MLB The Show Server Issues: Detailing the Saga So Far

Feature Article

Submitted on: 04/17/2017 by

The MLB The Show 17 server issues persisted over the weekend, and many are starting to feel like there is no end in sight.

While server issues are a traditional problem with Sony and MLB The Show, last year it seemed like there was a lot of progress made towards a smoother playing experience. Unfortunately this year, it appears the series has indeed suffered a setback with the online play.

Last year, there were some rough days even a couple of weeks after launch as well, but the servers going down at the start of Easter weekend was a real low point (Sony did get them back up on the whole by Saturday). With that in mind, we thought it best to at least summarize the issues that have cropped up during this first month and sort of just encapsulate the whole saga to this point.

A Summary of the Issues

The servers for MLB The Show 17 have been shaky at best from the get-go.

On day one, the original issue was a missing access token for most users, which removed their ability to access online features. From there, gamers have experienced games from all facets of Diamond Dynasty (including Conquest, Battle Royale, and Head to Head Seasons games) going into a processing queue.

When this happens, it holds up stat-based missions for hours or even days -- assuming those stats end up registering at all, which sometimes they do not.

The community itself had a tipping point of sorts on April 4, when the first Event was scheduled. The scheduled start time was 3 p.m. EST. Prior to this, a previous test event’s rules were up and users could join the event with the test restrictions, though their games would not count.

The actual Event came around, but the test event’s rules still applied, which allowed for some players to play with stacked teams versus bronze-only players.

SDS quickly shut down the event and delayed it for 24 hours.

Since that first Event, the servers have gone down at least a couple of times while games continue to enter the processing queue, or are even lost completely.

The Community Reaction

Anger, frustration and exhaustion have marked the community reaction thus far.

Many users have taken to issuing personal attacks via social media at developers (side note: never do this), with some expressing frustration at the lack of clear communication from Sony throughout the first few weeks post-release. At this point, the feedback has continued to spiral downwards, with communication becoming toxic at points.

In other words, instead of constructive communication that could lead to better interaction and possibly even faster troubleshooting of issues, the community has devolved into what is the equivalent of screaming obscenities into a brick wall.

The hit to Sony due to the lack of communication will probably be longer lasting than the server issues by a good measure, and it's going to take a lot of honest and open communication in the future to repair some of the wounds and divides the community and Sony have with one another on this front.

When Will it Be Fixed?

As we exit Easter Weekend, server issues are still continuing for some users.

A new patch has been mentioned, but obviously it will need to to get through testing and certification before it can go out to users. Our own best guess at a best-case scenario for that situation may put a more stable online experience a week or two away. If that is the case, users will have gone a full month without a stable online experience in MLB The Show 17.

That is, of course, a gigantic problem because large portions of the game depend upon online connectivity -- even seemingly "offline" modes like Road to the Show. This has been a problem with other sports games as well, with NBA 2K also a notable source of online headaches in recent years.

Because of this, large portions of the game are at times unplayable for users. With the possibility that this instability could continue, it's hard to justify recommending MLB The Show 17 for a purchase right now. We need to see that the game is fully functional and stable again to more comfortably say the game is safe to pick up -- at least when it comes to recommending it to anyone who has an internet connection.

While the fundamentals of the game are arguably the best they’ve been on the field, the experience as a whole due to the server issues makes the game more frustrating than not as of now.

Member Comments

# 21 jeffy777 @ 04/18/17 08:11 AM

Nice to see OS callling SDS out on this. As much as I love this game, they deserve all the criticism until this is resolved. Before the release, I was planing to renew my PSN subscription so I could play online, but I'm glad I didn't. So this issue is costing Sony money in more ways than one.

# 22 saturn2187 @ 04/18/17 08:18 AM

To perfectly honest, the biggest surprise to me is that there are people shocked at SDS. This is their thing. They pull the same act EVERY SINGLE YEAR. I bought from 12-15 and haven't bought 16 or 17. Finally got fed up with the lies and garbage. Does nobody remember a few years back they pledged online HR derby repeatedly prior to release, only for it to be completely absent at launch? The Online Franchise release in 12 or 13 that is completely unusable? These server issues are not new. Its the same thing literally every single year so I am amazed that people are so upset and shocked. Are you not used to it by now? The promises SDS makes ring hollow to me by now and I just laugh when I read their claims each year leading up to release.

# 23 saturn2187 @ 04/18/17 08:21 AM

There won't be improvements until the bottom line is affected. It's as simple as that. Their job is to make money. Their interactions with the community that is so highly praised is nothing more than a way to figure out what they can do to make more money. Can't knock it - its' capitalism. But people assume they are altruistic beings , listening to the community suggestions out of kindness, etc. No, its to make more money.

# 24 dalger21 @ 04/18/17 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bullit


	I think, and this is just my opinion of course, that gamers as a whole are getting real tired of being burned by shoddy games coming out. This trend of we can fix it after launch is already getting really old and I think it is just going to get worse before it gets better.

This. It seems more and more developers are using that mentality to get the game out and we will fix it later. ME:Andromeda has me thinking about my pre-ordering habits in the future. I've purchased every iteration of The Show since '08(PS3 and PS4). The past couple of years has made me reconsider that.

# 25 Anthonyg7575 @ 04/18/17 08:51 AM

I know all the issues with the online servers, but is anyone else having issues with offline stuff as well? I'm trying to play my own offline franchise only to keep having game after game locking up on me... this usually happens in the latter part of a game and I press the D pad to see who's pitching or to go to the bullpen to warm up a pitcher. The menu doesn't come up and the game just freezes. Then I have to closed the application and restart. I have not had this happen in RTTS mode though,

# 26 Starducket Moon @ 04/18/17 09:32 AM

I'm starting to think there's multiple issues to this. The first is the missions and it forcing so many people into playing on-line games. The amount of players may be the issue. Then there's an issue I had a few days ago... I played a Battle Royale game against someone who absolutely creamed me. I've lost before but everything I threw this guy was bombed over the fence. 12-0 in 3 innings. That included me turning a triple play on him. I mean I could throw it almost in the dirt and he'd hit it 500 feet. I figured he was just that good. On my end hitting, it seemed glitchy. Like the ball just would freeze and sputter. I didn't care. Just played the game to conclusion. I knew I was beat. The game went into queue and was never heard from again. I played other games that day and the games counted. So my eyebrows were raised. So it wouldn't surprise me if some have found a way to cheat. Let's let them clean up their yard. In the meantime I'm hoping they give a good explanation what has caused us so much frustration trying to enjoy a game we all looked so much forward to playing.

# 27 Speedy @ 04/18/17 09:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saturn2187


	To perfectly honest, the biggest surprise to me is that there are people shocked at SDS. This is their thing. They pull the same act EVERY SINGLE YEAR. I bought from 12-15 and haven't bought 16 or 17. Finally got fed up with the lies and garbage. Does nobody remember a few years back they pledged online HR derby repeatedly prior to release, only for it to be completely absent at launch? The Online Franchise release in 12 or 13 that is completely unusable? These server issues are not new. Its the same thing literally every single year so I am amazed that people are so upset and shocked. Are you not used to it by now? The promises SDS makes ring hollow to me by now and I just laugh when I read their claims each year leading up to release.

We're having a mature discussion...we can be critical without bashing SCEA and calling their game garbage and the developers liars.

# 28 Dolenz @ 04/18/17 09:55 AM

I play mostly Play vs CPU games in DD as a try and work through some missions. It has progressed from the point where I would get an occasional disconnect to now, where as I end a game I cross my fingers and pray it counts. Of course none of that helps. 2 of my last four games in this mode have been disconnected. It has caused me to take breaks from the game.

The big downside to that is the sheer amount of my (and many, many others) time that has been wasted. You could have been disconnected from the server in the second inning but you aren't going to know that until you put in another 40 minutes to finish the game. I can almost live with that in Conquest 3 inning games but 9 inning games take me an hour to finish sometimes.

Last night I actually decided to play a series or two in RTTS. I was on a post game points recap screen and noticed that I had two message that I needed to hit the touch pad to access. I hit the touchpad and the little network circle started spinning and I locked up. This is the most offline of all the major nodes.

I am greatly disappointed in the state of the servers and SDS for their lack of communication.

You have connected practically everything to the servers. Franchise checks the servers to see if you have completed any missions. DD games vs the CPU have to check the servers. You roll out events and timed missions that guarantee that the servers are going to overloaded. So many missions for the best cards require PvP games in Ranked, BR, and Events that you are forcing more people than ever to play online. If you are going to continue to funnel people to the server then you have to make sure you have the ability to handle it all.

# 29 Mike Lowe @ 04/18/17 10:21 AM

As someone who has yet to go online once, and someone who does not care one bit for rewards (I actually wish I could just turn off all of the notifications), I think this is the best version of the Show ever. I wish franchise mode had some more updates this year, but overall, the gameplay is fantastic with the right sliders, and aside from a few issues like catchers not being good enough at blocking pitches in the dirt and position players still tiring too quickly in franchise mode, I think the game is great.

I've noticed a lot of menus having wrong text, wrong year for stats, etc. but those are minor cosmetic things. I like how the game plays, and only wish SDS spent more time on strengthening their QA versus pedaling some of the gimmicky things we saw prior to release (Ken Griffey's hat is BACKWARDS!).

All told, I've enjoyed the game, and I hope the community doesn't shut this game down via lack of support. I know that's asking a lot to continue to be patient, but be patient--they want to get this right for everyone.

Back to my franchise!

# 30 335TDC @ 04/18/17 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Lowe


	As someone who has yet to go online once, and someone who does not care one bit for rewards (I actually wish I could just turn off all of the notifications), I think this is the best version of the Show ever. I wish franchise mode had some more updates this year, but overall, the gameplay is fantastic with the right sliders, and aside from a few issues like catchers not being good enough at blocking pitches in the dirt and position players still tiring too quickly in franchise mode, I think the game is great. I've noticed a lot of menus having wrong text, wrong year for stats, etc. but those are minor cosmetic things. I like how the game plays, and only wish SDS spent more time on strengthening their QA versus pedaling some of the gimmicky things we saw prior to release (Ken Griffey's hat is BACKWARDS!). All told, I've enjoyed the game, and I hope the community doesn't shut this game down via lack of support. I know that's asking a lot to continue to be patient, but be patient--they want to get this right for everyone. Back to my franchise!

I play the same way you do, but am on the complete opposite side of the reaction spectrum. I support the online players in their absolute disgust and frustration and believe that -- while you're right: being patient or giving up on the game are the only two options -- taking the "just be patient, they're good guys who want to get it right" stance is ridiculous. This is a LEGACY issue madeworse by the fact that this year SSD has pushed almost all their chips into the middle of the DD online table while not having the infrastructure to support the traffic. Not only that, but instead of just shutting down servers until they're fixed -- I know, money, never gonna happen -- they continue to play with people's time and even released a new "mission" while all this is going on. Irresponsible and inexcusable. Add to this their "Note to the Community" in which they never once used the words "sorry" or "apologize," but promised -- oh, joy! -- FREE STUFF and....well, patience would be, quite frankly, irresponsible.

# 31 dasfette @ 04/18/17 10:30 AM

I don't think I totally understand this mentality that some in the OS community have around developers. It very much feels like, per those folks, no one is ever, ever, ever to become upset over the way a game releases. You're allowed to provide "constructive criticism", but anything other than that can become reason for deletion of posts or banning (and, for the record, I'm not, by any means, condoning personal attacks on devs).

Well, funny thing around constructive criticism: I'm not a software engineer. And even if I was I simply don't have access to the game's coding. So it's a little difficult to provide constructive criticism around why the game's online modes don't work.

I can't imagine ANY other industry/commercial product where this is acceptable. If you buy a new car from Chevy and it doesn't go into reverse, are you satisfied with "you just have to be patient until Chevy finds a fix"? No! "Oh, and you better be an engineer because, unless you can tell us WHY the car won't go into reverse, we don't wanna hear it."

Sure, a car costs considerably more than a video game. But let's use a battery-operated shower cleaner. If you put the batteries in and it doesn't spray, would anyone find it reasonable for the consumer to "wait for a fix"? No! You'd return it as broken and have the choice, as a consumer, to buy a different product from another developer.

But video games don't work that way. Once you open that plastic wrapping, it's yours. If it doesn't perform to established expectations? Well, sucks for you, because no returning it. So you're either forced to wait for a fix (and you BETTER not say anything bad about the product - only constructive criticism!) or you sell it on the open market. It's absolutely absurd that we let the video game industry get away with such things.

But, that's where capitalism is so great. If you truly want to change those practices, you simply stop buying the product. SDS is a business here to make a profit. No profit means changes to the product, or no more business. So, maybe we should all put our money where our mouths are and stop buying the game until the devs decide to put out a working product that is worth the cost they charge.

# 32 335TDC @ 04/18/17 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Speedy


	We're having a mature discussion...we can be critical without bashing SCEA and calling their game garbage and the developers liars.

We CAN, but I say as long as attacks aren't of a personal nature, SSD-bashing is well-deserved, so long as the criticisms have basis in fact. When you go No-Man's-Sky silent for over a week and haven't apologized, you get what you deserve.

# 33 335TDC @ 04/18/17 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dasfette


	I don't think I totally understand this mentality that some in the OS community have around developers. It very much feels like, per those folks, no one is ever, ever, ever to become upset over the way a game releases. You're allowed to provide "constructive criticism", but anything other than that can become reason for deletion of posts or banning (and, for the record, I'm not, by any means, condoning personal attacks on devs). Well, funny thing around constructive criticism: I'm not a software engineer. And even if I was I simply don't have access to the game's coding. So it's a little difficult to provide constructive criticism around why the game's online modes don't work. I can't imagine ANY other industry/commercial product where this is acceptable. If you buy a new car from Chevy and it doesn't go into reverse, are you satisfied with "you just have to be patient until Chevy finds a fix"? No! "Oh, and you better be an engineer because, unless you can tell us WHY the car won't go into reverse, we don't wanna hear it." Sure, a car costs considerably more than a video game. But let's use a battery-operated shower cleaner. If you put the batteries in and it doesn't spray, would anyone find it reasonable for the consumer to "wait for a fix"? No! You'd return it as broken and have the choice, as a consumer, to buy a different product from another developer. But video games don't work that way. Once you open that plastic wrapping, it's yours. If it doesn't perform to established expectations? Well, sucks for you, because no returning it. So you're either forced to wait for a fix (and you BETTER not say anything bad about the product - only constructive criticism!) or you sell it on the open market. It's absolutely absurd that we let the video game industry get away with such things. But, that's where capitalism is so great. If you truly want to change those practices, you simply stop buying the product. SDS is a business here to make a profit. No profit means changes to the product, or no more business. So, maybe we should all put our money where our mouths are and stop buying the game until the devs decide to put out a working product that is worth the cost they charge.

Great post, especially concerning the "constructive criticism." I've always felt that OS was too sensitive about this, but at the same time I understand their desire to control the vocabulary used on their site. The "provide a solution or don't complain" angle is total garbage -- it's a mealy-mouthed middle-management business mantra meant to prevent the boat from rocking even while it's sinking.

The difference with video games and product returns, quite simply, is a simple caveat emptor: these are true luxury items, and the buyer can easily wait a week or two to see how things play out. But we don't, mainly because we love them and their releases are treated with such fanfare, much like blockbuster movies. It's our own fault at this point, and that sucks.

# 34 Dolenz @ 04/18/17 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Speedy


	We're having a mature discussion...we can be critical without bashing SCEA and calling their game garbage and the developers liars.

I have said this before, the game is great, it's the servers that are garbage. They make me want to

# 35 Mike Lowe @ 04/18/17 10:46 AM

No one at OS has told me to be supportive. I find there's great benefit in being kind when possible. I know it's frustrating, but you're stressing yourself out over a video game which isn't healthy. And even if we consider the game a total loss, it's $60. Sucks, but not the end of the world.

For what it's worth, franchise mode seems to be playing quite well. It's the only mode I've played so far, so I can't speak to the other modes. I can say, I haven't been frustrated with the game because I am simply avoiding those areas for now (accidental at first, but now intentional).

I get what folks are saying about saying what they want, but I guess outside of venting, I'm not sure the purpose it serves. I think SDS knows folks are disappointed and frustrated.

# 36 MLB14 @ 04/18/17 10:50 AM

The Show was always shaky online, but it was never like what I read this year. It seems like the server instability has gotten worse every year from 2014..

I think the problems lie more in the code powering online game connections than the servers themselves. I think that because how could they so badly underestimate the server bandwidth they would need for a solid launch.

This is the first year I've ever seen the game put up ridiculous distances for HRs too, but I'm giving them a pass on that because I know the new in-air ball physics are probably causing that. If they don't fix that though.. It's a negative point in my opinion. Human beings cannot hit a ball further than ~475 ft. at sea level (without wind).

Graphically, the game is outstanding. Under the hood.. I think the foundation they've built on over the past several years is buckling. This is the first year I've seen MLB 2K-like game glitches in MLB The Show and it's kinda weird.

# 37 jeffy777 @ 04/18/17 10:51 AM

I specifically asked about lag and online performance during one of the Twitch streams and Ramone said they couldn't really answer because they wouldn't know until the game launched. Maybe it's time to consider a beta to really test the servers in advance BEFORE release...

At this rate, it's starting to feel like the servers will only improve when the load decreases...and less people are playing the game...as in they've given up for the year and traded it in.

# 38 Dolenz @ 04/18/17 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Lowe


	And even if we consider the game a total loss, it's $60. Sucks, but not the end of the world.

Well , many paid $100, and that extra $40 was specifically so we could have the extras that would allow us to play DD. The mode that is most broken.

I can be patient but there is a limit to that patience, especially when there is little to no communication that gives me any idea about how much longer I am supposed to remain patient.

# 39 WaitTilNextYear @ 04/18/17 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dasfette


	I don't think I totally understand this mentality that some in the OS community have around developers. It very much feels like, per those folks, no one is ever, ever, ever to become upset over the way a game releases. You're allowed to provide "constructive criticism", but anything other than that can become reason for deletion of posts or banning (and, for the record, I'm not, by any means, condoning personal attacks on devs). Well, funny thing around constructive criticism: I'm not a software engineer. And even if I was I simply don't have access to the game's coding. So it's a little difficult to provide constructive criticism around why the game's online modes don't work. I can't imagine ANY other industry/commercial product where this is acceptable. If you buy a new car from Chevy and it doesn't go into reverse, are you satisfied with "you just have to be patient until Chevy finds a fix"? No! "Oh, and you better be an engineer because, unless you can tell us WHY the car won't go into reverse, we don't wanna hear it." Sure, a car costs considerably more than a video game. But let's use a battery-operated shower cleaner. If you put the batteries in and it doesn't spray, would anyone find it reasonable for the consumer to "wait for a fix"? No! You'd return it as broken and have the choice, as a consumer, to buy a different product from another developer. But video games don't work that way. Once you open that plastic wrapping, it's yours. If it doesn't perform to established expectations? Well, sucks for you, because no returning it. So you're either forced to wait for a fix (and you BETTER not say anything bad about the product - only constructive criticism!) or you sell it on the open market. It's absolutely absurd that we let the video game industry get away with such things. But, that's where capitalism is so great. If you truly want to change those practices, you simply stop buying the product. SDS is a business here to make a profit. No profit means changes to the product, or no more business. So, maybe we should all put our money where our mouths are and stop buying the game until the devs decide to put out a working product that is worth the cost they charge.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 335TDC


	Great post, especially concerning the "constructive criticism." I've always felt that OS was too sensitive about this, but at the same time I understand their desire to control the vocabulary used on their site. The "provide a solution or don't complain" angle is total garbage -- it's a mealy-mouthed middle-management business mantra meant to prevent the boat from rocking even while it's sinking. The difference with video games and product returns, quite simply, is a simple caveat emptor: these are true luxury items, and the buyer can easily wait a week or two to see how things play out. But we don't, mainly because we love them and their releases are treated with such fanfare, much like blockbuster movies. It's our own fault at this point, and that sucks.

A few comments on this line of thinking...

1. OS is a privately owned website that can institute whatever rules it deems necessary. If users don't like it, they don't have to use it. No one is forcing anyone to post here. But, when you do, it has to be by the rules.

2. Even if you don't feel competent to levy "constructive criticism" your wording can go along way to determining whether the post is acceptable or not. Almost 100% of the time when people name-call the devs (or anyone else), that will result in a deleted post at minimum. People know to expect that and the rules are very clear. People that can't get their point across without name-calling either need to remember to breathe before posting or they are not mature enough to be part of this community (theoretically).

3. Furthermore, do you really need to be a software engineer to think constructively--at least in general terms--about what the issues are and how to fix them? I don't think that's the case. You could say that your online experience is very frustrating and that Sony would be wise to change servers or upgrade and I think most people would consider that quite milquetoast and constructive in nature--even if not incredibly detailed. It's when you say it with expletives and accusatory language/name-calling that makes it unpleasant.

4. Your whole Chevy analogy doesn't fit. If you have a problem with a Chevy, you take it up with the dealership/GM. If you have a problem with Sony's game, you take it up with Sony. Venting on a middle man's website (OS) is not completely necessary in getting your issues resolved (or at least communicating your displeasure). Chevy will deal with a lot more heated feedback than OS, because Chevy is selling you a product and wants you to buy another. OS doesn't get any benefit at all from being patient toward irate feedback. Your analogies don't work because you're conflating consumer-business relationships (buying a product directly from a business) with consumer-third party situations (posting about the transaction on a separate message board).

5. As for the idea of putting your money where your mouth is....I totally, unequivocally 100% agree. People can skip next year's edition if they don't like this one and that's a reasonable thing to do. Furthermore, this whole "pre-ordering" glitzy versions is part of the problem. If they don't even need to display their "wares" and prove it to the customer, their model allows them to publish essentially a prototype on launch day and fix it over the ensuing weeks and months as they always do.

As for the blame, well, blame the consumers who knowingly pony up $100+ before the game even comes out with every expectation that they'll be disappointed. Also, blame the suits at Sony Corporate for putting their game developers on unrealistic timelines with a skeleton crew and minimal resources. I'm sure the guys at SDS dislike buggy game releases at least as much as we do. I'm sure they are upset that the rollout was not smooth and they have to figure it out while under fire from very unhappy customers. Personally, this is one of the reasons I am happy to work on editing for a while, lol, before ever playing a game.

# 40 dasfette @ 04/18/17 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WaitTilNextYear


	A few comments on this line of thinking... 1. OS is a privately owned website that can institute whatever rules it deems necessary. If users don't like it, they don't have to use it. No one is forcing anyone to post here. But, when you do, it has to be by the rules. 2. Even if you don't feel competent to levy "constructive criticism" your wording can go along way to determining whether the post is acceptable or not. Almost 100% of the time when people name-call the devs (or anyone else), that will result in a deleted post at minimum. People know to expect that and the rules are very clear. People that can't get their point across without name-calling either need to remember to breathe before posting or they are not mature enough to be part of this community (theoretically). 3. Furthermore, do you really need to be a software engineer to think constructively--at least in general terms--about what the issues are and how to fix them? I don't think that's the case. You could say that your online experience is very frustrating and that Sony would be wise to change servers or upgrade and I think most people would consider that quite milquetoast and constructive in nature--even if not incredibly detailed. It's when you say it with expletives and accusatory language/name-calling that makes it unpleasant. 4. Your whole Chevy analogy doesn't fit. If you have a problem with a Chevy, you take it up with the dealership/GM. If you have a problem with Sony's game, you take it up with Sony. Venting on a middle man's website (OS) is not completely necessary in getting your issues resolved (or at least communicating your displeasure). Chevy will deal with a lot more heated feedback than OS, because Chevy is selling you a product and wants you to buy another. OS doesn't get any benefit at all from being patient toward irate feedback. Your analogies don't work because you're conflating consumer-business relationships (buying a product directly from a business) with consumer-third party situations (posting about the transaction on a separate message board). 5. As for the idea of putting your money where your mouth is....I totally, unequivocally 100% agree. People can skip next year's edition if they don't like this one and that's a reasonable thing to do. Furthermore, this whole "pre-ordering" glitzy versions is part of the problem. If they don't even need to display their "wares" and prove it to the customer, their model allows them to publish essentially a prototype on launch day and fix it over the ensuing weeks and months as they always do. As for the blame, well, blame the consumers who knowingly pony up $100+ before the game even comes out with every expectation that they'll be disappointed. Also, blame the suits at Sony Corporate for putting their game developers on unrealistic timelines with a skeleton crew and minimal resources. I'm sure the guys at SDS dislike buggy game releases at least as much as we do. I'm sure they are upset that the rollout was not smooth and they have to figure it out while under fire from very unhappy customers. Personally, this is one of the reasons I am happy to work on editing for a while, lol, before ever playing a game.

I agree. OS is a private website, here to make money - and they can do as they wish. I can think how I wish. I can (technically) post what I want, bad language and all. And OS can delete my posts/ban me. Hell, if I do something REALLY stupid, I can even get arrested! That's totally cool, all the way around. It's responsibility for the action/individual - and that's great! I'm being totally serious.

The reason people post on forums is to connect with other consumers/individuals. OS is a bit different (and I would argue, better) because we DO get developer response. If OS isn't the forum to allow for freedom of thought around game performance (or at least limited thought, in some form), that's totally fine. Again, OS can do as they wish.

The reality is that people will go SOMEWHERE to talk to each other. See those ads at the bottom of the page? That's profit. They exist because OS has people who visit the site. So, truthfully, the same mentality applies to OS. If someone doesn't like that there are rules, or what the rules are, then don't belong to/visit OS. No profit = a change in philosophy/rules, or, possibly, no OS.

Personally, I don't mind the rules and, for the most part, I like what OS provides. Thus the reason I'm not on here cursing or attacking devs. I even try to follow the rules! What I am providing is my opinion, in what I believe to be a constructive manner. Remember, "constructive criticism" can be rather subjective.

You mention going straight back to the dealership (or, in this case, Sony). I agree. If people are really angry about the game, they should probably call Sony/SDS until they're sick of hearing from 'em. But I got to say that I disagree with your thought that, in reality, people ONLY go back to the dealership. If that were the case, forums around vehicle/vehicle performance wouldn't exist. Yet, they do.

Regardless, we're on the same page. The Show isn't, in my opinion, a bad game (surprise: I don't play online). SDS seem like decent folks. OS is full of really cool, smart people. And it absolutely makes sense that some people are upset over the game, and over OS. Again - take it or leave it. That's the choice we all have to make.

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