The MESS that is 2K17's help defense... How to fix THREAD

[itchyroll_51]

Took me a long time to figure this out but the culprit to all the crazy help CPU defense is on the setting "SWITCH RULES". Watch the vid. I did and you can see exactly where the mess comes from. I have also came up with a solution; so in this thread i hope you guys can let me know what you see against other teams PnRs with my "fix". Also would be great to hear how other deal with all the help defense problems form the CPU this year, especially in PnRs.

<iframe src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/l9t4xCiON3M" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="315" width="560"></iframe>

Sam Pham

[TarHeelPhenom]

Re: The MESS that is 2K17's help defense... How to fix THREAD

Question...will these work for CPU vs CPU and if we go in and set them for the CPU will they stick all game?

[LorenzoDC]

Re: The MESS that is 2K17's help defense... How to fix THREAD

I look forward to testing this.

It would be great if you were to do a video just breaking down what all of the settings options do. For example, you explained "pre rotate" quickly while you were talking, but you used a "catch hedge" setting and I don't even think I know what that does.

We need an illustrated "glossary" of all the settings and options, and when to use them.

[Nukleopatra]

Re: The MESS that is 2K17's help defense... How to fix THREAD

Question...will these work for CPU vs CPU and if we go in and set them for the CPU will they stick all game?

I second this question.

[Impetuous65]

Re: The MESS that is 2K17's help defense... How to fix THREAD

Just tried your setting and it doesn't happen as much but it still happens a lot.

[TarHeelPhenom]

Re: The MESS that is 2K17's help defense... How to fix THREAD

For now until a patch drops im playing with all players Help IQ at 99 and its definitely helping. Im thinking with that and Sam's finding while possibly raising the Def. Awareness slider this may be a band aid til a patch drops.

[bls]

Re: The MESS that is 2K17's help defense... How to fix THREAD

Turn ACE off and use adjustments during game depending on what opponent is doing. Just played a Grizzlies user and it was shrink the floor all day long with his line up of Gasol/Zach/Allen. It actually works when you use it too, you'll notice your defensive players playing off to protect the paint.

Also make the adjustments in the defensive settings like play tight, deny....etc.

Haven't played a Warriors user yet and doesn't look like I will being that I play with the Pistons.


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[strawberryshortcake]

Re: The MESS that is 2K17's help defense... How to fix THREAD

EDIT #2: Just completely re-tested Sam Pham's setting and it seems to be a very viable solution for the defensive concerns. The game seems to now be playable and enjoyable without the questionable defensive tactics

Spoiler

I think I may have to retract my earlier post; I think Sam Pham may have found the "solution" to the defensive headaches. From the limited test samples, it seems like what Sam Pham cooked up works. Still a trial run for the time being. I still need to test out what happens when I do switch to playing off-ball and on-ball defense.

Played two games (12 minute quarters, hall of fame, broadcast camera, play now games) with Sam Pham's new setting. He didn't mentioned whether or not ACE should be off or on. I turned ACE off. With ACE (ON), the CPU sometimes who automatically change my matchups (i.e. Durant on Tony Parker, etc), which sometimes would confuse me on who I was suppose to be guarding (since I was playing point guard). Honestly, it wasn't that bad with ACE (ON) using Sam Pham's new setting (still need to give ACE (ON) a full game test run though).

I purposely controlled the point guard position and let the game handle all my other teammates off-ball coverages. Wanted to see if my teammates would play absurd defense. Fortunately, I didn't see any questionable tactics.

(Note: I am one of those claiming the game pre-Sam Pham settings had questionable defense, where players would purposely run away leaving their man wide open for shots, and simply not pick up their assignment. I had the impression the game was simply more challenging because it was absolutely necessary to play both on-ball and off-ball defense, which in hindsight, was NOT because of a smarter CPU offense in a manner of speaking. It was simply because my offline hall of fame teammates were playing questionable sketchy defense.

Pre-Sam Pham settings, I needed to control off-ball defense because my teammates were simply playing questionable elementary defense if you would even call it that. The implementation of Sam Pham's setting no longer requires me to monitor any of my teammates on the floor. I could if I wanted to, but the two games I played back to back didn't require me to touch my off-ball defenders.

NBA2k17 with Sam Pham's new defensive settings now makes the game playable and pushes the fun factor to a 15/10. Now, I can legitimately start a MyLeague file without having to wait for a defensive patch.

Still a trial period, but Sam Pham seems to have resolved the defensive concerns.
I still need to test out what happens when I do switch to playing off-ball defense and on-ball defense.

However, this doesn't resolve some of the questionable opposition CPU defense. It happens infrequently but it does happen with the CPU.

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EDIT #1: I am currently re-testing Sam Phams settings because I overlooked what could be an important aspect: Pre-Rotation needs to be set to NO for most. Pre-Rotation is only set to YES for big man.




Everything below is before my above edit.

EDIT: Disregard the below post; I retested Sam Pham's defensive setting and I completely forgot to change the Pre-Rotation to No (Most) and Pre-Rotation to Yes (Big Man). Implementation of these two things and I no longer get the Kevin Durant journey across the court defense.

Spoiler

Just tried your setting and it doesn't happen as much but it still happens a lot.

I also just tested out, at least I think I have the proper settings in place, and it just happened with Kevin Durant running from one side of the court to the other. I was using Curry. Durant decides to mysteriously come over to help. Was extremely excited to see a possible fix, but unfortunately, it didn't resolve it.

For whatever reason, it actually worked better if I kept everything on out of the box default setting and simply follow what Vni suggested, sort of. I simply kept off-ball pressure (tight) and on-ball pressure (tight). I played a full game and didn't get strange things like that happening, or at least I have yet to come across it. Still a trial and error period.

Did I miss something in Sam Pham's video.

<iframe src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/HF_mjvbwp3M" allowfullscreen="" width="560" height="315" frameborder="0"></iframe>


Vni's Video
<iframe src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/raf5Kqlguv0" allowfullscreen="" width="560" height="315" frameborder="0"></iframe>

[jfsolo]

Re: The MESS that is 2K17's help defense... How to fix THREAD

Great Work Sam.

[DonWuan]

Re: The MESS that is 2K17's help defense... How to fix THREAD

Seriously This needs to be sticked at the top. 99% of my cpu issues are gone with a little bit of manual D from the user.

I only turned off ACE and changed help defense stuff under coaching sliders. Game is night and day and currently blowing out HOF cpu(the bad news).

I didnt touch individual player stuff as that would be unfair to cpu.

[stillfeelme]

Re: The MESS that is 2K17's help defense... How to fix THREAD

I also just tested out, at least I think I have the proper settings in place, and it just happened with Kevin Durant running from one side of the court to the other. I was using Curry. Durant decides to mysteriously come over to help. Was extremely excited to see a possible fix, but unfortunately, it didn't resolve it.

For whatever reason, it actually worked better if I kept everything on out of the box default setting and simply follow what Vni suggested, sort of. I simply kept off-ball pressure (tight) and on-ball pressure (tight). I played a full game and didn't get strange things like that happening, or at least I have yet to come across it. Still a trial and error period.

Did I miss something in Sam Pham's video.

<iframe src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/HF_mjvbwp3M" allowfullscreen="" width="560" height="315" frameborder="0"></iframe>


Vni's Video
<iframe src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/raf5Kqlguv0" allowfullscreen="" width="560" height="315" frameborder="0"></iframe>

Wow makes no sense. I wonder did they try to program bad rotations to simulate that bad rotations do happen in the NBA. These rotations are just uncalled for and don't make sense. Basically you can't have perfect defense for every single possession.

The one thing that is appears to be clear I think help rules override defensive man logic? The only difference I see between what you did is I don't think Sam Pham set pre-rotate for everybody. The settings probably need one player to have hierarchy or gets confused who knows though lol.

All these settings are one big IF, THEN, do loops and it looks like they didn't get time to test them all out for bugs.

[Marty Funkhouser]

Re: The MESS that is 2K17's help defense... How to fix THREAD

Turn ACE off and use adjustments during game depending on what opponent is doing. Just played a Grizzlies user and it was shrink the floor all day long with his line up of Gasol/Zach/Allen. It actually works when you use it too, you'll notice your defensive players playing off to protect the paint.

Also make the adjustments in the defensive settings like play tight, deny....etc.

Haven't played a Warriors user yet and doesn't look like I will being that I play with the Pistons.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Doesn't matter if ACE is off, adjustments are broken. Next time you play check your timeout screens and you can see that none of your adjustments have actually been made. They automatically revert no matter what.

[Lakers 24 7]

Re: The MESS that is 2K17's help defense... How to fix THREAD

Great video, definitely looking forward to more. So far I've gotten 3 online games in utilizing your suggestions and it seems to have made an improvement. The only time people were left open was by my own doing, either being out of position or leaving someone open on purpose. This has allowed me to run a realistic defense and actually strategize as opposed to worrying about covering a broken AI.

A little too early to say definitively one way or the other, but so far so good.

[bls]

Re: The MESS that is 2K17's help defense... How to fix THREAD

Doesn't matter if ACE is off, adjustments are broken. Next time you play check your timeout screens and you can see that none of your adjustments have actually been made. They automatically revert no matter what.

I don't change them at the timeout screen Marty, I change them in game. And they stick for me.


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[Marty Funkhouser]

Re: The MESS that is 2K17's help defense... How to fix THREAD

I don't change them at the timeout screen Marty, I change them in game. And they stick for me.


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I know, but if you go to the timeout screen you'll see that the adjustments aren't the ones you chose in game.