Werewolf LI Major League (GAME OVER!!! INDIANS--GOOD GUYS--WIN!!!)

[hoopsguy]

LOL

no hard feelings hmm man? I'm just calling em like I see em, and something about you has set off my internal "wolf-detector" in a way that only Izulde did in one of my first games way back when.

maybe i'm wrong. Maybe i'm right. But it's a D1 vote, and I'm just your average Ivan, so why not push it.

Every once in awhile this stuff is right on, and it is really gratifying to have it verified later in the game. I had that happen in my first game (X-Com) where I pushed after Blade6119 pretty relentlessly once I thought the voting patterns suggested he was hairy.

[st.cronin]

Unclaimed - Rube Baker, Roger Dorn, Pedro Cerrano, Jake Tomlinson


I'm obviously one of these people. Jake Tomlinson is a generic dude. So that leaves two people for me to search for retirement info within the movie scripts. And I think the retirement could fit for one of them, if I'm correctly recalling what I read about ML2 yesterday ...

What role, if any, do you have me claiming? Could you post a list of what you have? Because I think you may have made a mistake.

[DaddyTorgo]

Every once in awhile this stuff is right on, and it is really gratifying to have it verified later in the game. I had that happen in my first game (X-Com) where I pushed after Blade6119 pretty relentlessly once I thought the voting patterns suggested he was hairy.

yep. And it doesn't happen to me all that often. So since it's D1 figured it's a good place to go, at least for now.

[Barkeep49]

I like 1,5,9,13 as our picks. This whole "who do we trust to do random.org" business seems overblown. That's why we're having so many people go. So in other words 1,5,9,13 is fine as would be any other set of 4. I think we're just wasting time here and I'm afraid that not all four of our players picked, whoever they might be, will be on in time before deadline.

[hoopsguy]

Cronin, why go with player that gets the lowest amount of votes to determine the list?

If I was picking the step-ups today (only four, I would prefer five), I would go with:
Hoops
DaddyT
Celeval
Barkeep
KWhit (if we went five)

I include myself on the list because I trust me to do the right thing - use the step-up to help the team. The other names would potentially help generate information on how the talent was determined, based on my understanding of these players identities.

[hoopsguy]

Here is what I believe are the roles at the moment, based on reading the posts and trying to interpret hints based on my knowledge of the movie.

1. DaddyTorgo - Ivan Molina (random dude)
2. Barkeep - Ken Parkhurst (random dude)
3. KWhit - Tom Kettner (random dude)
4. Passacaglia - Rick "Wild Thing" Vaughn (P)
5. Celeval - hinted at Jake Taylor
6. Lathum - Isuro Tanaka (RF)
7. MikeVic - indispensible to team, talk about retirement, Dorn?
8. hoopsguy - stated position player (not random dude)
9. path12 - Jack Parkman (C/DH)
10. Jonathan Ezarik
11. ntndeacon
12. Gonzo - Willie Mays Hayes (CF)
13. PurdueBrad - Lou Brown (manager)
14. st.cronin - "crafty lefty", Eddie Harris (P)

[Passacaglia]

I think you're essentially voting for who you DON'T want to step up, hoops. Either that, or cronin is just trying to make it deliberately confusing.

[st.cronin]

Cronin, why go with player that gets the lowest amount of votes to determine the list?

Because there is no system that we can think of that doesn't involve trusting somebody. So we may as well say, ok the person that gets the most votes is the person we trust the least, at least theoretically. Conversely the player who gets the least votes is the person we trust the most.

We may be wrong, but its at least something.

[st.cronin]

I think you're essentially voting for who you DON'T want to step up, hoops. Either that, or cronin is just trying to make it deliberately confusing.

No, what I'm suggesting is: Each player put out a list of who they want to "step up." The player who receives the least number of votes, we abide by that list - if he names you, you step it up.

I realize this has only a tiny chance of working, but, let's all put our lists out at least, even if you want to stick with one of the earlier plans, and then talk about whether we want to abide by this or not.

[hoopsguy]

Because there is no system that we can think of that doesn't involve trusting somebody. So we may as well say, ok the person that gets the most votes is the person we trust the least, at least theoretically. Conversely the player who gets the least votes is the person we trust the most.

We may be wrong, but its at least something.

This post right here is Exhibit A on how I find myself almost always looking at things differently than Cronin :) I'm usually happy that I ask the questions about the differences by the time the explanation is complete, but we always start off at very different places when looking at these games.

[Passacaglia]

Oh, sorry, this vote is just to see who determines the list? I'm sorry, I'm pretty tired today, so I missed that. It seems like that's way too much of a hassle -- at what point do we tally those votes? Then that person needs to be on to make the list, and we need to figure that all 4 of the people called on to step it up show up in time to learn their instructions? If we're going to try something random, I like DT's idea more.

[DaddyTorgo]

i'm a backup, defensive-specialist middle infielder FWIW hoops

[st.cronin]

Here is what I believe are the roles at the moment, based on reading the posts and trying to interpret hints based on my knowledge of the movie.

1. DaddyTorgo - Ivan Molina (random dude)
2. Barkeep - Ken Parkhurst (random dude)
3. KWhit - Tom Kettner (random dude)
4. Passacaglia - Rick "Wild Thing" Vaughn (P)
5. Celeval - hinted at Jake Taylor
6. Lathum - Isuro Tanaka (RF)
7. MikeVic - indispensible to team, talk about retirement, Dorn?
8. hoopsguy - stated position player (not random dude)
9. path12 - Jack Parkman (C/DH)
10. Jonathan Ezarik
11. ntndeacon
12. Gonzo - Willie Mays Hayes (CF)
13. PurdueBrad - Lou Brown (manager)
14. st.cronin - "crafty lefty", Eddie Harris (P)

Ok, I thought maybe somebody else had claimed Harris. I think in the movies he was actually a righty. So the bait didn't exactly work.

[Passacaglia]

No, what I'm suggesting is: Each player put out a list of who they want to "step up." The player who receives the least number of votes, we abide by that list - if he names you, you step it up.

I realize this has only a tiny chance of working, but, let's all put our lists out at least, even if you want to stick with one of the earlier plans, and then talk about whether we want to abide by this or not.

I'm not sure I follow, but I'll do it:

st.cronin
DaddyTorgo
Barkeep
hoopsguy

[Passacaglia]

What do we do if more than one person gets no votes?

[st.cronin]

Oh, sorry, this vote is just to see who determines the list? I'm sorry, I'm pretty tired today, so I missed that. It seems like that's way too much of a hassle -- at what point do we tally those votes? Then that person needs to be on to make the list, and we need to figure that all 4 of the people called on to step it up show up in time to learn their instructions? If we're going to try something random, I like DT's idea more.

No, its the same as the regular lynch vote, its not a seperate vote. You just make a list, and if you have the least amount of votes... sigh, never mind. :(

[st.cronin]

What do we do if more than one person gets no votes?

Tiebreak should be earliest published list.

Even if we don't get this organized today, we can still try it tomorrow.

[Passacaglia]

No, its the same as the regular lynch vote, its not a seperate vote. You just make a list, and if you have the least amount of votes... sigh, never mind. :(

That's probably for the best. I promise I'm not being deliberately dense! :( Maybe tomorrow would be a better day for me to get involved in it -- but hey, you at least have my list right? That's got to count for something. :confused:

[st.cronin]

That's probably for the best. I promise I'm not being deliberately dense! :( Maybe tomorrow would be a better day for me to get involved in it -- but hey, you at least have my list right? That's got to count for something. :confused:

For the record, I'm planning to abide by this. Of the lists published, if I'm on the one that gets the least number of votes, I'll submit myself to step it up. Otherwise, I'll hold it.

[Passacaglia]

No, its the same as the regular lynch vote, its not a seperate vote. You just make a list, and if you have the least amount of votes... sigh, never mind. :(

Okay, I think I see what you're saying. Are you saying that tomorrow, the person who has the least votes *in the lynch vote from the day before* gets to create the list of 4 or 5 people who will step it up that day?

[Passacaglia]

Oh, I was so close. I think the only thing I missed is that we're all supposed to put in our lists today.

Anyway, I guess this doesn't help us much for tonight's game. Then again, a lot of people may have already put in plans to step it up tonight, which could throw a wrench into everything anyway.

[st.cronin]

Okay, I think I see what you're saying. Are you saying that tomorrow, the person who has the least votes *in the lynch vote from the day before* gets to create the list of 4 or 5 people who will step it up that day?

That would be an alternate method. I am saying, that today, whoever has the least votes in today's lynch vote, gets to create the list.

[Passacaglia]

That would be an alternate method. I am saying, that today, whoever has the least votes in today's lynch vote, gets to create the list.

Isn't that what I said?

[st.cronin]

Isn't that what I said?

Doesn't somebody need to step it up for today's deadline? I thought that's how this game worked.

[Passacaglia]

Doesn't somebody need to step it up for today's deadline? I thought that's how this game worked.

I don't see any place that it says someone needs to step it up. It might mean we lose the game if no one does -- but my hunch is that someone has already submitted an order to step it up anyway, and won't be on to repeal it before lynch. I could be wrong, though.

How do you expect this to work for tonight? We won't know who has the least votes in the lynch vote until it's too late. Damn you and your 24-hour phase!!

[hoopsguy]

Votes as of Post #275:
Hoops (will lose all tiebreaks) - Barkeep (74), Lathum (75)
Barkeep - JE (152)
Purdue - Cronin (160)
Cronin - Torgo (162)
NTN - KWhit (212)

Not voted - Pass, Celeval, MikeVic, Hoops, Path, NTN, Gonzo, Purdue

[path12]

Doesn't somebody need to step it up for today's deadline? I thought that's how this game worked.

You have to send in your night actions before deadline because of the 24 hour day. But actually stepping up (like Jack Parkman, say), would be conveyed by PM to Chief if I understand correctly.

[path12]

VOTE NTNDEACON

Jack Parkman has voted. You are all free to follow.

[Celeval]

So is that vote list who we want to step up, or who we don't want to step up? I admit to a certain amount of confusion.

[hoopsguy]

Celeval, based on the conversation around Cronin's vote list idea I would love to see us table this chain of thought until after the deadline and then consider it for our Day 2 approach.

[KWhit]

So is that vote list who we want to step up, or who we don't want to step up? I admit to a certain amount of confusion.

Same here. I'm trying to read too many posts too quickly, probably.

[hoopsguy]

If we go with the 1,5,9,13 approach then it is the following players:

DaddyTorgo, Celeval, Path, PurdueBrad

Not the list that I would have chosen if I was picking but that is kind of the point with random - that it hopefully represents a good compromise.

[Passacaglia]

I'm going to go ahead and put a vote in on Barkeep. He didn't really answer my question about his confusing statements yesterday, and he still has his vote on hoops, who really seems to be part of helping the village.

VOTE BARKEEP49

[MikeVic]

So for today's step-it-up users, we're going with the list of four that hoops posted? And for tomorrow, we're each submitting a list of people we want to step it up... and then the person with the least amount of votes gets to pick who steps it up?

[MikeVic]

VOTE NTNDEACON

Jack Parkman has voted. You are all free to follow.

Any reasons why?

[path12]

Any reasons why?

Jack Parkman doesn't usually explain his actions, but in this case I will. Someone needed a second vote to take the heat off hoops, who I would like to keep around for at least today.

[hoopsguy]

I'm going to go ahead and put a vote in on Barkeep. He didn't really answer my question about his confusing statements yesterday, and he still has his vote on hoops, who really seems to be part of helping the village.

VOTE BARKEEP49

In fairness, my wolf MO is to appear to aggressively help the village as well. BK has seen me play that card, and I can understand some suspicion. But is the risk/reward really worth it on Day 1?

I would like to see him a little more involved, as his statements today seem to be that there isn't anything to look at on Day 1. I don't buy that - it is a really good day to try and understand game mechanics. You start forming impressions on people, recognizing that they are likely to change. And you try to promote, rather than discourage, discussion. But that is just me ...

[KWhit]

I'm out for a while. I may be able to peek in before lynch, but I'm not sure.

[hoopsguy]

Jack Parkman doesn't usually explain his actions, but in this case I will. Someone needed a second vote to take the heat off hoops, who I would like to keep around for at least today.

Before it is over, I'm going to need a third vote. Which is part of the reason I'm laying back for now - I lose the tie-breaker and I want to put my vote in the best place to keep myself around for tonight's game. However, if I do end up making a self-preservation vote I'll also convey where I would have gone if I had the opportunity to make a consequence-free vote.

[path12]

Jack Parkman would also like to keep Barkeep around for at least another day, although I realize that any of you are less important than I am.

[PurdueBrad]

I'm torn on what to do, but as of right now, I'm going to say:

I vote for Barkeep

Similar reasons as previously stated, the quick votes back-to-back against Hoops caught me off guard and I think that Hoops is actually trying to help us. If I'm not mistaken, this gets most of the heat off of Hoops.

[Lathum]

I think we should have 5 people step it up for tonight. We may be able to learn more and I think it is important to win tonights game so we don't fall 2 back.

[hoopsguy]

Jack Parkman is slipping in and out of 3rd person when referring to himself. I would expect that a superstar like Jack Parkman would never need to use 1st person.

[path12]

Jack Parkman is slipping in and out of 3rd person when referring to himself. I would expect that a superstar like Jack Parkman would never need to use 1st person.

Jack Parkman agrees, and has told Jack Parkman to shape up. Which of course is no problem for Jack Parkman.

[Lathum]

I am also suspiscous of people who volunteer to step it up for 2 reasons.

1. Wolf trying to look heplfull
2. People with less "step ups" will be less likely targeted at night so a wolf who has steooed up can use that as an excuse why he is still alive later in the game.

[hoopsguy]

Agree with your point, Lathum, although I have one important distinction.

- less successful step-ups

Using, or not using a step-up appears to me to be a self-reporting process unless you impact the outcome, which will be reported by ChiefRum. But I don't see a way that we really learn if someone else used one or not. Which again gives the Yankee-lovers room to hide and sows suspicion in our ranks.

[MikeVic]

So when a player is stepping-it-up, they just PM the GM, and don't put anything in here? This is the same for the wolf skills?

[Lathum]

Agree with your point, Lathum, although I have one important distinction.

- less successful step-ups

Using, or not using a step-up appears to me to be a self-reporting process unless you impact the outcome, which will be reported by ChiefRum. But I don't see a way that we really learn if someone else used one or not. Which again gives the Yankee-lovers room to hide and sows suspicion in our ranks.

not sure, but considering our unknown talent levels it seems to me initialy a quantity over quality approach should be taken.

[Lathum]

So when a player is stepping-it-up, they just PM the GM, and don't put anything in here? This is the same for the wolf skills?

wolf skills?

if you mean night actions then yes, just PM the GM.

[MikeVic]

wolf skills?

if you mean night actions then yes, just PM the GM.

Yeah, the bodyguard, seer, etc. Thanks.

[hoopsguy]

Votes as of Post #300:
Barkeep - JE (152), Pass (283), Purdue (291)
Hoops - Barkeep (74), Lathum (75)
NTN - KWhit (212), Path (278)
Purdue - Cronin (160)
Cronin - Torgo (162)

Not voted - Celeval, MikeVic, Hoops, NTN, Gonzo

[MikeVic]

I want to keep hoopsguy on, since he seems to be doing a lot of the work and helping so far. I'll go with the majority right now and

VOTE BARKEEP

so that hoops has a greater chance to survive today.

[st.cronin]

I'm going to move my vote, which is out of character for me (normally I never move my vote on day 1 except as self preservation). But I feel pretty strongly that we'll benefit from having Barkeep and hoopsguy both around. So:

unvote Will Purdue
Vote ntndeacon

[hoopsguy]

If we have a tie between NTN and Barkeep then I believe that Barkeep got the earlier vote - don't think there were any unvotes prior to the first listed votes.

Barkeep - JE (152), Pass (283), Purdue (291), MikeVic (302)
NTN - KWhit (212), Path (278), Cronin (162)
Hoops - Barkeep (74), Lathum (75)
Cronin - Torgo (162)

Not voted - Celeval, Hoops, NTN, Gonzo

[hoopsguy]

I have very little interest in posting the vote that buries Barkeep today. I think he is playing a little frustrated at the moment, but I don't think he comes after me with the gusto he did yesterday as a wolf. It just doesn't seem like a value play for their faction to me.

NTN - I have him with a bunch of other people in the middle of my super-solid Day 1 trust list. A spot that he usually occupies in just about every game we play together based on lack of strong impressions. As of right now I'll vote for him instead of BK. And I'll need to put that vote out in about 15-20 minutes as I don't know if I'll be around for the deadline.

[MikeVic]

You make a good point hoops, and I was voting for Barkeep to make sure you don't go. I don't think either you, Barkeep, or NTN are wolves at this point. I have early suspicions about a couple others, but nothing concrete yet.

I might do an unvote and vote for someone else before the current hour is up.

[Barkeep49]

I'm going to go ahead and put a vote in on Barkeep. He didn't really answer my question about his confusing statements yesterday, and he still has his vote on hoops, who really seems to be part of helping the village.

VOTE BARKEEP49
What question? I thought I had quoted you earlier and asked for you to restate any questions you wanted me to answer. Hoops asked a question which I dutifully answered.

[hoopsguy]

Mike, what have you seen in NTN's play so far that makes you think he is not a wolf, other than just the statistical likelihood that more players are villagers than wolves?

I've obviously put more thought into Barkeep's position/play than just about anyone else in the game, given his early vote on me. If there is something specific about NTN's play that says villager then I'll look hard at voting for another candidate.

[Barkeep49]

I'm fine with NTN being voted off since he's so dangerous UTR. I'm going to be around at lynch but will move my vote that direction now, though obviously it is in my self defense as well.

Unvote hoopsguy
Vote NTN

[Lathum]

UNVOTE HOOPSGUY
VOTE NTNDEACON

lets keep it close.

Obviously NTN will vote for barkeep and vice versa

[st.cronin]

Well, I'd say hoops is off the hook.

[Lathum]

hmmm, interesting.

looks like me and Barkeep are now tied together

[hoopsguy]

Dueling bandwagons emerging! First Barkeep, now NTN.

Votes as of Post #310:
NTN - KWhit (212), Path (278), Cronin (303), Barkeep (309), Lathum (310)
Barkeep - JE (152), Pass (283), Purdue (291), MikeVic (302)
Cronin - Torgo (162)

Not voted - Celeval, Hoops, NTN, Gonzo

[st.cronin]

If and when ntn shows up, he'll almost certainly vote for BK, which means that BK is essentially in the lead.

[hoopsguy]

OK, I'm now in a position where I can post freely in terms of today's vote. With a 5-4 race right now and heading out the door, I'm pretty much compelled to vote for one of these guys or it is a throwaway.

Guys that have personally made me a little nervous: KWhit, Pass, MikeVic. However, I'm not going to be around to lead a largely aimless Day 1 charge at any of these guys so I'll vote on one of the leaders. I'm not expecting deadline voting challenges going forward ...

VOTE NTNDEACON

[MikeVic]

Mike, what have you seen in NTN's play so far that makes you think he is not a wolf, other than just the statistical likelihood that more players are villagers than wolves?

I've obviously put more thought into Barkeep's position/play than just about anyone else in the game, given his early vote on me. If there is something specific about NTN's play that says villager then I'll look hard at voting for another candidate.

I may be wrong, but I believe NTN was first to suggest using 4 step-it-ups at a time. Which we haev been running with since then, and makes so much sense. Why would a wolf give such a key piece of strategy?

[MikeVic]

Is it usually a smart move to mention who you think could be a wolf, and why? Even if it's a wild stab out there?

[MikeVic]

Also, I hope that

DaddyTorgo, Celeval, Path, PurdueBrad

all put in their step-it-ups!

[path12]

Jack Parkman is out until much later tonight.

[Lathum]

Is it usually a smart move to mention who you think could be a wolf, and why? Even if it's a wild stab out there?

absolutly.

It is very suspiscous to hit and run as we call it.

It is also considered bad form, even though there are times I do it on purpose.

[path12]

Also, I hope that

DaddyTorgo, Celeval, Path, PurdueBrad

all put in their step-it-ups!

Jack Parkman did.

[Lathum]

Also, I hope that

DaddyTorgo, Celeval, Path, PurdueBrad

all put in their step-it-ups!

I still think we need 5

[Lathum]

dola- I think DT needs to be looked at closer considering his throw away vote.

[st.cronin]

dola- I think DT needs to be looked at closer considering his throw away vote.

It was hardly a throw away vote, he tried very hard to talk people into voting for me.

[Lathum]

It was hardly a throw away vote, he tried very hard to talk people into voting for me.

lol, true.

[Passacaglia]

What question? I thought I had quoted you earlier and asked for you to restate any questions you wanted me to answer. Hoops asked a question which I dutifully answered.

I replied to that post, and asked a question. You posted later in the thread, but didn't answer the question. Perhaps you missed it? I gave you a while to answer it, before voting for you.

[MikeVic]

Ok, well, the first name that comes to mind is KWhit. He first voted for NTN, who I believe isn't a wolf, with the convenience added that he just didn't want to choose sides in the Barkeep vs hoops battle. But that's the only cause for suspicion I have right now.

The second name that comes to mind is path12. It could just be his character's personality, but he volunteered at least twice to step-it-up. But then he said we should put another high-class player to test out the talent/movie role theory. But someone also mentioned that a wolf could use "I only have a couple step-it-ups left" as a reason why they're hanging around. He voted for hoops without an explanation, until I asked about it. But his reason sounded solid enough. The vote also happened to be NTN, but I would think the wolves would disguise their actions better than back-to-back votes.

So that's what I'm thinking right now. I don't think hoops or NTN are wolves, so that leaves me voting for Barkeep right now to keep the other two aboard.

[MikeVic]

Dola,

The "but then he said we should put another high-class player to test out the talent/movie role theory" is an argument that he isn't a wolf. It sounds like I made it an argument that supports him being a wolf.

[Passacaglia]

I replied to that post, and asked a question. You posted later in the thread, but didn't answer the question. Perhaps you missed it? I gave you a while to answer it, before voting for you.

For the record, I'm referring to post 249. There's a lot of sentiment in here that we don't want to off Barkeep, since he will be valuable in later days, and I do see that -- ntn always makes me nervous since he doesn't post much, which is a double-edged sword for him, since he makes me suspect him more, and doesn't help the village as much. But I think Barkeep is getting a pass based on his history in previous games. That said, I'm willing to change my vote if he answers my question satisfactorily -- that's always been my MO.

[MikeVic]

Double Dola,

And so right now I think that one of KWhit or path12 are wolves (maybe both?), but as you can see I have nothing solid.

[ntndeacon]

We'll get some information on who "steps up" based on the results post from Chief Rum. That should help us start getting a sense of who ranks where in terms of importance. The Scout should be able to augment that if/when he reveals info. I think his value comes in helping us catch a wolf in a lie - viewing someone as high talent who doesn't get their result to come into play when they say they step up, for example. But we should be able to start working on a rough list without his info as we get deeper in the game.

I'm clearly in favor of a structured approach to the "step it up" performances, but I don't want to cram it down people's throats. So, here are some questions I have on how to examine what I've put out there:
- is five the right number of people to have submit a "step it up" performance per night? Too many or too few?
- is there a better way of selecting who goes each night than the number listed in the "Player List"?


sorry if we have the answers to these already, but I think 5 is a good number. we can not have less than 4 I think with 2 wolves and a possible conversion (bribe) to make a collaborator, that 4 would be the minimum but 5 gives us a little safety room. I like it.

only other way to do it than by player list is alphabetically by screen name. I think the player list we have is sufficient though.

[ntndeacon]

I agree that we want a random distribution for step ups today, and likely tomorrow. I still think 5 is too many to give us good info though.

However 3 is too few. I would be ok with 4 but not less than that.

[Lathum]

so we are close to the deadline.

who are the 4 people submiting?

[ntndeacon]

I have very little interest in posting the vote that buries Barkeep today. I think he is playing a little frustrated at the moment, but I don't think he comes after me with the gusto he did yesterday as a wolf. It just doesn't seem like a value play for their faction to me.

NTN - I have him with a bunch of other people in the middle of my super-solid Day 1 trust list. A spot that he usually occupies in just about every game we play together based on lack of strong impressions. As of right now I'll vote for him instead of BK. And I'll need to put that vote out in about 15-20 minutes as I don't know if I'll be around for the deadline.

In my defense, I did mention the need for a schedule for stepping it up early on. (If Iremember right even before you did hoops.) Granted it was just the kernel of that idea, but it was an important thing to look at as we have all seen I believe.

[MikeVic]

so we are close to the deadline.

who are the 4 people submiting?

I listed who I thought is supposed to submit a little further up this page:

DaddyTorgo, Celeval, Path, PurdueBrad. Those were taken from the last post I saw with names listed on the previous page.

[ntndeacon]

Well it looks as if Iam pretty much a goner. I can say how much I liked this chance to be in the bigs. I learned a lot from my mentor, Mr. Taylor.

I do think that path is suspicious. he sems like he is playing an out in front wolf. And he seems to play that role so well.
So that is where I am going.

Vote Path

[DaddyTorgo]

just got in. Will submit now

[DaddyTorgo]

Is it usually a smart move to mention who you think could be a wolf, and why? Even if it's a wild stab out there?


yes. I find it can help stimulate other people's thoughts. And if you die, best not to take anything to the grave with you

[Barkeep49]

I know we've got a lot going on now, but I want to get back to this point, which I didn't get to reply to this morning. First off, sorry I accused you of whining! Secondly, while I didn't follow a lot of what you said earlier yesterday, the thing that really makes me scratch my head is where you talk about hoops gunning for you, when all he had done was talk about the rules, and you had already put a vote on him, leading a mini-bandwagon (maybe lathum's vote would have come out for hoops either way, but the point remains that hoops is in the lead now). Can you explain what you meant by that?
Of course. People naturally go after those who have gone after them. To me hoops was very subtly building a case against me at that time. I referenced this, when asked before, with post numbers of where he was giving innuendo against me without actually giving a vote. I'll further point out that this has played out largely in the way that I stated, where others would pick up his banner and vote against me, without him having to do so. Nothing in this game, right now, is different for me than how hoops would play this as a wolf, such as sidetracking us to this discussion of stepping it up, rather than concentrating on finding the wolves. This is not to say he is a wolf, since part of what makes him a good wolf is how villagerish he is, but again nothing says to me "aha, he must be human".

[DaddyTorgo]

nice vote-change there to swing it onto ntn cronin. Managed to sneak it in without much fanfare hmm? interesting...and on D2 you can claim "well it was a D1 vote"

guys...cronin is smelling more and more rotten by the minute to me. And lathum earns a raised-eyebrow for not noticing how hard i've been trying to get people to vote for cronin/trying to throw suspiscion onto me.

[DaddyTorgo]

and my vote isn't moving fyi. i've played with cronin enough times as a wolf...something is tickling me about him already this game. now like I said, maybe i'm wrong. But given his extremely defensive reaction to what was a single D1 vote...I don't know. He's too smart a player to make that kind of "mistake" play, but maybe I tweaked something in him and made him defensive when he didn't mean to be? One of those posts where you post it and then go "oh shoot" right after you hit submit...

[st.cronin]

nice vote-change there to swing it onto ntn cronin. Managed to sneak it in without much fanfare hmm? interesting...and on D2 you can claim "well it was a D1 vote"

guys...cronin is smelling more and more rotten by the minute to me. And lathum earns a raised-eyebrow for not noticing how hard i've been trying to get people to vote for cronin/trying to throw suspiscion onto me.

Ladies and gentlemen, playing the role of Alan T this game ... DaddyTorgo!

[DaddyTorgo]

Ladies and gentlemen, playing the role of Alan T this game ... DaddyTorgo!

LOL :D:D

[DaddyTorgo]

quiet deadline

[st.cronin]

No vote from Celeval, right? Or PurdueBrad?

[st.cronin]

I submitted a "step it up" order, ftr.

[PurdueBrad]

No vote from Celeval, right? Or PurdueBrad?

I submitted and submitted my baseball powers. Thanks for switching your vote btw, wasn't quite sure what I did to deserve it.

[hoopsguy]

Missed votes also translate into lost "step it ups", which is not ideal.

NTN, assuming that you weren't blowing smoke near the end I'm sorry to hear that we lost a faithful Indian today.

So, I'm curious to see if there are going to be surprises with the "step it up" stuff today - did people follow the plan or chase after glory on their own?

[Chief Rum]

Figures. Probably the one day I will need to rush because of my other job, I hit massive traffic because some boob couldn't hook his boat up to his trailer right. :rolleyes:

Sorry for the wait, everyone. Tabulating votes right now.

[Celeval]

Crap - sorry, had some home stuff happen and couldn't get online an hour ago like I planned.

[Lathum]

And lathum earns a raised-eyebrow for not noticing how hard i've been trying to get people to vote for cronin/trying to throw suspiscion onto me.

You should be the one raising eyebrows for trying so hard considering there is no way you could be so certain barring a hidden game mechanic.

[Chief Rum]

Here is my vote count:

ntndeacon (6)-- KWhit (212), Path12 (278), st.cronin (303), Barkeep49 (309), Lathum (310), hoopsguy (315)
Barkeep (4)-- Jonathan Ezarik (152), Passacaglia (283), PurdueBrad (291), MikeVic (302)
Path (1)-- ntndeacon (336)
st.cronin (1)-- DaddyTorgo (162)

Did not vote-- Celeval, Gonzo

I believe this is correct. ntndeacon is the choice. I will do the writeup.

[Chief Rum]

For much of the day off and leading up to this first critical game against the Orioles, there was stalled debate over who to sit for the rest of the season. Finally, one candidate began to stand out. Once it became clear ntndeacon was to be the choice, the votes piled on.

Manager Lou Brown announced that ntndeacon would sit the rest of the year. In frustration, ntndeacon stalked into the lockerroom, grabbed his things and walked out of the clubhouse. He only left one baseball card on the top shelf--himself. ntndeacon is Rube Baker--and, alas, a villager.

The farmboy catcher has gone home, and the owner's evil plan is one day closer to coming to fruition.

NIGHT GAMES COMING SHORTLY

[Celeval]

Well, we did have three catchers. Sorry, guys, although I don't think any vote of mine would have made a difference in the outcome this time.

[hoopsguy]

Celeval, did you get your "step it up" in before the deadline?

[Celeval]

Celeval, did you get your "step it up" in before the deadline?

I didn't send one in before 7pm.. when I last was on before that, I was still unsure as to whether I was supposed to or not. I sent it at about 7:30, before the tallying, but I don't know if it'll go through.

[Chief Rum]

With somewhat heavy hearts, you prepare for the ballgame against the Orioles.

Before you hit the field, you see the Yankees come back beat the Tigers in extra innings, 6-5, courtesy of a homerun by Clu Heywood. You are 1.5 games back now and need to win tonight to keep pace.

You walk on the field to start the game, but no one walks to catcher. Lou Brown yells, "Hey, where the hell's Jake?"

The umpires and the Orioles stand and watch in bemusement as you all rush back into the clubhouse. Inside, Jake Taylor's locker--aka Celeval's locker--is taped a note.

"Sorry, guys, I gotta go see about a girl."

Apparently, Jake has gone off to see if he can woo back his old girlfriend--and he took the bullpen cart, too, the bastard. He probably won't be back this season.

Now, you're all just pissed. You storm out onto the field, becuase you're angry. Tonight's victim--the Orioles. You pummel them, 12-4, tonight, with contributions from money. But the man of the night is Pedro Cerrano, who crushes two dingers and drives in five runs to lead the way.

You are one game back again. But you are now short two catchers. And somehow, you just know, someone in the owner's office got in touch with that old girlfriend and got her to call Jake tonight.

DAY TWO HAS BEGUN

THE DEADLINE FOR DAY TWO WILL BE 10 P.M. EST/7 P.M. PDT

[DaddyTorgo]

least we won. Who's pedro?

[hoopsguy]

The Orioles learned it is very unwise to steal Jobu's rum.

Looks like the bad guys are targeting key players as well, unless you think that Celeval seemed like the obvious Night 1 victim.

[Lathum]

least we won. Who's pedro?

why? so you can take out our big hitter tommorow?

[Celeval]

Well, damn. Then again...

Werewolf... Rene Russo. Werewolf... Rene Russo...

Have fun, guys. :)

[DaddyTorgo]

why? so you can take out our big hitter tommorow?

flaw in your thinking: i'm not a wolf. My victory conditions are the same as the villager's. I am a simple villager.

[Lathum]

flaw in your thinking: i'm not a wolf. My victory conditions are the same as the villager's. I am a simple villager.

well I find it interesting that no one has claimed Pedro, he has a monster game, and the first thing you ask is "who's Pedro?"

that isn't a tad suspect?

[PurdueBrad]

All I know is that it'll be harder on me to make a lineup if we lose another catcher!!!

[Barkeep49]

I still have no clue which positions have been claimed and not. I know it's in the thread so I could reference it, but since I don't have it memorized I'd have no way of knowing that Pedro is an unclaimed role.

[KWhit]

Damn.

Nice that we got the win tonight. Sucks that we lynched a villager.

[Barkeep49]

If you were a wolf why would you be concerned about losing baseball games?

[DaddyTorgo]

TBH I hadn't gone back to check and see if someone had claimed to be Pedro earlier

[st.cronin]

Here is what I believe are the roles at the moment, based on reading the posts and trying to interpret hints based on my knowledge of the movie.

1. DaddyTorgo - Ivan Molina (random dude)
2. Barkeep - Ken Parkhurst (random dude)
3. KWhit - Tom Kettner (random dude)
4. Passacaglia - Rick "Wild Thing" Vaughn (P)
5. Celeval - hinted at Jake Taylor
6. Lathum - Isuro Tanaka (RF)
7. MikeVic - indispensible to team, talk about retirement, Dorn?
8. hoopsguy - stated position player (not random dude)
9. path12 - Jack Parkman (C/DH)
10. Jonathan Ezarik
11. ntndeacon
12. Gonzo - Willie Mays Hayes (CF)
13. PurdueBrad - Lou Brown (manager)
14. st.cronin - "crafty lefty", Eddie Harris (P)

I think Pedro has to be either hoopsguy, or JE. Or else somebody is fibbing.

[MikeVic]

Maybe my thought outline on why NTN was a villager was off or something, but I was right. ;)

That's ok, folks. You have your veteran leadership right here. Although it's funny we lost two catchers on the first day.

I'll have to see who else says what in their posts, but so far I still only have my two vague suspicions.

[st.cronin]

I'm not sure if this is what Barkeep is asking or not, but we can exclude Pedro from suspicion, no? Assuming we think we know who Pedro is, I mean.

[Lathum]

Am I the only one who thinks it was weird DT wanted to know who Pedro is?

[Barkeep49]

I'm not sure if this is what Barkeep is asking or not, but we can exclude Pedro from suspicion, no? Assuming we think we know who Pedro is, I mean.
Yeah, that's part of it. But in the scheme of things the villagers WANT to win, but the wolves don't care one way or another. If we win all our games while the wolves pick us off one by one they've still achieved a major victory. Seems to me only if it becomes clear that the villagers are winning would the wolves try to sabotage to give themselves a kind of moral victory. As such, why should they care about revealing or not revealing their secret identities? Why shouldn't they try to win games and be scouted highly?

[st.cronin]

Am I the only one who thinks it was weird DT wanted to know who Pedro is?

I don't know. I see your point, but almost everybody had claimed a character by now, so I read it as just "who was it who claimed to be Pedro again?"

Also, if anything, Pedro would make an undesirable target for future nights, since he's already used one of his "uppers."

[st.cronin]

Here's who I'm somewhat suspicious of:

Gonzo (playing very utr)
Mike Vic (was a bit too sure that ntn was good)

[Barkeep49]

Cronin, I like your thinking about Mike Vic.

[st.cronin]

All right, let's do it.

VOTE MIKEVIC

[KWhit]

Cronin, I like your thinking about Mike Vic.

He's come after me pretty hard today for no real reason. I can't say I like that!

:)

[MikeVic]

I'm not a wolf. I just figured that NTN originally brought up the plan that we ended up using, and it made sense. I didn't want to vote hoops, NTN, or Barkeep, but felt that hoops and NTN helped us out the most so far, so the vote defaulted to Barkeep.

[hoopsguy]

I'm Pedro Cerrano. And it has been very hard to play the game without making references to it - seriously, is there a cooler character in the movie than Pedro?

I agreed with Lathum that we should have five people putting actions in. And I was concerned that we had decided too late in the day on who would act. Finally, I wanted to see if Cerrano showed high talent as he is one of the people I would slot higher if I was assigning the order non-randomly. So that is why I put my "step up" in, despite not being on our agreed list.

[hoopsguy]

Also, it looks to me like the wolves targetted one of the players on our list of four - the guy that I think was most likely to be highly rated in a non-random scenario. Food for thought for tomorrow as we determine our group.

My suspicious nature has me thinking that the wolves were hoping to control todays action - that they had 1-2 people in the group and took out another player in the group who might out-talent their represenative(s).

[st.cronin]

Also, it looks to me like the wolves targetted one of the players on our list of four - the guy that I think was most likely to be highly rated in a non-random scenario. Food for thought for tomorrow as we determine our group.

My suspicious nature has me thinking that the wolves were hoping to control todays action - that they had 1-2 people in the group and took out another player in the group who might out-talent their represenative(s).

The vote was between Barkeep (scrub?), hoopsguy (unidentified), and ntn (unidentified). I'm not sure I buy your premise, especially given that there are probably only 2 wolves. I just don't think they would have the ability to control the vote with only 2 voices.

[Passacaglia]

Checking in for the evening. Bad lynch results (sorry ntn), but at least we kept pace with the Yankees.

[hoopsguy]

The vote was between Barkeep (scrub?), hoopsguy (unidentified), and ntn (unidentified). I'm not sure I buy your premise, especially given that there are probably only 2 wolves. I just don't think they would have the ability to control the vote with only 2 voices.

I'm talking about the night action, not the vote - where there were four people that were listed to "step it up". I don't think they set out to control it, per se, but liked how the list shaped up and took a shot by eliminating a player who would potentially rank ahead of them.

[KWhit]

Also, it looks to me like the wolves targetted one of the players on our list of four - the guy that I think was most likely to be highly rated in a non-random scenario. Food for thought for tomorrow as we determine our group.

My suspicious nature has me thinking that the wolves were hoping to control todays action - that they had 1-2 people in the group and took out another player in the group who might out-talent their represenative(s).

Yes, I think they definitely targeted Celeval for a reason. But it could just be to get us to look in the wrong direction.

However, I think there has to be some sort of dice roll mechanic in play here. If the "top" player(s) step it up, there is a bigger modifier than if only a mediocre player steps it up. So the wolves want to know who the best players are in (and who is going to be stepping it up on a given night) in order to try to take them out.

If only 1-2 players step it up (due to inactivity or night kill, etc) then we have a lesser chance of winning our game for the night which plays into the wolves hands. That's probably why they went after Celeval. I can't imagine both the wolves were in the group of 4 listed, but you might be right in that they specifically targeted someone from the list.

[Gonzo]

Here's who I'm somewhat suspicious of:

Gonzo (playing very utr)

Sorry everyone that I couldn't vote on day one, real life sometimes intervenes. Good that we won the game though. And that late charge for ntdeacon is a tad suspicious if you ask me.

[hoopsguy]

The question on the late move towards NTN - was it to save the wolf Barkeep? If so, BK has played a weird wolf game. Not out of question, but that played a role in my vote.

I also expected to see some more movement after I cast what was the last vote on NTN. I was out until after the deadline at that point, with something like two hours left. But there were very few votes late in this one, for whatever that is worth.

[MikeVic]

Whoa, why did I get a vote already?

[Barkeep49]

The swing to save me was nearly simultainous with the swing towards me. There was little shifting because it was a day 1 villager versus villager showdown.

[path12]

Also, it looks to me like the wolves targetted one of the players on our list of four - the guy that I think was most likely to be highly rated in a non-random scenario. Food for thought for tomorrow as we determine our group.



Jack Parkman is very surprised to hear that Jack Parkman was not the hero of the game. Jack Parkman is going to have to think about this.

[Passacaglia]

The swing to save me was nearly simultainous with the swing towards me. There was little shifting because it was a day 1 villager versus villager showdown.

Nearly simultaneous, but not quite simultaneous. You could also say the ntn bandwagon started almost immediately after you took the lead.

That said, I'm also a little worried about DT trying to find out who Pedro was, too.

So with the MikeVic vote -- is the only reasoning for him that he sounded too sure about ntn? Or is there more anyone has against him?

[Barkeep49]

Pass, I think Mike sounded as sure about ntn as he did me and hoops. He seemed fairly confident that all three of us were villagers. Obviously if he were a wolf, he'd know that and might be trying to use that information to gain trust. It's nothing substantial but it's out there.

[hoopsguy]

Jack Parkman is very surprised to hear that Jack Parkman was not the hero of the game. Jack Parkman is going to have to think about this.

Jack Parkman should strongly consider embracing the power of voodoo. Perhaps Jack would like to have his bats blessed?

[Passacaglia]

Pass, I think Mike sounded as sure about ntn as he did me and hoops. He seemed fairly confident that all three of us were villagers. Obviously if he were a wolf, he'd know that and might be trying to use that information to gain trust. It's nothing substantial but it's out there.

Right. I see the theory behind it, but I also recognize that this is his first game. I feel like it's common for new players (myself included) to think they know it all. I remember my 2nd game (maybe it was my 3rd), I was lynched Day 1, after revealing myself as the herbalist. I was sure I knew at least two wolves from that, and I was wrong about both. :) That's why I was just hoping there was more out there to base this on.

[hoopsguy]

OK, so who else submitted a "step-it-up" action yesterday?

I can understand some reluctance about coming forward with this information because it does provide information to the wolves about how many are left. But it also helps us to understand the relative talent levels as we plan our actions.

Also, I'm of the belief that I might as well try to win us another game today. We can have a different set of people submit actions along with mine in an effort to see if there are more talented players on the roster. I still would like to see the majority of the list as randomized as we can make it, but if I'm not included on the list then we give up a chance to learn relative talent levels between yesteday and today.

Please poke holes in this if you see something I'm missing.

[Lathum]

I did not step it up.

[Passacaglia]

OK, so who else submitted a "step-it-up" action yesterday?

I can understand some reluctance about coming forward with this information because it does provide information to the wolves about how many are left. But it also helps us to understand the relative talent levels as we plan our actions.

Also, I'm of the belief that I might as well try to win us another game today. We can have a different set of people submit actions along with mine in an effort to see if there are more talented players on the roster. I still would like to see the majority of the list as randomized as we can make it, but if I'm not included on the list then we give up a chance to learn relative talent levels between yesteday and today.

Please poke holes in this if you see something I'm missing.

I don't mind revealing that I didn't step it up. It looks like based on cronin's idea yesterday, we should go with my list. However, I think I'd rather we just stagger the list again.

[PurdueBrad]

I submitted my step it up power yesterday although it sounds like Cerrano's was much stronger than mine.

[Passacaglia]

I submitted my step it up power yesterday although it sounds like Cerrano's was much stronger than mine.

Did you get any kind of PM to that effect?

[DaddyTorgo]

OK, so who else submitted a "step-it-up" action yesterday?

I can understand some reluctance about coming forward with this information because it does provide information to the wolves about how many are left. But it also helps us to understand the relative talent levels as we plan our actions.

Also, I'm of the belief that I might as well try to win us another game today. We can have a different set of people submit actions along with mine in an effort to see if there are more talented players on the roster. I still would like to see the majority of the list as randomized as we can make it, but if I'm not included on the list then we give up a chance to learn relative talent levels between yesteday and today.

Please poke holes in this if you see something I'm missing.

i did

[DaddyTorgo]

VOTE ST. CRONIN

vote subject to change if something more interesting comes along or if i continue to receive no support

[MikeVic]

Pass, I think Mike sounded as sure about ntn as he did me and hoops. He seemed fairly confident that all three of us were villagers. Obviously if he were a wolf, he'd know that and might be trying to use that information to gain trust. It's nothing substantial but it's out there.

I was just posting what my thoughts were on wolf/non-wolf based on yesterday's activity.

As for the step-it-up, I didn't submit one. I think it's a good idea for hoops to submit again today with a different group of people.

[st.cronin]

I think its a terrible idea for us to be saying at this point whether we stepped it up or not. Now, I know I said that I had between deadline and the processing - but that was partly a bluff. I'm certainly not going to say now whether I actually did or not.

[hoopsguy]

OK, we have a little more time today than we did yesterday - what approach should we take to determine who should "step it up"? Also, based on yesterday being on that list is potentially hazardous to your health.

Barkeep, why would the wolves want to win games? Based on what I've seen in the rules there isn't any kind of role out there that can tell if players are jaking it, sabotaging the team through their "step it up" uses, or anything of the sort. They have multiple victory conditions - why wouldn't they pursue both simultaneously if there is no downside to doing so?

[hoopsguy]

I think its a terrible idea for us to be saying at this point whether we stepped it up or not. Now, I know I said that I had between deadline and the processing - but that was partly a bluff. I'm certainly not going to say now whether I actually did or not.

It makes it a lot harder to figure out the relative levels of talent if people don't share that information. Which is a double-edged sword, as the wolves learn the info as well. This scenario unfolds time and time again in werewolf games. My thoughts are that we benefit from conversation more than we do from "every man for himself".

If we don't share this information, then we are limited to the summary posts by Chief and the Scout to work through this evaluation. Which is fine, up until the Scout dies. Then where do we stand?

[KWhit]

VOTE ST. CRONIN

vote subject to change if something more interesting comes along or if i continue to receive no support

What is your argument against him again?

[Passacaglia]

I think its a terrible idea for us to be saying at this point whether we stepped it up or not. Now, I know I said that I had between deadline and the processing - but that was partly a bluff. I'm certainly not going to say now whether I actually did or not.

What? Why did we go through all that trouble of trying to structure who would step it up, then? I mean, we spent so much time on that -- were you trying to distract us from setting up a structure yesterday? Why didn't you just say back then that you didn't think it was a good idea?

[Passacaglia]

OK, we have a little more time today than we did yesterday - what approach should we take to determine who should "step it up"? Also, based on yesterday being on that list is potentially hazardous to your health.

Barkeep, why would the wolves want to win games? Based on what I've seen in the rules there isn't any kind of role out there that can tell if players are jaking it, sabotaging the team through their "step it up" uses, or anything of the sort. They have multiple victory conditions - why wouldn't they pursue both simultaneously if there is no downside to doing so?

Did BK say the wolves would want to win games, or just that they don't care if we win or lose games? The only reason I can see that a wolf would want to win a game is to gain the trust of the village -- if we win games, but the wolves kill us, it's all lost anyway.

[hoopsguy]

One more thing about revealing players...

There's 14 players, and 16 names. The wolves know which of the 14 are playing, so they can assume the role of the other two. But the wolves don't know who each other are.

However, if a wolf sees an identity being claimed that wasn't in the list of 14 players in the game, they now know who the other wolf is. This is a big advantage for them isn't it? We may have already tipped the scales in the wolves favour.

So when a player is stepping-it-up, they just PM the GM, and don't put anything in here? This is the same for the wolf skills?

Both of the quotes in bold had me blinking hard as I read them yesterday in a "he didn't just say that, did he???" kind of way. If MikeVic wasn't a first-time player I think I would probably have made a bigger deal out of these quotes. But these quotes are the reason I listed Mike as one of the three people who concerned me yesterday before putting in my vote. I understand the thought process on him being confident in the villager/villager showdown yesterday, but it didn't concern me as much as these quotes.

I think Mike would make an excellent candidate for our seer if he isn't the choice today in the voting.

[hoopsguy]

Did BK say the wolves would want to win games, or just that they don't care if we win or lose games? The only reason I can see that a wolf would want to win a game is to gain the trust of the village -- if we win games, but the wolves kill us, it's all lost anyway.

I think the latter - that they don't care. But if I was a wolf and I could pursue my minor victory condition without compromising my major victory condition - and I don't see anything at all in the rules suggesting that there is a conflict between the two - then I would definitely do it. I would expect the same thought process from a collection of wolves who has spent time thinking about the rules even a little bit.

[st.cronin]

What? Why did we go through all that trouble of trying to structure who would step it up, then? I mean, we spent so much time on that -- were you trying to distract us from setting up a structure yesterday? Why didn't you just say back then that you didn't think it was a good idea?

If the wolves know exactly who has "stepped it up" then that's a tremendous advantage for them. Likewise, if the wolves know exactly who is GOING to step it up tonight, that's a tremendous advantage for them. That was the theory behind the idea I put out - it would ration our "step ups" but also create enough deadline havoc that there could be room for some bluff.

[Passacaglia]

Both of the quotes in bold had me blinking hard as I read them yesterday in a "he didn't just say that, did he???" kind of way. If MikeVic wasn't a first-time player I think I would probably have made a bigger deal out of these quotes. But these quotes are the reason I listed Mike as one of the three people who concerned me yesterday before putting in my vote. I understand the thought process on him being confident in the villager/villager showdown yesterday, but it didn't concern me as much as these quotes.

I think Mike would make an excellent candidate for our seer if he isn't the choice today in the voting.

What would you make of the first quote? I guess it rolled off my pretty easily, since I remember that render asked the same thing in his first game. Are you thinking he was told to ask something like that, since it's an easy way to play dumb? It seems villager-esque to me, but that could be a contrivance.

The two quotes combined does make it seem like he could have some kind of role -- but why would you go telling everyone?

[hoopsguy]

When I said he is an excellent candidate for our seer, I meant for our seer to view. Not that I think he is the seer.

[Passacaglia]

When I said he is an excellent candidate for our seer, I meant for our seer to view. Not that I think he is the seer.

Oh. Uh, never mind then. :)

[hoopsguy]

If the wolves know exactly who has "stepped it up" then that's a tremendous advantage for them. Likewise, if the wolves know exactly who is GOING to step it up tonight, that's a tremendous advantage for them. That was the theory behind the idea I put out - it would ration our "step ups" but also create enough deadline havoc that there could be room for some bluff.

Based on what we have seen so far, the wolves can only target one person - so if we have a group of people that are going to submit a "step up" action we lessen the ability for the wolves to skew the outcome.

I don't like giving the wolves the gameplan, but the other end of the spectrum is that everyone decides for themselves and hordes their information. Then each of us has little context to evaluate what has taken place. I would rather try and make informed decisions, even if it gives the wolves more informed decisions. We have the advantage of numbers on them, which hopefully gives us enough time to compile worthwhile information. Like I mentioned earlier, it is a pretty standard werewolf scenario ...

[hoopsguy]

Oh. Uh, never mind then. :)

OK, so lets all post who we think is the seer, bodyguard, scout, and duke :)


Seer - Swaggs
Bodyguard - RendeR
Scout - AlanT
Duke - Peregrine


Please, please, please - no one take this suggestion seriously and actually list players who are in the game!

[MikeVic]

Both of the quotes in bold had me blinking hard as I read them yesterday in a "he didn't just say that, did he???" kind of way. If MikeVic wasn't a first-time player I think I would probably have made a bigger deal out of these quotes. But these quotes are the reason I listed Mike as one of the three people who concerned me yesterday before putting in my vote. I understand the thought process on him being confident in the villager/villager showdown yesterday, but it didn't concern me as much as these quotes.

I think Mike would make an excellent candidate for our seer if he isn't the choice today in the voting.

I thought that wolves didn't know who each other are, but was then told that they do. I also thought the "night actions" were called "wolf skills." I'm not saying if I have a special role or not, and I don't know if saying why I was confused would go against the rules. I'll ask ChiefRum.

[hoopsguy]

Mike, I'm not gunning for you - yet. I've worked with the idea that the posts were indicative of a first-time player and I haven't moved off that position yet. But you are a topic of discussion at the moment since you have votes. And I wanted to expand the scope of the conversation to include some of my concerns from yesterday, since I had listed your name as someone who had me uneasy.

It is kind of funny - the guys who have played a bunch of games together always say that we want new players in the mix because we are tired of playing against the same group. However, when we get a new guy and don't know how to read him based on past games, we struggle. That is where I'm at right now with you ... which is fine and part of the game.

I'm glad you responded, as I believe having a conversation in the thread is a lot more enjoyable than posting thoughts that go unanswered. And I'm glad you are keeping your special role, or lack thereof, to yourself.

[MikeVic]

Mike, I'm not gunning for you - yet. I've worked with the idea that the posts were indicative of a first-time player and I haven't moved off that position yet. But you are a topic of discussion at the moment since you have votes. And I wanted to expand the scope of the conversation to include some of my concerns from yesterday, since I had listed your name as someone who had me uneasy.

It is kind of funny - the guys who have played a bunch of games together always say that we want new players in the mix because we are tired of playing against the same group. However, when we get a new guy and don't know how to read him based on past games, we struggle. That is where I'm at right now with you ... which is fine and part of the game.

I'm glad you responded, as I believe having a conversation in the thread is a lot more enjoyable than posting thoughts that go unanswered. And I'm glad you are keeping your special role, or lack thereof, to yourself.


That's understandable, and I agree that discussion is better. :)

If I were to vote right now, I have no idea who I would vote for based on being wolf or not. Nothing's been said today that has added new information for myself. I would only vote right now as self-preservation. Kind of hard to pick out a wolf right now.

[st.cronin]

For me, the key thing is that he seemed so sure that ntn was a "villager"- on day 2 or later, I'd entertain the idea that he was a seer, but on day 1 it just didn't add up, even with the explanation. I'm certainly not married to my vote, though. Lathum, path12, Gonzo, Pass and KWhit all make me a bit nervous.

[KWhit]

I thought that wolves didn't know who each other are, but was then told that they do. I also thought the "night actions" were called "wolf skills." I'm not saying if I have a special role or not, and I don't know if saying why I was confused would go against the rules. I'll ask ChiefRum.

Not sure why you would think that night actions were called wolf skills unless that's how they were communicated to you. Which leads me to believe you are a wolf.

[KWhit]

For me, the key thing is that he seemed so sure that ntn was a "villager"- on day 2 or later, I'd entertain the idea that he was a seer, but on day 1 it just didn't add up, even with the explanation. I'm certainly not married to my vote, though. Lathum, path12, Gonzo, Pass and KWhit all make me a bit nervous.

Why do I make you nervous?

[st.cronin]

Why do I make you nervous?

No good reason, just haven't really decided what to make of you in this game yet. "Making me nervous" is several steps below "making me suspicious."

[KWhit]

No good reason, just haven't really decided what to make of you in this game yet. "Making me nervous" is several steps below "making me suspicious."

I hear ya. I don't have a good read on anybody yet except the a slight feeling that Hoops is good and MikeVic may be a wolf.

Other than that.... :confused:

[MikeVic]

Not sure why you would think that night actions were called wolf skills unless that's how they were communicated to you. Which leads me to believe you are a wolf.

I've PM'd ChiefRum about my confusion, and how I can convey that here without breaking rules (if that's possible). If it's not possible, then I guess it's just my word.

[path12]

Jack Parkman should strongly consider embracing the power of voodoo. Perhaps Jack would like to have his bats blessed?

No one does the voodoo like yoodoo. Jack Parkman cracks Jack Parkman up.

Jack Parkman also got a weird vibe from the question about who Pedro was, even though Jack Parkman understands that most of the team is anonymous compared to the excellence that is Jack Parkman.

So......

VOTE DADDYTORGO

Jack Parkman reserves the right to change the vote, despite its insight and accuracy.

[hoopsguy]

Here is what I show for early votes, as of Post #426:

MikeVic - Cronin (377)
Cronin - Torgo (401)
Torgo - Path (426)

[path12]

Both of the quotes in bold had me blinking hard as I read them yesterday in a "he didn't just say that, did he???" kind of way. If MikeVic wasn't a first-time player I think I would probably have made a bigger deal out of these quotes. But these quotes are the reason I listed Mike as one of the three people who concerned me yesterday before putting in my vote. I understand the thought process on him being confident in the villager/villager showdown yesterday, but it didn't concern me as much as these quotes.

I think Mike would make an excellent candidate for our seer if he isn't the choice today in the voting.


Jack Parkman noticed those quotes also, and put it down to a rookie move. But Jack Parkman questions the wisdom of speculating on any of the special roles besides the wolves.

[MikeVic]

No one does the voodoo like yoodoo. Jack Parkman cracks Jack Parkman up.

Jack Parkman also got a weird vibe from the question about who Pedro was, even though Jack Parkman understands that most of the team is anonymous compared to the excellence that is Jack Parkman.

So......

VOTE DADDYTORGO

Jack Parkman reserves the right to change the vote, despite its insight and accuracy.

Looks like Pedro is a greater talent than Parkman though. But we have lost two catchers, so I guess we need one around. ;)

[path12]

When I said he is an excellent candidate for our seer, I meant for our seer to view. Not that I think he is the seer.

Jack Parkman is not going to say that Jack Parkman misunderstood the original comment, but rather say that Pedro was not clear enough in conveying the meaning.

[Passacaglia]

Jack Parkman is not going to say that Jack Parkman misunderstood the original comment, but rather say that Pedro was not clear enough in conveying the meaning.

Thanks for having my back, Jack Parkman!

[DaddyTorgo]

kwhit...my case for cronin: snuck a vote onto NTN during the run yesterday with no commentary. D1...checked in and said "havn't read the rules or thread or anything" and then 5 minutes later dropped a vote onto PurdueBrad of all people.

smelled very wolfish to me, so i said so, and he jumped all over me.

[path12]

It is kind of funny - the guys who have played a bunch of games together always say that we want new players in the mix because we are tired of playing against the same group. However, when we get a new guy and don't know how to read him based on past games, we struggle. That is where I'm at right now with you ... which is fine and part of the game.

(OOC) I love having new players in the mix, but I hope they realize that quite often they will end up being lynched early. No offense. ;) (/OOC)

[path12]

I don't have a good read on anybody yet except the a slight feeling that Hoops is good

Jack Parkman is not convinced of that at all.

[MikeVic]

Looking back, wouldn't this have been a better way to keep track of step-it-ups:

Instead of revealing who we are, we would tell Pedro, Hays, Wild Thing, Parkman, or whoever to step-it-up... and it would be up to the people with those identities to step-it-up. But then the wolves couldn't make the connection between movie role and FOFC name?

[path12]

Jack Parkman thinks another option would be to announce after the deadline but before results whether or not someone else decided to step up for once besides Jack Parkman.

[Passacaglia]

What does Jack Parkman think about people who can't be around at deadline?

[KWhit]

kwhit...my case for cronin: snuck a vote onto NTN during the run yesterday with no commentary. D1...checked in and said "havn't read the rules or thread or anything" and then 5 minutes later dropped a vote onto PurdueBrad of all people.

smelled very wolfish to me, so i said so, and he jumped all over me.

Gotcha. I remember that now.

I agree that someone in the ntndeacon run is likely a wolf. I put the first vote on him due to inactivity and left for the day. Then when I came back, I was very surprised to see that he had won the vote.

I wasn't around for the moves, but reading back through them it seemed strange for so many to switch like that without a real clear reason to do so.

Typical day 1 weirdness, at the very least. Not sure if it means anything more than that yet or not.

[hoopsguy]

Hmmm, I really thought that I would get a little more trust for winning the game yesterday than I have received so far, but so be it. For what it is worth, I'll be considering "key player in win" as a fairly big check in the good column in coming days.

As far as "step it up" strategy goes, I've thought hard about having us delay that decision until close to the deadline. We appoint someone that we trust to make the decision for the day and he will definitely step it up. Additionally, he calls out 3-4 other people who are also in the thread near deadline (which will happen now that we have a normal deadline, right???) to submit their step it up action.

That will put the wolves on the defensive in terms of getting their action in against one of those players, but it also makes life tougher on the bodyguard, seer, and scout if they want their actions to be tied to someone who is going to step it up for a given day. And another obvious flaw is if the person doing the picking is a wolf, but if he doesn't make requests to 3-4 other players then we turn up the heat on him. I also think that people in the thread near deadline would act on their own if the appointed picker isn't doing his job.

Anyway, that is one alternate solution that I've been mulling this morning. Don't know that it is the best one, but it should help with obscuring our actions from the wolves.

[KWhit]

Jack Parkman is not convinced of that at all.

This is in reference to my statement that Hoops is looking slightly good in my opinion.

I agree that we don't know anything at this point about his true colors, but we do know that he stepped it up last night which at the very least means that he tried to help us win the game. Could be a wolf ploy, but at least it's something. Something is better than nothing, and at this point, it is a slight indicator toward him being likely good in my book.

[hoopsguy]

If I was getting to pick the step-ups for today, here is who I would want going:

Me - highest talent guy from yesterday, as shown in the results
Torgo
Barkeep
KWhit
Jonathan

The other four are guys who (I think) have claimed guys that were not in the movies. If one of them rates ahead of Pedro Cerrano then that would allow me to put the notion of talent being related to movie prominence to bed. However, if Cerrano is once again the focal point in a win then I'll argue very strongly about the importance of the bigger movie characters playing a larger role in wins.

Having this information allows us to much more closely evaluate night actions. It also helps set priorities for the bodyguard and seer - they should start with the people who have the most impact on us winning games, all other things being equal.

[Passacaglia]

If I was getting to pick the step-ups for today, here is who I would want going:

Me - highest talent guy from yesterday, as shown in the results
Torgo
Barkeep
KWhit
Jonathan

The other four are guys who (I think) have claimed guys that were not in the movies. If one of them rates ahead of Pedro Cerrano then that would allow me to put the notion of talent being related to movie prominence to bed. However, if Cerrano is once again the focal point in a win then I'll argue very strongly about the importance of the bigger movie characters playing a larger role in wins.

Having this information allows us to much more closely evaluate night actions. It also helps set priorities for the bodyguard and seer - they should start with the people who have the most impact on us winning games, all other things being equal.

I don't see a problem with that, and I trust hoops enough to go with this plan.

[Lathum]

OK, so lets all post who we think is the seer, bodyguard, scout, and duke :)


Seer - Swaggs
Bodyguard - RendeR
Scout - AlanT
Duke - Peregrine


Please, please, please - no one take this suggestion seriously and actually list players who are in the game!

hmmm, it's not like hoops to not even realize who is in the game

[KWhit]

If I was getting to pick the step-ups for today, here is who I would want going:

Me - highest talent guy from yesterday, as shown in the results
Torgo
Barkeep
KWhit
Jonathan

The other four are guys who (I think) have claimed guys that were not in the movies. If one of them rates ahead of Pedro Cerrano then that would allow me to put the notion of talent being related to movie prominence to bed. However, if Cerrano is once again the focal point in a win then I'll argue very strongly about the importance of the bigger movie characters playing a larger role in wins.

Having this information allows us to much more closely evaluate night actions. It also helps set priorities for the bodyguard and seer - they should start with the people who have the most impact on us winning games, all other things being equal.

I think that's a pretty good idea. But it may not tell us the whole story. Your guy is obviously the strongest of those that stepped it up last night. If you turn out to be the strongest tonight, that doesn't necessarily mean that the player talent is all based on the movie prominence. It might just mean that you happen to be strongest (either by movie tie-in or by random chance).

I kind of think that we'd get a better indication of how roles tie in with talent if it's not you that we lump in with the no-names, but someone else who hasn't been shown to be a high talent player.

However, part of me wants to use all of your 3 step it ups as fast as possible in case you're nigght killed by wolves. So maybe you should go ahead and step it up tonight anyway.

Thoughts?

[Barkeep49]

I like the idea of testing the group of us not in the movie versus hoops who we know to have powers.

[Barkeep49]

I think that's a pretty good idea. But it may not tell us the whole story. Your guy is obviously the strongest of those that stepped it up last night. If you turn out to be the strongest tonight, that doesn't necessarily mean that the player talent is all based on the movie prominence. It might just mean that you happen to be strongest (either by movie tie-in or by random chance).

I kind of think that we'd get a better indication of how roles tie in with talent if it's not you that we lump in with the no-names, but someone else who hasn't been shown to be a high talent player.

However, part of me wants to use all of your 3 step it ups as fast as possible in case you're nigght killed by wolves. So maybe you should go ahead and step it up tonight anyway.

Thoughts?
I don't think his stepping up gives us evidence that there is a movie tie in but if one of the scrubs steps it up more that gives us conclusive evidence that it's not. The whole it's easier to prove the negative than the positive.

[Lathum]

I'm certainly not married to my vote, though. Lathum, path12, Gonzo, Pass and KWhit all make me a bit nervous.

I find it odd that you would leave daddytorgo off this list despite him coming after you for 2 straight days. Seems to me we could have 2 wolves playing off each other.

[KWhit]

I don't think his stepping up gives us evidence that there is a movie tie in but if one of the scrubs steps it up more that gives us conclusive evidence that it's not. The whole it's easier to prove the negative than the positive.

I'll buy that. I like the idea of hoops going ahead and using his abilities asap anyway, since he's a possible candidate for a wolf kill.

[st.cronin]

I find it odd that you would leave daddytorgo off this list despite him coming after you for 2 straight days. Seems to me we could have 2 wolves playing off each other.

I used to always think, as a villager, that somebody gunning for me must be a wolf. But I think that's almost never true, so I look for other evidence first.

[Passacaglia]

I used to always think, as a villager, that somebody gunning for me must be a wolf. But I think that's almost never true, so I look for other evidence first.

I agree with that line of thinking. I've found that it doesn't help the village to accuse someone *just* because they're accusing you. At least, not early on.

[Lathum]

I used to always think, as a villager, that somebody gunning for me must be a wolf. But I think that's almost never true, so I look for other evidence first.

yeah, but the fact that he doesn't even make you nervous?

[Passacaglia]

Anyway, I don't see much to really make me want to put a vote in for the leading contenders. Looking at post-counts, the single digit club includes Gonzo and JE, and when you count the posts they've made after the game has started, it's 2 each. And while it's only Day 2, the game started Sunday night.

VOTE JONATHAN EZARIK

I'll give Gonzo a little benefit of the doubt since he's new.

[hoopsguy]

I don't think his stepping up gives us evidence that there is a movie tie in but if one of the scrubs steps it up more that gives us conclusive evidence that it's not. The whole it's easier to prove the negative than the positive.

Agreed - it isn't a lock that it is tied to the movies. I could have gotten lucky on random.org. I'm just as willing to see this theory disproven as proven.

However, Chief could easily have answered "random.org" when the question was posed. He didn't, which makes me think that there is a logic behind the talent. Maybe he just enjoyed watching us guess, but tonight will help move closer to a conclusion one way or another. Assuming, of course, that we are heading in this direction for the "step ups".

[st.cronin]

Honestly, I feel completely neutral about DT. If he were hinting at a seer role or something, while gunning for me, that would be completely different. But he's just going by feel/instinct, which is fine.

[MikeVic]

Honestly, I feel completely neutral about DT. If he were hinting at a seer role or something, while gunning for me, that would be completely different. But he's just going by feel/instinct, which is fine.

I was going by feel/instinct/fact with NTN, and you voted for me at the very beginning of D2! What's up with that? I just don't see how someone who so quickly gave a good strategy could be voted on for D1. Yeah, I'm new to the game and all, but voting for a helper on D1 seems kind of out there.

[Lathum]

VOTE ST.CRONIN

I have a hard time believing that he wouldn't even be curious about DT. I think it is to convienient DT was left off his list.

[DaddyTorgo]

i stepped up yesterday too don't forget. but i'd be happy to do so again.

[st.cronin]

I was going by feel/instinct/fact with NTN, and you voted for me at the very beginning of D2! What's up with that? I just don't see how someone who so quickly gave a good strategy could be voted on for D1. Yeah, I'm new to the game and all, but voting for a helper on D1 seems kind of out there.

That's not the way you phrased it yesterday - you said you were "sure" that ntn wasn't a wolf, or at least that's how I remember the substance of it.

Anyway, I'm now more than a little nervous about Lathum.

[st.cronin]

I'm probably out for the remainder of the day in a little bit. So I won't be able to move my vote to save myself or change my "step-it-up" policy.

I'll be around probably another 15 minutes or so.

[path12]

What does Jack Parkman think about people who can't be around at deadline?

Jack Parkman acknowledges that might be an issue.

[hoopsguy]

i stepped up yesterday too don't forget. but i'd be happy to do so again.

Thanks for the reminder - even had it in my notes. With that in mind, how about swapping in Lathum (Isuro Tanaka) as the last person?

[Barkeep49]

That's not the way you phrased it yesterday - you said you were "sure" that ntn wasn't a wolf, or at least that's how I remember the substance of it.

Anyway, I'm now more than a little nervous about Lathum.
I have been nervous about Lathum as well.

[st.cronin]

I have been nervous about Lathum as well.

Care to say more?

[Lathum]

really.

[Lathum]

Interesting.

DT guns for Cronin for 2 days, yet Cronin leaves him off his "nervous" list.

I call out Cronin on it and vote for him.

Cronin becomes "more nervous" about me, I am assuming it is because I voted for him. Yet DT, who voted for him 2 days in a row doesn't bother him at all.

Very odd.

[MikeVic]

That's not the way you phrased it yesterday - you said you were "sure" that ntn wasn't a wolf, or at least that's how I remember the substance of it.

Anyway, I'm now more than a little nervous about Lathum.

I don't think I've ever said that I'm "sure" NTN was a villager. I was just using his offering of strategy at a very early time as an indication that he's good.

I went back and looked at my posts involving my decision to vote... Possts 302, 306, 316, and 327 all mention either Barkeep, NTN, or hoops... and in none of them do I say I'm sure NTN is a villager. I just think he is.

Post 370 was just bragging that I was right NTN was a villager.

[DaddyTorgo]

i am less nervous about lathum than others at this point

[DaddyTorgo]

well i'm innocent lathum. simple villager. hoping this isn't some beautiful wolf-play by you. operating on the assumption for now that it's not. would love to see cronin lynched and a wolf to prove me right though.

[st.cronin]

You make a good point hoops, and I was voting for Barkeep to make sure you don't go. I don't think either you, Barkeep, or NTN are wolves at this point. I have early suspicions about a couple others, but nothing concrete yet.

I might do an unvote and vote for someone else before the current hour is up.

This is the post I'm talking about MikeVic. On day 1, I would not have been willing to say that about ANYBODY.

[Lathum]

well i'm innocent lathum. simple villager. hoping this isn't some beautiful wolf-play by you. operating on the assumption for now that it's not. would love to see cronin lynched and a wolf to prove me right though.

IMO if Cronin is a wolf then you are likely one as well.

The bolded statement stinks to me. It seems to me you are covering your ass in case cronin is lynched you can come out and say "see!!!, I TOLD you all"

[st.cronin]

Interesting.

DT guns for Cronin for 2 days, yet Cronin leaves him off his "nervous" list.

I call out Cronin on it and vote for him.

Cronin becomes "more nervous" about me, I am assuming it is because I voted for him. Yet DT, who voted for him 2 days in a row doesn't bother him at all.

Very odd.

Its not odd at all. DT hasn't done anything BUT gun for me, which is useless but doesn't tell me anything about his allegiance. I was nervous about you to start the day, and you dropped the second vote on me ... making me more nervous about you.

Seems perfectly rational from my point of view.

[MikeVic]

This is the post I'm talking about MikeVic. On day 1, I would not have been willing to say that about ANYBODY.

I'm saying that at that point, I don't think they are. And that's just based on the helping thing. I still kept my vote on Barkeep because I was more confident that hoops and NTN weren't wolves at that point, and that's because it seemed to me like they were trying to help more.

[Lathum]

Its not odd at all. DT hasn't done anything BUT gun for me, which is useless but doesn't tell me anything about his allegiance. I was nervous about you to start the day, and you dropped the second vote on me ... making me more nervous about you.

Seems perfectly rational from my point of view.

Well you and I play very differently then.

When someone guns for me and I KNOW I am good I assume they aren't and it conserns me at least a little bit.

[st.cronin]

Well you and I play very differently then.

When someone guns for me and I KNOW I am good I assume they aren't and it conserns me at least a little bit.

......

slightly more nervous

[DaddyTorgo]

IMO if Cronin is a wolf then you are likely one as well.

The bolded statement stinks to me. It seems to me you are covering your ass in case cronin is lynched you can come out and say "see!!!, I TOLD you all"


stinks? it might stink late in a game, but on d2 i would have nothing to gain by sacrificing another wolf. particularly one who i've been onto since d1 lathum.

[Lathum]

stinks? it might stink late in a game, but on d2 i would have nothing to gain by sacrificing another wolf. particularly one who i've been onto since d1 lathum.

not buying it. Wolf vs wolf is much more effective early on in a game since there are more players and less information out there.

IF you got your hand caught in the cookie jar you would have to make a stetement like that. Considering there is really no way you could be "onto" him since day 1 my assesment seems more likely.

[Barkeep49]

Care to say more?
His quick second vote on hoops. His stating that people who suspect him are more likely to be wolves when he is good, just to give a couple. He's made me uneasy. But, I should point out, that path made me very uneasy a few games ago and he turned out to be good, so I'm not sure how much value I add here.

[Lathum]

My vote on Hoops had been coming since AlanT's game ( hoops hasn't played in a game since) and I changed it when I had to.

[Lathum]

His stating that people who suspect him are more likely to be wolves when he is good, just to give a couple.

I don't see whats odd about that?

[hoopsguy]

My vote on Hoops had been coming since AlanT's game ( hoops hasn't played in a game since) and I changed it when I had to.

Yep, I get that you owe me a lynching for that game which I why I didn't protest your vote yesterday.

[Lathum]

Yep, I get that you owe me a lynching for that game which I why I didn't protest your vote yesterday.

It was more symbolic, I didn't think you would get lynched.

[KWhit]

Anybody have a vote count?

[Lathum]

man it got quiet.

KWhit, what do you think about the possibility DT and Cronin are wolves playing off each other?

[hoopsguy]

This is what I have for the vote count, as of Post #483:
Cronin - Torgo (401), Lathum (456)
MikeVic - Cronin (377)
Torgo - Path (426)
JE - Pass (452)

[KWhit]

man it got quiet.

KWhit, what do you think about the possibility DT and Cronin are wolves playing off each other?

I wouldn't put it past them, but I don't know.

I also am leery of the early vote and then a quote of "if they're a wolf, then you'll see" kind of comments. It's those things that 3-4 days later a wolf can point to to say "see, I told you so" to try to get into a COT.

However, I hesitate to put too much stock in things like that this early. There's usually nothing else to go on, but if you look too closely at every post that could be wolfish, EVERYBODY starts looking like a wolf!

:)

[MikeVic]

I still have no idea. KWhit hasn't said or done anything that would make me think he's a wolf right now. And neither has path. I'm not sure it makes sense to me for both DT and cronin to be wolves. I guess I just don't know what to look for. :)

[KWhit]

Did we ever agree on hoops' idea for step it ups tonight? He mentioned that he would step it up along with all of the no-name players.

I'm one of those, and I'm fine with stepping it up tonight. Does everyone else agree? I want to go ahead and send it in before I leave to go home (in about an hour) in case I can't make it back between then and lynch.

[Gonzo]

I have been nervous about Lathum as well.

Personally, I can't see why anyone would be nervous about Lathum. Doesn't seem particularly suspicious to me. Cronin...however...I'll hold off my vote for now.

[path12]

If DaddyTorgo ends up being a wolf, Jack Parkman will be much more suspicious of Cronin. But Jack Parkman usually finds Cronin hard to read, which should never be taken as a weakness of Jack Parkman but is more convoluted thinking on the part of Cronin.

[MikeVic]

I mean KWhit and path haven't said or done anything today to further my suspicions from yesterday.

And I think if no one else has a better plan for step-it-ups today, we should go with hoops' plan.

[path12]

And Jack Parkman is letting some of you scrubs try and step up into the limelight tonight.

[Barkeep49]

Ok I'm going to assume we're going with the hoops plan and am sending in my PM to that effect now.

CR: Can you update the thread title as I know we're having differing lynch times and want to be lazy rather than checking back on the first page :)

[KWhit]

Ok I'm going to assume we're going with the hoops plan and am sending in my PM to that effect now.


Me too.

[Lathum]

am I supposed to be stepping it up?

[DaddyTorgo]

how about the possibility lathum is a wolf trying to hide behind the dust-cloud that i am stirring up?

[Lathum]

how about the possibility lathum is a wolf trying to hide behind the dust-cloud that i am stirring up?

that makes no sense.

If I was "hiding" I wouldn't say a word, just let you do your thing.

[hoopsguy]

Well, based on the discussion today it is pretty clear that our Seer struck out on Night 1. So time to start working on a voting strategy.

I've also sent in my "step it up" order.

[MikeVic]

If a seer found a werewolf, how would the discussion change? Would the seer come forward and claim to be the seer, and say who they found? Is that how it normally works?

[hoopsguy]

Mike, that usually is the drill. They would out the wolf, the wolf would provide some kind of rebuttal, people would try to determine who is telling the truth.

From there, we would likely lynch one of the two involved parties and if we got it wrong the first time would come back around the next day.

If the seer isn't lynched (it happens from time to time) then he would rely on the bodyguard to protect him that night so he can get one more view in the books. We would applaud his effort in catching a wolf and wave good-bye as the wolves would undoubtedly get him the following night - barring unusual bodyguard rules in the game.

[DaddyTorgo]

i find your play intresting lathum. you're voting with me, yet arguing against me.