WW CV: Transformers (D5, day ends Friday 9 PM EST)

[Passacaglia]

Er, 5 for Lathum, and 4 for The Jackal.

[Lathum]

So I am getting votes because I am here?

That is total crap.

[Passacaglia]

an hour and a half? I only have 13 minutes now till deadline

I don't think he made his change now.

[Lathum]

an hour and a half? I only have 13 minutes now till deadline

huh?

I was talking about when I switched to Pass.

[PurdueBrad]

Trying my best to keep up. As of post 254

Eaglefan 3 - Schmidty (64), Jackal (134), KWhit (170)
Lerriuqs 4 - J23 (122), Darth Vilius (127), LSG (147), GoldenEagle (179)
The Jackal 4 - DaddyTorgo (139), Eaglefan (173), Lathum (224), Autumn (229)
JAG 1 - dubb93 (115)
Lathum 5- Alan T (221), Hoopsguy (237), Passacaglia (238), Danny (239), lerriuqs (247)

[LoneStarGirl]

unvote lerriuqs

Einie Meenie Miney Moe on EF or Lathum so

vote lathum

only because I like what EF said after Lerriquis did his reveal about his role being not as important as a seer

[Lathum]

This is really absurd.

I am more likely to be a wolf because I am on line and Jackal isn't?

This is why people are voting me.

In the future I am going to ne NTNDeacon 1.1 since actually playing the game gets you killed

[GoldenEagle]

UNVOTE Lerriuqs


VOTE Lathum

[Danny]

Unvote Lathum
Vote Jackal

Wow, the runs here are crazy, but I would like to see this vote close here.

[Lathum]

I am the resurrection

Lynch Jackal and I will bring him back to life.

[Danny]

At least we won't have a boring day 1 deadline.

[LoneStarGirl]

Vote count with 7 minutes left?

[Passacaglia]

Lathum 7, The Jackal 5

[JAG]

vote Jackal

Poetic justice would say they should tie and duke it out gladiator style. I honestly would've preferred to vote Pass if we were going third party, but it looks like it's the Lathum - Jackal show.

[Autumn]

I'm holding still. I don't have a particular reason to think J ackal is a wolf, but I don't like crazy runs like this. I can't even keep track tallying the votes, so trying to guess who's wolfing who ...

[JAG]

off to go play with daughter 1

[EagleFan]

I am seeing this as the Telle run last game all over again. The move off lerriuqs and me I can see but this is the second time that a run on Jackal was quickly answered by a counter run.

I have no issue with either a Jackal or Lathum vote but I think they both need to be looked at.

[GoldenEagle]

I hate to spill the beans here, but The Jackal is BumbleBee. Lynch him at your own risk.

[Passacaglia]

Lathum, why would you want to resurrect him?

[LoneStarGirl]

I dont think we should be doing a run on Jackal... especially if he is not here. I dont want to change my vote though because it appears that it will be wasted.

[Passacaglia]

Just to prove your role?

[JAG]

I am the resurrection

Lynch Jackal and I will bring him back to life.

I don't recommend that if he turns out to be a wolf by the way.

[Lathum]

Guys, I can resurrect Jackal after he is lynched.

Gives us a COT of 2 for tomorrow.

[PurdueBrad]

Trying my best to keep up. As of post 269

Eaglefan 3 - Schmidty (64), Jackal (134), KWhit (170)
Lerriuqs 2 - J23 (122), Darth Vilius (127)
The Jackal 6 - DaddyTorgo (139), Eaglefan (173), Lathum (224), Autumn (229), Danny (259), JAG (264)
JAG 1 - dubb93 (115)
Lathum 6- Alan T (221), Hoopsguy (237), Passacaglia (238), lerriuqs (247), lonestargirl (256), Golden Eagle (258)
I think this is right

[LoneStarGirl]

I hate to spill the beans here, but The Jackal is BumbleBee. Lynch him at your own risk.

okay well we definitely dont need to lynch him then. 5 minutes

[Lathum]

Lathum, why would you want to resurrect him?

To prove my role and give us a COT of 2. Worst case scenario I am lying and it is a 1-1 trade.

[Autumn]

Unless he's a wolf. Dude, you hvae to save that power for later. Or wait, will that reveal his role?

[RendeR]

Well I think you're being Lathum, by which I mean a bit dramatic. But I see what you mean, you didn't understand Jag's thinking. However, in Pass's defense, this is Werewolf, and we're supposed to make mountains out of molehills. Especially on day one.



This is why I particularly despise day ones. And to answer someone elses question, If I don't see a need to vote I probably wouldn't, but this game sort of requires a vote for protection purposes. So I'll vote.

VOTE JACKAL

[LoneStarGirl]

if both jackal and lathum are good we have 5 minutes to do a run on jag, or eagle fan

unvote lathum

vote eaglfan

[hoopsguy]

Unvote Pass
Vote Jackal

Is Jackal the only one you could resurrect? If so, why would you vote for him? I don't get that at all.

[LoneStarGirl]

This is why I particularly despise day ones. And to answer someone elses question, If I don't see a need to vote I probably wouldn't, but this game sort of requires a vote for protection purposes. So I'll vote.

VOTE JACKAL

So you are sayin you don believe GE's reveal that Jackal is BumbleBee?

[Danny]

EF revealed as Witness.

[GoldenEagle]

Unless Lathum is a wolf.

[Autumn]

A run on EF? He revealed as Witness.

[Passacaglia]

EagleFan has revealed as the witness.

[EagleFan]

I dont think we should be doing a run on Jackal... especially if he is not here. I dont want to change my vote though because it appears that it will be wasted.

While I have been on the end of a run when not present ad it does suck I don't get the logic of not voting someone who is not here. I understand wanting to give someone a chance but then the wolves would just make a move and go MIA until after the deadline hoping to not be voted because they were not there.

[Passacaglia]

So you are sayin you don believe GE's reveal that Jackal is BumbleBee?

Whoa, I missed that one. What?

[Lathum]

Is Jackal the only one you could resurrect? If so, why would you vote for him? I don't get that at all.

seems obvious it is going to be me or him...

[LoneStarGirl]

EagleFan has revealed as the witness.

Didn't read that I apologize

Now I am at a loss

unvote eaglefan

vote lathum

[Passacaglia]

Is Jackal the only one you could resurrect? If so, why would you vote for him? I don't get that at all.

My guess is that he can resurrect anyone except himself? So he's voting for whoever is not him.

[GoldenEagle]

I repeat, The Jackal is Bumble Bee.

[Danny]

Why not test Lathum's theory out and vote Jackal? If he is lying we will know it.

[hoopsguy]

seems obvious it is going to be me or him...

No, the run on you had not started at this point. I think we have our wolf.

[Lathum]

I cannot resurect myself

[PurdueBrad]

Eaglefan 4 - Schmidty (64), Jackal (134), KWhit (170)
Lerriuqs 2 - J23 (122), Darth Vilius (127)
The Jackal 7 - DaddyTorgo (139), Eaglefan (173), Lathum (224), Autumn (229), Danny (259), JAG (264), RendeR (278)
JAG 1 - dubb93 (115)
Lathum 6- Alan T (221), Hoopsguy (237), Passacaglia (238), lerriuqs (247), Golden Eagle (258), LSG (289)

As of 294

[Passacaglia]

No, the run on you had not started at this point. I think we have our wolf.

I think the role states he can resurrect anyone.

[Lathum]

No, the run on you had not started at this point. I think we have our wolf.

what are you talking about?

I revealed 6 minutes ago. The run started 20 minutes ago.

[LoneStarGirl]

damnit why are we goin for JAckal?

[Passacaglia]

damnit why are we goin for JAckal?

We're having to hope Lathum resurrects him at this point. If he doesn't do it, he's next.

[Danny]

I dont think we should be doing a run on Jackal... especially if he is not here. I dont want to change my vote though because it appears that it will be wasted.

Doesnt really make too much since to let this be your decision making, we all have roles or are evil.

[hoopsguy]

what are you talking about?

I revealed 6 minutes ago. The run started 20 minutes ago.

You voted for the guy you could resurrect when there was one vote on you. I can't see any reason to vote for him as opposed to looking for a new candidate.

[LoneStarGirl]

deadline

[Danny]

what are you talking about?

I revealed 6 minutes ago. The run started 20 minutes ago.

That was a very odd post by Hoops I agree.

[Passacaglia]

UNVOTE LATHUM
VOTE THE JACKAL

[PurdueBrad]

Pass' vote does not count...

[LoneStarGirl]

Doesnt really make too much since to let this be your decision making, we all have roles or are evil.

I dont understand what that means ?

And if Jackal does turn out to be good and Lathum does resurrect him then we should form a nice like 3 person COT I suppose

[PurdueBrad]

DEADLINE

[Autumn]

You voted for the guy you could resurrect when there was one vote on you. I can't see any reason to vote for him as opposed to looking for a new candidate.

Can't he ressurect anybody? I thought he was saying vote for jackal simply becuase he was the next leading candidate.

[Danny]

Crazy day, looks like Pass' vote came too late.

[PurdueBrad]

WRITE-UP TO COME...

[Passacaglia]

Ah well. Luckily, it ended up not being needed.

[Danny]

I dont understand what that means ?

And if Jackal does turn out to be good and Lathum does resurrect him then we should form a nice like 3 person COT I suppose

It means it's not like a situation in a normal game where you might be lynching an absent seer. That might happen here, but no matter what, we are lynching a player with a role or someone evil.

[Autumn]

Gotta go again, back ina few.

[Lathum]

FWIW even though it looks like I will live, I think it is TOTAL CRAP THAT PEOPLE WERE USING JACKAL NOT BEING HERE AS AN EXCUSE TO VOTE ME.


Total bullshit to punish someone for actually playing the game and being online. After 4 years I would have hoped we were more evolved then that.

[Danny]

FWIW even though it looks like I will live, I think it is TOTAL CRAP THAT PEOPLE WERE USING JACKAL NOT BEING HERE AS AN EXCUSE TO VOTE ME.


Total bullshit to punish someone for actually playing the game and being online. After 4 years I would have hoped we were more evolved then that.

I actually agree with this. This is a bit of a tired excuse, especially like I said when we all have roles.

[PurdueBrad]

The Autobots have rushed to the aid of their N.E.S.T. counterparts and are able to fight off the Decepticon threat, which seemed more token than anything. During the battle, there is an odd array of friendly fire. Who could have done it?

The Autobots gather and begin to point fingers. Ultimately, the finger points at The Jackal. "It must be him, his laser is still smoking," someone yells. The Autobots take aim, shooting him down. The Transformer collapses to the ground, with minimal electrical current left in his body.

Someone reaches down, looking at the hologram...You have lynched Bumblebee, the Leadership role.

[RendeR]

Lathum, dude, relax already. You didn't get voted off the planet yet.

If Jackal turns out good you'd better be able to deliver on the ressurection though.

[RendeR]

Ding!

[LoneStarGirl]

FWIW even though it looks like I will live, I think it is TOTAL CRAP THAT PEOPLE WERE USING JACKAL NOT BEING HERE AS AN EXCUSE TO VOTE ME.


Total bullshit to punish someone for actually playing the game and being online. After 4 years I would have hoped we were more evolved then that.

I did not use it as an excuse to vote for you. I used it as a reason to NOT vote Jackal.... and since you and EF had the same amount of votes on you, I choose you. I could have just as easily choose EF, but its a lot more fun to rile your feathers than it is to rile EagleFan's.

[LoneStarGirl]

The Autobots have rushed to the aid of their N.E.S.T. counterparts and are able to fight off the Decepticon threat, which seemed more token than anything. During the battle, there is an odd array of friendly fire. Who could have done it?

The Autobots gather and begin to point fingers. Ultimately, the finger points at The Jackal. "It must be him, his laser is still smoking," someone yells. The Autobots take aim, shooting him down. The Transformer collapses to the ground, with minimal electrical current left in his body.

Someone reaches down, looking at the hologram...You have lynched Bumblebee, the Leadership role.


Wow just like GE said. Good job

[PurdueBrad]

Mikaela Banes steps forward, screaming at her fallen hero. She approaches him, begs him to return to the aid of her and Sam and the human race. With a flicker and a tremble, Bumblebee stirs.

He is risen, bitter and angry, but risen thanks to his human friends.

[RendeR]

I actually agree with this. This is a bit of a tired excuse, especially like I said when we all have roles.


I do agree with his thoughts, just wish he could be less drama-queen-eqsue in his delivery.


I am bothered by Hoopsguys comments.

[Lathum]

I did not use it as an excuse to vote for you. I used it as a reason to NOT vote Jackal.... and since you and EF had the same amount of votes on you, I choose you. I could have just as easily choose EF, but its a lot more fun to rile your feathers than it is to rile EagleFan's.

well I'm glad I can entertain you

[Passacaglia]

Mikaela Banes steps forward, screaming at her fallen hero. She approaches him, begs him to return to the aid of her and Sam and the human race. With a flicker and a tremble, Bumblebee stirs.

He is risen, bitter and angry, but risen thanks to his human friends.


Nice!

[PurdueBrad]

Elsewhere, this conversation is caught by military satellites:

"My Lord, we bow down to you, and beg that you lead us as you had always dreamed."

"I will lead you my Apprentice, you obviously need my help."

In a military listening post, the first voice is identified as Megatron. But who was the second?

[LoneStarGirl]

Well Lathum think about it. If there was a run off of three people, two which haven't been online in a few hours, one of which had a sudden run on him, who would you vote for?

[Danny]

Uh, why did you resurrect bumblebee Mikaela when we need to confirm Lathum or not?

[Schmidty]

Just sitting back down and catching up. The Roto-Rooter guy showed up to pump our septic like 15 minutes before deadline, so I was outside with him, and wasn't able to move my vote or whatever, so sorry about that. After I catch up, I need to make dinner, so yeah.

[Lathum]

Well Lathum think about it. If there was a run off of three people, two which haven't been online in a few hours, one of which had a sudden run on him, who would you vote for?

I wouldn't let the fact that someone wasn't online effect my vote.

You want to vote me for another reason fine, but don't default to me because the other person isn't here. Thats crappy

[PurdueBrad]

I pasted the wrong Mikaela role in the rules, she gets a one time resurrection in general. That is my fault but this was it.

[lerriuqs]

Mikaela Banes steps forward, screaming at her fallen hero. She approaches him, begs him to return to the aid of her and Sam and the human race. With a flicker and a tremble, Bumblebee stirs.

He is risen, bitter and angry, but risen thanks to his human friends.


Doesn't Bumblebee have to be nightkilled for Mikaela to do this?

[EagleFan]

Just sitting back down and catching up. The Roto-Rooter guy showed up to pump our septic like 15 minutes before deadline, so I was outside with him, and wasn't able to move my vote or whatever, so sorry about that. After I catch up, I need to make dinner, so yeah.

vote roto-rooter guy, obviously a wolf using the "slut" ability to keep you from the thread. ;)

[lerriuqs]

I pasted the wrong Mikaela role in the rules, she gets a one time resurrection in general. That is my fault but this was it.

Ok. Clears my question.

[Passacaglia]

I pasted the wrong Mikaela role in the rules, she gets a one time resurrection in general. That is my fault but this was it.

So are you saying it was not Mikaela who did it? I am so confused.

[LoneStarGirl]

Uh, why did you resurrect bumblebee Mikaela when we need to confirm Lathum or not?

I just read the rules and I think its automatic

[lerriuqs]

So are you saying it was not Mikaela who did it? I am so confused.

The rules state that bumblebee had to be nightkilled for a resurrection by Mikaela.

[Lathum]

PB

Did my resurrection count or do I still have my ability?

[Passacaglia]

It looks like Mikaela has to choose to exercise that power.

[PurdueBrad]

I pasted from the wrong rule set for her role. I typed all my rules in Word but because of the smilie issue moved it to Notepad and made a revision. Mikaela gets one resurrection regardless, however there are serious consequences, which are hinted at in the Megatron conversation.

9:30 deadline coming.

[hoopsguy]

I wouldn't let the fact that someone wasn't online effect my vote.

You want to vote me for another reason fine, but don't default to me because the other person isn't here. Thats crappy

I initially voted for you because I thought the run on Jackal was bunk, the two leading candidates had both revealed with pro-village roles, and a person I was leaning towards trusting had voted for you.

You then revealed with a role that suggested you would reveal the person you were voting for - why would you be voting for Jackal if you intended to resurrect him? That made no sense to me.

Your role says that you need to commit to the move prior to the deadline while Mikaela could not submit her action until he was dead. Based on PB's information on order of actions, you clearly did not follow through on your promise to resurrect Bumblebee (identified early by GE) or else it would have been your role doing the resurrection instead of Mikaela.

I'm not sure if we are into Day 2 yet, but I'll be voting for you again as soon as I'm able to do so. If this counts, then

VOTE LATHUM

[EagleFan]

Okay, need to focus on the game. Hopefully I am still around (alive) after the night phase.

[LoneStarGirl]

The rules state that bumblebee had to be nightkilled for a resurrection by Mikaela.

8/19. The Humans- You know Bumblebee's identity but only win if you keep him alive. Mikaela has the power to rally him back from one kill although there may be serious consequences. In other words, if Bumblebee is killed and Mikaela is alive (and chooses to exercise her power), Bumblebee will be resurrected immediately. This power can be used only once.

Where does it say anything about nightkill?

[Autumn]

Wow, what a crazy deadline. I'm going to work on getting my vote log finished for analysis. But good job guys. We managed to stay even and avoid minor catastrophe.

[lerriuqs]

8/19. The Humans- You know Bumblebee's identity but only win if you keep him alive. Mikaela has the power to rally him back from one kill although there may be serious consequences. In other words, if Bumblebee is killed and Mikaela is alive (and chooses to exercise her power), Bumblebee will be resurrected immediately. This power can be used only once.

Where does it say anything about nightkill?

Pass has obviously corrected it. It initially said nightkill.

[GoldenEagle]

By the way Jackal, I am sorry I had to come out with that information but I felt it was in the best interest to save you.

[lerriuqs]

Pass has obviously corrected it. It initially said nightkill.

Sorry PB not Pass

[Schmidty]

vote roto-rooter guy, obviously a wolf using the "slut" ability to keep you from the thread. ;)

He was definitely a slut. I've never seen a plumber with a mesh shirt and hot pink spandex. He asked me what my favorite tea was.

[PurdueBrad]

Out of curiousity, does anybody know how to paste from word w/o those f-ing smilies 'cause that would have made it easier.

Also, this is the only built in 'mechanic' that triggers for my non-mechanic lovers out there.

[Autumn]

8/19. The Humans- You know Bumblebee's identity but only win if you keep him alive. Mikaela has the power to rally him back from one kill although there may be serious consequences. In other words, if Bumblebee is killed and Mikaela is alive (and chooses to exercise her power), Bumblebee will be resurrected immediately. This power can be used only once.

Where does it say anything about nightkill?

I think it was edited,LSG.

[GoldenEagle]

So would a save from Mikalea supersede a resurrection from Lathum? Or was Lathum just FOS?

[lerriuqs]

So would a save from Mikalea supersede a resurrection from Lathum? Or was Lathum just FOS?

Based on this, I'd say it supersedes it.

Out of curiousity, does anybody know how to paste from word w/o those f-ing smilies 'cause that would have made it easier.

Also, this is the only built in 'mechanic' that triggers for my non-mechanic lovers out there.

[DaddyTorgo]

8 minutes before night deadline - what type of choice do i have to make for it?

[Danny]

So would a save from Mikalea supersede a resurrection from Lathum? Or was Lathum just FOS?

It looks like the resurrection Lathum claims is a night ability and bumblebee was brought back immediately according to Mikaela's described role. That said, it doesn't mean Lathum isn't lying.

[PurdueBrad]

I think it was edited,LSG.

It was. I just finished double-checking to make sure all other roles match my master and they do. That is my fault for not double-checking that earlier, so my apologies. This is the way the role was meant to work in my final version.

[Passacaglia]

Okay, so Mikaela resurrected Bumblebee, and not the Resurrectionist?

[JAG]

Like Lathum said though, wouldn't it be a silly role to try and fake? If he's lying, it would be a 1-1 trade of villager for wolf.

[DaddyTorgo]

okay - now i gotta see what went on

[Passacaglia]

I initially voted for you because I thought the run on Jackal was bunk, the two leading candidates had both revealed with pro-village roles, and a person I was leaning towards trusting had voted for you.

You then revealed with a role that suggested you would reveal the person you were voting for - why would you be voting for Jackal if you intended to resurrect him? That made no sense to me.

Your role says that you need to commit to the move prior to the deadline while Mikaela could not submit her action until he was dead. Based on PB's information on order of actions, you clearly did not follow through on your promise to resurrect Bumblebee (identified early by GE) or else it would have been your role doing the resurrection instead of Mikaela.

I'm not sure if we are into Day 2 yet, but I'll be voting for you again as soon as I'm able to do so. If this counts, then

VOTE LATHUM

PB said the order of operations is based on the order it was received. Couldn't it have been that Mikaela submitted her order much earlier in the day? Seems like a no-brainer of an order -- not dependent on how the day plays out.

[hoopsguy]

GE, Lathum would have had to commit his power pre-deadline.

20. The Resurrectionist- This character has the ability resurrect a person immediately after lynching. However, this action must be submitted prior to that lynch and is irreversible. The lynched person's identity will be uncovered as will the person who revives them. Both will be permanently left in disguise mode.

If the action was submitted prior to deadline, that would seem to supercede Mikaela based on PB's answer earlier about order of actions:


I can definitely share it. Any actions that specifically butt up against one another will be determined by order the action was received. For instance, if player A were to pass player B a piece of the All-Spark and a player C was scanning and trying to steal the All-Spark from player A, then I process them in time order. So if player C's order came first, he'll steal the All-Spark before A could give it to B.

Otherwise, there are certain preferences given to the basic roles: Bodyguard block will always be my first processed order and wolf kill will always be my last processed action.

Hope this helps. If there is something more specific or individual, feel free to drop me a PM. If there is a general follow-up, feel free to post it here.

However, it was clearly Mikaela who brought Bumblebee back. Ergo, Lathum is lying.

[Passacaglia]

Also, hoops, I believe the Resurrectionist simply reveals the role of whoever is lynched. I don't get why you think Lathum can only resurrect The Jackal.

[Danny]

GE, Lathum would have had to commit his power pre-deadline.



If the action was submitted prior to deadline, that would seem to supercede Mikaela based on PB's answer earlier about order of actions:



However, it was clearly Mikaela who brought Bumblebee back. Ergo, Lathum is lying.

Oh, I thought this was a night time ability, but you are right.

[lerriuqs]

GE, Lathum would have had to commit his power pre-deadline.



If the action was submitted prior to deadline, that would seem to supercede Mikaela based on PB's answer earlier about order of actions:



However, it was clearly Mikaela who brought Bumblebee back. Ergo, Lathum is lying.

Why is it certain Lathum is lying? Perhaps he is simply superseded by Mikaela's power?

[hoopsguy]

It looks like the resurrection Lathum claims is a night ability and bumblebee was brought back immediately according to Mikaela's described role. That said, it doesn't mean Lathum isn't lying.

No, Lathum's role needs to be submitted prior to the deadline. I'll quote it again:

20. The Resurrectionist- This character has the ability resurrect a person immediately after lynching. However, this action must be submitted prior to that lynch and is irreversible.

[lerriuqs]

Why is it certain Lathum is lying? Perhaps he is simply superseded by Mikaela's power?

Or Mikaela already submitted their action prior to Lathum...

[Danny]

No, Lathum's role needs to be submitted prior to the deadline. I'll quote it again:

Check my post above yours.

[PurdueBrad]

Time check

[Lathum]

I can definitely share it. Any actions that specifically butt up against one another will be determined by order the action was received. For instance, if player A were to pass player B a piece of the All-Spark and a player C was scanning and trying to steal the All-Spark from player A, then I process them in time order. So if player C's order came first, he'll steal the All-Spark before A could give it to B.

Otherwise, there are certain preferences given to the basic roles: Bodyguard block will always be my first processed order and wolf kill will always be my last processed action.

Hope this helps. If there is something more specific or individual, feel free to drop me a PM. If there is a general follow-up, feel free to post it here.



Hoops, how do you gather I never put the order in from this?

Not to mention, my role is like a duke, if I am lying all that has to happen to disprove me is the real resurrectionist comes out and resurrects someone.

[RendeR]

GE, Lathum would have had to commit his power pre-deadline.



If the action was submitted prior to deadline, that would seem to supercede Mikaela based on PB's answer earlier about order of actions:



However, it was clearly Mikaela who brought Bumblebee back. Ergo, Lathum is lying.

Not sure how this is proven here at all.

[PurdueBrad]

PMs on their way out now, write up in 5-10 minutes. Thanks for bearing with me.

[Lathum]

No, Lathum's role needs to be submitted prior to the deadline. I'll quote it again:

I submitted my action one minute prior to deadline.

from the rules


Otherwise, there are certain preferences given to the basic roles

so is it out of the relm of possibilites that BB would be brought back by Mikhela first?

[DaddyTorgo]

FWIW even though it looks like I will live, I think it is TOTAL CRAP THAT PEOPLE WERE USING JACKAL NOT BEING HERE AS AN EXCUSE TO VOTE ME.


Total bullshit to punish someone for actually playing the game and being online. After 4 years I would have hoped we were more evolved then that.


i'm still catching up so idk what happened yet, but fwiw i agree with this post by lathum

[KWhit]

But Hoops, he's claiming to be the ressurectionist. Wouldn't the best thing to do be to lynch someone else and ask Lathum to put in a conditional to resurrect him/her if she turns out to be good? I don't know if he can do that kind of conditional, but it would give us a chance to try to get a free-pass on trying to lynch a wolf and allow him to save him if we're wrong.

And if Lathum is really lying, we'd find out and could lynch him then. Best of both worlds, eh?

[Autumn]

I don't know, I think Hoops has a point here. PB made sure to make clear the order of actions, and this is why, so we can catch someone in a lie. Did Lathum know Jackal was bumblebee andcount on him getting resurrected? It would make great cover.

[J23]

Unfortunately, I got home later than expected. Sorry I wasn't around at deadline as I had planned on, but I'm glad we have a CoT being built at least.

[hoopsguy]

Also, hoops, I believe the Resurrectionist simply reveals the role of whoever is lynched. I don't get why you think Lathum can only resurrect The Jackal.

Look at the sequence:
Post #217:
Eaglefan 7 - Schmidty (64), Alan T (96), Jag (132), Jackal (134), KWhit (170), lerriuqs (195), Hoopsguy (205)
Lerriuqs 5 - Danny (92), J23 (122), Darth Vilius (127), LSG (147), GoldenEagle (179)
The Jackal 3 - DaddyTorgo (139), Eaglefan (173), Passacaglia (214)
JAG 1 - dubb93 (115)
Schmidty 1 - Autumn (119)
Pass 1 - Lathum (151)

AS OF POST 216

Post #221 by Alan T:
Hmm... I guess I don't see a wolf vs wolf reveal against each other. It doesn't hurt to let a possible reveal live longer. if they are what they say they are, they'll likely be night targets sooner then later anyways.

UNVOTE Eaglefan

Vote Lathum

Post #224 by Lathum:
Unvote Pass
Vote Jackal

Post #237 by Hoopsguy:
UNVOTE EAGLEFAN
VOTE LATHUM

Honestly, I trust Alan more than I trust this emerging run at the moment. Will try to get back to change if needed, but the double reveal + run on guy who is not here smells very, very fishy to me.

Post #260 by Lathum:
I am the resurrection

Lynch Jackal and I will bring him back to life.

Why would Lathum commit to bringing back Jackal in this spot? Well, if he is a good guy it is because he has to - he does not have the luxury to wait until after the deadline. But if he is a bad guy then it is because he is bargaining in hopes of not being a D1 lynch.

As a good guy, this is when he puts in his resurrection order. Well, if not at this point then certainly at this point:

Post #268 by GoldenEagle:
I hate to spill the beans here, but The Jackal is BumbleBee. Lynch him at your own risk.

[JAG]

I don't know, I think Hoops has a point here. PB made sure to make clear the order of actions, and this is why, so we can catch someone in a lie. Did Lathum know Jackal was bumblebee andcount on him getting resurrected? It would make great cover.

Lathum couldn't have known. He revealed as the resurrectionist at 8:52 PM EST and GE claimed Jackal was Bumblebee at 8:53 PM EST.

[RendeR]

I don't know, I think Hoops has a point here. PB made sure to make clear the order of actions, and this is why, so we can catch someone in a lie. Did Lathum know Jackal was bumblebee andcount on him getting resurrected? It would make great cover.



While I understand hoops being suspicious of the situation, I think he's being WAY over the top on this. There is a way to test the theory and there certainly other reasons why Mikaela's save was used instead of the ressurectionists. I just don't see a rock solid case here, too many IFs.

Hoops doesn't normally build his case on wet sand like this. And thus I am disturbed by the vehemence of his comments.

[lerriuqs]

Note, DaddyTorgo is an autobot.

[hoopsguy]

RendeR, tell me how wet post #375 is. Along with the order of actions that clearly state that the Resurrectionist has to have the order in before deadline while Mikaela's power is only available after Bumblebee is dead?

[Lathum]

Hoops, I'm not sure what you don't get.

I voted Jackal to try and save myself. when I voted him I didn't commit myself to resurecting anyone at that point I knew however that I could resurect whoever got lynched.

I then sent an order to PB to resurect Jackal if he was the leading vote getter.

What's not to understand?

[RendeR]

Note, DaddyTorgo is an autobot.



Mmmmkay?

[lerriuqs]

RendeR, tell me how wet post #375 is. Along with the order of actions that clearly state that the Resurrectionist has to have the order in before deadline while Mikaela's power is only available after Bumblebee is dead?

None which doesn't preclude Mikaela's power from superseding the Resurrectionist's...

[PurdueBrad]

The recording of Megatron is shocking, something the Decepticon would never risk unless there were something major going on. Optimus Prime and company gather, listening to the recording, realizing that The Fallen has now become the leader of the Decepticons, with his own, unknown power. The celebration of Bumblebee's resurrection has now been off-set by this new fear.

Bumblebee turns to thank his savior, Mikaela Banes...but where is she?

Mikaela is found laying outside the control room, dead with a new tatoo, this one obviously added after death by the Decepticons, but at least her last action was one that mattered. Can you make your existence matter this much?

Hoopsguy was Mikaela and is now gone...

Tomorrow's deadline is 9 pm EST.

[Alan T]

I haven't caught up on everything including the lynch.. so if I repeat something already known, my apology.

I got my night result back and I'm basically a worthless role now according to it. I had the ability to look every night for the fallen. I was told tonight that due to Bumblebee being brought back, the Fallen is now the leader of the decepticons and has joined them. My nightly scan for him will no longer work either.

On that note, I was told prior to that lerriuqs showed no signs to me of being the fallen, but I assume based on the rest of the information that it doesn't matter if he was or not, I wouldn't know any longer anyways.

Anyhows, back to my falcons game and OOTP sim I am running.

[PurdueBrad]

Note, all powers regarding The Fallen are now null and void.

[Lathum]

RendeR, tell me how wet post #375 is. Along with the order of actions that clearly state that the Resurrectionist has to have the order in before deadline while Mikaela's power is only available after Bumblebee is dead?

That doesn't mean the resurection happens prior to the deadline!I put my order in 1 miunte prior to deadline. Maybe Mikhela put her order in 2 minutes before, i don't know all the ins and outs. PB also said certain prefrences are given to certain roles

[Passacaglia]

RendeR, tell me how wet post #375 is. Along with the order of actions that clearly state that the Resurrectionist has to have the order in before deadline while Mikaela's power is only available after Bumblebee is dead?

Can I tell you? I don't think Lathum would have seen himself under any obligation to put in his action, other than being sure he got it in before the deadline. Why would he be in a hurry to do it?

[RendeR]

RendeR, tell me how wet post #375 is. Along with the order of actions that clearly state that the Resurrectionist has to have the order in before deadline while Mikaela's power is only available after Bumblebee is dead?



As stated by PB Mikeala's ability is automatic (check his post clarifying the writeup) from that *I* infer that when bumblebee dies mikeala saves him automatically, regadless of other peoples intent.

If PB can/is willing to clarify that for us we can clear up a sticking point in your logic.

[GoldenEagle]

Great. Way to listen at the end guys.

[JAG]

That sounds ominous.

[JAG]

bah hoops, you've gotta stop dying like this.

[PurdueBrad]

As stated by PB Mikeala's ability is automatic (check his post clarifying the writeup) from that *I* infer that when bumblebee dies mikeala saves him automatically, regadless of other peoples intent.

If PB can/is willing to clarify that for us we can clear up a sticking point in your logic.

Mikaela's resurrection was done via order. The mechanic I mention refers to The Fallen.

[RendeR]

Guess the hoops argument is now moot.

[Danny]

So, Mikaela/Hoops is dead and the fallen has been converted. There was a post about megatron having the convo with the unknown entity prior to night results, so I think it's a safe bet that the conversion was not in place of a night kill and Hoops was likely the night kill

[JAG]

Lots and lots of good info for us on day 1 and although we lose a great villager in hoops, the role they took out had already used its power. Gonna go for now, have a good night all.

[RendeR]

So now we're left with suspicion of Lathum, he could be who he says he is and simply put his order in later than hoops.

He could be a lying scheming suck ass decepticon with balls of pure adamantium.

[PurdueBrad]

He could be a lying scheming suck ass decepticon with balls of pure adamantium.

That would make a great sig...

[Passacaglia]

Great. Way to listen at the end guys.

I don't know how long you were online for, but you revealed with 7 minutes left to deadline, and the other leading vote-getter also revealed with 8 minutes left. If you wanted something else to happen, you need to give more time than that. As it is, I think we got the best possible outcome -- we kept everyone alive and built a COT.

[RendeR]

I don't know how long you were online for, but you revealed with 7 minutes left to deadline, and the other leading vote-getter also revealed with 8 minutes left. If you wanted something else to happen, you need to give more time than that. As it is, I think we got the best possible outcome -- we kept everyone alive and built a COT.


+10

[hoopsguy]

I don't know how long you were online for, but you revealed with 7 minutes left to deadline, and the other leading vote-getter also revealed with 8 minutes left. If you wanted something else to happen, you need to give more time than that. As it is, I think we got the best possible outcome -- we kept everyone alive and built a COT.

Ahem. The hotness is dead on Day 1. No one wins.

[Passacaglia]

Ahem. The hotness is dead on Day 1. No one wins.

Well, I was just talking about how the day went, not the night.

[RendeR]

Ahem. The hotness is dead on Day 1. No one wins.

If only for the fact that you were mikeala I'd disagree with this entirely ;)

[J23]

So, does this look right?

COT
Jackal - Leadership
Lerriuqs - Scanner 1.0
GE

Seer Scanned (still chance of cunning)
DT

Claimed Roles
Lathum - Ressurectionist - not proven

[Danny]

Also, since the Fallen joined the decepticons, I think we now have to assume the starting ratio was 14, autobots, 4 decepticons and 1 fallen, so we are likely at 13 autobots and 5 decepticons now.

[Autumn]

J23, EF claimed Witness as well.

[PurdueBrad]

I'm out for a bit.

My apologies on the mispost of Mikaela's role, that was my mistake but I would rather have the game play out the way I intended then to neuter that or any other role. I'm embarrassed by that mistake and am sorry.

[Autumn]

I need to get some work done. I finished noting all the votes so I'll have something to examine later on.

[J23]

Thanks Autumn, thought I had missed one in there.

COT
Jackal - Leadership
Lerriuqs - Scanner 1.0
GE

Seer Scanned (still chance of cunning)
DT

Claimed Roles
Lathum - Ressurectionist - not proven
EagleFan - Witness - not proven

[RendeR]

All in all not the worst possible outcome on night 1. That said I'm out till sometime tomorrow.

[J23]

I guess I should point out that Lerriuqs could conceivably be a decepticon and lying, but I didn't list them this way in light of there being no counter scanner 1.0 reveal.

[EagleFan]

Thanks Autumn, thought I had missed one in there.

COT
Jackal - Leadership
GE

Seer Scanned (still chance of cunning)
DT

Claimed Roles
Lerriuqs - Scanner 1.0
Lathum - Ressurectionist - not proven
EagleFan - Witness - not proven

Shouldn't it be this way? I don't know that the real scanner 1.0 (if that was fake) would reveal on day one withot getting a scan in prior to outing the fake.

Not saying it was a fake. I pretty much put lerriuqs up above most in the trust list at this time. Just don't want to see us jump the gun. Last game someone got placed on a list of suspects and it seemed that after everyone saw it enough they believed it.

[EagleFan]

Off until after the game... Go Phils!!!!

[LoneStarGirl]

So, does this look right?

COT
Jackal - Leadership
Lerriuqs - Scanner 1.0
GE

Seer Scanned (still chance of cunning)
DT

Claimed Roles
Lathum - Ressurectionist - not proven

If hoops was Mikayla then wouldn't GE be Sam?

[Danny]

If hoops was Mikayla then wouldn't GE be Sam?

Yeah, I'd certainly think so.

[J23]

I questioned putting GE on there at all honestly. I suppose it is glaringly obvious, but I'd hate to do the bad guys' work for them!

[Autumn]

oh and Alan claimed a role having to do with the fallen, didn't he? I don't know if that's the kind of thing you're trying to list.

[lerriuqs]

oh and Alan claimed a role having to do with the fallen, didn't he? I don't know if that's the kind of thing you're trying to list.

Appears he's the intuitive. The reveal came before PB said all roles regarding the fallen weren't any good any more didn't it?

[lerriuqs]

Appears he's the intuitive. The reveal came before PB said all roles regarding the fallen weren't any good any more didn't it?

Yes he did, which would make me inclined to put him very close to being true COT.

[lerriuqs]

Also, since the Fallen joined the decepticons, I think we now have to assume the starting ratio was 14, autobots, 4 decepticons and 1 fallen, so we are likely at 13 autobots and 5 decepticons now.

And 7 are potentially on the CoT...pretty good start if it's accurate...

[Passacaglia]

Decepticons and Fallen will be supplied with extra Autobot names and roles

Just wanted to put this out there, before we get too excited about our COT.

[GoldenEagle]

I don't know how long you were online for, but you revealed with 7 minutes left to deadline, and the other leading vote-getter also revealed with 8 minutes left. If you wanted something else to happen, you need to give more time than that. As it is, I think we got the best possible outcome -- we kept everyone alive and built a COT.

Except for the fact that hoops is dead. Someone who would have helped down the stretch. I tried to sit on the info for as long as possible. I did not want to come forward with it. I thought Bumble Bee was the bodyguard, which could have been disastrous for us. There should have been votes to change to Lathum. Lathum's role is less important (and that is assuming he is telling the truth), there were plenty of people online to change the outcome.

[Passacaglia]

Except for the fact that hoops is dead. Someone who would have helped down the stretch. I tried to sit on the info for as long as possible. I did not want to come forward with it. I thought Bumble Bee was the bodyguard, which could have been disastrous for us. There should have been votes to change to Lathum. Lathum's role is less important (and that is assuming he is telling the truth), there were plenty of people online to change the outcome.

So I guess there was even more reason for you to make your reveal earlier?

[Autumn]

Isn't lynching the guy who can be resurrected the good move? It seems like you're suggesting that hoops wouldn't be dead if we had not lynched Jackal? I don't get it. We came out only down one villager instead of two.

[GoldenEagle]

So I guess there was even more reason for you to make your reveal earlier?

I tried to hold to the information as long as possible, especially with The Jackal not around. I did not want to come out and reveal his role, especially without his blessing. But I felt I had no choice, which is why I waited so long.

[GoldenEagle]

Isn't lynching the guy who can be resurrected the good move? It seems like you're suggesting that hoops wouldn't be dead if we had not lynched Jackal? I don't get it. We came out only down one villager instead of two.

Or we could have lynched Lathum who very well could have turned out to be a wolf. We would still have Hoops and his power to save The Jackal at any point in the future.

We also don't know what the consequences of The Fallen losing their night actions will be.

To say we came out of this smelling like roses is not exactly ture.

[Autumn]

Or we could have lynched Lathum who very well could have turned out to be a wolf. We would still have Hoops and his power to save The Jackal at any point in the future.

We also don't know what the consequences of The Fallen losing their night actions will be.

To say we came out of this smelling like roses is not exactly ture.

I agree we could have switched to Lathum. Personally I was afraid of making a switch with five minutes left. Lathum got pushed so hard so late I was afraid we were getting bamboozled, and a claim like yours could have been a wolf move to finish it.

Why would we still have Hoops? That's the part I don't get. Wasn't he just a nightkill, or am I missing something?

I agree, I don't understand the Fallen part, and what that had to do with Bumblebee. My fault for not watching the movie I guess. Bumblebee was the first Transformer I owned though. Back in his more humble form.

[Passacaglia]

I tried to hold to the information as long as possible, especially with The Jackal not around. I did not want to come out and reveal his role, especially without his blessing. But I felt I had no choice, which is why I waited so long.

I don't have a problem with when you chose to do it, but I don't get why you would try to blame everyone else for not moving off both candidates and finding someone else (when I believe no one else besides EF, lerriuqs, Lathum, and The Jackal had any votes) to get going.

[Passacaglia]

I still think we made the right move. Granted, I didn't realize that Mikeala could resurrect Bumblebee, but even so, according to the rules we knew at that time, she could only do it if he was nightkilled.

My thinking was that we had a shot to let Lathum prove his role, and if we lost The Jackal, at least we would have found a wolf.

[Darth Vilus]

so yeah, that was an action packed first day to say the least. damn hoops, porr guy has real trouble lasting in these games. and i really hate having to work, i miss so much. I'll be working again tomorrow but wed will be ok.

[Darth Vilus]

vote dubb

i want to vote for someone who wasn't on the board today and who didnt reveal a role today. I'll probably change tomorrow morning depending on where u guys are at but if we lynch someone we have no idea on we might have a chance of nabbing an UTR wolf. If not then Lathum can ressurect him (if he's telling the truth) and if not then we can lynch him later. Either way we'll clear somebody

[Darth Vilus]

*resurrect* It's been a long day

[Darth Vilus]

and by lynch him later i meant lathum not dubb. It was a really long day

[Alan T]

If not then Lathum can ressurect him (if he's telling the truth) and if not then we can lynch him later. Either way we'll clear somebody

Reading the role, my impression is that Lathum has to put in his ressurection order prior to finding out the lynch results correct?

Either way I think I'm likely going to vote elsewhere for today. I agree that leaving Lathum alone today makes more sense as he either is the role he says he is and can prove it, or he is a wolf and claimed to be a role that the wolves know is not in the game. My thought is Lathum should resurrect whoever today's lynch ends up being to prove his ability. That way the following happens:

1) He proves he is telling the truth and is added to the COT but resurrects a wolf that we then can have our night-kill role kill at night or we lynch the next day
2) He proves he is telling the truth and is added to the COT AND saves another good guy to be added to the COT
3) He can not prove it and ends up being the next day's lynch target.

[dubb93]

vote dubb

i want to vote for someone who wasn't on the board today and who didnt reveal a role today. I'll probably change tomorrow morning depending on where u guys are at but if we lynch someone we have no idea on we might have a chance of nabbing an UTR wolf. If not then Lathum can ressurect him (if he's telling the truth) and if not then we can lynch him later. Either way we'll clear somebody

I have never been an UTR wolf.

[JAG]

I definitely agree with Alan re: Lathum. We will have information one way or another about him after today's lynch if he fails to resurrect the lynched player.

EF, what did you witness last night?

[PurdueBrad]

Vote Count as of #435

dubb93 (1)- Darth Vilus (430)

[PurdueBrad]

After yesterday's battle with the Decepticons and word of a newer, greater threat rising in the merger of wills between The Fallen and the Decepticons, the Autobots are lucky to have a moment to honor their fallen comrade.

Mikaela Banes is buried in a private military ceremony, an unexpected honor for Sam's "criminal girlfriend", but one she definitely earned. The ceremony is held at a private corner of Arlington National Cemetery.

Nearby, several Decepticons begin raids on National Monuments in an attempt to draw the Autobots into a trap. Will they fall for it?

Deadline is at 9 PM CST today. Good luck!

[dubb93]

So today I want to look at third votes on known/suspected goods yesterday. The third vote is the vote that really establishes a guy as a serious lynch contender so lets look at the initial third votes:

Lerriuqs (suspected scanner 1.0) - Third vote by JAG

The last game I played with Alan, he was uncanny with his intuition. However, I didn't think EF's posts were any different than they usually are so I'm going to go a different way for now.

vote lerriuqs

Eaglefan (Suspected Witness) - Third vote by AlanT

Usually on day 1, I try to see what I can tell about people from their posts. Try to get a feel and vote with that. If I don't really pick up on anything, I just go with someone who hadn't checked in as default.

Since I'm not sure of my availability today, I need to go ahead and get a vote in. I don't really have a great place to put my day 1 vote, so will go with the person who made me think the most about their posts so far.

It was proven long ago that the second vote on someone on day 1 historically has been a far higher percentage of being a villager than a wolf. (To go along with historically there are far more villagers than wolves on day 1 anyways). Eaglefan used this logic earlier as he subtly threw it out as a reason why Schmidty looked bad.

Now, I'm not used to having wolves come out and try to ruffle me up on day 1 or try to draw my attention by putting an early vote on me like Schmidty did, so I guess I just took it for what it was and left it at that.

I guess I just got a weird vibe from Eaglefan's posts last night. So I'll put my vote there. I know it is a third vote on him and only one other person has a vote thus far, but *shrug* its what I have so I'll go with it. I might be back later, hopefully will. But just in case I don't.

Vote Eaglefan

These were both early votes as well. Two wolves looking to set up a villager/villager run off for the day?

Later in the day it came down to Lathum and Jackal, both presumed villagers at the moment. Who cast the third votes?

The Jackal (Bubblebee) - Third vote by DaddyTorgo early, however later in the day when it mattered the third vote was by Passacaglia following duel reveals above.

UNVOTE EAGLEFAN
VOTE THE JACKAL

Lathum (suspected resurrectionist) - Passacaglia following duel reveals with an unvote of Jackal to move to Lathum. The Jackal had already gotten more votes at this point so it isn't fair to bump anyone else up to the third vote spot since they were actually vote #4 or more at the time of the vote.

UNVOTE THE JACKAL
VOTE LATHUM

I'm up for making it interesting, since I doubt EF and lerriuqs will get more votes at this point.

Was Pass going out of his way here to make it villager/villager at the end? I don't think that is out of the realm of possibility.

Vote Pass

[Passacaglia]

I suppose you could look at it that way. My thinking was that the EF/lerriuqs reveals happened late, so we needed to get momentum on anyone we could -- The Jackal had a vote already, so I went that way. But then, The Jackal was starting to look like a runaway, and Lathum had one vote, so he looked like the best candidate to make the vote interesting. There wasn't a lot of time to sit and ponder who would make the best candidate for the day -- if I wanted a meaningful vote, I figured I had to go with whoever had votes. From what I recall, hoops and Danny voted at almost the same time as me, so they probably agree.

Anyway, I like Alan's idea of letting Lathum prove his ability tonight -- I'm not sure I see the downside, really.

[GoldenEagle]

I wonder if the Decepticons found out who Mikaela was (when Bumblebee was resurrected) or if hoops was just the random night kill? Any Decepticons want to go ahead and answer that one for us?

[Alan T]

Anyway, I like Alan's idea of letting Lathum prove his ability tonight -- I'm not sure I see the downside, really.


Yep, the reason I said it at the beginning of the day also was to make sure that it was not viewed by anyone as a way to save a possible wolf.

Heck, as I mentioned last night, since my role is useless now and I'm pretty much an ordinary villager I'm as good a test as any if people wanted to vote me. I'm not really wild on a run away vote for anyone though as it defeats the purpose of a voting history.

I'm guessing I'm not really a vote target though as PB pretty much validated everything I said to show I was telling the truth about my role but my point is I'm pretty set on letting Lathum prove his ability today. if whomever dies today is not ressurected, he will be my vote tomorrow regardless of the reason.

[Alan T]

I wonder if the Decepticons found out who Mikaela was (when Bumblebee was resurrected) or if hoops was just the random night kill? Any Decepticons want to go ahead and answer that one for us?


Well, I'm not a Decepticon, the only thing I noticed was Hoopsguy was on a crusade to either get Lathum lynched or be the lynch himself with the way he was posting. In a very un-Hoopslike fashion, he had many people here questioning him even to what he was up to.

I don't know if the kill was to either set Lathum up or to protect Lathum, but that appeared to me to clearly be the direction today was heading with him alive and his posts last night after the lynch.

I don't know why Hoops was so on the warpath there unless he had more information than he shared, but it pretty much cements in my mind the need to prove Lathum out. But I don't think we need to lynch him to do so, as I previously mentioned.

[Autumn]

I'm trying to work up a vote log. I think I have all the votes, however the vote tallies are proving hard to tabulate. I'll see if Ican finish before work.

[J23]

Thanks for pointing out that they know unused roles Pass. I somehow missed that in the first post.

[EagleFan]

Didn't see anything good on night one. Followed Lathum based on the stir he was making but saw nothing. The obviously doesn't clear him though so it was kind of useless in hindsight.

[Autumn]

All right, this is the best i can do. I know there's an error in the vote counts somewhere, I have one too many votes I think. But I can't find it. Let me know if you do. I need to get to work though. Also, let me know how I can post this so it's clearer to read.

Vote / Post number / Tally / Leaders

Lathum votes EF 55 1 EF
Schmidty votes Alant 58 1-1 EF, Alan
EagleFan votes Schmidty 63 1-1-1 EF, Alan, Schmity
Schmidty unvotes AlanT 64 1-1 EF, Schmidty
Schmidty votes EF 64 2-1 EF, Schmidty
Danny votes Lerriuqs 92 2-1-1 EF, Schmidty-Lerriuqs
AlanT votes EF 96 3-1-1 EF, Schmidty-Lerriuqs
JAG votes Lerriuqs 108 3-2-1 EF, Lerriuqs, Schmidty
Hoops votes jackal 112 3-2-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs, Schmidty-Jackal
Dubb votes JAG 114 3-2-1-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs, Schmidty-Jackal-JAG
autumn votes schmidty 119 3-2-2-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs-Schmidty, Jackal-JAG
EF unvotes schmidty 120 3-2-1-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs, Schmidty-Jackal-JAG
J23 votes lerriuqs 122 3-3-1-1-1 EF-Lerriuqs, Schmidty-Jackal-JAG
Pass votes Jackal 123 3-3-2-1-1 EF-Lerriuqs, Jackal, Schmidty-JAG
darth votes lerriuqs 127 4-3-2-1-1 Lerriuqs, EF, Jackal, Schmidty-JAG
lerriuqs votes danny 128 4-3-2-1-1-1 Lerriuqs, EF, Jackal, Schmidty-JAG-Danny
JAG unvotes Lerriuqs 132 3-3-2-1-1-1 Lerriuqs-EF, Jackal, Schmidty-JAG-Danny
jAG votes EF 132 4-3-2-1-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs, Jackal, S-J-D
jackal votes EF 134 5-3-2-1-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs, Jackal, S-J-D
daddy votes jackal 139 5-3-3-1-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs-Jackal, S-J-D
Pass unvotes Jackal 141 5-3-2-1-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs, Jackal, S-J-D
Pass votes EF 141 6-3-2-1-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs, Jackal, S-J-D
hoops votes lerriuqs 144 6-4-2-1-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs, Jackal, S-J-D
LSG votes lerriuqs 147 6-5-2-1-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs, Jackal, S-J-D
Lathum unvotes EF 151 5-5-2-1-1-1 EF-Lerriuqs, Jackal, Schmidty-JAG-Danny
Lathum votes Pass 151 5-5-2-1-1-1-1 EF-Lerriuqs, Jackal, S-J-D-P
Kwhit votes EF 170 6-5-2-1-1-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs, Jackal, S-J-D-P
EF votes Jackal 173 6-5-3-1-1-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs, Jackal, S-J-D-P
lerriuqs unvotes danny 175 6-5-3-1-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs, Jackal, S-J-P
lerriuqs votes jackal 175 6-5-4-1-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs, Jackal, S-J-P
GE votes lerriuqs 179 6-6-4-1-1-1 EF-Lerriuqs, Jackal, S-J-P
lerriuqs unvotes jackal 195 6-6-3-1-1-1 EF- Lerriuqs, Jackal, S-J-P
lerriuqs votes eaglefan 195 7-6-3-1-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs, Jackal, S-J-P
hoops unvotes lerriuqs 205 7-5-3-1-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs, Jackal, S-J-P
hoops votes eF 205 8-5-3-1-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs, Jackal, S-J-P
pass unvotes EF 214 7-5-3-1-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs, Jackal, S-J-P
Pass votes Jackal 214 7-5-4-1-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs, Jackal, S-J-P
Danny unvotes Lerriuqs 219 7-4-4-1-1-1 EF, Lerriuqs-Jackal, S-J-P
Danny votes Jackal 219 7-5-4-1-1-1 EF, Jackal, Lerriuqs, S-J-P
AlanT unvotes EF 221 6-5-4-1-1-1 EF, Jackal, Lerriuqs, S-J-P
AlanT votes Lathum 221 6-5-4-1-1-1-1 EF, Jackal, Lerriuqs, S-J-P-L
Lathum unvotes Pass 224 6-5-4-1-1-1 EF, Jackal, Lerriuqs, S-J-L
Lathum votes Jackal 224 6-6-4-1-1-1 EF-Jackal, Lerriuqs, S-J-L
Lerriuqs unvotes EF 227 6-5-4-1-1-1 Jackal, EF, Lerriuqs, SJL
Lerriuqs votes jackal 227 7-5-4-1-1-1 Jackal, EF, Lerriuqs, SJL
autumn unvotes schmidty 229 7-5-4-1-1 Jackal, EF, Lerriuqs, JL
autumn votes jackal 229 8-5-4-1-1 Jackal, EF, Lerriuqs, JL
hoops unvotes EF 237 8-4-4-1-1 Jackal, EF-Lerriuqs, JL
hoops votes lathum 237 8-4-4-2-1 Jackal, EF-Lerriuqs, Lathum, JAG
Pass unvotes Jackal 238 7-4-4-2-1 Jackal, EF-Lerriuqs, Lathum, JAG
pass votes lathum 238 7-4-4-3-1 Jackal, EF-Lerriuqs, Lathum, JAG
danny unvotes jackal 239 6-4-4-3-1 Jackal, EF-Lerriuqs, Lathum, JAG
danny votes lathum 239 6-4-4-4-1 Jackal, EF-Lerriuqs-Lathum, JAG
JAG unvotes ef 244 6-4-4-3-1 Jackal, Lerriuqs-Lathum, EF, JAGT
lerriuqs unvotes jackal 247 5-4-4-3-1 Jackal, Lerriuqs-Lathum, EF, JAGT
lerruqs votes lathum 247 5-5-4-3-1 Jackal-Lathum, Lerriuqs, EF, JAG
LSG unvotes lerriuqs 256 5-5-3-3-1 Jackal-Lathum, Lerriuqs-EF, JAG
lsg votes lathum 256 6-5-3-3-1 Lathum, Jackal, Lerriuqs-EF, JAG
GE unvotes lerriuqs 258 6-5-3-2-1 Lathum, Jackal, EF, Lerriuqs, JAG
GE votes lathum 258 7-5-3-2-1 Lathum, Jackal, EF, Lerriuqs, JAG
danny unvotes lathum 259 6-5-3-2-1 Lathum, Jackal, EF, Lerriuqs, JAG
danny votes Jackal 259 6-6-3-2-1 Lathum-Jackal, EF, Lerriuqs, JAG
jag votes jackal 264 7-6-3-2-1 Jackal, Lathum, EF,Lerriuqs, JAG
render votes jackal 278 8-6-3-2-1 Jackal, Lathum, EF,Lerriuqs, JAG
lsg unvotes lathum 279 8-5-3-2-1 Jackal, Lathum, EF,Lerriuqs, JAG
lsg votes ef 279 8-5-4-2-1 Jackal, Lathum, EF,Lerriuqs, JAG
lsg unvotes ef 289 8-5-3-2-1 Jackal, Lathum, EF,Lerriuqs, JAG
lsg votes lathum 289 8-6-3-2-1 Jackal, Lathum, EF,Lerriuqs, JAG

[JAG]

I'll try and reformat that.

[Passacaglia]

Yep, the reason I said it at the beginning of the day also was to make sure that it was not viewed by anyone as a way to save a possible wolf.

Heck, as I mentioned last night, since my role is useless now and I'm pretty much an ordinary villager I'm as good a test as any if people wanted to vote me. I'm not really wild on a run away vote for anyone though as it defeats the purpose of a voting history.

I'm guessing I'm not really a vote target though as PB pretty much validated everything I said to show I was telling the truth about my role but my point is I'm pretty set on letting Lathum prove his ability today. if whomever dies today is not ressurected, he will be my vote tomorrow regardless of the reason.

On my way to work, I was thinking the same thing -- the Decepticons gain nothing from knowing my role, so I don't mind it being me vs. you if it comes to that. Although, I worry that we might be villager-villager, and we wouldn't gain much from the vote. I think it's best for people to vote for who they think is a wolf in the end, with the idea that it's better to learn the role of a wolf than a villager, through resurrection.

[Autumn]

Eaglefan 4 - Schmidty (64), Jackal (134), KWhit (170)
Lerriuqs 2 - J23 (122), Darth Vilius (127)
The Jackal 7 - DaddyTorgo (139), Eaglefan (173), Lathum (224), Autumn (229), Danny (259), JAG (264), RendeR (278)
JAG 1 - dubb93 (115)
Lathum 6- Alan T (221), Hoopsguy (237), Passacaglia (238), lerriuqs (247), Golden Eagle (258), LSG (289)

As of 294


Ah, okay, well this is the last official tally. i see that EF's number is wrong, listed as 4 but with three voters. When I get a chance I'll compare this to what I have and see what's what.

[Autumn]

On my way to work, I was thinking the same thing -- the Decepticons gain nothing from knowing my role, so I don't mind it being me vs. you if it comes to that. Although, I worry that we might be villager-villager, and we wouldn't gain much from the vote. I think it's best for people to vote for who they think is a wolf in the end, with the idea that it's better to learn the role of a wolf than a villager, through resurrection.

Yeah I had thought of the same idea as you guys. But if Lathum resurrects the lynch victim it won't matter either way, we'll either find a wolf or clear a good guy. So no reason to rig an unusual vote I don't think.

[JAG]

Yeah I had thought of the same idea as you guys. But if Lathum resurrects the lynch victim it won't matter either way, we'll either find a wolf or clear a good guy. So no reason to rig an unusual vote I don't think.

Exactly, we should do a normal day of voting. If Lathum's lying, then obviously he's a wolf. Otherwise we basically get all the advantages of lynching (getting rid of a wolf) with none of the disadvantages (won't eliminate a villager), and as a bonus if Lathum's telling the truth, an extra person added to the CoT.

[The Jackal]

By the way Jackal, I am sorry I had to come out with that information but I felt it was in the best interest to save you.

Appreciated.

I'm still catching up, but good lord. I can't get mad at people voting for me just because I wasn't here, I had to go to a dinner party, not any of your faults that I wasn't around. Still, I decided against using my role when I left because it looked like I wasn't going to be a major candidate.. boy did that change. More thoughts when I finish catching up.

[The Jackal]

Craziness. Thanks for the revive, hoops.

The only good thing about the convert is that it happened early instead of late, much easier to track a suspicious voting pattern when it gets close to endgame.

[JAG]

Ok, I think this is correct. Sorry for the sea of blue / green to follow.

Day 1 voting (green = villager, blue = role reveal but not fully cleared, red = wolf)

(55) Lathum votes EF 1 (EF 1)
(58) Schmidty votes AlanT (EF 1, AlanT 1)
(63) EF votes Schmidty (EF 1, AlanT 1, Schmidty 1)
(64) Schmidty unvotes AlanT, votes EF (EF 2, Schmidty 1)
(92) Danny votes lerriuqs (EF 2, Schmidty 1, lerriuqs 1)
(96) AlanT votes EF (EF 3, Schmidty 1, lerriuqs 1)
(108) JAG votes lerriuqs (EF 3, lerriuqs 2, Schmidty 1)
(112) hoops votes Jackal (EF 3, lerriuqs 2, Schmidty 1, Jackal 1)
(114) dubb votes JAG (EF 3, lerriuqs 2, Schmidty 1, Jackal 1, JAG 1)
(119) Autumn votes Schmidty (EF 3, lerriuqs 2, Schmidty 2, Jackal 1, JAG 1)
(120) EF unvotes Schmidty (EF 3, lerriuqs 2, Schmidty 1, Jackal 1, JAG 1)
(122) J23 votes lerriuqs (EF 3, lerriuqs 3, Schmidty 1, Jackal 1, JAG 1)
(123) Pass votes Jackal (EF 3, lerriuqs 3, Jackal 2, Schmidty 1, JAG 1)
(127) Darth votes lerriuqs (lerriuqs 4, EF 3, Jackal 2, Schmidty 1, JAG 1)
(128) lerriuqs votes Danny (lerriuqs 4, EF 3, Jackal 2, Schmidty 1, JAG 1, Danny 1)
(132) JAG unvotes lerriuqs, votes EF (EF 4, lerriuqs 3, Jackal 2, Schmidty 1, JAG 1, Danny 1)
(134) Jackal votes EF (EF 5, lerriuqs 3, Jackal 2, Schmidty 1, JAG 1, Danny 1)
(139) DT votes Jackal (EF 5, lerriuqs 3, Jackal 3, Schmidty 1, JAG 1, Danny 1)
(141) Pass unvotes Jackal, votes EF (EF 6, lerriuqs 3, Jackal 2, Schmidty 1, JAG 1, Danny 1)
(144) hoops unvotes Jackal, votes lerriuqs (EF 6, lerriuqs 4, Jackal 1, Schmidty 1, JAG 1, Danny 1)
(147) LSG votes lerriuqs (EF 6, lerriuqs 5, Jackal 1, Schmidty 1, JAG 1, Danny 1)
(151) Lathum unvotes EF (EF 5, lerriuqs 5, Jackal 1, Schmidty 1, JAG 1, Danny 1, Pass 1)
(170) Kwhit votes EF (EF 6, lerriuqs 5, Jackal 1, Schmidty 1, JAG 1, Danny 1, Pass 1)
(173) EF votes Jackal (EF 6, lerriuqs 5, Jackal 2, Schmidty 1, JAG 1, Danny 1, Pass 1)
(175) lerriuqs unvotes Danny, votes Jackal (EF 6, lerriuqs 5, Jackal 3, Schmidty 1, JAG 1, Pass 1)
(179) GE votes lerriuqs (EF 6, lerriuqs 6, Jackal 3, Schmidty 1, JAG 1, Pass 1)
(195) lerriuqs unvotes Jackal, votes EF (EF 7, lerriuqs 6, Jackal 2, Schmidty 1, JAG 1, Pass 1)
(203) lerriuqs reveals as Scanner 1.0
(205) hoops unvotes lerriuqs, votes EF (EF 8, lerriuqs 5, Jackal 2, Schmidty 1, JAG 1, Pass 1)
(208) EF reveals as Witness
(214) Pass unvotes EF, votes Jackal (EF 7, lerriuqs 5, Jackal 3, Schmidty 1, JAG 1, Pass 1)
(219) Danny unvotes lerriuqs, votes Jackal (EF 7, lerriuqs 4, Jackal 4, Schmidty 1, JAG 1, Pass 1)
(221) AlanT unvotes EF, votes Lathum (EF 6, lerriuqs 4, Jackal 4, Lathum 1, Schmidty 1, JAG 1, Pass 1)
(224) Lathum unvotes Pass, votes Jackal (EF 6, Jackal 5, lerriuqs 4, Lathum 1, Schmidty 1, JAG 1)
(227) lerriuqs unvotes EF, votes Jackal (Jackal 6, EF 5, lerriuqs 4, Lathum 1, Schmidty 1, JAG 1)
(229) Autumn unvotes Schmidty, votes Jackal (Jackal 7, EF 5, lerriuqs 4, Lathum 1, JAG 1)
(237) hoops unvotes EF, votes Lathum (Jackal 7, EF 4, lerriuqs 4, Lathum 2, JAG 1)
(238) Pass unvotes Jackal, votes Lathum (Jackal 6, EF 4, lerriuqs 4, Lathum 3, JAG 1)
(239) Danny unvotes Jackal (Jackal 5, EF 4, lerriuqs 4, Lathum 4, JAG 1)
(244) JAG unvotes EF (Jackal 5, lerriuqs 4, Lathum 4, EF 3, JAG 1)
(247) lerriuqs unvotes Jackal (Lathum 5, Jackal 4, lerriuqs 4, EF 3, JAG 1)
(256) LSG unvotes lerriuqs, votes Lathum (Lathum 6, Jackal 4, lerriuqs 3, EF 3, JAG 1)
(258) GE unvotes lerriuqs (Lathum 7, Jackal 4, EF 3, lerriuqs 2, JAG 1)
(259) Danny unvotes Lathum, votes Jackal (Lathum 6, Jackal 5, EF 3, lerriuqs 2, JAG 1)
(260) Lathum reveals as the Resurrectionist
(264) JAG votes Jackal (Lathum 6, Jackal 6, EF 3, lerriuqs 2, JAG 1)
(268) GE reveals Jackal as Bumblebee
(278) Render votes Jackal (Jackal 7, Lathum 6, EF 3, lerriuqs 2, JAG 1)
(279) LSG unvotes Lathum, votes EF (Jackal 7, Lathum 5, EF 4, lerriuqs 2, JAG 1)
(289) LSG unvotes EF, votes Lathum (Jackal 7, Lathum 6, EF 3, lerriuqs 2, JAG 1)

[Autumn]

Did you figure out what I had wrong, JAG? Or just do it over?

[JAG]

I don't know for sure, you did miss one unvote of Jackal by hoops early on, but I'm not sure if that's where you were missing something. I'm pretty sure this is correct though, it matched PB's vote counts throughout the thread.

[DaddyTorgo]

wowsers thats a lot of work

[dubb93]

Looks like according to the above post that the third vote on ler was J23, not JAG as I had claimed earlier.

vote Lerriuqs

Simply because I'm yet to be able to get any kind of read on him.

[Alan T]

The more I think about it, the more that it makes me uneasy having all of those blue names there suddenly become ok in peoples minds because there was no counter reveal against them. As was mentioned earlier, the wolves knew what roles were not in the game. They are not going to reveal as something on day 1 that causes a counter reveal most likely. It just ends up getting them dead on day 2 or 3 at the latest.

I've come 180 degrees on my thoughts about Eaglefan - lerriuqs from yesterday. I now think that I find it unlikely that they are both wolves. (Neither one might be even). Because of that, I think it makes sense for Lerriuqs to scan Eaglefan tonight, and for whomever our other scanner roles are to check out lerriuqs.

I think it makes absolutely no sense for any of those guys to be today's lynch target however, but I get the feeling of people starting to give passes around to folks a bit too easy in a dangerous way at least. In this game at least, I don't think we should really put players in an elevated state of trust until there is some second party who can confirm somewhat at least, or they have a way of proving their role (such as Lathum should do tonight).

[The Jackal]

I agree with not placing too much trust in them. Problem is it is muddling the vote record from day 1, if we are to believe EF and lerriuqs might both be telling the truth there were villagers leading all day. I have to stare at the votes some more.

[Passacaglia]

I agree with not placing too much trust in them. Problem is it is muddling the vote record from day 1, if we are to believe EF and lerriuqs might both be telling the truth there were villagers leading all day. I have to stare at the votes some more.

I think I agree with you here. There's a lot of people in this game, so there's still a lot we can work with while under the temporary assumption that both EF and lerriuqs are good, but if not, I think we're shooting blindly into the air. Also, I figure that the roles they've claimed are more likely to be in the game, and less likely to be one of the roles not included and that could be claimed by wolves.

[Alan T]

I agree with not placing too much trust in them. Problem is it is muddling the vote record from day 1, if we are to believe EF and lerriuqs might both be telling the truth there were villagers leading all day. I have to stare at the votes some more.


I agree, and counting you , Eaglefan, Lerriuqs and Lathum as the four front runners from yesterday, we know you are good and can trust that. Lathum can prove it to us tonight. That leaves just Eaglefan and Lerriuqs. I'm guessing that we have a shot of having at least 1 wolf among the four, but if Eaglefan and Lerriuqs are telling the truth, it would be horrible of us to lynch them.

So I don't see us having much choice other than leaving that all unresolved for another day to see what works out. (ie: force the wolves to try to kill them off (vs the bodyguard) or risk more days of their actions being used against them.

[JAG]

The more I think about it, the more that it makes me uneasy having all of those blue names there suddenly become ok in peoples minds because there was no counter reveal against them. As was mentioned earlier, the wolves knew what roles were not in the game. They are not going to reveal as something on day 1 that causes a counter reveal most likely. It just ends up getting them dead on day 2 or 3 at the latest.

Oh I agree, I purposefully made the separation of green / blue / red to indicate that blue isn't cleared. This has come up a couple times though, do the wolves really know what roles are not in the game? From PB's comments in the introduction, I was under the impression that they have a big list of villager roles and names, far more than there are villagers, but I didn't think it was clear that they know or don't know what roles are not in the game. If they do know what roles aren't in the game, that makes the reveals more questionable than otherwise.

I've come 180 degrees on my thoughts about Eaglefan - lerriuqs from yesterday. I now think that I find it unlikely that they are both wolves. (Neither one might be even). Because of that, I think it makes sense for Lerriuqs to scan Eaglefan tonight, and for whomever our other scanner roles are to check out lerriuqs.

If we're going to use this strategy, EF and lerriuqs should coordinate when they send in their orders. Assuming they're both telling the truth, lerriuqs can only scan EF if he is in Transformer mode, so either EF would have to forego using his power tonight or wait until after lerriuqs scans him to do so (even then waiting might not work depending on where scan / witness fall in PB's global output of orders).

[Alan T]

Transformer names, while for show/flavor, are oftentimes tied into powers and win conditions. I would discourage a name reveal, as you'll see further down in the rules. In addition, Decepticons and Fallen will be supplied with extra Autobot names and roles in case this occurs anyway. Also, please do not read into the wording of PMs too much as they will be individualized and dramatized for player enjoyment.




This is what someone quoted last night, it says they are given both names and roles to prevent against a mass reveal

[lerriuqs]

The more I think about it, the more that it makes me uneasy having all of those blue names there suddenly become ok in peoples minds because there was no counter reveal against them. As was mentioned earlier, the wolves knew what roles were not in the game. They are not going to reveal as something on day 1 that causes a counter reveal most likely. It just ends up getting them dead on day 2 or 3 at the latest.

I've come 180 degrees on my thoughts about Eaglefan - lerriuqs from yesterday. I now think that I find it unlikely that they are both wolves. (Neither one might be even). Because of that, I think it makes sense for Lerriuqs to scan Eaglefan tonight, and for whomever our other scanner roles are to check out lerriuqs.

I think it makes absolutely no sense for any of those guys to be today's lynch target however, but I get the feeling of people starting to give passes around to folks a bit too easy in a dangerous way at least. In this game at least, I don't think we should really put players in an elevated state of trust until there is some second party who can confirm somewhat at least, or they have a way of proving their role (such as Lathum should do tonight).

The problem with this is that I need to scan them while they're in Transformer mode. I assume if Eaglefan tails someone, he'll switch to disguise mode so that I won't be able to scan him. Thus makes it a bit tougher to figure out who to scan since I'm essentially guessing as to whether they use their night powers or elect to go into disguise mode.

[Alan T]

The problem with this is that I need to scan them while they're in Transformer mode. I assume if Eaglefan tails someone, he'll switch to disguise mode so that I won't be able to scan him. Thus makes it a bit tougher to figure out who to scan since I'm essentially guessing as to whether they use their night powers or elect to go into disguise mode.


Ok, well I don't want to prevent someone from doing their job if they are telling the truth.

[Alan T]

The problem with this is that I need to scan them while they're in Transformer mode. I assume if Eaglefan tails someone, he'll switch to disguise mode so that I won't be able to scan him. Thus makes it a bit tougher to figure out who to scan since I'm essentially guessing as to whether they use their night powers or elect to go into disguise mode.


Since I no longer have any ability that is worthwhile, I won't be using anything at night any more. So if you are having to guess where to go each night, you won't have to guess with me if you feel I am worth a scan at any point.

[EagleFan]

The problem with this is that I need to scan them while they're in Transformer mode. I assume if Eaglefan tails someone, he'll switch to disguise mode so that I won't be able to scan him. Thus makes it a bit tougher to figure out who to scan since I'm essentially guessing as to whether they use their night powers or elect to go into disguise mode.

I have no problem being scanned and cleared but am very wary of being told to not use my power so I can be scanned. I doubt that I will be left around too much longer and it seems like it would benefit the wolves if I didn't use my power.

[JAG]

This is what someone quoted last night, it says they are given both names and roles to prevent against a mass reveal

All players got a chance to see the extra names / roles in the introduction. That list would satisfy the direct quote from the rules regarding the wolves knowing extra names / roles. Villagers don't know which ones are not in the game (at least I don't, I presume others don't as well). It is not explicitly stated that wolves do or do not know which names / roles are in the game. Sorry if I wasn't being clear on that.

[EagleFan]

Since I no longer have any ability that is worthwhile, I won't be using anything at night any more. So if you are having to guess where to go each night, you won't have to guess with me if you feel I am worth a scan at any point.

What ability did you have, must have missed that somewhere (trying to listen to a conference call while this is going on so I am too lazy to look it up ;) ).

[lerriuqs]

I have no problem being scanned and cleared but am very wary of being told to not use my power so I can be scanned. I doubt that I will be left around too much longer and it seems like it would benefit the wolves if I didn't use my power.

Agreed. If anything, the other scanner should be scanning you or did last night.

[lerriuqs]

I haven't caught up on everything including the lynch.. so if I repeat something already known, my apology.

I got my night result back and I'm basically a worthless role now according to it. I had the ability to look every night for the fallen. I was told tonight that due to Bumblebee being brought back, the Fallen is now the leader of the decepticons and has joined them. My nightly scan for him will no longer work either.

On that note, I was told prior to that lerriuqs showed no signs to me of being the fallen, but I assume based on the rest of the information that it doesn't matter if he was or not, I wouldn't know any longer anyways.

Anyhows, back to my falcons game and OOTP sim I am running.

Stated right before this...

Note, all powers regarding The Fallen are now null and void.

[lerriuqs]

All players got a chance to see the extra names / roles in the introduction. That list would satisfy the direct quote from the rules regarding the wolves knowing extra names / roles. Villagers don't know which ones are not in the game (at least I don't, I presume others don't as well). It is not explicitly stated that wolves do or do not know which names / roles are in the game. Sorry if I wasn't being clear on that.

And assuming they don't know that, you'd assume they'd be less likely to make a Day 1 fake reveal...

[Autumn]

My life has gotten several steps crazier than it was yesterday so I'm not going to be able to chat much in here. So far I agree with most of what was said. I hope that the other scanner will scan lerriuqs (if that makes sense transformer wise) to be sure we're not letting a wolf guide us by the nose. Also, given that we have at least some players who I think can interfere with night actions or take advantage of them, I don't think we should say too much in thread about what people will be doing at night.

[Autumn]

My trust list for the moment:

Clear:
GoldenEagle
The Jackal

Not Voting for due to reveals/scans:
Lerriuqs
DaddyTorgo
Lathum
EagleFan
Lerriuqs
AlanT

Unsure of for gut reasons:
Passacaglia
LonestarGirl
dubb93

No read:
Darth Vilius
JAG
Schmidty
J23
RendeR
KWhit

Unfortunately I don't have anything but gut right now. I took too long compiling the vote list and the rest of my day is filled up. I would like to vote for one of my gut reads up there but will hold on and see if any of them turn up in anyone else's analysis.

[Passacaglia]

All players got a chance to see the extra names / roles in the introduction. That list would satisfy the direct quote from the rules regarding the wolves knowing extra names / roles. Villagers don't know which ones are not in the game (at least I don't, I presume others don't as well). It is not explicitly stated that wolves do or do not know which names / roles are in the game. Sorry if I wasn't being clear on that.

PB's rules say that the Decepticons will be supplied with "extra" Autobot names and roles. I take that to mean they're given a list of names and a list of roles, and told that these are the names and roles not in the game, and that the rest are.

PB, can you confirm that?

[Passacaglia]

My trust list for the moment:

Clear:
GoldenEagle
The Jackal

Not Voting for due to reveals/scans:
Lerriuqs
DaddyTorgo
Lathum
EagleFan
Lerriuqs
AlanT

Unsure of for gut reasons:
Passacaglia
LonestarGirl
dubb93

No read:
Darth Vilius
JAG
Schmidty
J23
RendeR
KWhit

Unfortunately I don't have anything but gut right now. I took too long compiling the vote list and the rest of my day is filled up. I would like to vote for one of my gut reads up there but will hold on and see if any of them turn up in anyone else's analysis.

By unsure of, do you mean suspicious of? Otherwise I'm not sure how it's really different from no read.

[J23]

PB's rules say that the Decepticons will be supplied with "extra" Autobot names and roles. I take that to mean they're given a list of names and a list of roles, and told that these are the names and roles not in the game, and that the rest are.

PB, can you confirm that?

I would be very surprised if this wasn't the case. I don't know how else you can read it really.

[PurdueBrad]

PB's rules say that the Decepticons will be supplied with "extra" Autobot names and roles. I take that to mean they're given a list of names and a list of roles, and told that these are the names and roles not in the game, and that the rest are.

PB, can you confirm that?

This is true.

[Darth Vilus]

so who did everyone want to vote for? I'm heading out to work in a few so i need to know so i can either switch my vote or leave it where it is

[J23]

The problem with this is that I need to scan them while they're in Transformer mode. I assume if Eaglefan tails someone, he'll switch to disguise mode so that I won't be able to scan him. Thus makes it a bit tougher to figure out who to scan since I'm essentially guessing as to whether they use their night powers or elect to go into disguise mode.

One option to clear someone would be scanner 1.0 and scanner 2.0 scanning the same person the same night. IF we have both of these roles in game, it would ensure that we don't miss both of our scans in a night (1.0 scanning a disguise, 2.0 scanning a transformer). Since Lerriuqs is already revealed, he could state who he is scanning to make this happen if 2.0 follows along w/ his plan. I'm not sure that this is the best use of these abilities, but thought I'd throw it out there.

[Darth Vilus]

One option to clear someone would be scanner 1.0 and scanner 2.0 scanning the same person the same night. IF we have both of these roles in game, it would ensure that we don't miss both of our scans in a night (1.0 scanning a disguise, 2.0 scanning a transformer). Since Lerriuqs is already revealed, he could state who he is scanning to make this happen if 2.0 follows along w/ his plan. I'm not sure that this is the best use of these abilities, but thought I'd throw it out there.

do you think we would have two scanners? But we have a witness and an intuitive so It's very possible.

[J23]

do you think we would have two scanners? But we have a witness and an intuitive so It's very possible.

I have no idea. I don't have any evidence that Lerriuqs is even a scanner 1.0 other than his claim. That's why I stressed IF we have both scanners. I think the bad guys knowing the roles makes this a lot more tricky.

[Darth Vilus]

That's true J23.

Alright here is what i propose (I have to say it now because i'm going to head off to work), we lynch someone who wasn't in the mix yesterday, dubb, LSG, JAG, J23, Danny, Myself, etc. so we can have a free reveal assuming that Lathum is telling the truth. if he is lying then we got ourslves a decepticon. And then the scanner(s) can do whatever they feel like doing.

[Autumn]

One option to clear someone would be scanner 1.0 and scanner 2.0 scanning the same person the same night. IF we have both of these roles in game, it would ensure that we don't miss both of our scans in a night (1.0 scanning a disguise, 2.0 scanning a transformer). Since Lerriuqs is already revealed, he could state who he is scanning to make this happen if 2.0 follows along w/ his plan. I'm not sure that this is the best use of these abilities, but thought I'd throw it out there.

I'd have to look back through the roles carefully, but I would be afraid that telegraphing things like this would give the wolves a way to mess with the scan. But maybe that's not the case.

[Autumn]

By unsure of, do you mean suspicious of? Otherwise I'm not sure how it's really different from no read.

Sorry, not great headings. Yes, but unsure of I mean suspicious. Just my gut reads.

[Danny]

Sorry, not great headings. Yes, but unsure of I mean suspicious. Just my gut reads.

Apparently I wasn't even worthwhile putting on your list :(

[Danny]

It definitely seems clear that there will be a good possibility of fake role reveals throughout this game. I think it is very dangerous to clear someone just because of a role reveal.

Regarding the Lathum stuff. I lean towards thinking Hoops would have known how is power worked, but the nice thing is we can 100% confirm Lathum or not without having to lynch him. Still, at this point I am not sure where I intend to go with my vote.

[Autumn]

Apparently I wasn't even worthwhile putting on your list :(

Shit, I knew I'd miss someone. I should have counted, lol. I'm providing plenty of proof of how little brain space I have for this right now.

You would be in the No Read list. Not that my lists really mean anything. I just wanted to post my thoughts since there's not much happening here and I'm not really ready to vote.

[Alan T]

I'd have to look back through the roles carefully, but I would be afraid that telegraphing things like this would give the wolves a way to mess with the scan. But maybe that's not the case.


That was something I was concerned about earlier when I welcomed a scan as well, but looking through the roles, I didn't see anything there that interfere with it.

The only things close were the cunning wolf role and the role that could block someone's action. But neither of those are what you are talking about here (I think).

I'm not sure fully how I feel about the coordinated scan idea as I'm guessing that would mean lerriuqs would have to announce his target for whomever is the other scanner to follow. But that puts too much power in lerriuqs hands if he is indeed bad and lying to us.

I don't see though how we'll ever get good scans with so many people being in one mode or another without the coordination though.

[Danny]

I don't see though how we'll ever get good scans with so many people being in one mode or another without the coordination though.

It's much more risk/reward since there is the potential for two successful scans, but also for none.

[J23]

My hope is that the other seer (if we have one) would have scanned Lerriuqs night one, and would know whether or not they could follow Lerriuqs lead. Of course, if they didn't scan him, they could on some night rather than following the pattern that Lerriuqs requested.

Given that there is a wolf power to block someone's action,

[J23]

oops, hit post too soon somehow...

Given that there is a wolf power to block someone's action, it would still be pretty easy to disrupt the coordinated scan, but it's not unlikely that the block would be used on the seer even without the coordination.

[Lathum]

boom chack a lacking in.

I have a stupid busy day today. Have to write a paper, go to class, then probably go for a run when I get home.

So far it looks like little action on the voting front.

I'll probably check back in a few times to see what develops.

I would also caution that we not be to cavalier with who is going to be scanned, etc...

[KWhit]

Pretty quiet day so far.

I agree with the idea that we look elsewhere tonight from our main candidates yesterday.

And I don't like the idea of the seer telling us who he will be scanning each night. That seems like a bad idea, even if there is a second seer out there.

[Autumn]

Time is running out for me. I'll be gone for the evening, so will probably miss deadline. The only votes so far, I think, are on dubb, one of my gut reads. I'd be pleased to have a runoff between two of my reads, so I'm going to vote another one. I'll be on for a little while longer to see if I need to switch.

For the record, Pass just pinged me with a lot of vote movement yesterday. I haven't had time to examine it, and given how little we know i don't think i'd be able to parse much. But it just struck me as someone trying to make something happen, and I don't know what. Nothing tangible, just gut, but I need to vote somewhere.

VOTE PASSACAGLIA

[Passacaglia]

I think you mean the only vote is on me? Maybe you're misreading a vote count of something, because dubb voted for me.

[Passacaglia]

Anyway, I'll agree that I was trying to make something happen. I hate days where nothing happens -- we don't really get any info out of them.

[Schmidty]

Checking in guys. Busy day today. I'll try to catch up ASAP.

[Autumn]

I think you mean the only vote is on me? Maybe you're misreading a vote count of something, because dubb voted for me.

Oh, my mistake if so. I hadn't looked back. I thought I remembered someone voting dubb, for the same reason I would - that he's been practically nonexistent. Then as soon as he was voted, dubb appeared with a bunch of analysis. Seemed fishy to me.

I was thinking there was a vote on dubb and that was it. I didn't remember a vote on you, Pass. I'll wait for an official vote count, but if it's just on you, I'll vote dubb instead.