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Originally Posted by BezO |
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Not cutting it. All the interaction is stationary... patty cake until someone wins. It seems the exception is that the user can steer blockers, but that's not enough.
Watch some Youtube clips. Look at all the engaged players flow towards outside runs. Despite being engaged, defenders can still do their job... maintain outside leverage, contain, fill gaps, etc.
I won't go list all the areas that are affected. Point is that one of the biggest problems on defense, regarding animations & AI, is that engaged players have no mobility. It kills the spacing & timing of the game. Too easy to run outside. Too easy to scramble outside. Too easy to step into the pocket (if you needed to). Everything is based on disengaging. Even the defensive moves, you have to engage 1st, when a pass rusher's goal is to NOT engage.
Because all of this is missing, they have to balance the game with band-aids. It has to be easier to disengage because you can't do your job unless you do. We have to hot route contain assignments. Because DBs can't ride gunners, punt returns are nerfed. So on & so on.
There are missing fundamentals of football that only a few here talk about. They are not being addressed. So where you see the game improving, I see the foundation of the problems being ignored.
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I wish I could frame this post and hang it on the "OS Wall"
I remember when Emmdot was asking what we wanted out of line play right before M13 released. Much of what people were citing was the "binary" nature of engagement in madden. This is why everyone always compares it to All Pro football. In Madden, everything is described as a win or a loss. I guess you could call it tertiary since they do have a "SUPER win". However, this is not realistic at all. Even in M25 on Next Gen, you will not see the pocket collapse. Feeling pressure in the pocket does not happen because you are either clobbered by a lineman who has disengaged, or you have all day to throw it. If you play against the computer there will be times were you will actually see a 10 second pocket if you are not controller a D Lineman. This happens when there is no concept of pushing it or, more aptly as Bezo put it, lineman still doing their job while engaged. When you get sacked in Madden, SOMETIMES you will see a decent edge rush where a DE will beat the tackle, but it looks silly. First off, the DE never gets down to a proper rush angle. He will run perfectly up right in a silly looking arc. Secondly, the tackle barely moves and once he is beat, he stays in his hunched over position with his hands up. Most of the time, you see a DT just beat his man and the G or C just gives up and he runs through untouched to clobber the QB. It's certainly miles better than what we had last gen, but it is still far below the standard we had years ago.
Same thing goes for linebacker play. This is why everyone complains about madden when it moves. You can't fix this game until you get how the players interact done right. None of it looks organic or natural because it isn't. This is also why I have zero confidence in "WR/DB" interaction being fixed. You can't fix it or add it until you have fixed how ALL players in the game interact. And don't tell me it can't be done, you can look on youtube and find thousands of hours of footage of how it can be done nearly flawlessly without a real time physics engine on inferior hardware.