Columbine: 10 years later.

[Mo]

Re: Columbine: 10 years later.

This may be out of line, but I question where the parents were for these 2 high school kids. As bad as the kids were, they were still the parents' responsibility...

If you read the article, it mentions that the parents were aware of their kids issues and did try to help them.

[Speedy]

Re: Columbine: 10 years later.

If you read the article, it mentions that the parents were aware of their kids issues and did try to help them.

What people present in front of the media and the outside world and what actually do on a daily basis is totally different. Moms/Dads make a facade like everything's okay but the homelife is horrible - I've seen it on a personal basis. In any event, parenting starts from day 1. It's not a do-what-I-say approach but a do-as-I-do since kids only learn how to talk, walk, eat, etc. by watching and learning. Obviously everything can't be censored but each parent should know what his/her kid is doing. I hated my parents digging into my life as a teenager but in hindset I'm thankful.

[slickdtc]

Re: Columbine: 10 years later.

This may be out of line, but I question where the parents were for these 2 high school kids. As bad as the kids were, they were still the parents' responsibility...

These kids made bombs and shot up a ton of people. They're ****ing crazy. I don't know how much you can prevent that.

[Mo]

Re: Columbine: 10 years later.

I wouldn't called them kids either, to me they were adults.

[Laettner32]

Re: Columbine: 10 years later.

These kids made bombs and shot up a ton of people. They're ****ing crazy. I don't know how much you can prevent that.

I just bought the new book by David Cullen, "Columbine". It is intense. I am just about thru the actual shooting. Klebold so far hasn't done much(relatively speaking.) Eric did almost all the damage so far. But they are about to go into the Library. Klebold was a follower. Eric had to change alot of the plan just to make sure Dylan followed thru. So far, Dylan has walked over a couple of people who were injured. Students say that he saw them, but didn't shoot. Eric on the other hand was relentless. The book says that before the Library, Eric had shot around 100 rounds. Dylan was barely over 20. Several of those were at some students running across a field almost out of range anyway, if not already out of range.

Eric had women. Dylan had a girl that liked him, he didn't like her. They were fairly popular, had several "jock" friends, and were not in the "Trenchcoat Mafia".

For what it counts, the book says Dylan had an older model BMW for the time. It wasn't new, or recent or anything...if that matters.

[Cebby]

Re: Columbine: 10 years later.

What people present in front of the media and the outside world and what actually do on a daily basis is totally different. Moms/Dads make a facade like everything's okay but the homelife is horrible - I've seen it on a personal basis. In any event, parenting starts from day 1. It's not a do-what-I-say approach but a do-as-I-do since kids only learn how to talk, walk, eat, etc. by watching and learning. Obviously everything can't be censored but each parent should know what his/her kid is doing. I hated my parents digging into my life as a teenager but in hindset I'm thankful.

People are different.

I know 4 groups of siblings all within a year of each other (2 sets are twins) who were, as far as I know and have seen, raised the same way, and each group has drastically different kids. It's hard for me to say that the parents ****ed up because one of their kids is selling coke when the other is applying for med school, or when one girl has had sex with 4 people in a night and the other is saving herself for something.

For all we know, the parents could have been trying, but when a kid wants to blow up his school, there's not much parents can do.

[Laettner32]

Re: Columbine: 10 years later.

People are different.

I know 4 groups of siblings all within a year of each other (2 sets are twins) who were, as far as I know and have seen, raised the same way, and each group has drastically different kids. It's hard for me to say that the parents ****ed up because one of their kids is selling coke when the other is applying for med school, or when one girl has had sex with 4 people in a night and the other is saving herself for something.

For all we know, the parents could have been trying, but when a kid wants to blow up his school, there's not much parents can do.

Rack 'em! Cebbys best post ever. As a parent of two boys. A 6 year old, and a 3 year old, they could not be more different. They are polar opposites. Same mom, same dad, same house and neighborhood. Both are good kids, but...Wow! They are ying and yang. One is the athlete, the other the artist. One is in bed by 8:00 p.m., they other never wants to go down. One is afraid of his own shadow, the other is the "bully" at school. One can play by himself and his toys all day, the other is following you all day.

[matt8204]

Re: Columbine: 10 years later.

People are different.

I know 4 groups of siblings all within a year of each other (2 sets are twins) who were, as far as I know and have seen, raised the same way, and each group has drastically different kids. It's hard for me to say that the parents ****ed up because one of their kids is selling coke when the other is applying for med school, or when one girl has had sex with 4 people in a night and the other is saving herself for something.

For all we know, the parents could have been trying, but when a kid wants to blow up his school, there's not much parents can do.

You're right. Sometimes, parents are absolutely to blame, but NOT always. There is only so much you can do. If a kid flat-out does not listen to you despite your best efforts, that's not your fault. You could have two wonderful parents who have a kid that goes onto become a serial killer. Conversely, a kid could have the worst parents imaginable and grow up to be very successful. People take their own course in life and at some point, you have to take responsibility for the things YOU have done.

[Laettner32]

Re: Columbine: 10 years later.

I just read David Cullens book, and one thing stands out.

The so called "quiet period" during the massacre. They killed their last victim in the library. After that the boys wandered the halls, went back to the library, and made eye contact with several students but did not shoot. This was approximately 30 minutes of time. They shot at empty rooms, walls. At one point they shot out the windows of the library at some cops/fleeing students, but they were difficult shots.

Why did they stop?

Cullen says that psychologist claim that they simply got bored with the rampage. I just don't buy that, they went out to the woods several times and practiced on trees or set up junk to shoot many times. That was a "thrill", but killing students "bored 'em"?

Eric broke his nose during the massacre from the recoil of a shotgun blast.

The propane tanks he set up hoping to collapse the library onto the cafeteria failed to go off. This was what Eric really wanted to do. He probably was shocked/bewildered that they never went off. During the "quiet period" he went back to the cafeteria and shot 'em with his rifle (no dice) and Dylan messed with some wiring.

In their writings/video journal they made, they wondered how long they would be around until the cops killed 'em.

IMO I think they didn't know what else to do. They were hoping to be shot dead by now. I don't think they enjoyed it like they thought they would. They had plenty of ammo, kids lined up under desks just sitting ducks. And plenty of time to do much more damage before the SWAT teams entered. Instead, they just wondered around. Again, witnesses said they looked into their classrooms and saw them trying to hide...and just walked past 'em.

As awful as this tragedy was, it could have easily been much more worse.

[slickdtc]

Re: Columbine: 10 years later.

Hmm, I'll have to read that book. I never gave too much thought to Columbine... I was pretty young when it happened. But once this thread was created, I read a bit more into it and would like to get deeper perspective on it as well. I'm not too big of a book guy, but I think I'll pick it up.

[Laettner32]

Re: Columbine: 10 years later.

I recommend the book to anyone interested.

Like I said, IMO Eric (who was the leader, organizer without a doubt) was in disbelief about the lack of bombs going off, he thought he would turn the place into another Oklahoma City. He had a "God" complex, how could they have failed? He was meticulous about them.

Then, after he shot and killed a student under a table in the library, the recoil breaks his nose. He is bleeding significantly. Things weren't going to plan.
I think he suffered a concussion. Was "out of it", Dylan was a follower all along, simply copied what Eric did. Walked around with him. Obviously, no autopsy could be done on his brain, there wasn't enough left after he shot himself.

Finally, they also imagined going out in a "blaze of glory" battling the cops. After so much time they had to be wondering "where the hell are they?" They wandered for a bit, went back to the library to see if their cars would explode (they rigged 'em to a timer) but again, they were duds. They found a serene corner of the library looking at the mountains...and killed themselves.

[bluengold34_OS]

Re: Columbine: 10 years later.

I live like 10 min from that school, and the Wife always wants to drive by it just to see it. I have yet to do that, even though we are so close. It just feels kinda wrong to look upon it, even though its only in a curious sort of way.