Wow.. Min. Wage in the US is only $5.15/hr

[bryan_05]

Re: Wow.. Min. Wage in the US is only $5.15/hr

Because thats the straight-up truth. You f'ed up (no pun intended) and are now paying the consequences. That is life.

But should her children also pay the consequences?

[GP Mercy]

Re: Wow.. Min. Wage in the US is only $5.15/hr

But should her children also pay the consequences?

Children shouldn't have to suffer consequences because of what their parents have done. Yet, it happens everyday. Doesn't it?

[bryan_05]

Re: Wow.. Min. Wage in the US is only $5.15/hr

Children shouldn't have to suffer consequences because of what their parents have done. Yet, it happens everyday. Doesn't it?

My point exactly. Everyone bashes on the mom for "f-ing" up, but they just throw her children out with her.

[mjb2124]

Re: Wow.. Min. Wage in the US is only $5.15/hr

$7.00 an hour with no overtime is about $14,000 per year. Let's say you live in a poor part of the country... this will be VERY nice on prices.

$300 rent x 12 = $3600
$75 electricity x 12 = $890
$20 phone x 12 = $240
$200 Food x 12 = $2400
$2 x 250 days work Mass Transit = $500
Goodwill CLothes $200
Taxes = $2800

Left = $3370

Who knows about doctor's bills or children. Remember that is what is left with very low prices on clothes, food, rent, electricity. And NO Car.

$7.00 / hour ON YOUR OWN is NOT GOOD.

Why is this fictional person only working 1 job?

Open up the Sports Illustrated with the article about Hines Ward. His mother worked 3 jobs to support him once she moved to America. His father left them and she came to America with nothing because she thought the opportunities here were best for Hines. She barely spoke English, but made the best out of what she could. Now things are going pretty darn good for her.

Part of my problem is that there are a million excuses why not to. That's the easy way out. It's difficult to take responsibility and do as much as one can to improve themselves. Hines' mother is a perfect example - and she was even a step behind since she didn't speak English well.

[Havok410]

Re: Wow.. Min. Wage in the US is only $5.15/hr

Where is min wage 11 bucks an hour?

And you are right, an increase in min wage is not going to lead to an increase in saving money for necessities.

It's $9.50 in Sante Fe (highest in the nation).

Minimum wage is $6.15/hr here. My younger brother (16 years old) makes that much and is more then happy. I make alittle more ($7.15), and it's more then enough for now.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._state_minimum_wages

[GamingJones]

Re: Wow.. Min. Wage in the US is only $5.15/hr

$7.00 an hour with no overtime is about $14,000 per year. Let's say you live in a poor part of the country... this will be VERY nice on prices.

$300 rent x 12 = $3600
$75 electricity x 12 = $890
$20 phone x 12 = $240
$200 Food x 12 = $2400
$2 x 250 days work Mass Transit = $500
Goodwill CLothes $200
Taxes = $2800

Left = $3370

Who knows about doctor's bills or children. Remember that is what is left with very low prices on clothes, food, rent, electricity. And NO Car.

$7.00 / hour ON YOUR OWN is NOT GOOD.

A single parent earning 14K per year is going to get welfare, food stamps, etc, which IS additional income that does not count towards their annual income as far as the poverty line is concerned.

[GamingJones]

Re: Wow.. Min. Wage in the US is only $5.15/hr

My point exactly. Everyone bashes on the mom for "f-ing" up, but they just throw her children out with her.

If you want to help the mother and kids, put a program in place to help her pay for community college, trade school, or someway to better herself and her kids life. THAT will help them.

Giving a person, who has already demonstrated poor decision making ability, free money for working no harder will most likely lead to more poor decisions.

[pfunk880]

Re: Wow.. Min. Wage in the US is only $5.15/hr

If you want to help the mother and kids, put a program in place to help her pay for community college, trade school, or someway to better herself and her kids life. THAT will help them.

Giving a person, who has already poor decision making ability, free money for working no harder will most likely lead to more poor decisions.

Bingo.

But I have a feeling this thread's going to get closed.

[Misfit]

Re: Wow.. Min. Wage in the US is only $5.15/hr

If hypothetical 16 year old mother of 2 kids can't support her kids then the state will take them away and put them in foster care. Is it fair for the kids? I don't know, define fair. Kids are dependent upon their caretakers and living in foster care may not be a picnic but poor people in America have it a lot better than poor people in third world countries. Not everyone gets an easy life, its the way the world works.

Minimum wage is fine and shouldn't be toyed with. How hard is it to get a job that pays above minimum wage? I worked in kitchens all throughout high school and college and never once made minimum wage and the starting wage was usually around 8 dollars. Fast food places will pay even better. Bottom line, if you're making only $5.15 an hour its because you're doing a job any idiot could do and you're completely disposable to your employer. If you want a better wage better seperate yourself from your peers.

And this isn't backed by statistical data, but I have a cousin who used to be a social worker and it offerred a unique perspective on the welfare system in the US. She went into it with the typical youthful look that these people needed help to get out of the gutter and all that stuff. Every family she encountered was happy and didn't want to be taken off of welfare. They were all perfectly content to let the government give them money. Sure they weren't living in style or anything, but they felt the trade-off of not working was more than worth it. And she worked in the greater Boston area, not exactly a small population of people either. Take that for what it's worth.

[bryan_05]

Re: Wow.. Min. Wage in the US is only $5.15/hr

Why is this fictional person only working 1 job?

Open up the Sports Illustrated with the article about Hines Ward. His mother worked 3 jobs to support him once she moved to America. His father left them and she came to America with nothing because she thought the opportunities here were best for Hines. She barely spoke English, but made the best out of what she could. Now things are going pretty darn good for her.

Part of my problem is that there are a million excuses why not to. That's the easy way out. It's difficult to take responsibility and do as much as one can to improve themselves. Hines' mother is a perfect example - and she was even a step behind since she didn't speak English well.

But what if she has 3 kids? What if one of the kids is handicapped? What if none of her jobs provide insurance.

Citing one example will not convince me of anything. I am just trying to say $7.00 and hour for a mom with 2 kids or just about anyone. THAT SUCKS! Living paycheck to paycheck sucks. Everyone posting here is probably pretty well off and college educated or soon to be, probably were born into it as well. which leads to doing everything you can to improve yourself doesn't mean you are going to make it like "Hines Ward mom".

[Cataschism]

Re: Wow.. Min. Wage in the US is only $5.15/hr

Washington State is #1

Yeah it's flippin $7.63 here. Under some conditions in Kansas it's 2 something? That's insane.

[mjb2124]

Re: Wow.. Min. Wage in the US is only $5.15/hr

But what if she has 3 kids? What if one of the kids is handicapped? What if none of her jobs provide insurance.

Citing one example will not convince me of anything. I am just trying to say $7.00 and hour for a mom with 2 kids or just about anyone. THAT SUCKS! Living paycheck to paycheck sucks. Everyone posting here is probably pretty well off and college educated or soon to be, probably were born into it as well. which leads to doing everything you can to improve yourself doesn't mean you are going to make it like "Hines Ward mom".

I don't mean to sound harsh and I know it does, but those were her choices when she decided to have 3 kids. She could've stopped at 1 knowing she couldn't support them with the salary that she earned. It's one thing to make 1 mistake, but then to do it 2 more times?

Personal responsibility seems to be a thing of the past. Too many people want too many things handed to them. The Handicap reference is a different story though. I might be mistaken, but I believe the Government will help out more in those instances. I need to look that up though.

Yes, I'm sure many of us have never had to deal with this. Personally I know I haven't, but I've also gone out of my way to increase my self-worth even when I was already doing well. Maybe I've never been around these problems and this is why I feel the way I do, but it's not going to change. Just my personal beliefs.

[MassNole]

Re: Wow.. Min. Wage in the US is only $5.15/hr

If hypothetical 16 year old mother of 2 kids can't support her kids then the state will take them away and put them in foster care. Is it fair for the kids? I don't know, define fair. Kids are dependent upon their caretakers and living in foster care may not be a picnic but poor people in America have it a lot better than poor people in third world countries. Not everyone gets an easy life, its the way the world works.

It isn't even close to being that simple. The state would typically try to help the family as best they could through WIC, food stamps, Head Start, etc. before taking that drastic of a step. In the Commonwealth, lets not even get into the programs in place to assure that doesn't happen. Removal, sans an emergency situation is the most severe step and the step the state does not want to take.

Minimum wage is fine and shouldn't be toyed with. How hard is it to get a job that pays above minimum wage? I worked in kitchens all throughout high school and college and never once made minimum wage and the starting wage was usually around 8 dollars. Fast food places will pay even better. Bottom line, if you're making only $5.15 an hour its because you're doing a job any idiot could do and you're completely disposable to your employer. If you want a better wage better seperate yourself from your peers.

And this isn't backed by statistical data, but I have a cousin who used to be a social worker and it offerred a unique perspective on the welfare system in the US. She went into it with the typical youthful look that these people needed help to get out of the gutter and all that stuff. Every family she encountered was happy and didn't want to be taken off of welfare. They were all perfectly content to let the government give them money. Sure they weren't living in style or anything, but they felt the trade-off of not working was more than worth it. And she worked in the greater Boston area, not exactly a small population of people either. Take that for what it's worth.

In theory Welfare should not be paying any more than could be made by working, so it should generally be capping around $800/mo ($5.15/hr x 40 hrs x 4 weeks). So perhaps they were happy and perhaps that bonding with the children is much more important to that family as a means to raise the children right so that they can avoid the pitfalls their parents fell into. Perhaps they are lazy and content draining the system, I can't seriously say that isn't a possibility. However, if minimum wage was raised it would also have an effect on welfare given the formula used, so that would give these people a little more money as well, which wouldn't be the worst thing in the world. However sadly this is where inflation would really start to kick in which would become a problem. I am all for making these people get up off their asses and work, I really am, however I also realize that through largely their own poor choices in life they were unable to acquire any sort of skill set to make themselves even remotely marketable. So this is really one hell of a Catch 22.

My reform would involve workfare, where they need to show they are making steps towards finding a real job and using the state for support in that attempt. I know in the Commonwealth we force birth control upon people (this seems primed for a major challenge) and if they can't prove they were on it then the Commonwealth won't increase benefits when they pop out more children. I for one love this, as I grew up in a small town where we had trash who did what MA seeks to prevent against. This would also be part of the ideal reform, because if you can show you took every reasonable step to avoid pregnancy (abstenence isn't reasonable) then the Commonwealth will help you out. I would also force mandatory drug screening on these people, and whereas I can appreciate the use of a couple of recreational drugs I don't want welfare money purchasing them. I would also like to see school choice implemented for welfare and low income families, so that the traditionally horrible schools don't hold the children back any further.

[MassNole]

Re: Wow.. Min. Wage in the US is only $5.15/hr

Yeah it's flippin $7.63 here. Under some conditions in Kansas it's 2 something? That's insane.

That is typically for waiters and waitresses and any other job largely dependent upon tips. However, within that law there is a rider that says if they didn't make enough to be at what minimum wage was through tips then the employer must pay them enough to equal that.

[MassNole]

Re: Wow.. Min. Wage in the US is only $5.15/hr

But what if she has 3 kids? What if one of the kids is handicapped? What if none of her jobs provide insurance.

Citing one example will not convince me of anything. I am just trying to say $7.00 and hour for a mom with 2 kids or just about anyone. THAT SUCKS! Living paycheck to paycheck sucks. Everyone posting here is probably pretty well off and college educated or soon to be, probably were born into it as well. which leads to doing everything you can to improve yourself doesn't mean you are going to make it like "Hines Ward mom".

I think this is really stretching the issue don't you? Given this fact pattern I would highly recommend the mother voluntarily enter her kids into foster care while she attempts to improve her life. Also, I can't speak for the rest of the country, but in Massachusetts (MA is the leader of the pack with most of these social reform laws involving children) the Commonwealth would provide insurance for these children. I don't know how many other states have followed MA's lead on this though, I just know Vermont has, but I am really unsure about the other 48 states.