Half of students don't belong in college - OregonLive.com
Thoughts?
Without making this a political thread (although I realize it could be borderline mods) I think the Government spends far too much on financial aid for college. Today it seems that any idiot can get into college which only takes away the importance of a Bachelor's degree from those who really earned it. I will take my wife's cousin as a prime example of this. She had average grades at a well below average HS, average SAT scores and got into college for $27k-30k a year. Due to her family's low income she got a lot of financial aid, meaning the Government picked up $100k+ for her, and her current job is now at Dunkin Donuts. Whereas this used to be the exception it is now steadily becoming the norm.
The problem with this in my opinion is two fold. First, it devalues the college degree as a whole. Now whereas this wouldn't apply to Ivy League schools (although their admissions and grading policies leave A LOT to be desired for their prestige) it does effect a lot other schools, mostly the smaller private schools and the smaller state schools. Now because students are coming out with between $50k-200k in debt, even worse if they go to grad school, they are less apt to take blue collar jobs and those who do expect more pay. If they can't find jobs and default on their loans, the taxpayers are left holding the bill while the colleges received an economic windfall. Now because we have less blue collar workers in the work force, jobs leave the country to fill the positions, which creates even fewer jobs, and this cycle continues to repeat.
Meanwhile the colleges receive a windfall in payments and make huge profits disguised as endowments. The answer to me seems two fold as well, severely cut the amount of financial aid available and place restrictions on it, such as minimum GPA's to even qualify and then minimum GPA's to keep the money (I would say somewhere between the 3.3-3.5 range). Second, colleges should lose their tax exempt status across the board so that more money from their profits goes back into economic development. Instead they hord students, reap the rewards, and create economic chaos.
Thoughts....opinions?
Half of students don't belong in college
by Ken Moyle, guest opinion Saturday February 21, 2009, 10:44 AM
The Oregonian's recent articles on the escalating cost of undergraduate education and the incredible debt carried by most graduating seniors did not address the fundamental issue underlying this problem: Even at these costs, the quality of education being delivered to a majority of students is closer to remedial high school rather than college.
Undergraduate education in America is an enormous business, with 9 million undergraduates spending $20,000 to $50,000 each year on tuition, books, lodging, meals and entertainment. Make no mistake about it: Administrators, academics, publishers, bankers and the sports industry all have a vested interest in increasing the undergraduate population.
Our colleges and universities compete to attract students through amenities such as fine facilities, strong sports programs, spas and easy course options.
A standing joke among faculty members is an adaptation of a communist adage: "We pretend to teach and they pretend to learn." We all know that there are so-called "graduates" who can barely read or write and couldn't pick out the United States on a map.
A vibrant and rigorous higher education system is, of course, a vital part of our national infrastructure. Indeed, we have many fine institutions and many students who are working hard to extract as much as they can from the schools they are attending. The problem is that about half of our student population shouldn't be there for academic or motivational reasons.
Why are they there, then? Because the higher education business, in its zeal to keep expanding, has convinced us that everyone "has to" go to college regardless of what they get out of it. We have managed to raise the bar for getting any kind of menial job to a bachelor's degree and are well on the way to requiring a master's to qualify for a barista position.
The sad thing is that the kids who are there for the wrong reasons are not only carrying a huge debt after their four or five wasted years, but they have also given up several years of productive output, on-the-job learning and income.
Most businesses have to train graduates from scratch anyway because most don't come to them with useful skills; they use the bachelor's degree as a simple tool for winnowing applicants, because those with a bachelor's may be more trainable than those without. If a bachelor's degree really meant something and there was a significant nonbachelor's pool of talented people, job requirements would become more realistic.
The whining of the higher education business execs for more money from their students and state governments certainly would subside if the undergraduate population suddenly dropped by half and parents demanded that colleges actually deliver a rigorous education for the money invested.
It's time to make the "higher" in higher education mean something.
by Ken Moyle, guest opinion Saturday February 21, 2009, 10:44 AM
The Oregonian's recent articles on the escalating cost of undergraduate education and the incredible debt carried by most graduating seniors did not address the fundamental issue underlying this problem: Even at these costs, the quality of education being delivered to a majority of students is closer to remedial high school rather than college.
Undergraduate education in America is an enormous business, with 9 million undergraduates spending $20,000 to $50,000 each year on tuition, books, lodging, meals and entertainment. Make no mistake about it: Administrators, academics, publishers, bankers and the sports industry all have a vested interest in increasing the undergraduate population.
Our colleges and universities compete to attract students through amenities such as fine facilities, strong sports programs, spas and easy course options.
A standing joke among faculty members is an adaptation of a communist adage: "We pretend to teach and they pretend to learn." We all know that there are so-called "graduates" who can barely read or write and couldn't pick out the United States on a map.
A vibrant and rigorous higher education system is, of course, a vital part of our national infrastructure. Indeed, we have many fine institutions and many students who are working hard to extract as much as they can from the schools they are attending. The problem is that about half of our student population shouldn't be there for academic or motivational reasons.
Why are they there, then? Because the higher education business, in its zeal to keep expanding, has convinced us that everyone "has to" go to college regardless of what they get out of it. We have managed to raise the bar for getting any kind of menial job to a bachelor's degree and are well on the way to requiring a master's to qualify for a barista position.
The sad thing is that the kids who are there for the wrong reasons are not only carrying a huge debt after their four or five wasted years, but they have also given up several years of productive output, on-the-job learning and income.
Most businesses have to train graduates from scratch anyway because most don't come to them with useful skills; they use the bachelor's degree as a simple tool for winnowing applicants, because those with a bachelor's may be more trainable than those without. If a bachelor's degree really meant something and there was a significant nonbachelor's pool of talented people, job requirements would become more realistic.
The whining of the higher education business execs for more money from their students and state governments certainly would subside if the undergraduate population suddenly dropped by half and parents demanded that colleges actually deliver a rigorous education for the money invested.
It's time to make the "higher" in higher education mean something.
Without making this a political thread (although I realize it could be borderline mods) I think the Government spends far too much on financial aid for college. Today it seems that any idiot can get into college which only takes away the importance of a Bachelor's degree from those who really earned it. I will take my wife's cousin as a prime example of this. She had average grades at a well below average HS, average SAT scores and got into college for $27k-30k a year. Due to her family's low income she got a lot of financial aid, meaning the Government picked up $100k+ for her, and her current job is now at Dunkin Donuts. Whereas this used to be the exception it is now steadily becoming the norm.
The problem with this in my opinion is two fold. First, it devalues the college degree as a whole. Now whereas this wouldn't apply to Ivy League schools (although their admissions and grading policies leave A LOT to be desired for their prestige) it does effect a lot other schools, mostly the smaller private schools and the smaller state schools. Now because students are coming out with between $50k-200k in debt, even worse if they go to grad school, they are less apt to take blue collar jobs and those who do expect more pay. If they can't find jobs and default on their loans, the taxpayers are left holding the bill while the colleges received an economic windfall. Now because we have less blue collar workers in the work force, jobs leave the country to fill the positions, which creates even fewer jobs, and this cycle continues to repeat.
Meanwhile the colleges receive a windfall in payments and make huge profits disguised as endowments. The answer to me seems two fold as well, severely cut the amount of financial aid available and place restrictions on it, such as minimum GPA's to even qualify and then minimum GPA's to keep the money (I would say somewhere between the 3.3-3.5 range). Second, colleges should lose their tax exempt status across the board so that more money from their profits goes back into economic development. Instead they hord students, reap the rewards, and create economic chaos.
Thoughts....opinions?
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