Test: Dribble Penetration

[Kushmir]

Quote: Originally Posted by RyanFitzmagic

Shouldn't it depend on the matchup? I don't think it's something universal where you can say "You can't bump someone to keep them from driving." I've seen players' first steps get cut off in one-on-one situations IRL, and IMO elite perimeter defenders can do it somewhat consistently.

Couldn't agree more. Single Outcomes are terrible for gaming....even casual fans know that--anytime users have a tactic where they can dictate the interaction will only have one outcome we like to call than an exploit. Its the bane of any H2H gaming environment.

This happened today while I was playing Charlotte. TJ cut Kemba off and after he drove into him he poked the ball away and it was loose for a moment. That's exactly the kind of gameplay i'm talking about:



One where you can't just take for granted you'll be able to trigger an "on the hip" animation and get 3 feet from the basket anytime you want. You'll actually have to see who's defending you/which way he's leaning and use some actual strategy...How is the one outcome thing even remotely fun?

[tjery14]

Quote: Originally Posted by Kushmir

While dribble penetration is a welcome addition to 2K18 and aids in how beautiful and free flowing the game is.....it has to be better balanced. Early H2H gameplay has shown that the balance aspect is lacking. This isn't calling out the devs...you never know about some issues with balance until millions of people get their hands on your game--many with the intention of breaking it. The issues with dribble penetration are as follows: 1) There's no emphasis on going AROUND or BY the defender by requiring the user point the stick off-center. Many guys are simply dribbling right into the defender and pressing turbo. 2) Charges are non-existent. This is probably the biggest issue....dribblers have no conscience attacking when over-aggression isn't punished...and in this case its rewarded, often with shooting and blocking fouls. 3) There aren't enough loose balls. Turboing into defenders should result in turnovers almost as a rule. VOILA! another chance to show off the loose ball system. 4) The dribble interactions aren't held to a hardcore standard. This sticks out when so many other areas of gameplay are...look at how contested/physical the paint is. The shot-meter demands you have skill, the improved passing? The list goes on and on. When the dribbler is forced to turn his back it should serve as gameplay "warning" players that no progress is being made...continuing to hit turbo or make contact after that should result in Losing the ball and Offensive Fouls. Look at how long it takes for Derozan to lose the ball here (Covington's on-ball defense IQ is 89) 5) The success rate is too high. There's almost no situation where the dribbler fails. They can collide with the defender until they get a favorable animation. After a few unsuccessful tries, Derozan simply walks Covington to the basket here: What should happen? Well in addition to losing the ball and turnovers, lets see more guys redirected off their intended path when they aren't successful, like happens here: Lastly, I took my Richaun Holmes my 76 rated backup center (speed with ball rating: 44) and simulated 20 instances where he drove the ball into a defense. I went right at the defender and pressed shoot when I was in position. He was stonewalled (forced to turn his back) on only three occasions. The others saw him drive easily on the defender and get into the lane...good position defense forced him to pull up twice and he was driven out of bounds two times. There are no fouls so we can only imagine how many times he would have gotten a whistle--but I can think we call can agree that success rate is HORRIBLE. See for yourself: NOTE: The end of the video got cut off--but trust me there were 20 of them.

Guy playing offball defense just waiting for cpu to defend for him complaining that cpu dont steal/take charge/cutoff every time when someone try to pass by his cpu defender.
Pathetic.
Try some onball this year, you will have many steals and cutoffs (if ur good).

[Kushmir]

Quote: Originally Posted by tjery14

Guy playing offball defense just waiting for cpu to defend for him complaining that cpu dont steal/take charge/cutoff every time when someone try to pass by his cpu defender. Pathetic. Try some onball this year, you will have many steals and cutoffs (if ur good).

😂😂😂😂 I play on-ball plenty....I've been at this for awhile, junior. The funniest part is you don't even know why its important to be super proficient guarding the two....how positively CUTE.

But know this: Not you or anyone else determines how I play. I told fatleg this a few days ago....ignore the clowns who think they know what "skill" is. As long as a person isnt manipulating the AI, no one need worry about how they compete on 2K.

Next month you guys will be all: 😭😭😭 " he didn't make his own subs or even set his own picks, he didn't grab his own rebounds either.....*sniff, sniff, sniff* he lets the CPU catch his lobs too." 😂 #belessdumbplease

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I527 using Operation Sports mobile app

[RyanFitzmagic]

Quote: Originally Posted by m29a

Stonewalling is still there, and it's good enough imo. You guys act as if it's gone.

I haven't seen it at all when using good ballhandlers, even with the CPU's defensive sliders up to 75.

[tjery14]

Kushmir - my point is that ur making a problem that really dont exist. There is no problem to cutoff guys who sprint run into paint all the time, there easily cutoff if u play onball. If u just switched on onball defender and press steal or just back off this guy would lose the ball running like this into you.
Ps. Sorry for my english

[tjery14]

But i must admit that some guys are so fuc*ing annoying just sprint running into the paint all 20 minutes, u cut them off, they pass to other permiter player and trying same thing all over again, easy to defend against this but its really cheap and such player should be banned from playing basketball. Like man, whats fun in tilting stick left/right and pressing R2 all fuc*in 20 minutes?

[JKSportsGamer1984]

Quote: Originally Posted by El_Poopador

Honestly I like where it is now. In most of the examples, it didn’t result in a score, but rather an ugly contested shot. I much prefer that to being stonewalled on 95% of drives. Online I can see maybe tweaking it, but I hope they don’t touch it for play against the CPU. This is the first time in years where it’s actually fun and rewarding to get a mismatch on the perimeter. Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

Couldn't agree more. Definitely don't want 2K making it like it was in 2K17 with the invisible walls, defenders warping back into position to impede your progress after being beat off the dribble, etc.. In 2K17 it was as if every perimeter defender was Kawhi Leonard & the on ball defense was too sticky. All that perimeter bumping is unrealistic because it would be called a foul 99% of the time in the NBA.

I like how they have it this year. You can actually drive the basketball which makes the game more fun in my opinion.

[JKSportsGamer1984]

Quote: Originally Posted by fakeassc

Please DO NOT change dribble penetration. Dribble penetration was a BIG issue in 2k17 that I wanted changed. You kept on being cut off by the CPU unreasonably. When the CPU got even an arm in front of you, and you dribbled into the arm (not the CPU's set defensive stance and body), you got blocked off. 2k18 has absolutely fine dribble penetration. There is NO need to change charges or reach-ins and ESPECIALLY no need to change the CPU's ability to cut you off. IF you want changes, just tweak up lateral quickness for the CPU. I find it very fair, as the CPU cuts me off as much as I cut them off. I disagree with this thread entirely. EDIT: Take a look at all the 2k17 slider threads. Most (if not all) the major reputable slider makers turned down body-up sensitivity for the purpose of increasing (i.e. promoting) dribble penetration because it was difficult to do in 2k17. Now that 2k18 has allowed us more dribble penetration, I am extremely thankful to 2k for that. Please do not change it when it has been an improvement on 2k17. I don't want to go back to the situation in 2k17 when the body-up sensitivity slider had to be at 0 to make the game enjoyable. 2k18 is making steps in the right direction, in my opinion, in terms of gameplay.

Completely agree!