Werewolf CLXVI - The Drenai Saga (GAME OVER - VILLAGE WINS!)

[The Jackal]

Vote Count (as of post 498):

4 - Raven - HomerSimpson98 (343), Zinto (387), fontisian (432), timmae (497)
3 - fontisian - Raven (330), saldana (354), Chief Rum (401)
3 - Grover - path12 (271), cheekimonk (417), JAG (465)
3 - Suicane75 - britrock88 (331), Grover (344), EagleFan (481)
1 - EagleFan - Suicane75 (478)

[EagleFan]

You are much more aggressive than I remember Font.

I remember an aggressive font being a good font.

[Raven]

If we go raven and he's village is font next then? Need help here..

Looks like 50% or more chance I'm gone, and I'm a villager.
Good luck all!

[JAG]

Unvote Grover
Vote Raven

Let's reduce shenanigan possibilities.

[Raven]

I could switch to Grover to tie it up but I won't. I'm a villager.

[cheekimonk]

Just to break the tension, this game reminds me of a tweet from a friend: If someone says, "Hey, I'm only human," look at them sideways and say, "That sure does sound like something a robot would say..."

[Suicane75]

Also, this is gross. I am waiting for Suicane to move his vote because it makes almost no sense at this point to be on EF.

Eh, we have a leader. I'm staying where I am.

[The Jackal]

Deadline

[The Jackal]

I lied

[The Jackal]

Deadline for reals

[HomerSimpson98]

Ugh I don't feel as confident now as I did earlier.

[The Jackal]

Vote Count:

5 - Raven - HomerSimpson98 (343), Zinto (387), fontisian (432), timmae (497), JAG (504)
3 - fontisian - Raven (330), saldana (354), Chief Rum (401)
3 - Suicane75 - britrock88 (331), Grover (344), EagleFan (481)
2 - Grover - path12 (271), cheekimonk (417)
1 - EagleFan - Suicane75 (478)

[The Jackal]

Another day, another execution, another begrudging acceptance of fate.

Raven was a common soldier.

Fear begins to settle heavily upon you now as the numbers dwindle. It is almost as if the dark magic can sense it and feeds off of it. There seems to be the occasional chill in the air, unnatural in high summer. Will you all wake up in the morning?

[The Jackal]

You awake the following morning to the feeling of the earth moving. At first your sleep-addled mind believes it to be an earthquake but as your senses focus you realize that it is the steady beat of thousands of drums. The Nadir army is nearly ready for you. As you make your way to the communal areas, you notice that another soldier has been slain.

timmae was a common soldier.

Day 3 begins - will an infiltrator be discovered today?

[EagleFan]

On the bright side, no roles lost yet...

[EagleFan]

vote cheekimonk

Not changing that vote today.

[britrock88]

If we have 4 wolves, were at 8:4, which gives us one more mislynch without allowing wolves to reach parity.

[EagleFan]

Day One:

Post Time Voter Vote Unvote
76 4:07 Narcizo britrock88
80 7:04 Zinto GoldenEagle
81 7:11 JAG saldana
82 7:45 EagleFan Zinto
88 8:11 timmae Grover
96 9:57 Grover Suicane75
101 10:29 Chief Rum Raven
108 11:43 Raven Suicane75
112 11:57 cheekimonk timmae
123 12:25 Suicane75 Grover
128 12:28 britrock88 JAG
134 12:43 path12 britrock88
152 14:18 britrock88 timmae JAG
160 15:50 EagleFan Zinto
161 15:52 EagleFan Raven
163 15:57 JAG GoldenEagle saldana
166 16:25 Narcizo GoldenEagle britrock88
174 16:55 Chief Rum Suicane75 Raven
176 17:19 timmae JAG Grover
177 17:23 Suicane75 GoldenEagle Grover
180 18:06 HomerSimpson98 fontisian
189 18:35 JAG fontisian GoldenEagle
190 18:35 GoldenEagle Suicane75
192 18:42 Raven fontisian Suicane75
197 18:58 cheekimonk britrock88 timmae
204 19:11 path12 GoldenEagle britrock88
207 19:13 EagleFan GoldenEagle Grover
214 19:34 Grover fontisian Suicane75
216 20:02 JAG Suicane75 fontisian
223 20:25 GoldenEagle fontisian Suicane75
237 20:49 EagleFan Raven GoldenEagle
239 21:22 cheekimonk Raven britrock88
240 21:37 timmae GoldenEagle JAG
242 21:48 EagleFan fontisian Raven
244 21:54 fontisian GoldenEagle Raven

[EagleFan]

Day One

6 - GoldenEagle - Zinto (80), Narcizo (166), Suicane75 (177), path12 (204), timmae (240), fontisian (244)
5 - fontisian - HomerSimpson98 (180), Raven (192), Grover (214), GoldenEagle (223), EagleFan (242)
2 - Suicane75 - Chief Rum (174), JAG (216)
1 - timmae - britrock88 (152)
1 - Raven - cheekimonk (239)

[EagleFan]

Crud, Raven's vote should be in green on that day one final vote post.

[fontisian]

Lost of green on my lynch. That leaves Homer or Grover as possible scum, yeah?

EF: If my unaligned pairs are correct, cheek being scum would narrow a four man wolfteam down to four possible worlds:
<style type="text/css"><!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}--></style><table dir="ltr" style="table-layout:fixed;font-size:13px;font-family:arial,sans,sans-serif;border-collapse:collapse;border:1px solid #ccc" border="1" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><colgroup><col width="62"><col width="51"><col width="57"><col width="54"></colgroup><tbody><tr style="height:21px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;cheek&quot;]">cheek</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;cheek&quot;]">cheek</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;cheek&quot;]">cheek</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;cheek&quot;]">cheek</td></tr><tr style="height:27px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;grover&quot;]">grover</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;grover&quot;]">grover</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;homer&quot;]">homer</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;saldana&quot;]">saldana</td></tr><tr style="height:21px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;homer&quot;]">homer</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;saldana&quot;]">saldana</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;saldana&quot;]">saldana</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;suicane&quot;]">suicane</td></tr><tr style="height:21px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;saldana&quot;]">saldana</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;zinto&quot;]">zinto</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;suicane&quot;]">suicane</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;zinto&quot;]">zinto</td></tr></tbody></table>
Thoughts?

[fontisian]

Actually, I'm inclined to discount the first world, as it would mean the GE lynch consisted entirely of townies. So let's narrow that to:
<style type="text/css"><!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}--></style><table dir="ltr" style="table-layout:fixed;font-size:13px;font-family:arial,sans,sans-serif;border-collapse:collapse;border:1px solid #ccc" border="1" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><colgroup><col width="51"><col width="57"><col width="54"></colgroup><tbody><tr style="height:21px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;cheek&quot;]">cheek</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;cheek&quot;]">cheek</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;cheek&quot;]">cheek</td></tr><tr style="height:27px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;grover&quot;]">grover</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;homer&quot;]">homer</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;saldana&quot;]">saldana</td></tr><tr style="height:21px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;saldana&quot;]">saldana</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;saldana&quot;]">saldana</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;suicane&quot;]">suicane</td></tr><tr style="height:21px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;zinto&quot;]">zinto</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;suicane&quot;]">suicane</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;zinto&quot;]">zinto</td></tr></tbody></table>

[JAG]

I noticed D1 that cheek switched to Raven without comment towards the end of the day.

[EagleFan]

With Raven being a villager I am inclined to give Grover a pass. I can't get a read on Homer or Zinto. Will have to go back over the course of events to see what happened.

[saldana]

Actually, I'm inclined to discount the first world, as it would mean the GE lynch consisted entirely of townies. So let's narrow that to:
<style type="text/css"><!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}--></style><table dir="ltr" style="table-layout:fixed;font-size:13px;font-family:arial,sans,sans-serif;border-collapse:collapse;border:1px solid #ccc" border="1" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><colgroup><col width="51"><col width="57"><col width="54"></colgroup><tbody><tr style="height:21px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;cheek&quot;]">cheek</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;cheek&quot;]">cheek</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;cheek&quot;]">cheek</td></tr><tr style="height:27px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;grover&quot;]">grover</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;homer&quot;]">homer</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;saldana&quot;]">saldana</td></tr><tr style="height:21px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;saldana&quot;]">saldana</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;saldana&quot;]">saldana</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;suicane&quot;]">suicane</td></tr><tr style="height:21px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;zinto&quot;]">zinto</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;suicane&quot;]">suicane</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;zinto&quot;]">zinto</td></tr></tbody></table>

care to fill us in on what your little grid is?...i have never seen this before and am interested to see what level of associations this is supposed to be

[Suicane75]

Vote: EagleFan

[fontisian]

care to fill us in on what your little grid is?...i have never seen this before and am interested to see what level of associations this is supposed to be
Turns out I can post the whole thing, so let's do that:
<style type="text/css"><!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}--></style><table dir="ltr" style="table-layout:fixed;font-size:13px;font-family:arial,sans,sans-serif;border-collapse:collapse;border:1px solid #ccc" border="1" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><colgroup><col width="109"><col width="63"><col width="76"><col width="78"><col width="61"><col width="43"><col width="109"><col width="31"><col width="45"><col width="51"><col width="67"><col width="49"></colgroup><tbody><tr style="height:21px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;">
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;britrock88&quot;]">britrock88</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;cheekimonk&quot;]">cheekimonk</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;Chief Rum &quot;]">Chief Rum </td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;EagleFan&quot;]">EagleFan</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;Grover&quot;]">Grover</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;HomerSimpson98&quot;]">HomerSimpson98</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;JAG&quot;]">JAG</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;path12&quot;]">path12</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;saldana&quot;]">saldana</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;Suicane75&quot;]">Suicane75</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;Zinto&quot;]">Zinto</td></tr><tr style="height:27px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;britrock88&quot;]">britrock88</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;x\n&quot;]">x
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;">
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td></tr><tr style="height:21px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;cheekimonk&quot;]">cheekimonk</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;x&quot;]">x</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td></tr><tr style="height:21px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;Chief Rum &quot;]">Chief Rum </td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;x&quot;]">x</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td>
</td><td>
</td></tr><tr style="height:21px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;EagleFan&quot;]">EagleFan</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;">
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;x&quot;]">x</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td></tr><tr style="height:21px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;Grover&quot;]">Grover</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;x&quot;]">x</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td>
</td></tr><tr style="height:21px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;HomerSimpson98&quot;]">HomerSimpson98</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;x&quot;]">x</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td></tr><tr style="height:21px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;JAG&quot;]">JAG</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;x&quot;]">x</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td></tr><tr style="height:21px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;path12&quot;]">path12</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;x&quot;]">x</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td>
</td></tr><tr style="height:21px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;saldana&quot;]">saldana</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;x&quot;]">x</td><td>
</td><td>
</td></tr><tr style="height:21px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;Suicane75&quot;]">Suicane75</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;x&quot;]">x</td><td>
</td></tr><tr style="height:21px;"><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;Zinto&quot;]">Zinto</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;background-color:#ff0000;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;-&quot;]">-</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td>
</td><td style="padding:2px 3px 2px 3px;vertical-align:bottom;" data-sheets-value="[null,2,&quot;x&quot;]">x</td></tr></tbody></table>Each red space indicates a knowing unalignment (meaning the two did not know they were on the same team at the time I was analyzing.) This isn't a full chart, as I would add additional minuses to indicated stronger correlations and green spaces to indicate likely alignments, but since this is such a fast game, I haven't gotten around to it yet.

The current red spaces are based on fairly simplistic vote analysis, things like people voting right next to each other or voting for each other in a way that doesn't look like bussing. Keep in mind that the more experienced the player, the less likely this kind of thing is to work.

[EagleFan]

Question anyone voting for me today, trying to get the village to do their job for them.

[cheekimonk]

I noticed D1 that cheek switched to Raven without comment towards the end of the day.

I actually explained that...on my very first day of ever playing WW I didn't want to be a deciding vote between the 2 top targets.

If I'm a wolf, then the wolves have been lucky as hell as I would be more a liability (I could be a liability for us as well, I guess, but I digress). I've tried to pick up signs of coordinated votes. I'm can't say I'm good at it yet, but there seem to be plenty of other "wolfy" people around than me.

[fontisian]

Question anyone voting for me today, trying to get the village to do their job for them.
EF, is this what I think it is?

[EagleFan]

I think the wolves made a mistake going after someone on my list to try to disprove me. I'll let that sit for a while, will explain later but you'll probably figure it out.

[EagleFan]

EF, is this what I think it is?

If it was, I couldn't say that it was... whatever you think it could be...

[EagleFan]

Anyone else seeing this page look like a spreadsheet now? Odd, ever since font posted that chart I see boarder lines around things on this page.

[EagleFan]

If I go to a different page in this thread, don't see it.

Sorry, just found that odd.

[fontisian]

Huh. I corrupted everything.

[Suicane75]

Yeah, I thought it was my internet being funky and not loading certain things, but I see it too.

[britrock88]

JAG surviving to D3 makes me wonder...

(Sorry, JAG.)

[path12]

Hey, here's a fun idea. What if we stopped fucking around and lynched Raven already?

Notable statement.


Zinto: It's been a while, and I've been intensively playing mafia the entire time.

Especially in light of this one.

[Grover]

vote cheekimonk

Yes, I know he's new, but claiming that he would be a liability for the wolves is an interesting take. Could be they've planned it for him to 'play dumb' to throw us of the scent?

I'm not buying it. Something is fishy.

[Grover]

I actually explained that...on my very first day of ever playing WW I didn't want to be a deciding vote between the 2 top targets.

If I'm a wolf, then the wolves have been lucky as hell as I would be more a liability (I could be a liability for us as well, I guess, but I digress). I've tried to pick up signs of coordinated votes. I'm can't say I'm good at it yet, but there seem to be plenty of other "wolfy" people around than me.

Furthering my point. Why would one even claim that they would be a liability to the wolves? Why even mention the possibility you are aligned with them? What is he considering to be "wolfy", when he himself is acting what one could consider wolfy?

I look forward to hearing cheek's defense here, if he has a viable one.

We cannot afford another day with lynching a villager.

[JAG]

I actually explained that...on my very first day of ever playing WW I didn't want to be a deciding vote between the 2 top targets.

If I'm a wolf, then the wolves have been lucky as hell as I would be more a liability (I could be a liability for us as well, I guess, but I digress). I've tried to pick up signs of coordinated votes. I'm can't say I'm good at it yet, but there seem to be plenty of other "wolfy" people around than me.

I missed that explanation. That's not usually a good thing though, ducking a deciding vote, just so you know. It makes it look like you want to hide your vote rather than taking a stand.

[JAG]

JAG surviving to D3 makes me wonder...

(Sorry, JAG.)

Eh, it's what it is. I assume either I've been barking up the wrong tree, or I've been correct on Zinto and he doesn't want the scrutiny that killing me would bring. Or they might want me alive so they can push me as a candidate later in the game, who knows?

[JAG]

If anyone can put together a D2 vote table, it would be appreciated.

[cheekimonk]

Grover, I made a comment in response to JAG's observation that I switched to Raven late on D1 w/out explanation (I did, indeed, explain it in a separate post). I guess the rest of the post was overreaction gauging by your comments. I got a vote yesterday, but JAG's post was the first time anyone has cast real suspicion on me. We're down 4 villagers (which is as bad as it could get after D2...right?) so D3 is a critical vote for us. I don't really know how to argue I'm a villager as everyone says that. I'd just hate to be the nail in our coffin in my first game because I was just dumb enough to draw attention away from those with seemingly suspicious strategies (to me, at least).

[cheekimonk]

I missed that explanation. That's not usually a good thing though, ducking a deciding vote, just so you know. It makes it look like you want to hide your vote rather than taking a stand.

Thanks. I picked up on that D2 with the discussion of "hidden/wasted" votes.

[JAG]

Grover, I made a comment in response to JAG's observation that I switched to Raven late on D1 w/out explanation (I did, indeed, explain it in a separate post). I guess the rest of the post was overreaction gauging by your comments. I got a vote yesterday, but JAG's post was the first time anyone has cast real suspicion on me. We're down 4 villagers (which is as bad as it could get after D2...right?) so D3 is a critical vote for us. I don't really know how to argue I'm a villager as everyone says that. I'd just hate to be the nail in our coffin in my first game because I was just dumb enough to draw attention away from those with seemingly suspicious strategies (to me, at least).

Assuming you're not a wolf, there's no reason to call yourself dumb because you're getting suspicion. Pretty much everyone does something that someone else thinks is suspicious. Just try and take a look at posts and bring up points that's haven't yet been made that you think might lead us to a wolf. The voting is a little tougher as we haven't caught a wolf yet, but there still is probably some information to be gleaned from it.

[JAG]

I don't have tons of time, but I'm going to try and review D2 posting today.

[Grover]

Vote: EagleFan

Why?

[HomerSimpson98]

Very discouraging and frustrating. I'm obviously doing a shitty job of identifying the bad guys as timmae was also someone who I thought may be wolf. Wrong again.

Got some weird voter action around deadline and I'm trying to wrap my tiny brain around it. Font and Zinto are 2-for-2 in lynching good guys. And why did Sui stay on EF with a wasted vote

[The Jackal]

Vote Count:

2 - cheekimonk - EagleFan (516), Grover (539)
1 - EagleFan - Suicane75 (526)

[britrock88]

I'll start working on a tally.

[cheekimonk]

Font and Zinto are 2-for-2 in lynching good guys.

I noticed this as well.

[The Jackal]

Bumping Vote Count:

2 - cheekimonk - EagleFan (516), Grover (539)
1 - EagleFan - Suicane75 (526)

[cheekimonk]

Font and Zinto are 2-for-2 in lynching good guys.

In fact, Zinto hasn't cast one vote for anyone not lynched (stayed on GE D1, stayed on Raven D2).

[britrock88]

Time Post Voter Type Votee Count
21:21 264 EagleFan vote Saldana 1
21:27 267 JAG vote Zinto 1
22:39 271 Path12 vote Grover 1
8:43 279 Cheekimonk vote Suicane75 1
9:31 285 Timmae vote Suicane75 2
10:32 290 Suicane75 vote EagleFan 1
11:16 304 Britrock88 vote Fontisian 1
12:10 312 Grover vote Fontisian 2
12:42 314 Fontisian vote Grover 2
13:16 328 Grover unvote Fontisian 1
13:26 330 Raven vote Fontisian 2
13:26 331 Britrock88 unvote Fontisian 1
13:26 331 Britrock88 vote Suicane75 3
14:14 341 EagleFan unvote Saldana 0
14:14 341 EagleFan vote Grover 3
14:15 342 HomerSimpson98 vote Raven 1
14:17 344 Grover vote Suicane75 4
16:07 354 Saldana vote Fontisian 2
16:21 356 Chief Rum vote Suicane75 5
17:23 359 EagleFan unvote Grover 2
17:23 359 EagleFan vote Timmae 1
18:01 366 JAG unvote Zinto 0
18:08 367 Suicane75 unvote EagleFan 0
18:08 367 Suicane75 vote Grover 3
19:06 384 EagleFan unvote Timmae 0
19:08 387 Zinto vote Raven 2
19:19 394 Timmae unvote Suicane75 4
19:23 396 Fontisian unvote Grover 2
19:37 401 Chief Rum unvote Suicane75 3
19:37 401 Chief Rum vote Fontisian 3
19:41 403 EagleFan vote Suicane75 4
19:59 417 Cheekimonk unvote Suicane75 3
19:59 417 Cheekimonk vote Grover 3
20:09 432 Fontisian vote Raven 3
20:19 445 Timmae vote Raven 4
20:19 446 Suicane75 unvote Grover 2
20:19 446 Suicane75 vote Raven 5
20:35 460 Timmae unvote Raven 4
20:35 460 Timmae vote EagleFan 1
20:37 463 EagleFan unvote Suicane75 2
20:37 463 EagleFan vote Cheekimonk 1
20:38 465 JAG vote Grover 3
20:45 478 Suicane75 unvote Raven 3
20:45 478 Suicane75 vote EagleFan 2
20:47 481 EagleFan unvote Cheekimonk 0
20:47 481 EagleFan vote Suicane75 3
20:56 497 Timmae unvote EagleFan 1
20:56 497 Timmae vote Raven 4
20:58 504 JAG unvote Grover 2
20:58 504 JAG vote Raven 5

[britrock88]

Two straight days Suicane has been in the running, only to be eclipsed by two other candidates later on.

[britrock88]

This guy had one of the biggest momentum-swinging votes away from Sui (and onto Font, for what that's worth):

vote Chief Rum

[britrock88]

Just a couple thoughts about the end of yesterday, from my view:

- JAG: it seems clear that his last vote was just to ensure a safe margin and prevent any sniping.
- Font: a good deal of attention has been paid to her "Let's just finish lynching Raven" line. It is interesting given the hindsight of Raven coming up town, but we were also dealing with separate strains of last-minute alternatives being offered up. That usually leaves little time for claims and probably risks a good special moreso than just following through with a lynch on a VV claimant.

[britrock88]

This guy had one of the biggest momentum-swinging votes away from Sui (and onto Font, for what that's worth):

vote Chief Rum

You know what? I'd rather just go to the source of my consternation to see if anything is really there.

unvote Chief Rum
vote Suicane75

[Chief Rum]

This guy had one of the biggest momentum-swinging votes away from Sui (and onto Font, for what that's worth):

vote Chief Rum

So font wants to lynch a villager (Raven) and has voted to lynch villagers two days straight and is acting off and super aggressive for whatever reason, but you're on me for switching from Suicane to her?

I had wanted to vote for her in the first place, but she wasn't really a candidate by the time I voted. I only switched when she became more of a possibility.

There were a ton of "momentum-swinging" votes yesterday. To be frank, I'm more looking askance at the ones who didn't participate in the vote changes.

How many vote changes did you have yesterday, brit?

[Chief Rum]

You know what? I'd rather just go to the source of my consternation to see if anything is really there.

unvote Chief Rum
vote Suicane75

That makes more sense. That's a vote I can support, as I want to know what his deal is, too. Suicane may not be anything--there isn't a ton of evidence that he is. But he has figured so prominently in our votes that knowing his allegiance would be a tremendous aid in our vote analysis.

[Chief Rum]

FTR, I don't think we're facing four wolves. Given the numbers in the game, that just seems like too much.

I suspect we have three wolves, four villager roles and probably the other dude, too. I guess he is neutral, but it sounds like he wins with the village.

[path12]

Updated Brit's Day 2 vote with standings:

Time Post Voter Type Votee
21:21 264 EagleFan vote Saldana saldana 1
21:27 267 JAG vote Zinto saldana 1, Zinto 1
22:39 271 Path12 vote Grover Grover 1, saldana 1, Zinto 1
8:43 279 Cheekimonk vote Suicane75 Grover 1, saldana 1, Suicane 1, Zinto 1
9:31 285 Timmae vote Suicane75 Suicane 2, Grover 1, saldana 1, Zinto 1
10:32 290 Suicane75 vote EagleFan Suicane 2, EF 1, Grover 1, saldana 1, Zinto 1
11:16 304 Britrock88 vote Fontisian Suicane 2, EF 1, font 1, Grover 1, saldana 1, Zinto 1
12:10 312 Grover vote Fontisian font 2, Suicane 2, EF 1, Grover 1, saldana 1, Zinto 1
12:42 314 Fontisian vote Grover font 2, Grover 2, Suicane 2, EF 1, saldana 1, Zinto 1
13:16 328 Grover unvote Fontisian Grover 2, Suicane 2, EF 1, font 1, saldana 1, Zinto 1
13:26 330 Raven vote Fontisian font 2, Grover 2, Suicane 2, EF 1, saldana 1, Zinto 1
13:26 331 Britrock88 unvote Fontisian
13:26 331 Britrock88 vote Suicane75 Suicane 3, Grover 2, EF 1, font 1, saldana 1, Zinto 1
14:14 341 EagleFan unvote Saldana
14:14 341 EagleFan vote Grover Grover 3, Suicane 3, EF 1, font 1, Zinto 1
14:15 342 HomerSimpson98 vote Raven Grover 3, Suicane 3, EF 1, font 1, Raven 1, Zinto 1
14:17 344 Grover vote Suicane75 Suicane 4, Grover 3, EF 1, font 1, Raven 1, Zinto 1
16:07 354 Saldana vote Fontisian Suicane 4, Grover 3, font 2, EF 1, Raven 1, Zinto 1
16:21 356 Chief Rum vote Suicane75 Suicane 5, Grover 3, font 2, EF 1, Raven 1, Zinto 1
17:23 359 EagleFan unvote Grover
17:23 359 EagleFan vote Timmae Suicane 5, Grover 2, font 2, EF 1, Raven 1, timmae 1, Zinto 1
18:01 366 JAG unvote Zinto Suicane 5, Grover 2, font 2, EF 1, Raven 1, timmae 1
18:08 367 Suicane75 unvote EagleFan
18:08 367 Suicane75 vote Grover Suicane 5, Grover 3, font 2, Raven 1, timmae 1
19:06 384 EagleFan unvote Timmae Suicane 5, Grover 3, font 2, Raven 1
19:08 387 Zinto vote Raven Suicane 5, Grover 3, font 2, Raven 2
19:19 394 Timmae unvote Suicane75 Suicane 4, Grover 3, font 2, Raven 2
19:23 396 Fontisian unvote Grover Suicane 4, Grover 2, font 2, Raven 2
19:37 401 Chief Rum unvote Suicane75
19:37 401 Chief Rum vote Fontisian font 3, Suicane 3, Grover 2, Raven 2
19:41 403 EagleFan vote Suicane75 Suicane 4, font 3, Grover 2, Raven 2
19:59 417 Cheekimonk unvote Suicane75
19:59 417 Cheekimonk vote Grover font 3, Grover 3, Suicane 3, Raven 2
20:09 432 Fontisian vote Raven font 3, Grover 3, Suicane 3, Raven 3
20:19 445 Timmae vote Raven Raven 4, font 3, Grover 3, Suicane 3
20:19 446 Suicane75 unvote Grover
20:19 446 Suicane75 vote Raven Raven 5, font 3, Suicane 3, Grover 2
20:35 460 Timmae unvote Raven
20:35 460 Timmae vote EagleFan Raven 4, font 3, Grover 3, Suicane 3
20:37 463 EagleFan unvote Suicane75
20:37 463 EagleFan vote Cheekimonk Raven 4, font 3, Grover 3, Suicane 2, cheekimonk 1
20:38 465 JAG vote Grover Raven 4, Grover 4, font 3, Suicane 2, cheekimonk 1
20:45 478 Suicane75 unvote Raven
20:45 478 Suicane75 vote EagleFan Grover 4, font 3, Raven 3, Suicane 2, cheekimonk 1, EF 1
20:47 481 EagleFan unvote Cheekimonk
20:47 481 EagleFan vote Suicane75 Grover 4, font 3, Raven 3, Suicane 3, EF 1
20:56 497 Timmae unvote EagleFan
20:56 497 Timmae vote Raven Grover 4, Raven 4, font 3, Suicane 3
20:58 504 JAG unvote Grover
20:58 504 JAG vote Raven Raven 5, font 3, Grover 3, Suicane 3


Just easier for me to see this way. Still scrolls though. My cut and paste and finding wolves skillz have apparently stagnated. :mad:

[path12]

VOTE JAG

[Suicane75]

Since I know I'm a villager, I'd be interested more in the people who started the runs on me. Including today.

[The Jackal]

Vote Count:

2 - cheekimonk - EagleFan (516), Grover (539)
1 - EagleFan - Suicane75 (526)
1 - Suicane75 - britrock88 (559)
1 - JAG - path12 (564)

[JAG]

If we go raven and he's village is font next then? Need help here..

Eh, most people would think this is a wolfy post. You usually don't want to start pointing to the next candidate so early.

This combo happened at 6 minutes and 4 minutes before deadline, followed by a timmae night kill. Thoughts from others on this? My first impression was that this looked better for Zinto after timmae was night killed.

[EagleFan]

Not sure what to think about path. Anyone getting a read on him? I see hit and run.

[Suicane75]

Timmae also threw a vote for EF late. Misdirection for both? Or something more sinister? Fudge if I know.

[EagleFan]

I think that timmae night kill could tell us something. Why timmae over JAG? No offense meant to timmae by that question, just trying to get into the wolves' heads when they made that decision.

[britrock88]

Not sure what to think about path. Anyone getting a read on him? I see hit and run.

Scant, but positive.

[britrock88]

I think that timmae night kill could tell us something. Why timmae over JAG? No offense meant to timmae by that question, just trying to get into the wolves' heads when they made that decision.

I'm wondering if it's a wolfpack consisting of newer folks.

[britrock88]

I'm wondering if it's a wolfpack consisting of newer folks.

Or one that makes us want to think this.

[britrock88]

It sure would be nice to have some red in the vote charts to help us analyze things...

[EagleFan]

Okay, I can reveal this now. I misread my PM and thought that I lost my protection powers if I reveal but I only lose the PM ability with the seer if I reveal. That becomes useless after tonight when the wolves kill me.

I am the bodyguard and was scanned last night; they know who I am and I can now be killed because of that scan. I didn't initially say it because I thought that I lost my bodyguard powers which would pretty much make me a vanilla villager and give the wolves an incentive to keep me alive.

Since I can't protect the seer it kind of makes my role a crapshoot anyway as I wouldn't know who to protect.

I protected JAG night one and Chief Rum on night two so far. I was close to protecting Narc but decided JAG, wish I went with my first thought.

[path12]

EF, that was the very first time all game that I've made a vote with no comment plus I've been pretty active throughout. With the vote jumping you've done that is BS.

For the record, I think JAG and font are both wolves. I think font is likely the cunning which is why she has been quite upfront in her interactions -- so she could be scanned good. JAG has a good reputation here, has figured in a few vote moves and tipped to Raven end of day yesterday. They both could be considered vet enough for the night 1 Narcizo kill.

I could very well be wrong, I might be right, but at least I've got some sort of theory.

[britrock88]

EF, that was the very first time all game that I've made a vote with no comment plus I've been pretty active throughout. With the vote jumping you've done that is BS.

For the record, I think JAG and font are both wolves. I think font is likely the cunning which is why she has been quite upfront in her interactions -- so she could be scanned good. JAG has a good reputation here, has figured in a few vote moves and tipped to Raven end of day yesterday. They both could be considered vet enough for the night 1 Narcizo kill.

I could very well be wrong, I might be right, but at least I've got some sort of theory.

I appreciate thinking aloud! I really don't think JAG and Font are both wolves, though your point about the cunning is well-taken.

[JAG]

Font and Sui coming out aggressively...

vote font

Finally circling around to look at the tally. Interesting votes, IMO:

- JAG dropping GE from the lead into a tie with Suicane (and bringing Font within 1)
- Raven creating a 3-way tie among GE, Suicane, and Font by dropping Suicane out of the lead
- Path and EagleFan voting GE 2 up within 2 minutes of each other
- Grover elevating Font over Suicane as the alternative to GE
- JAG reversing Grover's option and tying Suicane and Font 2 behind
- EagleFan switching off GE to tie him with Font, then voting Font a bit later

Nothing particularly damning about any of these, but these stuck out to me as the highest-leverage votes of the day.

Despite my vote being on you, I agree with your read--I'm getting a negative feel for EF.

Also agree with JAG's earlier sentiment that Font seems good but shouldn't be above suspicion.

Also concur with the perception that there's no read out there for Chief Rum. Very UTR-feeling to this point.

Also intrigued by the Raven run-up, particularly since it's newbie-heavy.

JAG surviving to D3 makes me wonder...

(Sorry, JAG.)

Two straight days Suicane has been in the running, only to be eclipsed by two other candidates later on.

This guy had one of the biggest momentum-swinging votes away from Sui (and onto Font, for what that's worth):

vote Chief Rum

Just a couple thoughts about the end of yesterday, from my view:

- JAG: it seems clear that his last vote was just to ensure a safe margin and prevent any sniping.
- Font: a good deal of attention has been paid to her "Let's just finish lynching Raven" line. It is interesting given the hindsight of Raven coming up town, but we were also dealing with separate strains of last-minute alternatives being offered up. That usually leaves little time for claims and probably risks a good special moreso than just following through with a lynch on a VV claimant.

You know what? I'd rather just go to the source of my consternation to see if anything is really there.

unvote Chief Rum
vote Suicane75


In looking over yesterday and today, I see Brit throwing around a good bit of suspicion and taking fairly safe opinions. I'm going to start here.

Vote brit

[JAG]

Okay, I can reveal this now. I misread my PM and thought that I lost my protection powers if I reveal but I only lose the PM ability with the seer if I reveal. That becomes useless after tonight when the wolves kill me.

I am the bodyguard and was scanned last night; they know who I am and I can now be killed because of that scan. I didn't initially say it because I thought that I lost my bodyguard powers which would pretty much make me a vanilla villager and give the wolves an incentive to keep me alive.

Since I can't protect the seer it kind of makes my role a crapshoot anyway as I wouldn't know who to protect.

I protected JAG night one and Chief Rum on night two so far. I was close to protecting Narc but decided JAG, wish I went with my first thought.

Good, I suspected you were alright. This unsurprisingly confirms one of the wolf roles in the game.

[Zinto]

Eh, it's what it is. I assume either I've been barking up the wrong tree, or I've been correct on Zinto and he doesn't want the scrutiny that killing me would bring. Or they might want me alive so they can push me as a candidate later in the game, who knows?


If I was a wolf you would already be dead. I have watched you blow up too many wolf teams to not try to remove you from a game ASAP.

[JAG]

Assuming EF is telling the truth, I think Sui is a bad vote today. He came out vs. EF last night and first thing today, which is totally unnecessary if they're going to kill EF anyway.

[Zinto]

I wish Autumn was playing. He always can tell when Jag is a wolf.

[JAG]

EF, that was the very first time all game that I've made a vote with no comment plus I've been pretty active throughout. With the vote jumping you've done that is BS.

For the record, I think JAG and font are both wolves. I think font is likely the cunning which is why she has been quite upfront in her interactions -- so she could be scanned good. JAG has a good reputation here, has figured in a few vote moves and tipped to Raven end of day yesterday. They both could be considered vet enough for the night 1 Narcizo kill.

I could very well be wrong, I might be right, but at least I've got some sort of theory.

I was also thinking font was either good or cunning the way she's played out in front. I voted late last night to make sure there wasn't a tie and went with my best shot at a wolf at the time. I'm not saying a wolf would never do that, but it puts a big spotlight on you. If there was another wolf up, I agree it looks a good bit worse though.

[Chief Rum]

My gut instinct on font the past day or so has been cunning, too. She just seems very over the top. While that's not unheard of for her, she's even more so in this game, from what I am used to.

[Zinto]

If we go raven and he's village is font next then? Need help here..


Is this a post that the wolf team would target as a newbie asking for help on who to scan? I assume that they were seer hunting yesterday and there isn't a lot else I could find.

[JAG]

Good point Zinto, I hadn't read into it like that, but it does look like a seer asking for a scan option.

[JAG]

The other thing about brit is Narc was the first night kill and voted brit to start the game, which would make Narc look pretty good if brit ever turned up wolf, so you get a 2-for-1 eliminating a good player who also looks good with his vote.

[path12]

I was also thinking font was either good or cunning the way she's played out in front. I voted late last night to make sure there wasn't a tie and went with my best shot at a wolf at the time. I'm not saying a wolf would never do that, but it puts a big spotlight on you. If there was another wolf up, I agree it looks a good bit worse though.

To be honest, it's as much meta as anything and I usually hate meta voting.

But if we posit that Narc means a vet on the wolves team and you are still alive after three days than that last minute vote looks more shady than it might.

Though I'll add that I thought you had defended font when I pointed out her combo of going for Raven plus the fact that she is in the zone as far as playing right now if it has been as intensive as she indicated. When I looked back it was Brit -- and I thought your post regarding his quotes was sort of persuasive which would be a point for you.

Werewolf is a hard game. But given some of the other comments after pointing my finger at you two leads me to switch up:

UNVOTE JAG
VOTE FONTISIAN

[cheekimonk]

I had been wondering if font was always so confrontational and blunt. With the vets pointing out now that she's not, that unknown factor in my thinking has an answer...

vote fontisian

[EagleFan]

Take cheek out, then worry about the other wolves. The more I see the more I am convinced that he is a wolf.

[EagleFan]

dola: not that we should have a runaway; that way we can get some vote history (or you guys can get some vote history) to look at tomorrow.

[path12]

I had been wondering if font was always so confrontational and blunt. With the vets pointing out now that she's not, that unknown factor in my thinking has an answer...

vote fontisian

She's always blunt in the few games I've played with her. She is also fearless and very clever and I'll always have a soft spot for how great she was for my team in the Game of Thrones game. So the first day or two I was kind of irritated about how people were reacting to her.

But as time goes by this game and we see a few votes, I think she is bad bad bad.

[saldana]

Take cheek out, then worry about the other wolves. The more I see the more I am convinced that he is a wolf.

what are you seeing? i have never played with him before (i think this is his first game) and am not getting any kind of read, but given that no one has countered your claim, i am highly inclined to trust you at this point.

[path12]

Take cheek out, then worry about the other wolves. The more I see the more I am convinced that he is a wolf.

It would not surprise me at all. And if you are getting killed our priority should be trying to take out the brutal. But I have no idea who that may be.

[path12]

Dola, the brutal or whatever the one was that had the ability to kill you.

[saldana]

I was also thinking font was either good or cunning the way she's played out in front. I voted late last night to make sure there wasn't a tie and went with my best shot at a wolf at the time. I'm not saying a wolf would never do that, but it puts a big spotlight on you. If there was another wolf up, I agree it looks a good bit worse though.

this is what i was thinking too...the cunnings job is to draw attention and get scanned, so by coming on so strong (too strong some may say), she was possibly doing exactly that.

she has done a couple other things that have pinged my radar as well, such as basically flinging everyone in the game's name against the wall to see who she can get traction on for a vote.

i will wait to vote til i hear back from EF, but i see no reason to change my vote from yesterday.

[cheekimonk]

Take cheek out, then worry about the other wolves. The more I see the more I am convinced that he is a wolf.

Is there any reasoning I can address? All I see is:

vote cheekimonk

Not changing that vote today.

With your reveal, voting me out takes us to 6:3 at best, 5:4 at worst (lynching me, your death, and their NK). This could be a game-deciding vote so I at least want to know I made my case and it isn't just carelessness that got me, and the village, killed. I'd like to play with you guys again in the future. :D

[cheekimonk]

FYI, I have a date at 6p Central. Could be drinks...could be more, so I may not be around for the deadline.

[fontisian]

With your reveal, voting me out takes us to 6:3 at best, 5:4 at worst (lynching me, your death, and their NK). This could be a game-deciding vote so I at least want to know I made my case and it isn't just carelessness that got me, and the village, killed. I'd like to play with you guys again in the future. :D
Nosta Khan - Can scan for Druss. Once Druss is known, has a way of killing him.
Vote: Cheekimonk
Tell you what, you tell me what the obvious thing you did wrong was, and I'll point out the less obvious thing for future reference.

[fontisian]

She's always blunt in the few games I've played with her. She is also fearless and very clever and I'll always have a soft spot for how great she was for my team in the Game of Thrones game. So the first day or two I was kind of irritated about how people were reacting to her.

But as time goes by this game and we see a few votes, I think she is bad bad bad.
<3

Aw. I forgive you for being completely wrong/possibly (but probably not?) evil.

[cheekimonk]

Vote: Cheekimonk
Tell you what, you tell me what the obvious thing you did wrong was, and I'll point out the less obvious thing for future reference.

I think, from your quote, you're implying I'm Nosta? Read the post below from EF. EF is the bodyguard and has to be dead soon or later for the wolves to win. Unless I'm reading the role wrong, but I don't think I am.

I guess that was the "obvious" thing? I would be pleased to hear your "less obvious" thing.

Okay, I can reveal this now. I misread my PM and thought that I lost my protection powers if I reveal but I only lose the PM ability with the seer if I reveal. That becomes useless after tonight when the wolves kill me.

I am the bodyguard and was scanned last night; they know who I am and I can now be killed because of that scan. I didn't initially say it because I thought that I lost my bodyguard powers which would pretty much make me a vanilla villager and give the wolves an incentive to keep me alive.

Since I can't protect the seer it kind of makes my role a crapshoot anyway as I wouldn't know who to protect.

I protected JAG night one and Chief Rum on night two so far. I was close to protecting Narc but decided JAG, wish I went with my first thought.

[fontisian]

Not quite. The obvious thing is that you have more information than the rest of us in regards to Nosta's power. You outright said that scum have an additional kill to use on EF, but Jackal's description of Nosta's role doesn't go into detail on how that works (it could just be that the normal night kill can't be blocked by the other bodyguard or some other variation).

The less obvious thing was your town. New townies don't take someone attempting to lynch them that well, especially to the point of using a smiley face. It comes off as contrived.

[cheekimonk]

Not fun to wind up font's target du jour. At least my "appointment" tonight saves me from drawn out back-and-forth.

[fontisian]

You've got three hours. You can't address my concerns in that time?

Fair warning though, I won't be lynched toDay, and if you're not around when the wagon swings off of me it could be problematic for you.

[Chief Rum]

Not quite. The obvious thing is that you have more information than the rest of us in regards to Nosta's power. You outright said that scum have an additional kill to use on EF, but Jackal's description of Nosta's role doesn't go into detail on how that works (it could just be that the normal night kill can't be blocked by the other bodyguard or some other variation).

The less obvious thing was your town. New townies don't take someone attempting to lynch them that well, especially to the point of using a smiley face. It comes off as contrived.

I thought the same thing when he posted until I checked out the rules, and I don't interpret it the way you do. While it doesn't out and out say that there is a separate kill from the night kill, it does say that Dross can't be nightkilled, and that is pretty much laid out there. My thought on that was that the wolves must have another way of killing him.

[Chief Rum]

Fair warning though, I won't be lynched toDay, and if you're not around when the wagon swings off of me it could be problematic for you.

Are you revealing?

Font, stop being coy and spit it out. If you can help us narrow the field, please do. My vote right now is on you. If you're a roled villager, I would prefer not to lynch you.

[cheekimonk]

Not quite. The obvious thing is that you have more information than the rest of us in regards to Nosta's power. You outright said that scum have an additional kill to use on EF, but Jackal's description of Nosta's role doesn't go into detail on how that works (it could just be that the normal night kill can't be blocked by the other bodyguard or some other variation).

The less obvious thing was your town. New townies don't take someone attempting to lynch them that well, especially to the point of using a smiley face. It comes off as contrived.

Huh? Nosta has a way of killing him. He has to be dead for the wolves to win. We haven't killed a wolf, so Nosta is still alive. Ergo, EF is dead. Maybe the rules of WW are more complex (?) and I'm missing something?

What does "your town" mean? I'm not taking the idea of getting lynched well, but I'm also a laid back kind of person. I can counter logic, but you'll never find me going after people (like you have, no offense). I don't even know what to tell you about a smiley face...

[Chief Rum]

Huh? Nosta has a way of killing him. He has to be dead for the wolves to win. We haven't killed a wolf, so Nosta is still alive. Ergo, EF is dead. Maybe the rules of WW are more complex (?) and I'm missing something?

I think she's talking about you saying there will be two kills tonight, one for Dross and one for the nightkill, and that in saying so, you are revealing yourself as having more knowledge (which could only mean you're a wolf).

I don't think it is that clear from the rules, but she is right that you were rather forthright about it. How did you come to the conclusion we would have two kills tonight?

[fontisian]

Huh? Nosta has a way of killing him. He has to be dead for the wolves to win. We haven't killed a wolf, so Nosta is still alive. Ergo, EF is dead. Maybe the rules of WW are more complex (?) and I'm missing something?

What does "your town" mean? I'm not taking the idea of getting lynched well, but I'm also a laid back kind of person. I can counter logic, but you'll never find me going after people (like you have, no offense). I don't even know what to tell you about a smiley face...
Chief got the first part.

The second part was supposed to be "your tone." Apologies.

[The Jackal]

Vote Count:

3 - cheekimonk - EagleFan (516), Grover (539), fontisian (599)
2 - fontisian - path12 (588), cheekimonk (589)
1 - EagleFan - Suicane75 (526)
1 - Suicane75 - britrock88 (559)
1 - britrock88 - JAG (578)

[cheekimonk]

I don't think it is that clear from the rules, but she is right that you were rather forthright about it. How did you come to the conclusion we would have two kills tonight?

I never said tonight. I said soon or later. The wolves have to kill EF. Yes, I did (do) assume that since his death can't be by NK, then a NK can still occur. There are other roles that set up more deaths on a night than the lynch and NK. I very well could be wrong. I guess it's quite possible that I am. This is still a critical vote...we cannot lynch another villager. I don't want to have bungled my way into a bad kill that I'll be blamed for when it's revealed I'm a villager.

[Chief Rum]

I never said tonight. I said soon or later. The wolves have to kill EF. Yes, I did (do) assume that since his death can't be by NK, then a NK can still occur. There are other roles that set up more deaths on a night than the lynch and NK. I very well could be wrong. I guess it's quite possible that I am. This is still a critical vote...we cannot lynch another villager. I don't want to have bungled my way into a bad kill that I'll be blamed for when it's revealed I'm a villager.

Are you claiming to be a vanilla villager? No role?

[path12]

<3

Aw. I forgive you for being completely wrong/possibly (but probably not?) evil.

Right back atcha for being probably (but possibly not? Nah.) evil. :)

[fontisian]

But why not consider that by knowing his identity, scum can just ignore Druss' usual night kill immunity? Why assume they specifically get another kill?

[JAG]

Well, this has been an interesting day.

[path12]

I never said tonight. I said soon or later. The wolves have to kill EF. Yes, I did (do) assume that since his death can't be by NK, then a NK can still occur. There are other roles that set up more deaths on a night than the lynch and NK. I very well could be wrong. I guess it's quite possible that I am. This is still a critical vote...we cannot lynch another villager. I don't want to have bungled my way into a bad kill that I'll be blamed for when it's revealed I'm a villager.

Well, you talked ratios after tonight, which certainly implies it would all occur tonight.

[Chief Rum]

But why not consider that by knowing his identity, scum can just ignore Druss' usual night kill immunity? Why assume they specifically get another kill?

To me, there's no getting around the statement "Dross can not be nightkilled".

Combine that with "Nosta has a way of killing him", which suggests not the normal way (i.e. nightkill), and I don't think it is a tremendous leap to think that there are multiple possible deaths here.

[Chief Rum]

Wouldn't the wolves kill Dross the second they could? I just assumed he would die tonight. I think EF is assuming that too. What am I missing?

[Chief Rum]

I don't think there's a way to resolve this without a lynch, though.

VOTE CHEEKIMONK

[fontisian]

To me, there's no getting around the statement "Dross can not be nightkilled".

Combine that with "Nosta has a way of killing him", which suggests not the normal way (i.e. nightkill), and I don't think it is a tremendous leap to think that there are multiple possible deaths here.
I don't think there's a way to resolve this without a lynch, though.

VOTE CHEEKIMONK
...
What? How do these work together?

[saldana]

OK font, that could be a nice catch and it is the closest thing to evidence we have, so for today i will go with you

vote Cheekimonk

[Chief Rum]

...
What? How do these work together?

I am saying you have a potential point and the only way to figure out is to lynch cheekimonk. Do you disagree?

[britrock88]

I don't want a runaway, but Font isn't getting traction, EF's claimed, I'm alone on Suicane, and I'm not voting for myself. Hrmph.

[The Jackal]

Vote Count:

5 - cheekimonk - EagleFan (516), Grover (539), fontisian (599), Chief Rum (619), saldana (621)
2 - fontisian - path12 (588), cheekimonk (589)
1 - EagleFan - Suicane75 (526)
1 - Suicane75 - britrock88 (559)
1 - britrock88 - JAG (578)

[fontisian]

I am saying you have a potential point and the only way to figure out is to lynch cheekimonk. Do you disagree?
But you just made an argument as to why my point isn't valid.

[Chief Rum]

But you just made an argument as to why my point isn't valid.

No, I made a point that you shouldn't be so certain you are correct. But I'm not saying you're wrong either.

Plus, I do think cheeki is being a little cagey. And you're apparently someone who can stop a lynch, so my main vote target isn't available (and if you're telling the truth, I want you alive).

So cheeki is as good as anyone at this point. Might as well figure this out now, and not let it drag out for days.

[HomerSimpson98]

OK font, that could be a nice catch and it is the closest thing to evidence we have, so for today i will go with you

vote Cheekimonk

Interesting. You voted for font to be lynched yesterday, no?

[EagleFan]

I would look more closely at saldana tomorrow. I have to go back over things but there were a couple subtle things that stood out from him.

[JAG]

Post Time Voter Vote Count Unvote Count
76 4:07 Narcizo britrock88 1
80 7:04 Zinto GoldenEagle 1
81 7:11 JAG saldana 1
82 7:45 EagleFan Zinto 1
88 8:11 timmae Grover 1
96 9:57 Grover Suicane75 1
101 10:29 Chief Rum Raven 1
108 11:43 Raven Suicane75 2
112 11:57 cheekimonk timmae 1
123 12:25 Suicane75 Grover 2
128 12:28 britrock88 JAG 1
134 12:43 path12 britrock88 2
152 14:18 britrock88 timmae 2 JAG 0
160 15:50 EagleFan Zinto 0
161 15:52 EagleFan Raven 2
163 15:57 JAG GoldenEagle 2 saldana 0
166 16:25 Narcizo GoldenEagle 3 britrock88 1
174 16:55 Chief Rum Suicane75 3 Raven 1
176 17:19 timmae JAG 1 Grover 1
177 17:23 Suicane75 GoldenEagle 4 Grover 0
180 18:06 HomerSimpson98 fontisian 1
189 18:35 JAG fontisian 2 GoldenEagle 3
190 18:35 GoldenEagle Suicane75 4
192 18:42 Raven fontisian 3 Suicane75 3
197 18:58 cheekimonk britrock88 2 timmae 1
204 19:11 path12 GoldenEagle 4 britrock88 1
207 19:13 EagleFan GoldenEagle 5 Raven 0
214 19:34 Grover fontisian 4 Suicane75 2
216 20:02 JAG Suicane75 3 fontisian 3
223 20:25 GoldenEagle fontisian 4 Suicane75 2
237 20:49 EagleFan Raven 1 GoldenEagle 4
239 21:22 cheekimonk Raven 2 britrock88 0
240 21:37 timmae GoldenEagle 5 JAG 0
242 21:48 EagleFan fontisian 5 Raven 1
244 21:54 fontisian GoldenEagle 6 Raven 1

Updated with vote counts. :)

EF, can I ask if you have certain proof or just a hunch here? If you look at the D1 movement the last couple hours by cheek, it doesn't look very wolf-like to me.

[cheekimonk]

Are you claiming to be a vanilla villager? No role?

I'm not claiming any role. There's no reason to out myself with only Druss being known, and after the first 2 nights ANY villager is critical...role or not. It's going to hurt the village to lose me and I can say that based on straight logic without an emotional appeal to everyone to trust me that I'm EXTRA valuable. That would reek of desperation to me, and would get the wolves after me in any case.

[cheekimonk]

Well, you talked ratios after tonight, which certainly implies it would all occur tonight.

No, I talked ratios. Period. If I'm lynched and I'm right that a NK can still happen when Druss is killed, then that's -3 villagers now or later. I didn't think I had to point out that the ratios are going to look even worse later on.

I do assume the wolves will kill Druss ASAP, but the rules don't say how that works or when. As I said, soon or later EF is dead.

[HomerSimpson98]

I honestly dont see what cheeki has done to warrant the runaway. Everything he said could easily be deduced from the first page of this thread. Yeah the stupid smile emoticon was not ideal but i took it as a joke (from someone who has told many stupid jokes).

[cheekimonk]

But why not consider that by knowing his identity, scum can just ignore Druss' usual night kill immunity? Why assume they specifically get another kill?

Because the rule goes at length to say Nosta has "a way of killing him." Putting that right against "cannot be NK'd" says to me that "way" is something other than NK.

[Grover]

Ended up doing roughly 350 miles of driving today for work... catching up on the thread!

[cheekimonk]

I honestly dont see what cheeki has done to warrant the runaway. Everything he said could easily be deduced from the first page of this thread. Yeah the stupid smile emoticon was not ideal but i took it as a joke (from someone who has told many stupid jokes).

Hey!

[HomerSimpson98]

lol - I meant jokes that didnt land quite as well as they do in your head. I'm the king of those.

[Grover]

and I still feel very confident voting for cheeki.

I think Suicane and britrock definitely deserve long hard looks as well.

[cheekimonk]

lol - I meant jokes that didnt land quite as well as they do in your head. I'm the king of those.

Lol! There's a lot of things not landing today quite as well as they are in my head...

[path12]

I dunno. I'd rather see one of font/JAG/Brit but those don't seem to be getting traction.

[cheekimonk]

Can I point out in my defense that EF got this roll on me started (maybe I haven't helped my case with my answers but this is my first time on the spot in this game) and I have yet to get a response to this earlier exchange:

Take cheek out, then worry about the other wolves. The more I see the more I am convinced that he is a wolf.

Is there any reasoning I can address? All I see is:

vote cheekimonk

Not changing that vote today.

I feel like I'm throwing water on a grease fire without knowing any better, but why was this grease fire started? I really do NOT want to leave you guys thinking I'm a terrible player when you lynch another villager not because of any logical reason but because of my awkward answers.

[cheekimonk]

EF, can I ask if you have certain proof or just a hunch here? If you look at the D1 movement the last couple hours by cheek, it doesn't look very wolf-like to me.

Being as objective as I can, I don't think my D2 pattern was very wolf-like either...at least as I judge it. There are definitely patterns that are more wolf-like, to me, which goes back to why this was started on me in the first place.

[Chief Rum]

Being as objective as I can, I don't think my D2 pattern was very wolf-like either...at least as I judge it. There are definitely patterns that are more wolf-like, to me, which goes back to why this was started on me in the first place.

Are there any patterns in particular you want to point out?

[britrock88]

I dunno. I'd rather see one of font/JAG/Brit but those don't seem to be getting traction.

Pat, can I ask who's in the group you trust the most?

[path12]

I honestly dont see what cheeki has done to warrant the runaway. Everything he said could easily be deduced from the first page of this thread. Yeah the stupid smile emoticon was not ideal but i took it as a joke (from someone who has told many stupid jokes).

Well then, who do you like? Who do you distrust? I see two votes and no movement. Would love to hear some thoughts on people.

[saldana]

Interesting. You voted for font to be lynched yesterday, no?

i did, and i was going to vote her again today, but she seems to have actually caught something that makes sense...everything else is just a hunch...she tagged onto an actual fact, so i will go with her today, and if Cheekimonk comes up village, i will vote her at 1001 tonight.

[HomerSimpson98]

I feel that font has taken a fairly insignificant post, one that I think can be deduced from the character list and roles, and blown it up to be something it isnt.

[HomerSimpson98]

It's going to hurt the village to lose me and I can say that based on straight logic without an emotional appeal to everyone to trust me that I'm EXTRA valuable. That would reek of desperation to me, and would get the wolves after me in any case.

Did you mean to say "can" or "cant"??

[path12]

Pat, can I ask who's in the group you trust the most?

Well, it's pretty small which is frustrating.

I believe EF because of no counter claim -- though if you are Druss would you counter? I think with the count getting closer and no seer hits you probably would.

I know my alignment.

I have not seen anything that has pinged me from Chief (except the vet angle), Zinto (except how quiet he is), and saldana (who I remember usually playing his cards close to the vest).

I think Suicane is a confused new player.

I've given Homer & cheekimonk newbie benefit but am looking harder now.

I was suspicious of Grover and am not so much right now but cannot for the life of me figure out why.

And you know that I'm pinged hard by you, font & JAG currently. I probably feel best about JAG out of that group but he is a better player than I am so he may just be playing me.

Did I miss anyone?

[cheekimonk]

Are there any patterns in particular you want to point out?

Suicane, for one. He started the momentum for the bad lynch on D1, then helped along the momentum on D2's bad lynch before ditching for EF...when EF was not remotely in danger. Convenient since I called him out for stoking the fire for GE on D1.

font, in addition to being oddly aggressive here, tried to start a pile-on on D1 before jumping at the last minute to GE. Who did he try to start the run on? Why, none other than Raven...D2's erroneous lynching and one he also piled on immediately when it started along with...

Zinto. Who, I've pointed out, has not cast a single vote for someone not lynched (all bad for us). He's been quiet, too, and vets have pointed out that it's quieter than usual.

[britrock88]

So I'm just going to assume for the sake of this exercise that we lynch Cheekimonk and that he's a wolf. What does that tell us?

- his D1 LL avoidance points indirectly to Suicane and Font
- his D2 switch from Sui to Grover points toward Suicane and away from Grover
- posting/reads:
----- justifies early D2 Sui vote by Sui bandwagoning onto GE D1; switches to Grover when Sui points out it was a self-defense vote
----- (post 463, EF points out how it feels orchestrated)
----- defends himself when Grover asks pointed questions
----- makes a mechanical inference about Druss/Nosta, catches heat from Font for it

...I dunno. Not that I get any kind of good feeling, but this seems like it could very well be new player feeling out the WW atmosphere. I'd still rather head toward Suicane first, I think. But I'll reread him to see what there is pointing in that direction beyond his presence near the LL for the last 2 days.

[britrock88]

Well, it's pretty small which is frustrating.

I believe EF because of no counter claim -- though if you are Druss would you counter? I think with the count getting closer and no seer hits you probably would.

I know my alignment.

I have not seen anything that has pinged me from Chief (except the vet angle), Zinto (except how quiet he is), and saldana (who I remember usually playing his cards close to the vest).

I think Suicane is a confused new player.

I've given Homer & cheekimonk newbie benefit but am looking harder now.

I was suspicious of Grover and am not so much right now but cannot for the life of me figure out why.

And you know that I'm pinged hard by you, font & JAG currently. I probably feel best about JAG out of that group but he is a better player than I am so he may just be playing me.

Did I miss anyone?

That's everyone. Thanks!

I'm intrigued because I'm reading you very positively, yet I am also good and read JAG and Font the same way. We might be able to make sense of it after dusk...

[HomerSimpson98]

vote font

Not comfortable on lynching cheeki

[cheekimonk]

i did, and i was going to vote her again today, but she seems to have actually caught something that makes sense...everything else is just a hunch...she tagged onto an actual fact, so i will go with her today, and if Cheekimonk comes up village, i will vote her at 1001 tonight.

Did I not counter her argument against me? Sure, what I said turned out to be strange but it could have been interpreted many different ways (since I did say it so poorly). Why so quick for her to leap to the absolute worst interpretation for me? (something that's been a pattern for her with nearly every player in this game since it began)

[path12]

I will say that the more cheek explains the better I feel about lynching him.

No offense.

[britrock88]

Where I stand at the moment.

++: EF, Grover, Path
+: Font, JAG
=: Homer, Saldana, Zinto
-: Cheeki, CR, Sui
--:

Still going to reread Sui, and maybe some of the quieter types.

[Zinto]

I don't particularly want it to be a runaway on Cheeki. I came to the same conclusion that there was a good chance there is going to be a two kills if Druss was found.

[britrock88]

I will say that the more cheek explains the better I feel about lynching him.

No offense.

Yeah, possibly the wolf on his heels?

[Zinto]

Zinto. Who, I've pointed out, has not cast a single vote for someone not lynched (all bad for us). He's been quiet, too, and vets have pointed out that it's quieter than usual.


I unfortunately don't have the ability to place a vote and guarantee they are going to be lynched. Yeah my voting record is bad but who knows how good anyone's voting record is right now.

[Zinto]

I'm not claiming any role. There's no reason to out myself with only Druss being known, and after the first 2 nights ANY villager is critical...role or not. It's going to hurt the village to lose me and I can say that based on straight logic without an emotional appeal to everyone to trust me that I'm EXTRA valuable. That would reek of desperation to me, and would get the wolves after me in any case.


If you have a role you probably should reveal. It is looking like you are going to be lynched and it gives us enough time right now to change course and figure things out.

[cheekimonk]

I will say that the more cheek explains the better I feel about lynching him.

No offense.

I understand...and I can actually see your point given the quality. But that's feeling...and I'm willing to bet that's true of many. But where's the evidence - pattern or logic?

[cheekimonk]

Got to head to my date, so I leave my fate in your hands. I just ask everyone to go back and find the logic/argument that started this mess. I explicitly asked for it and still haven't gotten it so I can't refute it. The village is going to be in dire straits tomorrow if I'm lynched...I don't want it to be because I gave everyone indigestion.

[Zinto]

If you don't reveal Cheek I am going to assume you are a wolf. Because it doesn't make sense for you not to reveal.

[Zinto]

(But good luck on the date!)

[cheekimonk]

If you have a role you probably should reveal. It is looking like you are going to be lynched and it gives us enough time right now to change course and figure things out.

I don't fully trust you, Zinto. I'm not going to be baited. But you have a point. I've been saying it's going to be BAD for us if I'm lynched. I've been giving that hint all damn day. Now I'm wolf dinner, but I'd rather be NK'd I suppose if it means the village has a better chance of actually lynching a wolf.

[Chief Rum]

If you don't reveal Cheek I am going to assume you are a wolf. Because it doesn't make sense for you not to reveal.

Well, unless he isn't anything, just vanilla.

[path12]

I understand...and I can actually see your point given the quality. But that's feeling...and I'm willing to bet that's true of many. But where's the evidence - pattern or logic?

Well I don't buy your Suicane thing at all. I see nothing weird about his voting either day 1 or day 2.

I can understand your explanation on the night kill because I can read that rule both the way font did and the way you did.

But all in all you have the demeanor of someone who hasn't played a ton, got caught out a little bit and are desperately trying to backpedal. I get that too, it's happened to me before. Hell, it's happened to all of us before.

However, I haven't moved my vote to you yet and don't know that I will.

[Chief Rum]

Or maybe not. cheeki, are you revealing for a role?

[Zinto]

Well, unless he isn't anything, just vanilla.


He has hinted at a role a couple of times now. It is the right play for him to reveal if does.

[britrock88]

Suicane:

Voting:
- D1: nothing suspicious. Early vote was on Grover, FWIW. Moved to GE in self-defense.
- D2: Early vote on EF. Then, when in 5-2-2 LL, promotes Grover to 3 votes (instead of Font). Then, with a Raven 4/Grover 3/Sui 3 tally, moves from Grover to Raven. Finally, with a Raven 4/Grover 3/Sui 2 tally, moves to EF (2) and puts himself 1 vote closer to LL. EF votes Sui into a tie before Timmae and JAG push Raven ahead. A very interesting day, but I don't find it telling. If anything, it seems his self-preservation instinct is less than one might expect.

Posting
- D1: Metas with Grover, no other content.
- D2: Gives a negative gut read of EF (reasonable, IMO). Gets after CR a little bit for stepping off his meta Raven vote. Gets the wolfclaim query from Font, gives a standard-looking newbie answer. Explains Raven vote as choice between Raven and Font, acknowledges Font's assistance in the tally. A little EF tunnel vision.
- D3: largely absent.

Sui honestly seems like a newbie villager. Sigh. Reading new players is tough.

[britrock88]

I don't fully trust you, Zinto. I'm not going to be baited. But you have a point. I've been saying it's going to be BAD for us if I'm lynched. I've been giving that hint all damn day. Now I'm wolf dinner, but I'd rather be NK'd I suppose if it means the village has a better chance of actually lynching a wolf.

This could be orchestrated, fo sho.

unvote Suicane75
vote Zinto

On board with a Cheekimonk lynch, but want to keep the discussion going.

[path12]

So. Five good roles listed, four bad roles listed, one sorta neutral??

Seems like we don't believe all four bad roles are there, anyone got a guess on how many good ones?

[Zinto]

I don't fully trust you, Zinto. I'm not going to be baited. But you have a point. I've been saying it's going to be BAD for us if I'm lynched. I've been giving that hint all damn day. Now I'm wolf dinner, but I'd rather be NK'd I suppose if it means the village has a better chance of actually lynching a wolf.


You don't have to trust me. There are a bunch of other people who would call me out in thread if I was misleading you.

[cheekimonk]

Or maybe not. cheeki, are you revealing for a role?

The village will hate me more for revealing that, but a lynching is pretty bad hate anyways. Lynching me will be BAD for the village because I'm roled. I've been trying to hint that all day. Do as you will...

[path12]

I ask because I count one uncountered reveal, and two possibles (which could be good or bad)

[path12]

The village will hate me more for revealing that, but a lynching is pretty bad hate anyways. Lynching me will be BAD for the village because I'm roled. I've been trying to hint that all day. Do as you will...

The village will be more pissed if you are good, roled, and didn't speak up with whatever info you might have to help.

[fontisian]

Claim your role cheek.

[Chief Rum]

The village will hate me more for revealing that, but a lynching is pretty bad hate anyways. Lynching me will be BAD for the village because I'm roled. I've been trying to hint that all day. Do as you will...

Lynching a roled villager is worse than forcing the wolves to kill you.

[path12]

Lol, i'm mashing f5 like it is deadline.

[path12]

Welp, looks like he left the thread. I'm out any minute. Will be back before deadline.

[cheekimonk]

Dardalion. WHEN Druss dies, you will have lynched a replacement bodyguard.

[fontisian]

I am dardalion.

[Chief Rum]

I am dardalion.

Wait. How would you have stopped your hypothetical lynch today then? Are you hinting at two different roles? What's up, font?

[path12]

Well. This got interesting.

[Chief Rum]

Good heaven. Both y'all just shady as hell. Maybe this is some kind of "getting a wolf in the clear" plan between font and cheeki.

[Grover]

One of these two are lying.

[HomerSimpson98]

Yeah this is insane

[path12]

One of these two are lying.

You think? :D

[JAG]

Wait. How would you have stopped your hypothetical lynch today then? Are you hinting at two different roles? What's up, font?

Presumably by claiming, but yeah, that is weird. But no wolf would claim / hint at a duke role for obvious reasons.

[HomerSimpson98]

Uh oh a smily face. Path is next in line

I'm sticking with font

[saldana]

great, 2 reveals for the same role, neither can be verified.

i am interested in the answer to the question about why Font said she wouldnt be lynched tonight...made herself sound like she was the duke.

[saldana]

i love when 4 of us all post the same thing at the same time.

OOG...off to karate, back by 9EST

[JAG]

Unvote brit

[Suicane75]

Just checking in since I wont be around at the deadline. I know EF isn't a wolf but I'm going to keep my vote there just because I have no idea whether to throw it at Font or Cheek.

[path12]

Just checking in since I wont be around at the deadline. I know EF isn't a wolf but I'm going to keep my vote there just because I have no idea whether to throw it at Font or Cheek.

Suicane, believe me when I tell you that you need to put your vote on one or the other of them.

[Suicane75]

Ughh, real life is ruining this night for me.

Unvote: EagleFan
Vote: Fontisian

[Chief Rum]

This blows. I put these two on the same level and I have always felt worse about font. So I'm switching up.

I'm pretty sure either way we get a baddie.

UNVOTE CHEEKIMONK

VOTE FONTISIAN

[Chief Rum]

Umm, okay.

[JAG]

I'm pretty torn here. This might be the most uneasy I've felt about a claim war.

A possibility to consider: font is brutal, we mislynch and its down to 6-4 or 5-4 if the wolves get a double kill with removing EF. Then if they have the double lynch role or we lynch font, we lose because they get an extra kill or two depending on what roles they have.

On the other hand, we might have the neutral role which could counter that. The stakes are high though.

[Zinto]

Dardalion. WHEN Druss dies, you will have lynched a replacement bodyguard.


Well you wouldn't be a replacement BG. It would only be a one time thing.

[Zinto]

I'm pretty torn here. This might be the most uneasy I've felt about a claim war.

A possibility to consider: font is brutal, we mislynch and its down to 6-4 or 5-4 if the wolves get a double kill with removing EF. Then if they have the double lynch role or we lynch font, we lose because they get an extra kill or two depending on what roles they have.

On the other hand, we might have the neutral role which could counter that. The stakes are high though.


I have been thinking the same thing. I don't understand why Font was hinting at being the duke.

[Grover]

unvote cheekimonk

vote fontisian

[Zinto]

You've got three hours. You can't address my concerns in that time?

Fair warning though, I won't be lynched toDay, and if you're not around when the wagon swings off of me it could be problematic for you.


I guess this is the post in question. I take this more as Font revealing that she was going to reveal a role if things came down to it. My question is why not do that day one or yesterday when there was a very good chance she would be lynched?

[fontisian]

Hey people. Time to use your brains.

Wait. How would you have stopped your hypothetical lynch today then? Are you hinting at two different roles? What's up, font?
1. I said I wasn't going to be lynched toDay, implying that I was a powerrole. With EF claiming and me finally getting a shot at doing something you can take as a guess as to why I didn't clarify.

2.If I were the scum in this grouping, I would have claimed Rowena instead of my near useless role and made the seer counterclaim me.

3. Cheek scum slipped. I've played hardball town. Get your shit together townies.

[fontisian]

I guess this is the post in question. I take this more as Font revealing that she was going to reveal a role if things came down to it. My question is why not do that day one or yesterday when there was a very good chance she would be lynched?
Because I have balls of steel.

I made that post toDay as a fair warning to Cheek, because he said he wouldn't be around. It sucks to be the default lynch when everyone scrambling to get off a power role.

[fontisian]

Anyway, my money's on a Cheek/Grover/Saldana/Zinto scumteam, with a side chance of Homer. Saldana works in every Cheek!scum world, so make sure he dies.

Use the chart. I'm not sure it entirely applies to brit, JAG and Chief, but this scumteam isn't exactly on top of roleclaims either (Cheek went for the option that felt safe instead of the most useful one).

[fontisian]

I'm actually think the Day 1 voting points to Suicane being town, and Cheek being reluctant to be the deciding vote on any townie.

[fontisian]

Hey. People. If Cheek and I are the only ones with votes by the end of the Day, and all the scum roles are in the game, Entukku's going to kill me with him.

[JAG]

Post Time Voter Vote Unvote
76 4:07 Narcizo britrock88
80 7:04 Zinto GoldenEagle
81 7:11 JAG saldana
82 7:45 EagleFan Zinto
88 8:11 timmae Grover
96 9:57 Grover Suicane75
101 10:29 Chief Rum Raven
108 11:43 Raven Suicane75
112 11:57 cheekimonk timmae
123 12:25 Suicane75 Grover
128 12:28 britrock88 JAG
134 12:43 path12 britrock88
152 14:18 britrock88 timmae JAG
160 15:50 EagleFan Zinto
161 15:52 EagleFan Raven
163 15:57 JAG GoldenEagle saldana
166 16:25 Narcizo GoldenEagle britrock88
174 16:55 Chief Rum Suicane75 Raven
176 17:19 timmae JAG Grover
177 17:23 Suicane75 GoldenEagle Grover
180 18:06 HomerSimpson98 fontisian
189 18:35 JAG fontisian GoldenEagle
190 18:35 GoldenEagle Suicane75
192 18:42 Raven fontisian Suicane75
197 18:58 cheekimonk britrock88 timmae
204 19:11 path12 GoldenEagle britrock88
207 19:13 EagleFan GoldenEagle Grover
214 19:34 Grover fontisian Suicane75
216 20:02 JAG Suicane75 fontisian
223 20:25 GoldenEagle fontisian Suicane75
237 20:49 EagleFan Raven GoldenEagle
239 21:22 cheekimonk Raven britrock88
240 21:37 timmae GoldenEagle JAG
242 21:48 EagleFan fontisian Raven
244 21:54 fontisian GoldenEagle Raven

I didn't fix color for Raven and timmae, I think font's Raven vote is missing too.

Time Post Voter Type Votee Count
21:21 264 EagleFan vote Saldana 1
21:27 267 JAG vote Zinto 1
22:39 271 Path12 vote Grover 1
8:43 279 Cheekimonk vote Suicane75 1
9:31 285 Timmae vote Suicane75 2
10:32 290 Suicane75 vote EagleFan 1
11:16 304 Britrock88 vote Fontisian 1
12:10 312 Grover vote Fontisian 2
12:42 314 Fontisian vote Grover 2
13:16 328 Grover unvote Fontisian 1
13:26 330 Raven vote Fontisian 2
13:26 331 Britrock88 unvote Fontisian 1
13:26 331 Britrock88 vote Suicane75 3
14:14 341 EagleFan unvote Saldana 0
14:14 341 EagleFan vote Grover 3
14:15 342 HomerSimpson98 vote Raven 1
14:17 344 Grover vote Suicane75 4
16:07 354 Saldana vote Fontisian 2
16:21 356 Chief Rum vote Suicane75 5
17:23 359 EagleFan unvote Grover 2
17:23 359 EagleFan vote Timmae 1
18:01 366 JAG unvote Zinto 0
18:08 367 Suicane75 unvote EagleFan 0
18:08 367 Suicane75 vote Grover 3
19:06 384 EagleFan unvote Timmae 0
19:08 387 Zinto vote Raven 2
19:19 394 Timmae unvote Suicane75 4
19:23 396 Fontisian unvote Grover 2
19:37 401 Chief Rum unvote Suicane75 3
19:37 401 Chief Rum vote Fontisian 3
19:41 403 EagleFan vote Suicane75 4
19:59 417 Cheekimonk unvote Suicane75 3
19:59 417 Cheekimonk vote Grover 3
20:09 432 Fontisian vote Raven 3
20:19 445 Timmae vote Raven 4
20:19 446 Suicane75 unvote Grover 2
20:19 446 Suicane75 vote Raven 5
20:35 460 Timmae unvote Raven 4
20:35 460 Timmae vote EagleFan 1
20:37 463 EagleFan unvote Suicane75 2
20:37 463 EagleFan vote Cheekimonk 1
20:38 465 JAG vote Grover 3
20:45 478 Suicane75 unvote Raven 3
20:45 478 Suicane75 vote EagleFan 2
20:47 481 EagleFan unvote Cheekimonk 0
20:47 481 EagleFan vote Suicane75 3
20:56 497 Timmae unvote EagleFan 1
20:56 497 Timmae vote Raven 4
20:58 504 JAG unvote Grover 2
20:58 504 JAG vote Raven 5

[EagleFan]

My case against cheek...

The back and forth between he and Suicane looked a little contrived.

His reveal seems rather fake. A while between him hinting and revealing. The reveal has the smell of something a vet would tell him to try, just the right role to reveal due to his circumstance of not being around tonight.

His reaction to being a leading vote getter. Takes it far too lightly at first, like a new player that is a wolf would handle it; not wanting to cause a stir. A new player that is a villager would have been a lot more vocal. It's the deer in headlights look most of us had the first time we were a wolf and had the village looking at us.

Finally, and most important... his knowledge of my role and how it relates to what the wolves can do. There isn't anything specific in the role that is posted that says what he said. I PM'd Jackal to get some details after I found out that I was scanned last night. cheek's take on it seems quite a bit like what I read into the response that I got back.

[fontisian]

Oh, and I counterclaimed him. Let's not forget that.

Seriously, does it make any sense at all for me to counter Cheek instead of trying to out another role as scum? Cheek lied. I am telling the truth. Ugh.

[Grover]

Dammit. This is too hard.

unvote fontisian

[Zinto]

Vote Cheek

[fontisian]

...

Thank you, likely scum.

[JAG]

Vote cheek

After rereading him today, I feel better about this.

[Zinto]

The reason for Cheek over Font is that Cheek seemed to really go over how the kills work and then seemed to think he was going to turn into a BG replacement.

[HomerSimpson98]

The only one I trust here is EF. And while his take is logical it isn't iron clad. Like Grover said, this sucks.

unvote font

Vote cheeki

[fontisian]

Ok. Now that we've figured that out, we need to designate 1-2 other people and have a single vote on each, to prevent Entukku's power from being used without risking killing a scum, and also without depleting the majority lynch enough to allow a last minute swing by scum onto me.

[Grover]

vote cheek

This was my original vote. Sticking with it now.

[JAG]

Ok. Now that we've figured that out, we need to designate 1-2 other people and have a single vote on each, to prevent Entukku's power from being used without risking killing a scum, and also without depleting the majority lynch enough to allow a last minute swing by scum onto me.

Oh, good catch on that. I thought the wolves got to pick the second lynch, not that it was random.

[saldana]

anyone have a count?

[HomerSimpson98]

Entukku - Once per game can initiate a double lynch, where the winning vote getter and a random vote getter from that day ..[/QUOTE]

Doesn't matter how many others there are. Just that you are a vote getter

[HomerSimpson98]

F'ng iPhone butchered that post. My bad. Point I was making is that it doesn't matter that there is 2 or 8 vote getters

[saldana]

Hey people. Time to use your brains.


1. I said I wasn't going to be lynched toDay, implying that I was a powerrole. With EF claiming and me finally getting a shot at doing something you can take as a guess as to why I didn't clarify.

2.If I were the scum in this grouping, I would have claimed Rowena instead of my near useless role and made the seer counterclaim me.

3. Cheek scum slipped. I've played hardball town. Get your shit together townies.

this is a purely meta post, and has nothing to with the game

but is it necessary to insult people?

its werewolf...do we need to directly call people as "scum" every 10 minutes?

there will always be conflict...thats the nature of the game, but i have said this before in games...attack the play, not the player...personal attacks have no place here, and if they do, i am done playing.

[JAG]

Entukku - Once per game can initiate a double lynch, where the winning vote getter and a random vote getter from that day ..

Doesn't matter how many others there are. Just that you are a vote getter[/QUOTE]

It matters because if too many people go off the wolf, the vote could potentially be swung by the wolves to a villager, especially if they are close to endgame with a mislynch.

[fontisian]

this is a purely meta post, and has nothing to with the game

but is it necessary to insult people?

its werewolf...do we need to directly call people as "scum" every 10 minutes?

there will always be conflict...thats the nature of the game, but i have said this before in games...attack the play, not the player...personal attacks have no place here, and if they do, i am done playing.
Scum is the term for any non-town role. It's not an insult. Neither is a general call to think about what you're doing a personal attack.

[JAG]

this is a purely meta post, and has nothing to with the game

but is it necessary to insult people?

its werewolf...do we need to directly call people as "scum" every 10 minutes?

there will always be conflict...thats the nature of the game, but i have said this before in games...attack the play, not the player...personal attacks have no place here, and if they do, i am done playing.

I think scum is just the term they use for wolves wherever font plays most, like townie is her term for villager. I don't believe she is calling someone a scum as in a real insult.

[path12]

I'm pretty torn here. This might be the most uneasy I've felt about a claim war.

A possibility to consider: font is brutal, we mislynch and its down to 6-4 or 5-4 if the wolves get a double kill with removing EF. Then if they have the double lynch role or we lynch font, we lose because they get an extra kill or two depending on what roles they have.

On the other hand, we might have the neutral role which could counter that. The stakes are high though.

Wouldn't it then be better to lynch her now since the Brutal doesn't take effect until after Druss is dead?

Snaga - Gains brutal if Druss dies.

I feel you would have known that.

[fontisian]

Weren't you guys claiming that I was playing like a cunning? Now I'm a likely brutal all of sudden?

[path12]

The past hour really makes me feel like font and JAG are playing you guys.

[path12]

Weren't you guys claiming that I was playing like a cunning? Now I'm a likely brutal all of sudden?

I'm just quoting JAG. I don't think you are a brutal necessarily. But even if his question was true, you're not until AFTER EF DIES WHICH PEOPLE HE HAS NOT.

It's JAG being misleading, and JAG is nothing if not detail oriented. You two are wolves.

[saldana]

Scum is the term for any non-town role. It's not an insult. Neither is a general call to think about what you're doing a personal attack.

perhaps somewhere else it is, but it never has been here.

and "use your brains" and "get your shit together", while not directed at any one individual, are insulting to the people you are referring to (which includes me, who was insulted, so i can speak to this point rather confidently)

[JAG]

Wouldn't it then be better to lynch her now since the Brutal doesn't take effect until after Druss is dead?



I feel you would have known that.

You're right. Normally I'm not this embarrassingly bad with rules, but here I've mistaken a couple obvious things. The only thing I can say is I've spent my time going through posts and votes, not looking at page 1. I recalled there was a double lynch bad guy because I hadn't remembered seeing that role before, but I forgot how his power worked and that the brutal didn't appear until Druss was gone.

I stand by my vote of cheek though. I didn't really see what EF and font did at first read, reading again I think he overstepped.

[fontisian]

perhaps somewhere else it is, but it never has been here.

and "use your brains" and "get your shit together", while not directed at any one individual, are insulting to the people you are referring to (which includes me, who was insulted, so i can speak to this point rather confidently)
It's the terminology used on almost every site that plays games beyond werewolf. The largest mafia site is actually called "mafiascum." It's so completely integral to gameplay on every site I play except this one, that I don't think I could stop using it if I tried.

Can you explain what's insulting about the other two? They're fairly common phrases in my day to day life, which is admittedly among a younger and more vulgar group of people than frequent this website.

[path12]

You're right. Normally I'm not this embarrassingly bad with rules, but here I've mistaken a couple obvious things. The only thing I can say is I've spent my time going through posts and votes, not looking at page 1. I recalled there was a double lynch bad guy because I hadn't remembered seeing that role before, but I forgot how his power worked and that the brutal didn't appear until Druss was gone.

I stand by my vote of cheek though. I didn't really see what EF and font did at first read, reading again I think he overstepped.

Y'know, if this was a hugely complicated game I could totally buy that.

Here there are 10 possible roles, each with a one line description. Not buying it.

[fontisian]

Y'know, if this was a hugely complicated game I could totally buy that.

Here there are 10 possible roles, each with a one line description. Not buying it.
Path, why would he lie about something that easy to check?

[saldana]

Can you explain what's insulting about the other two?

are you seriously asking what is insulting about telling a full grown adult to "use your brain"?...basically saying "hey, you are stupid"...nah...not insulting at all.

[path12]

Path, why would he lie about something that easy to check?

Because he has a reputation as one of the very best players around here and people will usually trust him without checking for themselves. Hell, I've taken false vote counts at face value before. It's ballsy but you guys NEED tonight to take out Druss. It's actually kind of cracking me up that he is helping you to do it.

[JAG]

Y'know, if this was a hugely complicated game I could totally buy that.

Here there are 10 possible roles, each with a one line description. Not buying it.

If it was a complicated game, I would've been much more on top of the rules. You don't want to believe it, that's fine, but it's the truth. I've been trying to hunt wolves as I believe my posting history shows.

[HomerSimpson98]

Path, why would he lie about something that easy to check?

Why in the hell are you chiming in on this? You accused cheeki of the same crap. I swear it's like you want to be lynched

[fontisian]

are you seriously asking what is insulting about telling a full grown adult to "use your brain"?...basically saying "hey, you are stupid"...nah...not insulting at all.
Of course not. It means you aren't thinking in this specific case. If you were stupid, you wouldn't have a brain to use.

[Grover]

If cheek ends up being a commoner, I am voting font and not budging from it tomorrow.

[path12]

If cheek ends up being a commoner, I am voting font and not budging from it tomorrow.

Probably too late then.

[fontisian]

Why in the hell are you chiming in on this? You accused cheeki of the same crap. I swear it's like you want to be lynched
...
Seriously.

Cheek did not lie (well, except when he roleclaimed, though that was a result of desperation). He had access information he could only acquire as a wolf. I'm sure his explanation of the scum ability to kill Drass is accurate.

[path12]

Well, I'm only in and out after about five more minutes or so. Any vote count?

[HomerSimpson98]

unvote cheek

[britrock88]

++: EF, Font, JAG
+: Grover, Path, Suicane
=: Chief Rum, HomerSimpson
-: Saldana, Zinto
--: Cheekimonk

[britrock88]

Font may be abrading, but I think she's got this one right.

[EagleFan]

...
Seriously.

Cheek did not lie (well, except when he roleclaimed, though that was a result of desperation). He had access information he could only acquire as a wolf. I'm sure his explanation of the scum ability to kill Drass is accurate.

What she said.

[path12]

OK, I'm out. Good job wolves. Hope I'm wrong.

[britrock88]

Vote Count:

6 - cheekimonk - EagleFan (516), fontisian (599), saldana (621), Zinto (711), JAG (713), Grover (718)
4 - fontisian - path12 (588), cheekimonk (589), Suicane75 (696), Chief Rum (696)
1 - Zinto - britrock88 (670)