PES 2016 - Fluid formations, tactics, and more to achieve simulation gameplay!

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  • fearwhatnow
    MVP
    • Aug 2006
    • 1474

    #31
    Re: PES 2016 - Fluid formations, tactics, and more to achieve simulation gameplay!

    Originally posted by KG
    Hell yeah. Could you imagine going back to the 8 directional movement? Ugh
    The movement was indeed limited but the AI in PES 5-6 and especially in the Liveware Edition was one of the best both defensively and offensively.
    If you fire up these games again you'll see right away:
    - Cpu AI defense covering is gorgeous.
    - Teammates and cpu players running into open space 100% when you want them to run.
    - Goalkeepers intelligence is superb.
    - Fouls. Fouls everywhere.
    - Through balls simplified but a joy to use.
    - Cpu changing sides.

    There were ofc flaws but after 10 years the game has become worse. That's the sad truth.

    Comment

    • Matt10
      Hall Of Fame
      • Apr 2006
      • 16664

      #32
      Re: PES 2016 - Fluid formations, tactics, and more to achieve simulation gameplay!

      Originally posted by fearwhatnow
      The movement was indeed limited but the AI in PES 5-6 and especially in the Liveware Edition was one of the best both defensively and offensively.
      If you fire up these games again you'll see right away:
      - Cpu AI defense covering is gorgeous.
      - Teammates and cpu players running into open space 100% when you want them to run.
      - Goalkeepers intelligence is superb.
      - Fouls. Fouls everywhere.
      - Through balls simplified but a joy to use.
      - Cpu changing sides.

      There were ofc flaws but after 10 years the game has become worse. That's the sad truth.
      I was never a big critic on 8-directional or 360; didn't really matter to me honestly, so I agree with everything you mentioned. I played the crap out of WE9:LE, it was by far one of my favorite in the PES series next to PES 4 (with global edits).

      That nostalgia though....

      <iframe width="750" height="422" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/CTMvHzf3C1w" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
      (no sound)

      I think what the problem with PES and FIFA is now that the directional controls are all over. This results in more options, but more problems. At limited directions, it was much easier to program imho - so the proper positioning and gameplay was able to be intact - and more reflective of what we all know the game should be.
      Last edited by Matt10; 08-27-2015, 12:54 PM.
      Youtube - subscribe!

      Comment

      • fearwhatnow
        MVP
        • Aug 2006
        • 1474

        #33
        Re: PES 2016 - Fluid formations, tactics, and more to achieve simulation gameplay!

        Matt, it's unbelievable how much they've ruined the game after 10 years. Just watch how organic everything was. Passing, free "dead" ball situations, out of reach crossings, cpu changing sides, cpu strikers holding the ball and passing to left and right wings. I can go on forever.

        Comment

        • dmendenhall_9
          Rookie
          • Sep 2014
          • 260

          #34
          Re: PES 2016 - Fluid formations, tactics, and more to achieve simulation gameplay!

          Originally posted by Matt10
          I was never a big critic on 8-directional or 360; didn't really matter to me honestly, so I agree with everything you mentioned. I played the crap out of WE9:LE, it was by far one of my favorite in the PES series next to PES 4 (with global edits).

          That nostalgia though....

          <iframe width="750" height="422" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/CTMvHzf3C1w" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
          (no sound)

          I think what the problem with PES and FIFA is now that the directional controls are all over. This results in more options, but more problems. At limited directions, it was much easier to program imho - so the proper positioning and gameplay was able to be intact - and more reflective of what we all know the game should be.
          Hey Matt,

          Slow response but I did give the game a try on professional, unfortunately the pass percentage seems more linked to the style of play then to the difficulty (Bayern still very high even on professional, I have had some pretty good games though that felt organic. The ball wasn't pinging around as much and had some really great animations and goals and other stuff, ha. I was enjoying using manual controls and playing against professional or top player and using advanced shooting controls.

          I will post some games to see what you think, would love some input from fearwhatnow because I know how brutally honest you are on what you see but I really like the setup I have (not perfect by any means but more organic, or realistic).
          Twitter - mendy_9
          PSN - dmendenhall_9
          Twitch - dmendenhall_9

          Comment

          • dubcity
            Hall Of Fame
            • May 2012
            • 17874

            #35
            Re: PES 2016 - Fluid formations, tactics, and more to achieve simulation gameplay!

            Originally posted by fearwhatnow
            Matt, it's unbelievable how much they've ruined the game after 10 years. Just watch how organic everything was. Passing, free "dead" ball situations, out of reach crossings, cpu changing sides, cpu strikers holding the ball and passing to left and right wings. I can go on forever.

            Didn't take them that long to ruin it. PES 08 was trash, and so were 09 and 10. And those were all non-360 dribbling. Can't speak to the greatness of PES 6 because I didn't play much that gen.

            Comment

            • dmendenhall_9
              Rookie
              • Sep 2014
              • 260

              #36
              Re: PES 2016 - Fluid formations, tactics, and more to achieve simulation gameplay!

              Newest video with some different settings.

              I am playing against top player, pass assist off, shooting advanced, game speed -1. (ignore how bad I play this game).

              The start of the video shows what formations I have setup for both teams and the tactics I am using. (I am finding the culprit of 90% passing is when a team has both possession and short pass as their tactics = lots of short passes back and forth with not always a lot of forward momentum or even looking for a risky pass to open up the defense. may be able to counteract this with how formation is set up, then I can play in positions to make them try a difficult pass).

              Things I like about this
              -AI pass percentage is 72%, they try and miss hard passes, sometimes mi**** passes
              -they switch the ball to the other side of the field!
              -the shape of the team (more france than brazil, don't know if my fluid formations stuck for them?) is pretty much great. looks like a team would on a football field
              -some great little organic battles can be found in front of the net

              Things not so good
              -AI attack can be repetitive and sometimes look robotic
              -i suck at no assist passing but love how it feels
              -goals were kinda lame in this game and wish they would shoot when they have the chance more often

              <iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/MLGkYfsYVc4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

              Let me know what you think!
              Twitter - mendy_9
              PSN - dmendenhall_9
              Twitch - dmendenhall_9

              Comment

              • stevostl
                Pro
                • Aug 2015
                • 558

                #37
                Re: PES 2016 - Fluid formations, tactics, and more to achieve simulation gameplay!

                OK I have changed some of my settings I said was best from earlier in this thread...


                I now play -1 game speed and on professional with 0 or 1 support settings and manual shoot

                I'm getting the best results playing this way in the demo at the moment

                the good thing about this game is I keep wanting to play it even though it's a demo with some issues so that's very good.

                I have decided manual shot or Advanced is the best once you get use to it. Default shoot is to easy. I was playing on no level support for passing I did switch back to 1 for my passing in the midfield to be better when I was struggling with the lesser teams. I have since switched back to full manual when using the better teams.. I do not use the advanced for through ball though.. do not like that.

                manual shot is the best and has the most variety and the Left stick come in to play more with this setting and Advanced to.

                my only thing now is playing against the computer AI on professional is that the keepers are to weak imo going down to that level but the computer AI is more realistic in their pin point passing on this as opposed to the higher levels

                Keep posting the settings you guys think are best... I'm convinced that manual shoot is the best now though for playing this game against the AI. I have scored some good goals that I haven't seen yet with it... . a lot more variety. I also feel it's good to play on manual shoot when playing at professional level. default shooting is just to easy after you play so much.

                overall.. I think the best settings for the demo are this
                -1 game speed
                0 level support (manual passing) or 1... (i prefer manual but I do switch it to 1 sometimes if I was struggling to get passes together in the midfield)
                advanced or manual shoot (i prefer manual)
                trough ball default
                professional or top player setting

                I still say the best thing about this game that makes me love the demo so much is the control of your players and the way you can play defense in this game.

                ps. I forgot to mention I turn fluid formations on and set them according to klashman's team tactics in 2015
                Last edited by stevostl; 09-01-2015, 04:31 PM.

                Comment

                • dmendenhall_9
                  Rookie
                  • Sep 2014
                  • 260

                  #38
                  Re: PES 2016 - Fluid formations, tactics, and more to achieve simulation gameplay!

                  This is my rebuttal to the Fifa 16 videos, haha. Played with a far out view so you can see the shape of the team. I think it really is amazing. Only things I would try and fix are more fouls and a little less pass accuracy (though the more I play the more I see the AI in the 70 percentage and only in the 80's if they have short pass and possession as tactics). Take a look and let me know. I am a PES fanboy for sure but I think this looks better than FIFA demo but I also can't wait to play that. For some reason I just do not like how FIFA players turn on the ball. So abrupt, also there isn't the PES magic if that makes sense. Ha. Anyway take another look and let me know what you think.

                  <iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/AJtbhevXbd4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
                  Twitter - mendy_9
                  PSN - dmendenhall_9
                  Twitch - dmendenhall_9

                  Comment

                  • kubakrs22
                    Just started!
                    • Oct 2015
                    • 1

                    #39
                    Re: PES 2016 - Fluid formations, tactics, and more to achieve simulation gameplay!

                    I had one question is fluid formation good for online games and does it work good in online game?

                    Comment

                    • nazreenjefrizal
                      Rookie
                      • Oct 2015
                      • 6

                      #40
                      Better realistic result

                      I hated when every time I play on professional level I got ridiculous result (goalfest)

                      Below is my recommendation to those who enjoys realistic result.

                      Difficulty professional
                      Time duration 15 mins
                      Control all manual

                      This is the most important one. : all goalkeeper must have minimum stamina of 80. Overall player rating must above 62.

                      After I set all CPU goalkeeper .. Yes I mean all gk .. The game is better. Minimum deflecting is 77. If you don't set this... You keep scoring against CPU gk. But this time around you will be more satisfy when scoring.

                      Comment

                      • BlueChampions
                        Rookie
                        • Oct 2015
                        • 10

                        #41
                        Re: PES 2016 - Fluid formations, tactics, and more to achieve simulation gameplay!

                        Folks. Signed up into this forum to post just this:

                        Have tried various tweaks for simulation gameplay and finally have concluded that this is the definitive tweak you'd ever need for a brilliant simulation in PES 2016.

                        Here's the deal: Take a couple of teams (say Chelsea and Man City). For each player, reduce the values for 'SPEED' and 'EXPLOSIVE POWER' by 10 points each (just TEN). Play a game with those teams. AI opponent fouls more than I do. Possession and shot stats are always right. Manual passing, manual shooting, zero gamespeed. Perfect gameplay.

                        Many PES players love playing lower league football and some even avoid games with top teams. That's primarily because playing with the top teams produce the worst gameplay because invariably all those players are in the 80s when it comes to speed and explosive power and this ruins the game. To slow the game down, most people use -1 and -2 gamespeed but that means losing out on the game's reflexes, responsiveness and the super smart gameplay nuances associated with this. Games in -1 and -2 gamespeed do become dull over a period of time and they do not reflect the pace and change of pace of real football games. Do stick to zero gamespeed as the fixed parameter in whatever tweak you do. In here, you keep the gamespeed as zero and reduce the speed of the players.

                        Even with these edited top teams, if you play against the unedited smaller teams, top teams will still play like top teams and you can see it for yourself.

                        Please do try and let me know.
                        Last edited by BlueChampions; 10-10-2015, 08:13 AM.

                        Comment

                        • nazreenjefrizal
                          Rookie
                          • Oct 2015
                          • 6

                          #42
                          Re: PES 2016 - Fluid formations, tactics, and more to achieve simulation gameplay!

                          Originally posted by BlueChampions
                          Folks. Signed up into this forum to post just this:

                          Have tried various tweaks for simulation gameplay and finally have concluded that this is the definitive tweak you'd ever need for a brilliant simulation in PES 2016.

                          Here's the deal: Take a couple of teams (say Chelsea and Man City). For each player, reduce the values for 'SPEED' and 'EXPLOSIVE POWER' by 10 points each (just TEN). Play a game with those teams. AI opponent fouls more than I do. Possession and shot stats are always right. Manual passing, manual shooting, zero gamespeed. Perfect gameplay.

                          Many PES players love playing lower league football and some even avoid games with top teams. That's primarily because playing with the top teams produce the worst gameplay because invariably all those players are in the 80s when it comes to speed and explosive power and this ruins the game. To slow the game down, most people use -1 and -2 gamespeed but that means losing out on the game's reflexes, responsiveness and the super smart gameplay nuances associated with this. Games in -1 and -2 gamespeed do become dull over a period of time and they do not reflect the pace and change of pace of real football games. Do stick to zero gamespeed as the fixed parameter in whatever tweak you do. In here, you keep the gamespeed as zero and reduce the speed of the players.

                          Even with these edited top teams, if you play against the unedited smaller teams, top teams will still play like top teams and you can see it for yourself.

                          Please do try and let me know.
                          Will definitely try your suggestion mate.. Thanks. I never play zero speed cos the players animation look weird.. Cartoonished . it will be a lot of hassle to edit all the team but if the result is good.. It worth it. Cheers

                          Comment

                          • dmendenhall_9
                            Rookie
                            • Sep 2014
                            • 260

                            #43
                            Re: PES 2016 - Fluid formations, tactics, and more to achieve simulation gameplay!

                            Originally posted by BlueChampions
                            Folks. Signed up into this forum to post just this:

                            Have tried various tweaks for simulation gameplay and finally have concluded that this is the definitive tweak you'd ever need for a brilliant simulation in PES 2016.

                            Here's the deal: Take a couple of teams (say Chelsea and Man City). For each player, reduce the values for 'SPEED' and 'EXPLOSIVE POWER' by 10 points each (just TEN). Play a game with those teams. AI opponent fouls more than I do. Possession and shot stats are always right. Manual passing, manual shooting, zero gamespeed. Perfect gameplay.

                            Many PES players love playing lower league football and some even avoid games with top teams. That's primarily because playing with the top teams produce the worst gameplay because invariably all those players are in the 80s when it comes to speed and explosive power and this ruins the game. To slow the game down, most people use -1 and -2 gamespeed but that means losing out on the game's reflexes, responsiveness and the super smart gameplay nuances associated with this. Games in -1 and -2 gamespeed do become dull over a period of time and they do not reflect the pace and change of pace of real football games. Do stick to zero gamespeed as the fixed parameter in whatever tweak you do. In here, you keep the gamespeed as zero and reduce the speed of the players.

                            Even with these edited top teams, if you play against the unedited smaller teams, top teams will still play like top teams and you can see it for yourself.

                            Please do try and let me know.
                            I am def going to try and check this out. I never play with the lower leagues. For a more comprehensive overview of PES sim setting check out my other thread called PES 2016 sim settings and feel free to comment in there.
                            Twitter - mendy_9
                            PSN - dmendenhall_9
                            Twitch - dmendenhall_9

                            Comment

                            • BlueChampions
                              Rookie
                              • Oct 2015
                              • 10

                              #44
                              Re: PES 2016 - Fluid formations, tactics, and more to achieve simulation gameplay!

                              Originally posted by dmendenhall_9
                              I am def going to try and check this out. I never play with the lower leagues. For a more comprehensive overview of PES sim setting check out my other thread called PES 2016 sim settings and feel free to comment in there.
                              Thanks mate. Looking forward to your views. Cheers.

                              Comment

                              • BlueChampions
                                Rookie
                                • Oct 2015
                                • 10

                                #45
                                Re: PES 2016 - Fluid formations, tactics, and more to achieve simulation gameplay!

                                Check this YouTube where I play as Dortmund vs PSG (AI). Manual passing. Manual shooting. Zero gamespeed. Values for 'speed' and 'explosive power' reduced by 10 points for all players.



                                Let me know your views. Cheers.
                                Last edited by BlueChampions; 10-11-2015, 02:31 AM.

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