of franchise/sequel games.

All the Nintendo franchise games will continue to sell like crazy and games like Resident Evil 5, Halo 3 will sell millions quickly.

[Admiral50]

Re: What is Nex gen and what are you expecting from it?

Next gen is a hyped flop for me.

I've spent thousands on a 360 (that's died and been replaced and ready to die again) and games and have more disappointments then any other console and no real A quality, 'classic' game yet.

All of this 'high production costs make the games more expensive' stuff is crap. The games are barely anything more than high res versions of their previous games and initially would cost less to make.

Anyway, price aside it's the games that have been the let down for me.

Perfect Dark Zero was the first. No real explanation needed. Basically I was a huge N64 fan of PD and Goldeneye and find the 360 version laughable in most ways. The graphics are nothing special anyway, but it's the try hard gameplay that loses me. It's not even half as good as it's much older original and probably worse than EA's crap Bond games.

Oblivion - certainly a good game. Any game that I play for 30 or 40 so hours must be doing something right. But it was full of bugs, graphical glitches and badly made discs and loading methods. Not to mention the good initial story that depleted by the end, feeling rushed and uninspired. Good game yes, but not the great game it was hyped to be. Especially considering I bought the console for this game.

Gears of War - Just don't get this game. My opinions went up and down based on the previews but now in trying it myself I am back to thinking, 'why do people rate this so high?'.
I have to agree with the EA rep, it does nothing new. Yet even more than that, what it does isn't that great. To me, this is really an example of great graphics hiding an above average game. It's short, has too few enemies (variety), heavily scripted, on rails, conveniently placed boxes and pillars all through the game and the camera still isn't as good as the best 3rd person games, let alone first person, especially when you are hiding behind cover in mutliplayer only to have your opponent see you by swivelling his character on this spot. The random and unbalanced chainsaw is a flop too.

Saints Row - another big selling, hype game. They've pretty much released a work in progress, beta here. This is as bad, if not worse than any buggy EA game. Freezing, disappearing cars and roads, bugs everywhere basically. And a very average frame rate too, in addition to the terrible screen tearing. The game itself is nothing more than a GTA clone, yet couldn't even manage to be on par with the original GTA 3 from the PS2, five or so years ago. The multiplayer is just an afterthought too.

I could go on and you guys do know I have high expectations but I'm sure there are hardcore gamers out there who share similar opinions. Especially when you think in relation to this being the most hyped and most expensive generation of gaming.

And yes, I do like the Wii. I've played it and am looking forward to quite a few of the simple but extremely fun games plus many, many virtual console classics. I like my hi-def tv and how the 360 looks on it, but gameplay comes first and the 360 simply hasn't delivered. Especially considering I've bought almost all of the arcade titles and played them more for the last few months.

Call of Duty 3 (which I got yesterday on 360) was the last straw for me. To keep it short, it's basically a 5 year old engine that's been heavily touched up. The single player is heavily scripted and on rails with invisible borders everwhere, even on simple objects throughout the map. Not being able to jump on many of them is one thing, but to have this barrier around them just confirms the feeling of an old, rehashed engine. The multiplayer fails too. It's not COD2 and not BF2, instead some disaster that falls in the middle. It's like Quake in a WW2 setting.

Anyway, so yeah I'm selling my 360 and games and am just going to enjoy the simple yet new gameplay of the Wii. This generation is a letdown. The graphics aren't a big enough jump to warrant the high prices, yet because they can look all new and shiny, the developers have got lazy, just flicking the hi-res switch and forgetting about innovation and fun. Hopefully the success of the Wii gets MS and Sony to think outside of the box.

Till then, enjoy the Wii and wait for the Xbox 3 and PS4.

[pk500]

Re: What is Nex gen and what are you expecting from it?

Good post, KDRE.

The bedrock of any generation should be quality games that are innovative, refined and push their respective genres in terms of GAMEPLAY.

The only hardware aspect that should be considered is something that changes the way we play games, not the way we see them. Graphics are porn for the eyes, and little else, unless we're seeing a jump from 30 fps to 60 fps that will make a racing game much smoother and faster, for example.

So Nintendo must be given credit for the dual screens and touch screen for the DS and the control scheme for the Wii. There's absolutely NOTHING different about the way you play with the 360 than you did with the Xbox. It's still the same controller doing the same things as before. The PS3 has the Dual Shock with some motion recognition, but it looks to be more of a knee-jerk reaction to the Wiimote than anything innovative.

So far I've seen very little from the next gen to indicate any of the above criteria are being met. But it's early.

Take care,
PK

[rudyjuly2]

Re: What is Nex gen and what are you expecting from it?

Next-gen is doing something that current gen can't do. Next gen should be at least as good or better than current gen in every area imo. Right now, that seems to be only graphical updates which isn't necessarily a bad thing. However many games take steps backwards in options and/or gameplay when moving to a new console.

When we went from the PS1 to the PS2, players actually caught the ball with their hands. We saw fingers on players for the PS2. Collision detection was much improved and the enhanced graphics actually affected gameplay. The current gen graphics are pretty decent and although next gen does take it to another level the improvements haven't really enhanced the gameplay since the jump wasn't as big.

Personally, I just expect evolution. I like the port idea. I hate it when a developer takes a good game and wrecks it like EA did with NBA Live when they went from the PS1 to the PS2. Gameplay can always be improved in every game on every console. Simply take the current gen game and its gameplay and AI and add improved graphics along with evolutionary improvements in gameplay etc. Any time you see a next gen game like Madden come out and they take steps backwards in terms of franchise, camera angles, etc. I find that to be a mistake. However, what I'm asking for isn't that big a deal which is why I'm balking at paying next gen prices which I think are too high for what I want (despite how expensive the technology may be).

I'd be happy if they just juiced up the graphic power and left everything else the same. Forget Blue-Ray, media stuff, etc. Just get me a new gaming machine at reasonable prices.

[Pete1210]

Re: What is Nex gen and what are you expecting from it?

All "next-gen" means to me is the next generation of hardware: xbox 360, PS3 and Wii.

I got mostly what I expected from the xbox 360. Games that look a lot better and a much improved xbox live interface. What disappointed me has been the reliability of the console and connectivity issues in many live games.

Innovation in games I see as a separate issue.

[23]

Re: What is Nex gen and what are you expecting from it?

Seems the bulk of complaints are mostly from the game developers themselves moreso than the what the machines are capable of.

I remember Microsoft saying they asked developers what tools they needed most to develop their games to make it easier.

Knowing that this happened, what is it about these games that turn people off so fast

[forensicd]

Re: What is Nex gen and what are you expecting from it?

Next gen is gameplay, gameplay, gameplay, and some more gameplay. Graphics get old quick if the game sucks (look at nba Live or madden). Im tired of getting these games that last 8 hours at most. When I had the NES, SNES, etc I would play those games for hours and hours, months and months. I still pick up games like kid icarus, marios, or any of the classics and play them for more time than I would COD3 or GOW. What does this say about todays games? They care more about the fluff than coming up with original ideas and inovations I assume, but the staying power of todays games is next to none. After about 2 weeks, most games are done and over.

We have all been wowed by the pretty graphics, but pretty graphics no longer mean as much becuase we are bombarded with them everyday (from movies to music videos to ads). Games no longer have a soul like they used to, and get punched out so quick is mind boggling. Ideas are rehashed over and over till the genre sucks. Shooters to me are over done, and boring, but it seems every major release is from this group. Great games, like LocoRoco on the psp, combine intuitive gameplay with new design concepts. Viva Pinata seems to be the same way as well. With the games coming out all resembling each other, I dont see how the industry will sustain itself.

[rudyjuly2]

Re: What is Nex gen and what are you expecting from it?

Next gen is gameplay, gameplay, gameplay, and some more gameplay. Graphics get old quick if the game sucks (look at nba Live or madden). Im tired of getting these games that last 8 hours at most. When I had the NES, SNES, etc I would play those games for hours and hours, months and months. I still pick up games like kid icarus, marios, or any of the classics and play them for more time than I would COD3 or GOW. What does this say about todays games? They care more about the fluff than coming up with original ideas and inovations I assume, but the staying power of todays games is next to none. After about 2 weeks, most games are done and over.

For sports games, the games have improved so much since then that its hard to keep innovating to that degree. Tecmo was awesome but you just guessed a play and ran in a zig zag pattern to dodge guys across the field. Games were fun but also a lot simpler back then. They have progressed so much that we keep expecting massive gameplay improvement that may not be possible any more. Maybe minor gameplay improvements are all we should expect. That's why I'm still sticking with my PS2 a little longer. Don't want to spend a lot of money for a graphics update.