Rory McIlroy PGA TOUR Trailer - Golf Without Limits

[Chairman7w]

Re: Rory McIlroy PGA TOUR Trailer - Golf Without Limits

Yeah, let's call it what it is guys, that stuff was just stupid.

Very disappointed.

... But then seeing bright lights at night, someone in a military uniform, the massive ship, and granny swinging her golf clubs, I was like forget this. No way.

[brandon27]

Re: Rory McIlroy PGA TOUR Trailer - Golf Without Limits

I guess I would be considered one of the casuals seeing as I have no real interest in golf whatsoever. You know what caught my attention. The magnificent, extremely realistic lighting and the golf ball dropping in the water. Graphically it looks very nice, very enticing.

... But then seeing bright lights at night, someone in a military uniform, the massive ship, and granny swinging her golf clubs, I was like forget this. No way.

Yeah, let's call it what it is guys, that stuff was just stupid.

Very disappointed.

It might be stupid, sure. However, you can't make a business decision based on what you, personally think is stupid though. You have to cater to your customers. All of them. Especially when selling in a niche market, when putting out all of the expense you are in licensing authentic courses, golfers, brands/clothing/apparel and equipment. I'm not sure where the disappointment comes from? Because it's in the game? OK, don't play that portion. Problem solved? Should be.


So, the night golf with lights doesn't appeal to you. OK. Great. Don't play the mode. That's the point they're trying to make here with the "Golf without Limits" and "Play your way" catch lines in their videos. You want to play PGA golf. Go for it! You want to play fantasy golf, at night? Go for it! You have the option. That's the important part of all of this.


To actually make money selling this game, with the overhead going into it, you've got to expand your reach when it comes to your client base. Appeal to as many as you can. I have no problem with it. I likely will play the fantasy courses under regular golfing conditions. Likely never touch the night, glow junk, and it won't bother me one bit.


Of course, that's all assuming the game plays well and I enjoy it.

[DivotMaker]

Re: Rory McIlroy PGA TOUR Trailer - Golf Without Limits

Yeah, let's call it what it is guys, that stuff was just stupid.

Very disappointed.

To you, me and other Simulation purists, yes. To the casual arcade crowd, maybe not.....

[DivotMaker]

Re: Rory McIlroy PGA TOUR Trailer - Golf Without Limits

It might be stupid, sure. However, you can't make a business decision based on what you, personally think is stupid though. You have to cater to your customers. All of them. Especially when selling in a niche market, when putting out all of the expense you are in licensing authentic courses, golfers, brands/clothing/apparel and equipment. I'm not sure where the disappointment comes from? Because it's in the game? OK, don't play that portion. Problem solved? Should be.


So, the night golf with lights doesn't appeal to you. OK. Great. Don't play the mode. That's the point they're trying to make here with the "Golf without Limits" and "Play your way" catch lines in their videos. You want to play PGA golf. Go for it! You want to play fantasy golf, at night? Go for it! You have the option. That's the important part of all of this.


To actually make money selling this game, with the overhead going into it, you've got to expand your reach when it comes to your client base. Appeal to as many as you can. I have no problem with it. I likely will play the fantasy courses under regular golfing conditions. Likely never touch the night, glow junk, and it won't bother me one bit.


Of course, that's all assuming the game plays well and I enjoy it.

Spot on Brandon....

[strawberryshortcake]

Re: Rory McIlroy PGA TOUR Trailer - Golf Without Limits

It might be stupid, sure. However, you can't make a business decision based on what you, personally think is stupid though. You have to cater to your customers. All of them. Especially when selling in a niche market, when putting out all of the expense you are in licensing authentic courses, golfers, brands/clothing/apparel and equipment. I'm not sure where the disappointment comes from? Because it's in the game? OK, don't play that portion. Problem solved? Should be.


So, the night golf with lights doesn't appeal to you. OK. Great. Don't play the mode. That's the point they're trying to make here with the "Golf without Limits" and "Play your way" catch lines in their videos. You want to play PGA golf. Go for it! You want to play fantasy golf, at night? Go for it! You have the option. That's the important part of all of this.


To actually make money selling this game, with the overhead going into it, you've got to expand your reach when it comes to your client base. Appeal to as many as you can. I have no problem with it. I likely will play the fantasy courses under regular golfing conditions. Likely never touch the night, glow junk, and it won't bother me one bit.


Of course, that's all assuming the game plays well and I enjoy it.

I hear you. Options is definitely always a good thing.

Someone mentioned "casual" in a previous post. I was just throwing it out there (using me as an example) that not all casuals are looking for arcade elements in their video games. A certain percentage of people (not you specifically, but just in general) like to possibly make the assumption that "casual" gamers mean arcade gamers, first person shooters, etc.

I am probably even more casual than your average casual gamer if you can even call me that. Maybe I am a complete outlier.

I bought my PS4 on launch with NBA2k14 and eventually MLBtheShow14. Played NBA2k14 for a couple or days or so. Turned off my PS4. Several months later, picked up MLB14 and played it for about 1 to 2 weeks. Turned off my PS4. The PS4 was in hibernation until a couple days ago, NBA2k14 once again. I don't regret my PS4 purchase at all; it does provide enjoyment.

For whatever reason, I have this feeling that any time a developer chooses to implement any type of "arcade" mode to their game, there's a possibility it may seep through to the other more realistic modes. There may be absolute no correlation between their arcade vs simulation modes, but that's just how I see things. It feels tainted. If the game replicates the simulation well, I may be able to overlook the arcade mode, never touch, or humor myself and give it go just for the sake of it.

Such a realistic pretty looking game, and they just had to throw in the arcade option ... that's all.

EA can choose as they please. I can also choose as I please. (NBA2k15 didn't include a legitimate halftime show and I chose not to buy it. If NBA2k16 also does not include a legitimate halftime show, I will most likely completely bypass it again.)

[brandon27]

Re: Rory McIlroy PGA TOUR Trailer - Golf Without Limits

Spot on Brandon....

Ha, thanks. I hate talking about it from a business standpoint, but I think we all have to remember video games are a business. Big business actually. It's not just something simply made for our own pleasure how we see fit.


I actually applaud EA for doing what they've done here. Assuming I have the option to play the game in a PGA mode, and in an Arcade mode. Which it sounds like I do. As long as they don't force me to play the side of the game I'm not interested in. I'm happy.


Similar to Madden/NHL/Fifa.. I HATE the Ultimate team modes. I hate that they waste time with them. I understand why they are there, and that people do like them. I'm not forced to play it, only see it on the menu as an option, so I don't care.


I just think sometimes we all need to take a step back and look at these games for what they are. It's not just 100% about yours, or my individual pleasure with it. We're not entitled to that. It's a game made to appeal to as many people as possible. It's impossible to make everyone happy. All I hope, is I have to option to avoid the ugly side of the game, because I've always enjoyed playing the EA Golf series for what it is... a round of video game golf.

[DivotMaker]

Re: Rory McIlroy PGA TOUR Trailer - Golf Without Limits

I hear you. Options is definitely always a good thing.

Someone mentioned "casual" in a previous post. I was just throwing it out there (using me as an example) that not all casuals are looking for arcade elements in their video games. A certain percentage of people (not you specifically, but just in general) like to possibly make the assumption that "casual" gamers mean arcade gamers, first person shooters, etc.

I am probably even more casual than your average casual gamer if you can even call me that. Maybe I am a complete outlier.

I bought my PS4 on launch with NBA2k14 and eventually MLBtheShow14. Played NBA2k14 for a couple or days or so. Turned off my PS4. Several months later, picked up MLB14 and played it for about 1 to 2 weeks. Turned off my PS4. The PS4 was in hibernation until a couple days ago, NBA2k14 once again. I don't regret my PS4 purchase at all; it does provide enjoyment.

For whatever reason, I have this feeling that any time a developer chooses to implement any type of "arcade" mode to their game, there's a possibility it may seep through to the other more realistic modes. There may be absolute no correlation between their arcade vs simulation modes, but that's just how I see things. It feels tainted. If the game replicates the simulation well, I may be able to overlook the arcade mode, never touch, or humor myself and give it go just for the sake of it.

Such a realistic pretty looking game, and they just had to throw in the arcade option ... that's all.

EA can choose as they please. I can also choose as I please. (NBA2k15 didn't include a legitimate halftime show and I chose not to buy it. If NBA2k16 also does not include a legitimate halftime show, I will most likely completely bypass it again.)

I hear you. I expect that RM will have a clear distinction between pure arcade and simulating modes and anything in between like TW14 had. We are all waiting to get our hands on it to see how true to the PGA TOURNAMENTS it plays in Tour mode or will we have to go to Custom mode to dial in the difficulty that each of us are looking for. That is one of their tag lines for this game....play it your way....

[MrSkagTrendy]

Re: Rory McIlroy PGA TOUR Trailer - Golf Without Limits

Anyone know if this title has GameFace featured in it? I'm trying to live my dream here! Would be great to see myself finally getting good at golf!

[Chairman7w]

Re: Rory McIlroy PGA TOUR Trailer - Golf Without Limits

Very true, can't argue with that at all, good post.

My problem with it is that I think of the development time and money that went into that crap (a battleship crashing? Really?) and I think of the real courses that could have taken up that time instead. If they didn't take the time to make space golf (or whatever's going on there) they could have added a dozen more real courses, and golfers.

But I understand that doesn't change your point, they have to try and appeal to the widest possible audience. But the selfish side of me hates it.

Sigh... Oh well, first world problems, right?

It might be stupid, sure. However, you can't make a business decision based on what you, personally think is stupid though. You have to cater to your customers. All of them. Especially when selling in a niche market, when putting out all of the expense you are in licensing authentic courses, golfers, brands/clothing/apparel and equipment. I'm not sure where the disappointment comes from? Because it's in the game? OK, don't play that portion. Problem solved? Should be.


So, the night golf with lights doesn't appeal to you. OK. Great. Don't play the mode. That's the point they're trying to make here with the "Golf without Limits" and "Play your way" catch lines in their videos. You want to play PGA golf. Go for it! You want to play fantasy golf, at night? Go for it! You have the option. That's the important part of all of this.


To actually make money selling this game, with the overhead going into it, you've got to expand your reach when it comes to your client base. Appeal to as many as you can. I have no problem with it. I likely will play the fantasy courses under regular golfing conditions. Likely never touch the night, glow junk, and it won't bother me one bit.


Of course, that's all assuming the game plays well and I enjoy it.

[pietasterp]

Re: Rory McIlroy PGA TOUR Trailer - Golf Without Limits

Ha, thanks. I hate talking about it from a business standpoint, but I think we all have to remember video games are a business. Big business actually. It's not just something simply made for our own pleasure how we see fit.

The thing is, I'm not sure that 'conventional business wisdom' is accurate here. Theoretically you're correct: the focus-group tested mentality and "appeal to everyone" approach should, in theory, attract the broadest swath of consumers.

However, it's not clear to me that the actual data bears that out. The 2 biggest (by far and away) selling sports titles are essentially "sim" titles: Madden and NBA2K (no jokes about Madden not being sim...take that to the other forum ). Even for what's rapidly becoming more of a 'niche' sport, MLB the Show does phenomenally well on a single platform. In fact, I can think of vanishingly few examples (in sports gaming, anyway) where the "appeal to everyone" approach works particularly well.

The golf market may be smaller now (even that's not clear to me, given that the overall pie of gamers is much much larger now than it was in the heydey of golf games in the 90's), but that doesn't automatically mean 'appealing to a broader demographic' (if that's even possible) is the proper solution. Presumably, at least as many 'hardcore' golf fans will be turned off by the dilution of the product as non-golf fans will be turned on. If it were as simple as that, why isn't there a successful arcade NFL or NBA style game on the market (or, why aren't NBA-Jam style gameplay modes incorporated into NBA2K)?

TL;DR: I'm not saying you are wrong, but until/unless the actual data bears out that this "appeal to everyone" approach results in an appreciable difference in profitability for the franchise (although compared to what baseline is up for debate), you can't simply state that this approach is correct. We'll see. But in my experience, "appeal to everyone" = "appeal to no one".

[ManiacMatt1782]

Except you are limited to under 15 courses and only 8 real ones. Inexcuseable for a 60 dollar release from a major publisher. I just don't see how consumers are expected to pay 60 dollars for this. The value is simply not there.

[ImTellinTim]

Re: Rory McIlroy PGA TOUR Trailer - Golf Without Limits

Except you are limited to under 15 courses and only 8 real ones. Inexcuseable for a 60 dollar release from a major publisher. I just don't see how consumers are expected to pay 60 dollars for this. The value is simply not there.

And this is why it's important to pay attention to what the move to this not being a yearly title entails when making a decision on the value of the game.

If they have some kind of subscription after the new, free stuff they are promising to get new courses, you could be right. If they up the number of courses to a good level for free, it could be worth it in the end. Unfortunately, I think this means that a price drop won't be coming any time soon. Might have to make that $60 decision before we have all the info.

[DivotMaker]

Re: Rory McIlroy PGA TOUR Trailer - Golf Without Limits

Very true, can't argue with that at all, good post.

My problem with it is that I think of the development time and money that went into that crap (a battleship crashing? Really?) and I think of the real courses that could have taken up that time instead. If they didn't take the time to make space golf (or whatever's going on there) they could have added a dozen more real courses, and golfers.

But I understand that doesn't change your point, they have to try and appeal to the widest possible audience. But the selfish side of me hates it.

Sigh... Oh well, first world problems, right?

The people who developed those arcade modes are not course artists. RM does not have an unlimited Dev budget the likes of which you see with CoD, Madden, FIFA, etc. I can promise you, they had all hands on deck for this and I think they may surprise us with the DLC content that is available at or shortly after launch, both free and paid.

[brandon27]

Re: Rory McIlroy PGA TOUR Trailer - Golf Without Limits

Very true, can't argue with that at all, good post.

My problem with it is that I think of the development time and money that went into that crap (a battleship crashing? Really?) and I think of the real courses that could have taken up that time instead. If they didn't take the time to make space golf (or whatever's going on there) they could have added a dozen more real courses, and golfers.

But I understand that doesn't change your point, they have to try and appeal to the widest possible audience. But the selfish side of me hates it.

Sigh... Oh well, first world problems, right?

I agree, believe me, I'd much rather see the weird golf stuff gone too, but I dont think that's possible for them to do given what I had already mentioned.

I also don't think the creation of those other modes really took away from course development time. There's probably two separate departments there working on courses/environments, versus working on gameplay.

I know the course selection at launch sucks, but theyve stated there's continuous DLC to come and that it's not an annual release, so there's more to come, and I think alot of folks are probably going to sit this out until they see just what that is.

Personally, I've said this all along, my decision will be made based on how I feel about the game after getting a few rounds in through the EA Access preview.

[Chairman7w]

Re: Rory McIlroy PGA TOUR Trailer - Golf Without Limits

I shall await your reports with baited breath!

Personally, I've said this all along, my decision will be made based on how I feel about the game after getting a few rounds in through the EA Access preview.