5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

[JackSL97]

Let me preface this by saying 2k5 did some things much better than madden 05, namely the presentation...that Chris Berman half time show till this day is better than any half time show madden has ever done...BUT in the face of nostalgia people tend to romanticize nfl 2k5, overlooking its flaws and seeing at it as a product that it was never meant to be...

1) The Commentary- This is one area of the game that has consistently received praise throughout the years and im not too sure why- Dan Stevens and Pete O’Keefe were incredibly generic and repetitive and one could tell they had no real experience calling nfl games even without the knowledge they were fictional characters ie voice actors...bottom line they were simply a product of 2k not putting money into getting real nfl commentators and 2k did this early on with their nba series as well with Rod West and Bob Steele...the fact that 2k ported nearly all their lines from 2k5 to 2k8 is one of many aspects that showed how much effort 2k really put into Apf 2k8 (not very much at all)

2. The Barebones Franchise Mode- It wasn’t even a debate in 2004 which football game had the better franchise experience, madden ran away with that one very much like how 2k ran away with the presentation aspect of the game...Game Prep was extremely tedious and broken and player progression was broken as well with Larry Fitzgerald guaranteed to be a superstar no matter what...you couldn’t edit players in-season and the mode as a whole felt more or less like a traditional season mode rather than a franchise mode, the only thing 2k did better here was the Chris Berman weekly wrap-up show which bests anything madden has done in that department to this day

3) The Gameplay- In the context of 2004 football gaming, 2k5’s gameplay was rock-solid and its animations were smooth and natural-looking...however madden has surpassed 2k in many aspects in the gameplay department since then and people who still cite 2k5’s gameplay as the standard for gameplay in a football game are quite delusional and probably haven’t picked up a madden title in 15 years...even in the context of 2004, animations were very repetitive, you had little control over a WR or DB playing the ball, special teams was flat out broken as you rarely if ever could return a kick for a touchdown, there was no hitstick/equivalent to the hitstick which simulated real tackling much better than 2k’s button mashing component, etc...its cool to see people still finding value in a football game 18 years old but to say 2k5’s gameplay is better than modern-day madden’s is just absurd

4. The Crib- I’ve watched the 2k5 retrospective videos and seen people talk about The Crib as if it was some game-changing feature...unbeknownst to a lot of 2k5 players is the fact that the crib ALSO appeared in nba 2k5, as the mode was simply part of the 2k brand at the time much like the VIP viewer that also appeared in nba 2k games for years...the crib was a fun feature in hindsight but was a pure gimmick that would’ve inevitably been removed had the nfl 2k series continued on...it was removed from the nba series in 2k8

5. First Person Football- Another feature that gets high praise in the community...this was a great concept and 2k was ahead of their time with this one in light of the popularity of VR today but the actual execution of this mode left a lot to be desired...to put it simply playing FPF could be very headache-inducing...I could see the praise being justified if this was some early version of a myplayer/superstar mode but this was simply a gimmicky feature that would’ve been scrapped after 2k6 when 2k would’ve had to make their own version of a superstar mode for 2k7 in an alternate reality where competition existed beyond 2004...its quite interesting to think that the nba series could’ve gotten a myplayer mode 3 years earlier had this been the case...


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[tril]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

Gameplay, animations, and player movement are still better than Madden.

agree about first-person football and the crib. never deep-dived into these two modes.

The franchise mode is still solid. it provides enough depth and simplicity to keep me immersed in my virtual experience. I only used game prep for a few seasons then turned it off cause I find these types of features too time-consuming.


2k still holds up, because they provide the type of experience that I'm looking for on the field.
My statement is not an anti-EA comment because NCAA football 2006/11/14 still provides an authentic collegiate experience.

[convince]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

Lol, as far as number 4 and 5, neither was anything I cared about so whatever. But as the other three, you are crazy. I still believe the draft prep is better in 2k5 than anything you find in any sports game today. And while you may have a point in some aspects of gameplay when comparing to Madden today but in reality it should crush a 17 year old game and it does not. Again I couldn't disagree with you more with 1,2 and 3 but the other two I don't care that much. Also guys I'm going to get back into rosters building because I'm building a PC now.

[kjcheezhead]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

This post is acting as tho they are just releasing 2k5, an 18 year old game at this point.

That said out of the 5 you listed, Commentary is always bad. Madden has gone through a dozen different teams in this time frame and all of them get boring and repetitive.

NBA2k boasts one of the better franchise modes and nowadays Madden is by far the worst of the major sports titles. I don’t know what this game will offer for modes but I trust 2ks developers to deliver better than what madden released over the past 3 console generations.

Gameplay. In my opinion 2k8 has some of the best gameplay of any football title but this is not going to be a simulation. If you’re expecting a perfect representation of Sundays you’re in for disappointment but I still think 2ks games have offered much better player movement and physics than other sports games. Especially madden from the past 10 plus years.

The Crib. It was cool for its time but I don’t expect it to be back in the same form. If 2k goes the my city route from NBA2k that’ll be amazing in my opinion.

First person football was always a gimmick and I never liked it but vr games are a lot better than 2004 tech so if they bring it back I’ll check it out at least.


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[AUChase]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

The date is April 18 2022. I did not expect to find a thread criticizing a football game that came out a few months before my 9th grade year of HS.

[JackSL97]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

The date is April 18 2022. I did not expect to find a thread criticizing a football game that came out a few months before my 9th grade year of HS.

Well considering the sheer number of people in the community who still hold 2k5 as the standard for football gaming and refuse to believe modern day maddens could possibly be better than 2k in any way, I felt making this thread was necessary despite it being an 18 year old game


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[canes21]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

I don't think people necessarily refuse to believe Madden could be better. It simply could be that people don't enjoy modern Madden games and they enjoyed NFL 2k5 and they find it sad that is has been nearly 20 years since an NFL game came out that they really enjoyed.

If we are talking gameplay purely on the field, I still would take APF 2k8 over Madden 22 next gen every day of the week. The difference in AI alone makes it very hard for me to enjoy Madden consistently. Add in all of the other messy parts of the game and it isn't that surprising why so many people are not the biggest fans of Madden games.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

[tinpanalley]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

You can't talk about definitive objective terms like "overrated" and then give opinions. Well, you can, but you defy the objective analysis you're attempting to give.


The fact is this is all personal opinion.
1. ALL sports game commentary sucks. But that the 2K5 commentary is still listenable is extraordinary. And I would argue, it's precisely because they were actors. Their style may seem outdated to us now, but have you heard what younger commentators sound like today? They're awful. (...there's subjective for you).
2. I HATE franchise modes for over-complexity. So I love the simplistic nature of franchise in 2K5 where you can ignore everything and it doesn't matter because I only play one season. I hate games that interfere in my experience forcing me to do stupid fantasy things like talk to scouts. And I know LOTS of people like this.
3. The base fundamental AI and physics of 2K5 are miles above most Maddens of the last 10 years and I'll tell you what, I'm actually not delusional despite your diagnosis because it's my opinion which is actually even relatively provable. (Again, opinion... but my point is to prove your view that it is overrated wrong. And if I can do that, then even on a simplistic level it renders your assessment purely subjective.)
4. I don't know how old you were when the game came out, but nobody thought The Crib was anything more than a silly add-on used to cash in on what was a very very rampant and saturated celeb TV market at the time. I don't know who you've heard talk about it, but nobody I knew at the time or since then has given one ounce of thought to the mode. But, again, just to go back to your assessment of the game's overratedness: how can your opinion be a reason the game lacks validity as a highly rated game?
5. First person football was actually a throwback if you know gaming history a bit. Early-mid 90s particularly on PC had lots of polygon graphics titles and the assumption was the first person view in a 3D world was the future of gaming. Distinctive Gaming sort of pioneered this with 4D Boxing but several other sports games had some mode of putting you in a first person view, expanding on the view from PunchOut (the original arcade game, not the NES one). So by 2004, lots of games had played with this idea unsuccessfully and abandoned it as a legitimate way of playing. In 2K5 it was considered a bit of a fun, slightly silly feature. More of a fun experience, like instant replay was, of seeing things rendered in first person view and getting a different perspective on the field. Again, nobody I knew then or now thought of it as anything more than that. So, it wasn't actually ahead of its time at all, it was more of an acceptably quirky, out of date, throwback.

The only part where you're categorically 'wrong' -- and even there you're entitled to your opinion -- is in the thinking that the game was never intended as a "truer" simulation of NFL football. That's in fact what 2Ks whole drive was with their sports titles back then. EASports went for fun, easy to pick up, and also thorough representation of the facets of league management, but 2K went for physics and on-field reality. Be it in their MLB, NBA, or College titles, often at the expense of better graphics.

Anyway, of course my opinions are opinions and have nothing to do with anything. But I think you're getting the responses you're getting because, and only because, you literally say "this is why it's overrated" and then go on to state opinions about things you aren't fond of in the game. You even go as far as saying, 'and if you think I'm wrong you're basically nuts'. So, anyway. I would say, then don't play 2K5 or even waste your time talking about it. All you're gonna get is people annoyed that you don't like it which I would imagine isn't your goal.

[TarHeelPhenom]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

As a former EA fan boy, I can tell you that I wasn't fond of 2k5 when it first came out. It was a game that felt totally different to Madden 05 and as a fanboy I had that game on a short leash so to speak. I didn't come to appreciate that game until years later once, I broke away from being strictly EA. I will say this, 18 years later, I love 2k5 and Madden 05/07 equally and for different reasons:

1) I love Madden 05/07's Franchise Mode. I just do. I love that Owner Mode is tied to it. I love the Player Morale, the fact that players can hold out. I love that you can control 1 team or 32 teams if you choose to. I love that you can make 32 Created Teams/Rosters/Stadiums/Uniforms and import all 32 into a Franchise Mode and have a fictional league if you want to. I love the things that people call "fluff" like the Tony Bruno Show and the Local and National Newspapers simply because they were in there. I loved the Position battles, Player Roles and the Gameplay was good for it's time. To me Madden 05-07 had the deepest Franchise Modes ever in football games.

I love 2k5 because the overall package felt more like authentic NFL football. I loved the challenge system. You could challenge anything and the AI would too...and you could see valid evidence in the replay. Here is only one example of what I mean...

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/xEyTVmwUjF0" title="YouTube video player" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

In that play the AI challenged whether the player stepped out of bounds on the interception return. That's something that as of now, you never see in Madden. There are bang bang plays in football, and 2k5's challenging system was top notch. I loved/still love their ESPN presentation package. They used the ESPN license to the full. It wasn't just that Chris Berman did the halftime show. But, they used the real highlights from the game that was being played. It was the Chris Berman weekly wrap up show. It was Mel Kiper doing pre-draft and post draft analysis. It was Trey Wingo covering the offseason stuff. I loved the fact that 2k5 has what it appears that EA is about to implement in Madden 23..."Hit Everything"...if it is what I think it is then it's something that was in 2k football 18-20 years ago. You could hit a received well before the ball arrived if you wanted to and PI's would be called accordingly. If you wanted to hit a guy late out of bounds you could do it if you wanted to and unnecessary roughness was called accordingly. It took a while for me to get used to player movement on 2k5 because it was so different than Madden; but I came to appreciate it.


2) I will say that the Franchise Mode could have been better and I believe it would have if they would have continued to make the game past 2004. I loved the fact that Franchise Mode had Weekly Prep, but it was broken...either that or I have never been able to figure out how it properly works. The Sim stats were wacky. If you set simulation minutes to 15 min. quarters, at the end of the season you would have the leading rusher rushing for 5,000 yards, the leading pass catcher at 3,000 and the leading QB passing for like 9,000 yards in a season. Also, the amount of customization in game was limited.

Thankfully, for both games, we had people in the communities here and at Football Idiots who made editors for both so that both can still be enjoyed.

I'm kind of confused why the OP decided to make this thread though on an NFL 2k5 forum? Is it to lift up Madden at the expense of 2k5? That could be done on the Madden forum right? I'm willing to wager if a 2k5 post was made on the Madden forum it would get locked. I've also seen the OP post these same things on a different thread as well so...

[JackSL97]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

You can't talk about definitive objective terms like "overrated" and then give opinions. Well, you can, but you defy the objective analysis you're attempting to give.


The fact is this is all personal opinion.
1. ALL sports game commentary sucks. But that the 2K5 commentary is still listenable is extraordinary. And I would argue, it's precisely because they were actors. Their style may seem outdated to us now, but have you heard what younger commentators sound like today? They're awful. (...there's subjective for you).
2. I HATE franchise modes for over-complexity. So I love the simplistic nature of franchise in 2K5 where you can ignore everything and it doesn't matter because I only play one season. I hate games that interfere in my experience forcing me to do stupid fantasy things like talk to scouts. And I know LOTS of people like this.
3. The base fundamental AI and physics of 2K5 are miles above most Maddens of the last 10 years and I'll tell you what, I'm actually not delusional despite your diagnosis because it's my opinion which is actually even relatively provable. (Again, opinion... but my point is to prove your view that it is overrated wrong. And if I can do that, then even on a simplistic level it renders your assessment purely subjective.)
4. I don't know how old you were when the game came out, but nobody thought The Crib was anything more than a silly add-on used to cash in on what was a very very rampant and saturated celeb TV market at the time. I don't know who you've heard talk about it, but nobody I knew at the time or since then has given one ounce of thought to the mode. But, again, just to go back to your assessment of the game's overratedness: how can your opinion be a reason the game lacks validity as a highly rated game?
5. First person football was actually a throwback if you know gaming history a bit. Early-mid 90s particularly on PC had lots of polygon graphics titles and the assumption was the first person view in a 3D world was the future of gaming. Distinctive Gaming sort of pioneered this with 4D Boxing but several other sports games had some mode of putting you in a first person view, expanding on the view from PunchOut (the original arcade game, not the NES one). So by 2004, lots of games had played with this idea unsuccessfully and abandoned it as a legitimate way of playing. In 2K5 it was considered a bit of a fun, slightly silly feature. More of a fun experience, like instant replay was, of seeing things rendered in first person view and getting a different perspective on the field. Again, nobody I knew then or now thought of it as anything more than that. So, it wasn't actually ahead of its time at all, it was more of an acceptably quirky, out of date, throwback.

The only part where you're categorically 'wrong' -- and even there you're entitled to your opinion -- is in the thinking that the game was never intended as a "truer" simulation of NFL football. That's in fact what 2Ks whole drive was with their sports titles back then. EASports went for fun, easy to pick up, and also thorough representation of the facets of league management, but 2K went for physics and on-field reality. Be it in their MLB, NBA, or College titles, often at the expense of better graphics.

Anyway, of course my opinions are opinions and have nothing to do with anything. But I think you're getting the responses you're getting because, and only because, you literally say "this is why it's overrated" and then go on to state opinions about things you aren't fond of in the game. You even go as far as saying, 'and if you think I'm wrong you're basically nuts'. So, anyway. I would say, then don't play 2K5 or even waste your time talking about it. All you're gonna get is people annoyed that you don't like it which I would imagine isn't your goal.

1. Not true. Have you played nba 2k? nba 2k11 in particular with Kevin Harlan and Clark Kellogg was great and you felt like you were watching a real nba broadcast...Dan Stevens and Peter O’Keefe sounded like 2 guys who knew nothing about the sport of football and “You can’t coach that!” is one of the cheesiest lines i’ve heard in my life...2k5 and 2k8 commentary was generic as it gets...there’s a certain magic in listening to the nba 2k commentary and there’s a reason Kevin Harlan has been in the game for so many years...madden 05’s commentary with John Madden and Al Michaels was much more simulation for the mere fact they were real nfl commentators and despite the implementation not being the best it still gave you the gist of a real nfl broadcast

2. Well it sounds like Madden 13 Connected Careers would’ve been the ideal franchise experience for you then if you truly hate over-complexity in a franchise mode, but your argument here seems more like a biased defense of 2k5’s barebones franchise than an actual argument that madden would be better off if they did what 2k5 did with franchise

3. I still play 2k5 from time to time because I enjoy going back and playing old sports games for the fun factor and i’ve even watched videos of 2k5 resurrected and I can tell you the game on the field looks severely outdated and stuck in 2005...Apf 2k8 isn’t much better as its simply a more streamlined version of 2k5 and everyone here knows deep down 2k8 could’ve been so much better than it was had 2k put the resources they put into nba 2k in apf2k8

4. I’ve watched numerous 2k5 retrospective videos and The Crib always gets brought up as a cool feature that really added something to the game...at this point people should go back to nba 2k5 and crown that as the greatest nba video game of all time since it had the crib, the vip system as well as Espn licensing lol

5. Still another feature that gets brought up in every 2k5 discussion...like I said im still waiting for the espn nba 2k5 feature-by-feature dissection so we can officially name it “the greatest basketball game ever” lmao

I actually LIKE nfl 2k5 and its a fun game to go back to and play every once in a while but I can’t fathom how nearly 20 years later the game still gets compared to madden as if madden hasn’t surpassed it in nearly every facet despite madden being a perpetually underwhelming game...my theory on why nfl 2k5 has achieved immortal status is because
madden 06 was a huge f*ck up and really skewed peoples’ perspectives on the series as a whole, not only due to the games many shortcomings but because people were upset that EA had signed the exclusive license and these same people have held a bias against EA Sports ever since despite the NFL itself being the main perpetrator here


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[JackSL97]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

As a former EA fan boy, I can tell you that I wasn't fond of 2k5 when it first came out. It was a game that felt totally different to Madden 05 and as a fanboy I had that game on a short leash so to speak. I didn't come to appreciate that game until years later once, I broke away from being strictly EA. I will say this, 18 years later, I love 2k5 and Madden 05/07 equally and for different reasons:



1) I love Madden 05/07's Franchise Mode. I just do. I love that Owner Mode is tied to it. I love the Player Morale, the fact that players can hold out. I love that you can control 1 team or 32 teams if you choose to. I love that you can make 32 Created Teams/Rosters/Stadiums/Uniforms and import all 32 into a Franchise Mode and have a fictional league if you want to. I love the things that people call "fluff" like the Tony Bruno Show and the Local and National Newspapers simply because they were in there. I loved the Position battles, Player Roles and the Gameplay was good for it's time. To me Madden 05-07 had the deepest Franchise Modes ever in football games.



I love 2k5 because the overall package felt more like authentic NFL football. I loved the challenge system. You could challenge anything and the AI would too...and you could see valid evidence in the replay. Here is only one example of what I mean...



<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/xEyTVmwUjF0" title="YouTube video player" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>



In that play the AI challenged whether the player stepped out of bounds on the interception return. That's something that as of now, you never see in Madden. There are bang bang plays in football, and 2k5's challenging system was top notch. I loved/still love their ESPN presentation package. They used the ESPN license to the full. It wasn't just that Chris Berman did the halftime show. But, they used the real highlights from the game that was being played. It was the Chris Berman weekly wrap up show. It was Mel Kiper doing pre-draft and post draft analysis. It was Trey Wingo covering the offseason stuff. I loved the fact that 2k5 has what it appears that EA is about to implement in Madden 23..."Hit Everything"...if it is what I think it is then it's something that was in 2k football 18-20 years ago. You could hit a received well before the ball arrived if you wanted to and PI's would be called accordingly. If you wanted to hit a guy late out of bounds you could do it if you wanted to and unnecessary roughness was called accordingly. It took a while for me to get used to player movement on 2k5 because it was so different than Madden; but I came to appreciate it.





2) I will say that the Franchise Mode could have been better and I believe it would have if they would have continued to make the game past 2004. I loved the fact that Franchise Mode had Weekly Prep, but it was broken...either that or I have never been able to figure out how it properly works. The Sim stats were wacky. If you set simulation minutes to 15 min. quarters, at the end of the season you would have the leading rusher rushing for 5,000 yards, the leading pass catcher at 3,000 and the leading QB passing for like 9,000 yards in a season. Also, the amount of customization in game was limited.



Thankfully, for both games, we had people in the communities here and at Football Idiots who made editors for both so that both can still be enjoyed.



I'm kind of confused why the OP decided to make this thread though on an NFL 2k5 forum? Is it to lift up Madden at the expense of 2k5? That could be done on the Madden forum right? I'm willing to wager if a 2k5 post was made on the Madden forum it would get locked. I've also seen the OP post these same things on a different thread as well so...

well we can agree on certain things I could see...my point of making this thread and speaking out on 2k5 as a whole is to give a alternate perspective on the game with facts to back it up...2k5 was a very flawed but fun game and as you could see in the madden forum the madden vs 2k discussion is alive and well


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[testyourmight]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

You lost ALL credibility for saying Madden has better gameplay. Madden’s gameplay is horrible. Even real NFL players bash how bad it is.

[canes21]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

What facts have you used to back up your opinions?

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

[noplace]

Re: 5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

Definitely stepped out of bounds but those animations and physics.. ..... 😳

[JackSL97]

5 Overrated Aspects of NFL 2k5

You lost ALL credibility for saying Madden has better gameplay. Madden’s gameplay is horrible. Even real NFL players bash how bad it is.

Stay stuck in a delusional mindset, I could care less...Madden of course could be better gameplay-wise but 2k5 looks archaic in 2022


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports