"Sweeper" vs. Slider vs. Sweeping Curveball

[Ghost Of The Year]

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The last few years have seen more and more pitchers start throwing a new version of the Slider, a ''Sweeper''. It's typically thrown slower than a regular Slider, resulting in much more horizontal break. So in game, is this new ''Sweeper'' more akin to the Sweeping Curveball, or is it still closer to the regular Slider? Is it time for Sony to add this new pitch to the mix, or does the regular Slider and/or Sweeping Curveball replicate the ''Sweeper'' well enough?

[CBoller1331]

Re: "Sweeper" vs. Slider vs. Sweeping Curveball

The last few years have seen more and more pitchers start throwing a new version of the Slider, a ''Sweeper''. It's typically thrown slower than a regular Slider, resulting in much more horizontal break. So in game, is this new ''Sweeper'' more akin to the Sweeping Curveball, or is it still closer to the regular Slider? Is it time for Sony to add this new pitch to the mix, or does the regular Slider and/or Sweeping Curveball replicate the ''Sweeper'' well enough?

I think the regular Slider replicates this pitch best, as it already moves pretty strictly horizontally. Maybe the "Slurve" could be a good replacement if you prefer to differentiate it from a traditional slider. I think the Max break on a Slurve is bigger than the max break on the Slider in the game.

The Sweeping Curve in the game is a bit too "loopy" and has too much downward break to replicate the Sweeper IRL

[IndianSummer]

Re: "Sweeper" vs. Slider vs. Sweeping Curveball

I haven’t really looked into this but in real life arm slot position has an impact on how the pitch reacts as far as horizontal break or more of a downward break.
Sidearm pitch is more horizontal and an overhead pitch will be more downward.

[The Gamer]

Re: "Sweeper" vs. Slider vs. Sweeping Curveball

Great topic

Sent from my SM-S918U using Tapatalk

[Ghost Of The Year]

Re: "Sweeper" vs. Slider vs. Sweeping Curveball

The Sweeping Curve in the game is a bit too "loopy" and has too much downward break to replicate the Sweeper IRL

Thank-you CB, I think this boils it down perfectly to what I wanted to know. Looking at it in game, I can see that now. Thanks again.

[0blong00]

Re: "Sweeper" vs. Slider vs. Sweeping Curveball

I think the slurve is the closest. I say this because there was veteran pitcher last year (sorry I can’t remember who it was) whose pitch was being identified as a sweeper but he insisted it was a slurve. Also I find the slurve to be the hardest pitch to handle in the game. For whatever that’s worth.

[Ghost Of The Year]

Re: "Sweeper" vs. Slider vs. Sweeping Curveball

I think the slurve is the closest. I say this because there was veteran pitcher last year (sorry I can’t remember who it was) whose pitch was being identified as a sweeper but he insisted it was a slurve. Also I find the slurve to be the hardest pitch to handle in the game. For whatever that’s worth.

That sounds like probably ex-Met Zack Wheeler.

I see some pitchers throwing both a traditional a slider in addition to the exaggerated sweeper slider. It's a shame you can't give a pitcher two of the same pitch, with very different speeds and break. It looks like any changes I'll make will be using the slurve as a sweeper, and leave a pitchers slider as is.

[0blong00]

Re: "Sweeper" vs. Slider vs. Sweeping Curveball

That sounds like probably ex-Met Zack Wheeler.

I see some pitchers throwing both a traditional a slider in addition to the exaggerated sweeper slider. It's a shame you can't give a pitcher two of the same pitch, with very different speeds and break. It looks like any changes I'll make will be using the slurve as a sweeper, and leave a pitchers slider as is.

Very well could be. I really can’t remember what game was watching last year where they were talking about this.

[InASimulation]

Re: "Sweeper" vs. Slider vs. Sweeping Curveball

Here’s my take:

I’ll check baseball savant, brooksbaseball, and baseball prospectus’s pitchfx leaderboards.

If brooksbaseball says their slider “sweeps across the zone” then slurve.
If it says their slider is anything else then slider.
If it says their curve has “sweeping glove-side movement” then sweeping curve.

Do the same thing for the other pitches.
Curveballs with “primarily 12-6 movement” = 12-6
Check baseball savant & baseball prospectus for curveball vs. knuckle-curve.
Sinkers with “heavy sinking action” = sinker.
All other sinkers = 2 seam.
Sinkers with “virtually no sinking action reminiscent of a true sinker” = running fastball.
4 seamers with “slight arm side run” or greater = running fastball.
All other 4 seamers = 4 seam.
Changeups with “slight cut action” or greater = changeups.
All other changeups = circle-change.
Splitters with “slight cut action” or greater = splitter.
All other splitters = forkball.
Screwballs and knuckleballs and cutters are just screwballs and knuckleballs and cutters.
There really aren’t any palmballs and like only 2 vulcan changes, (Ian Kennedy, who retired, and Levi Stoudt for the Reds. )

Some of the pitches I go with are:
Jhoan Duran’s splinker: Sinker, forkballs don’t have enough movement in this game.
Dauri Moreta’s slider: Screwball, it breaks the opposite way of a normal slider.
Joey Lucchesi’s churve: Changeup

Also have Zack Wheeler throw a slider and a slurve.

Could talk pitches for days.

[InASimulation]

Re: "Sweeper" vs. Slider vs. Sweeping Curveball

I haven’t really looked into this but in real life arm slot position has an impact on how the pitch reacts as far as horizontal break or more of a downward break.
Sidearm pitch is more horizontal and an overhead pitch will be more downward.

Arm slot works in the game too.
Changing a pitchers motion will drastically affect how their pitches move regardless of ratings.
Plus, pitchers will locate those same pitches w/ the same ratings differently.

[HeadCoach2.0]

Re: "Sweeper" vs. Slider vs. Sweeping Curveball

Here’s my take:

I’ll check baseball savant, brooksbaseball, and baseball prospectus’s pitchfx leaderboards.

If brooksbaseball says their slide “sweeps across the zone” then slurve.
If it says their slider is anything else then slider.
If it says their curve has “sweeping glove-side movement” then sweeping curve.

Do the same thing for the other pitches.
Curveballs with “primarily 12-6 movement” = 12-6
Check baseball savant & baseball prospectus for curveball vs. knuckle-curve.
Sinkers with “heavy sinking action” = sinker.
All other sinkers = 2 seam.
Sinkers with “virtually no sinking action reminiscent of a true sinker” = running fastball.
4 seamers with “slight arm side run” or greater = running fastball.
All other 4 seamers = 4 seam.
Changeups with “slight cut action” or greater = changeups.
All other changeups = circle-change.
Splitters with “slight cut action” or greater = splitter.
All other splitters = forkball.
Screwballs and knuckleballs and cutters are just screwballs and knuckleballs and cutters.
There really aren’t any palmballs and like only 2 vulcan changes, (Ian Kennedy, who retired, and Levi Stoudt for the Reds. )

Some of the pitches I go with are:
Jhoan Duran’s splinker: Sinker, forkballs don’t have enough movement in this game.
Dauri Moreta’s slider: Screwball, it breaks the opposite way of a normal slider.
Joey Lucchesi’s churve: Changeup

Also have Zack Wheeler throw a slider and a slurve.

Could talk pitches for days.

So a 2 seamer is just a sinker that doesn't sink as much?

Real talk.

[InASimulation]

Re: "Sweeper" vs. Slider vs. Sweeping Curveball

Yup, less sink more run.

[Ghost Of The Year]

Re: "Sweeper" vs. Slider vs. Sweeping Curveball

I’ll check baseball savant, brooksbaseball, and baseball prospectus’s pitchfx leaderboards.

If brooksbaseball says their slide “sweeps across the zone” then slurve.
If it says their slider is anything else then slider.
If it says their curve has “sweeping glove-side movement” then sweeping curve.

Do the same thing for the other pitches.
Curveballs with “primarily 12-6 movement” = 12-6
Check baseball savant & baseball prospectus for curveball vs. knuckle-curve.
Sinkers with “heavy sinking action” = sinker.
All other sinkers = 2 seam.
Sinkers with “virtually no sinking action reminiscent of a true sinker” = running fastball.
4 seamers with “slight arm side run” or greater = running fastball.
All other 4 seamers = 4 seam.
Changeups with “slight cut action” or greater = changeups.
All other changeups = circle-change.
Splitters with “slight cut action” or greater = splitter.
All other splitters = forkball.
Screwballs and knuckleballs and cutters are just screwballs and knuckleballs and cutters.
There really aren’t any palmballs and like only 2 vulcan changes, (Ian Kennedy, who retired, and Levi Stoudt for the Reds. )

Man, that's good stuff. Thanks.

Also have Zack Wheeler throw a slider and a slurve.

I noticed somewhere at least a couple pitchers have two sliders in 23, I didn't check to see to see if one was supposed to represent a sweeper, but I do hope Sony has been working on making it possible for us to add two of one pitch for 24. Wheeler definitely needs a slider and a sweeper, even if the slurve has to represent the sweeper.

[InASimulation]

Re: "Sweeper" vs. Slider vs. Sweeping Curveball

Man, that's good stuff. Thanks.

I noticed somewhere at least a couple pitchers have two sliders in 23, I didn't check to see to see if one was supposed to represent a sweeper, but I do hope Sony has been working on making it possible for us to add two of one pitch for 24. Wheeler definitely needs a slider and a sweeper, even if the slurve has to represent the sweeper.

I saw a pitcher with 2 literally sliders early on, it was J.T. Ginn but they fixed that in an update.

Honestly I think SDS is right in theory, just not in practice.

The slurve sits 72-88 mph and mirrors the slider’s pinpoint motion.
While the sweeping curve sits 68-84 mph and mirrors the curve’s motion.
But on default/live rosters they call sweeping curves slurves and slurves sliders.

They basically programmed the sweeper in before people called it a ‘sweeper’ and said
“we’re going to make this a slider with tons of horizontal movement but only use it as a pitcher’s curveball even though the sweeping curve can do that job.”

Imo sliders are gyro sliders.
Whenever I face a slider that has like 99 break or something, it just feels off.

[Ghost Of The Year]

Re: "Sweeper" vs. Slider vs. Sweeping Curveball

4 seamers with “slight arm side run” or greater = running fastball.

There really aren’t any palmballs and like only 2 vulcan changes, (Ian Kennedy, who retired, and Levi Stoudt for the Reds. )

Could talk pitches for days.

Yeah, and if Sony isn't going to utilize the Vulcan and Palmball, they should replace it with the sweeper slider. Plus, they don't utilize the running fb either. That's three pitch slots going to waste. AND they need to figure out how to program a choice to throw a sixth pitch, and make reduce the minimum pitches in repertoire from three to two.