RPG Definition

[Dealin Rams]

I'm a bit confused. I was skeptical prior to playing Fallout 3, but it has turned out to be one of my favorite games of all time. Previously, I'd tried playing games like KOTOR and Jade Empire - which I thought fell in to the same category as Fallout 3 (i.e., RPGs) - and really didn't enjoy them. They're just not for me. So are these games actually in different categories? Is Fallout 3 not an RPG?

More importantly, if I liked Fallout 3, but didn't like KOTOR or Jade Empire, will I like either Oblivion or Mass Effect?

[Cyros]

Re: RPG Definition

You'd probably like Oblivion if you like Fallout 3 (same developer) but I'm not sure about Mass Effect. It's the same developer as KOTOR and Jade Empire so a lot of the elements are the same, but the combat mechanics are really different.

These are pretty much what are called "Western Rpgs". With these type of games you get more of a blank canvas for your character allowing you to usually design the characters looks, abilities, and the role he plays in the world (good, bad, neutral).

Other types of Rpgs are Japanese Rpgs which I won't detail now. I hope this helps you.

[LanteriX]

Re: RPG Definition

I think I'd call Fallout 3 more of a FPS with RPG elements to it more than anything.

[trobinson97]

Re: RPG Definition

Can you switch to 3rd person in Fallout like you can in Oblivion?

[Dealin Rams]

Re: RPG Definition

Can you switch to 3rd person in Fallout like you can in Oblivion?

Yes, but I actually like playing it better in 1st-person.

[Bornindamecca]

Re: RPG Definition

I don't know what I'd call Fallout. You can call it an FPS or a sandbox/freeroamer, but I don't know if it has enough story to call it an RPG. Your character is more customizable than in an FPS, but RPGs tend to have a driving story that pushes you from one event to another.

[JohnnytheSkin]

Re: RPG Definition

I don't know what I'd call Fallout. You can call it an FPS or a sandbox/freeroamer, but I don't know if it has enough story to call it an RPG.

I see where you're coming from, but as Cyros alluded to, "western RPGs" are different. Look at both Fallout and Oblivion, you had the "main story" but could tackle it whenever you wanted. There was no driving force for you to complete it and you could spend hours upon hours doing sidequests and wandering around. Same with Mass Effect in a way, since you could just hop and bop to different planets once you got the ship and avoid the story missions.

Japanese RPGs (from Square Enix, Konami, etc) are all story driven and linear. Not a lot of deviation from the story, unless you count the uber-hard bosses and ultimate weapons you can find at the end.

I play both, but have generally preferred JRPGs. I enjoy western RPGs, but hate making decisions since I always think I'm making the wrong one. I also tend to play them as either full good or full evil which dampens things for me as well...though Mass Effect is one of my favorite games of all time.

[Cyros]

Re: RPG Definition

As I've matured I've started enjoying Rpgs a lot more than I used (used to jump in and not know what I was doing at all). I like my western rpgs (especially from Bioware) but at times I really get into wanting to play a JRPG (mostly cause I like watching anime and such).

[Bornindamecca]

Re: RPG Definition

I see where you're coming from, but as Cyros alluded to, "western RPGs" are different. Look at both Fallout and Oblivion, you had the "main story" but could tackle it whenever you wanted. There was no driving force for you to complete it and you could spend hours upon hours doing sidequests and wandering around. Same with Mass Effect in a way, since you could just hop and bop to different planets once you got the ship and avoid the story missions.

I think Fallout is different from Mass Effect and Oblivion. In Oblivion, not only are you given an important task by a dead king, but the death of the king spills over into the characters you meet AND you have Oblivion gates opening up all over the place. The first three adventures in Oblivion are very story oriented, and really dominate the first few hours to play. While you have the option to ignore that and pick flowers, that freedom is not for lack of a driving story.

Mass Effect is even more so. Every scene ends with "now go do this, before Saren destroys the universe!" Sure, you can say, "meh, I don't care if Saren brings a swarm of Geth to destroy all organic beings", but that's not really in the spirit of the adventure they are presenting you.

Fallout is the opposite of those two. They show your childhood, kick you out of the Vault and say, "if you want, you can look for your Dad." That's not a story by the classic definition. It's just an intro. It doesn't really affect anything. No one cares about your Dad unless you ask, and there is no real reason to go and find him. It's just a free roamer at that point. There's no oblivion gate epidemic. No Saren. Just a wasteland where you can do whatever you want. There is a big gap between leaving the Vault, and starting up the main quest.


On top of that, you're in a world that has already been "destroyed" so your character isn't in the hero role like in Oblivion or Mass Effect. You're just another loser in a desperate broken world, and if you want to find your Dad, head over to DC, but if not, whatever. You can just hang around and drink irradiated water until you get cancer and die, and the world won't change. In the other games, theoretically the world will get much worse if you don't do anything,.

[Candyman5]

Re: RPG Definition

I heard that in some of the DLC that will have in it a way to fix the nuclear wastelands but will involve alot of gathering and man power. If that is true then its going to be a awsome idea.

[allBthere]

Re: RPG Definition

I think Fallout is different from Mass Effect and Oblivion. In Oblivion, not only are you given an important task by a dead king, but the death of the king spills over into the characters you meet AND you have Oblivion gates opening up all over the place. The first three adventures in Oblivion are very story oriented, and really dominate the first few hours to play. While you have the option to ignore that and pick flowers, that freedom is not for lack of a driving story.

Mass Effect is even more so. Every scene ends with "now go do this, before Saren destroys the universe!" Sure, you can say, "meh, I don't care if Saren brings a swarm of Geth to destroy all organic beings", but that's not really in the spirit of the adventure they are presenting you.

Fallout is the opposite of those two. They show your childhood, kick you out of the Vault and say, "if you want, you can look for your Dad." That's not a story by the classic definition. It's just an intro. It doesn't really affect anything. No one cares about your Dad unless you ask, and there is no real reason to go and find him. It's just a free roamer at that point. There's no oblivion gate epidemic. No Saren. Just a wasteland where you can do whatever you want. There is a big gap between leaving the Vault, and starting up the main quest.


On top of that, you're in a world that has already been "destroyed" so your character isn't in the hero role like in Oblivion or Mass Effect. You're just another loser in a desperate broken world, and if you want to find your Dad, head over to DC, but if not, whatever. You can just hang around and drink irradiated water until you get cancer and die, and the world won't change. In the other games, theoretically the world will get much worse if you don't do anything,.

that's a great point, and something i find kind of charming about fallout3. the biggest impact on the world could be that strange side quest 'oasis'. And you're right, you don't 'matter', but surviving is a challenge and comming out of the vault to explore the wasteland just to see what's in it is very motivating for me. Since the player is setting foot outside the vault for the first time too - I wonder what's going to out here - kind of feeling.

Oblivion is awesome, no doubt, but the scaling really hurt it imo (which fallout has too - see radioskorps and mullurks)

Mass effect is awesome too. I love all three of these games, they are all similar, and very different at the same time. if there was 4 or 5 of these a year I wouldn't have time for many other games.

To me a good RPG is like being 'IN' a story lol, kind of like the never ending story in a way...and other games like gta4 and such are like playing out a movie - rpg's have this element too, but it's just a much deeper feeling than that.

[Defel]

Re: RPG Definition

To answer the OP's question...

I think any game will be classified as an RPG if you gain levels/skills by gaining experience points AND your ability to survive in the game is very dependent on your level. Story or style doesn't matter at all.

It's like the genre of sports games...If someone likes MLB 09: The Show, they shouldn't automatically like NHL 09 because they're both games where teams compete and whoever ends up with the most points wins. Like RPGs, they can have different rules and a totally different pace.

Yeah, you'll probably like Oblivion and Mass Effect.