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Originally Posted by TMagic |
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So, as the title suggests, do today's players have better talent collectively than in any years past?
I know that this may not be the popular opinion, but I would have to say yes.
I've been watching some old school bball lately (trying to get my bball fix. lol) and they are just not as impressive as the players that we have today, IMO.
I would venture to say that many of today's players would excel not even as far back as the 90's. And I'm not talking about the superstars. I'm talking about lesser players as well. Guys like T Parker, Deng, or even a JR Smith would be studs "back in the day" in my book.
One of the reasons I think the Bulls were so dominant is because their team had a very similar structure to a team you'd see today, with Jordan and Pippen being more skilled/athletic than any other players and being on the wing. Then you have Rodman as the hustler/defender. Kukoc the euro player (dribbling, shooting as a big man) and coming off the bench. Etc...
Players today are just more well rounded than in the past. Plus they are more athletic. Watching the older games, I don't see players with the same dribbling ability that players possess today. And rarely did I ever see a guy break a guy down to get into the paint solely utilizing a combination of handles and quickness. From what I've been watching, players looked a lot easier to defend. A few exceptions I would say are Jordan, Penny, Grant, and to a lesser extent, Pippen (I'm sure there are a few others. These are the guys that stand out at the top of my head). Today we see a myriad of players in the league that can pull off a lot of what we've seen these guys do back then. Essentially every team has guys that can take a guy off the dribble and finish with athleticism and creativity at the rim.
Today the smallest players on the floor (PGs) possess strength, leaping ability, quickness, and speed unlike any in history. Just think of guys like Wall, Westbrook, Rose, Lawson, etc. On top of that their handles are superior to any player that has come before them.
The one glaring hole is the big men. But I don't know whether that is because the dramatic evolution of PG and Wing play that has far exceeded that of the big men. One could say that leaves less opportunities for big men because perimeter players have just gotten that much better.
Or it could be a result of the style of play from then up until now. Back then there was A LOT more inside/out basketball being played. Most teams tried to dump the ball inside the paint. The game (mostly speaking of the late 80's, 90's) consisted of mostly post ups and isolations. This would make big men more valuable than they are today and would result in more opportunities for them on offense.
Or maybe it's simply that they just aren't as good. lol...I myself don't believe that to be the case, as I think there are several guys that you can place into the past and see them be every bit as good, if not better than they are now.
This reminds me of a time before when someone was trying to argue that Oscar was better than Kobe. Kobe would have had a field day in Oscars time. lol
All in all, I think that the league today as a better pool of talent than in the past. But that's just my own opinion. And I'm really interested on hearing what everyone else thinks.
Thoughts...?
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You've been duped. The lack of hand-checking today is a god-send for perimeter players. No longer is there any need to turn their backs on the offense or to protect their dribble. Its easier to get into the paint than ever with the outlawing of cut-banging and hip-riding.
This is what the bean counters want though. A finesse pin-ball game where acrobatic layups, power dunks, and fancy dribbles rule the day.
Tony Parker is a speed guard but he would be severely hindered by the violent hands-on game of long ago. Luol Deng is too erratic to ever be a "stud". J.R. Smith is too immature and myopic.
The Bulls were an incredible team because their parts fit together so cohesively. Ron Harper was brilliant, he knew all the angles and saw everything on the court. His defense was exceptional and he could guard points, shooting guards and small forwards. He was a big reason why the Bulls could play their quick switching perimeter defense.
Michael Jordan could do everything, and do it at the highest level. Scottie Pippen was an exceptional team defender, a runner, and a whip-it passer.
Dennis Rodman was an incredible defender and rebounder. Credit Rodman with turning the opponents glass into a volleyball game.
Luc Longley gets forgotten but he was an integral player. At 320 lbs he was a can't miss post target (couldn't move him off his spot) which allowed the Bulls to dump entry passes in and play off the Big Australian. Consequently, the defense was bent completely out of shape.
And the bench was strong, Toni Kukoc was 6'10 with a guard-like handle. Steve Kerr was a drop-dead shooter. Bill Wennington was 7 feet, and automatic from mid range. Phil Jackson was the coach, a courageous and disciplined man committed to a philosophy. This team was the perfect storm of players, coach, and strategy.
Players today are not more well-rounded. How many have an appetite for doing anything off the ball (90% of the game)? Boxing out? Screening? Footwork? Ball reversals? Focus? These areas are lacking.
When watching an 'older' game, take your eyes off the ball and watch whats happening on the weak side. There is alot more action. Solid screens, determined cuts, ect. That is where the game is won and lost.
The presense of hand-checking necessitates that the ball handler be more careful with their dribble. The league wants to see the fancy dribbles and the guards dominate though. Supposedly, its more 'fun'. Anyhow, if today's powder-puff defense were played in the 60s, 70s, 80s, and early 90s the guards would be flashing the ball like a yo-yo.
Every team has players that can finish with creativity at the rim? Thats blasphemous. The hardest players to defend are guys who are active off the ball and are unpredictable in where they receive the ball.
For what its worth, Penny Hardaway and Grant Hill were just one on one scorers. Similarly, they were both soft as warm brie.
Wall, Westbrook, Rose, and Lawson are erratic jump shooters that play zero defense. All four are guilty of overhandling, overpenetrating, and making numerous mistakes in a crowd. Oh, but they can flash the ball like a coin and convert acrobatic layups. The game is more than that.
The glaring hole is big men. Why? Because the powers that be don't want to see bigs ruining their highlight a minute pin-ball game. The zone defenses also drastically reduce the bigs area to work. Once again, the league thinks power basketball is 'boring'. The result is bull**** basketball all over the league.
Perimeter players haven't truly gotten better. The rules have been peverted. And did I mention the balls they use today are mushy oranges that constantly plop/swish through the net?
For me, Oscar was slightly better than Kobe. Why? Much stronger and consistently played all out defense. Rough-house defenders give Kobe serious trouble, not so for Oscar. Both wonderful players though.
The talent pool today is diluted and the players sloppy/lazy. I fear this situation will only get worse.