WW IL - Do Werewolves Dream of Electric Sheep? Game Over, page 36

[Chief Rum]

right, because putting myself out there like that on DAY 2 would have been an optimal strategy.

First of all, get your facts straight. It was DAY THREE. Second, no one knew yet about the scan one night, kill the next order. Twothree didn't reveal that until Day Four.

Optimal strategy would have been to say you were scanned on Night One. Saying Night Two wouldn't protect anyone, just make you look bad, which is exactly what it's doing.

[Lathum]

TANGLEWOOD- CAN THE BODYGUARD PROTECT THE SAME PERSON MULTIPLE NIGHTS?

[Chief Rum]

TANGLEWOOD- CAN THE BODYGUARD PROTECT THE SAME PERSON MULTIPLE NIGHTS?

If you're not a Replicant, you should know of all things not to ask that question. Unless you just want to draw a map for the wolves to their target.

Of course, if you're a Replicant, you want Tanglewood to answer that question.

I'm not saying a word. The Replicants will just have to guess where I will be tonight.

[Lathum]

I want the answer to that question because if twothree dies tonight you may have some serious explaining to do.

[Lathum]

and now I am out for the night. I hope twothree kills me, I really do.

Cronin was Holden

[Chief Rum]

I want the answer to that question because if twothree dies tonight you may have some serious explaining to do.

If I can protect him, you would figure he would be protected. If I can't, he dies. I'm still the BG in either situation, and you would still be trying to kill the BG. How on Earth does an answer either way say one thing about my allegiance?

[twothree]

This is going to fun reading for people in the morning. :)

Play nice everybody. :D

[Chief Rum]

But chill out for a bit, because I may have found something that is making me re-think my position on you. It's not ironclad, but it's an unanswered question that for the first time (in my mind) lends creedence to what you are saying.

twothree stated he found st. cronin being killed out in the open, near an abandoned apartment complex (IIRC). If st.cronin is a normal, non-BR human (clearly not a wolf or a BG and nothing suggests Tyrell or the other guy have night time actions), then why and how was he out in the open the night he died? He would not be out and about if he was a regular average joe. So he could only have been Holden.

And if he was, I would say I have to believe Lathum, too, and offer my deepest apologies for this whole mess.

[Chief Rum]

That said, trying to "out" the rules under which I can provide my guardian abilities has to be one of the dopiest things I have seen someone do. And someone as experienced as Lathum should certainly know better.

But for my accusations, reserving only in case you are a Replicant after all, I do apologize, Lathum. Let's try to work together to win this thing.

[ntndeacon]

Do you have to kill someone tonight twothree? Unless we are sure we have a replicant (say that for some strangwe reason we had not killed Barkeep) Is it a good thing to kill someone that we dont know is good...(and have 2 deaths tonight one of which we know will be a good guy.)

[twothree]

Oh, and just because I remembered...(and might possibly be dead tommorrow).

I made up the dream I reported on day 1. My actual dream was that of a white horse running in the countryside. I didn't want to state that because I have seen the director's cut of Blade Runner, and in it Deckard has a short dream of a white unicorn running outside.

I figured if I stated my real dream someone might identify me as Deckard.

[twothree]

Do you have to kill someone tonight twothree? Unless we are sure we have a replicant (say that for some strangwe reason we had not killed Barkeep) Is it a good thing to kill someone that we dont know is good...(and have 2 deaths tonight one of which we know will be a good guy.)

No, I don't have to kill someone. And, so far I haven't submitted any intention of killing someone. But, stating you are going to kill someone, creates a lot of conversation. ;)

[twothree]

However, killing someone is the only way to prove that they are a human or a replicant. Voting them off to Mars, gives no information.

Right now RendeR/Lathum claim two different things, RendeR stated Holden is still alive, Lathum stated Holden was st. cronin and is dead. (Since, Chief Rum backed off his story, I will leave him out for now. ) So, the way I figure it, if either RendeR/Lathum dies tonight, then we will find out if they are a human or a replicant and which story is the correct one to believe.

[twothree]

waves to the ghost of st. cronin...waves to the early rising tanglewood on the other side of the pond.

I need to get to sleep.

[Alan T]

So either Render is lying or Lathum is lying.

If Lathum is lying, Render either is the other seer or knows who it is. If Render is lying, then St.Cronin was the seer and Lathum just a cleared human.

If we vote one off, then we won't know if they or the other person were lying. So in order to get a replicant, either Lathum or Render need to be night killed or we need to vote both of them off. That is what stinks about no reveal lynches.

Now... Chief Rum might have guesses about what Cronin was or wasn't, but his guesses being right or wrong don't damn either Lathum or Render in this case. Chief might be a bad guy who outed one of his own late in the game to buy trust knowing that Barkeep likely was going down anyways and took a gamble that the bodyguard was already dead in his reveal.. But that would be completely risky to do unless they get some information in their night kills that would have shared that information.. (or their seer had previously found the bodyguard and they knew he was dead). Right now I'm not sure which way I feel about Chief, but killing him or voting him doesn't help with resolving the Render/Lathum disagreement.

[Chief Rum]

Two day job. I will be out for most of the day as usual. I will try to check in before deadline in between jobs.

[Telle]

Well here's who we have left:

Alan T
Jonathan Ezarik
Chief Rum
LoneStarGirl
Lathum
RendeR
path12
Telle
ntndeacon
twothree

Looks like we're currently focusing on Lathum, RendeR, and Chief Rum. Prior to twothree's hospitalization we were looking at Alan T. It looks to me like there's a number of other names up there who haven't been thoroughly scrutinized.

Also, now that we know that Barkeep was a replicant, we should go back through and scour his posts and vote record. I'm going to be a bit busy at work today, so if someone else wants to put in this effort that would be great.. otherwise I'll see what I can do before the deadline this evening.

[Alan T]

Its very easy.. Lathum says St.Cronin WAS Holden. Render says Holden is still alive.

Both can't be true. Today's vote is either for one or the other. One in this case is outright lying and we have to decide which.

[Telle]

Well I still believe Lathum, and have ever since st cronin was killed.

[twothree]

Well, since I still haven't seen a post from RendeR with new information. I will attempt to terminate RenedR tonight. I hope he is not human.

[Telle]

I think there's also a possibility that RendeR is human and is just talking out of his ass to stir things up.. but if so then it's his own damn fault if he gets killed :)

[Alan T]

Well, since I still haven't seen a post from RendeR with new information. I will attempt to terminate RenedR tonight. I hope he is not human.

Well... if he is, then bad news might be that you killed the other seer possibly. Good news is we know Lathum is lying and can lynch him today.

[Alan T]

I think there's also a possibility that RendeR is human and is just talking out of his ass to stir things up.. but if so then it's his own damn fault if he gets killed :)

That would be a good way to help us lose the game if its the case.

[Telle]

So now the question is, do I call home and wake his butt up so that he has a chance to attempt to explain his comments before twothree kills him...

[Alan T]

So now the question is, do I call home and wake his butt up so that he has a chance to attempt to explain his comments before twothree kills him...

I don't know if that crosses the RL -> Game boundry a bit much or not. I assume you don't know his guilt or innocence, and even if you did you have no game mechanism for out of thread discussion.. So probably best to just leave it be...

I dont know that I would have chosen to kill Render only for not popping in, but either way it gives us some information. My biggest fear is if Render is right, the harm in killing him is much greater than the harm in killing lathum.

Personally if it was me and I was in twothree's shoes, I would just kill Lathum, and if he turned up human lynch Render today. If Lathum turned up bad, then we can assume Render either is Holden or knows who he is. I just feel the risk of killing Render at night is much higher than killing Lathum, but in the end it's twothree's call.

[Telle]

Oh yeah, I really don't know whether RendeR is a human or replicant. I was just worried that if he gets killed before he's able to give more info on his rather cryptic message that it could cause us more problems trying to figure out what the hell he was saying and the truthfulness of it.

As it happens, it appears that he's finally shown up. Considering that our daughter has been waking up before 8am lately, I was rather surprised that he wasn't here already.

[Alan T]

Doesnt really matter what he posts at this point, if twothree isnt coming back before 10am anyways though.

[RendeR]

FYI she slept till 9:15 =) and our son until 9:30, quiet morning for me for a change, though it leaves me dropping in on short notice.


SO, no matter what you make of my remarks it makes no real sense to off me yet.

Lathum's story is riding on the fringe of sanity if you take his posting tone into account, Rum has been calm and steady. That tells me one of rather desperate and one is secure in himself.

I'd kill lathum. I think he's just scrambling to save his butt at this point.

[RendeR]

And here is hoping twothree is posting my termination order to throw off the replicants =)

[Lathum]

If I can protect him, you would figure he would be protected. If I can't, he dies. I'm still the BG in either situation, and you would still be trying to kill the BG. How on Earth does an answer either way say one thing about my allegiance?

show me where I said I wanted twothree to kill you, /i think I was pretty obvious about him killing LSG.. It is amazing the words you are trying to put in my mouth

[Telle]

Well assuming that twothree has put in a night action to kill you, and he doesn't make it back in time.. any last words?

[Lathum]

where are people getting Render saying holden is alive from?

[RendeR]

Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious

[RendeR]

Holden is alive.

St. Cronin was scanned night 1

No-one.


not sure I can offer more than that at this time.


From here.

[Lathum]

Telle, did you get my "hint"

[Telle]

I'm just not buying it. Things seem to line up much better with the idea of st cronin being Holden than the idea that Holden is still around.

So perhaps we're about to get our second wolf :) (or third maybe if we actually managed to unknowingly send one off to Mars?)

[Telle]

Telle, did you get my "hint"

Evidently not :)

[Lathum]

FYI she slept till 9:15 =) and our son until 9:30, quiet morning for me for a change, though it leaves me dropping in on short notice.


SO, no matter what you make of my remarks it makes no real sense to off me yet.

Lathum's story is riding on the fringe of sanity if you take his posting tone into account, Rum has been calm and steady. That tells me one of rather desperate and one is secure in himself.

I'd kill lathum. I think he's just scrambling to save his butt at this point.

are you claiming to be holden?

[Lathum]

Telle, post 1481, remember the night you were scanned

[Alan T]

where are people getting Render saying holden is alive from?

Umm from here:

Holden is alive.

St. Cronin was scanned night 1

No-one.


not sure I can offer more than that at this time.

[Alan T]

Wow, I am getting slow in my old age I think.

[Alan T]

Well its deadline, guess we get to see what happens here. I hope twothree guessed correctly on who to kill between Lathum and Render.

[Telle]

Telle, post 1481, remember the night you were scanned

Gah.. yeah, that totally blew right over my head!

Lathum is DEFINITELY human and has DEFINITELY been scanned.

[Telle]

He just matched up something perfectly in my PM about the night I was scanned.. something he couldn't know unless he had experienced it himself.

[Lathum]

then who is holden?
who was scanned night 1?
who was scanned last night?

I was under the impression RenderR was merely playing devils advocate by answering these questions.

If he claims he is Holden of Holden is alive he is lying.

[Alan T]

Well if telle is vouching for Lathum, I now really do hope Twothree sent in a kill order for Render. And hoping he is a wolf, that leaves:


2. Jonathan Ezarik
4. Chief Rum
6. LoneStarGirl
9. path12
16. ntndeacon

For the third wolf to hide within.. So this takes us back to the issue with Chief Rum..

He revealed the information that he was protecting twothree BEFORE the night results were out, but after deadline. The wolves obviously went after twothree that night, so Chief rum if he was a wolf, would have assumed they were going to kill twothree there, or get bodyguard blocked (meaning the bodyguard was still alive). So for him to come out before results stating he was the bodyguard and protected twothree would be crazy.

The real bodyguard if Chief isn't it, would be able to come out and say he's lying. And since twothree didn't die, we have to assume he was protected somehow. So i think we have to come to the thought that chief rum is the bodyguard, he just doesn't really get much in the way of information at night thus was wrong about stuff that cronin did, was wrong about Lathum, and got lucky with barkeep.

So that leaves:

2. Jonathan Ezarik
6. LoneStarGirl
9. path12
16. ntndeacon

And I still feel pretty good about going after LSG, but easily one of the other three listed there could be an UtR wolf who has just slid along the entire game unnoticed.

[Lathum]

dola- If I am killed and anyone claims they were scanned last night they are lying.

If they mention "moral dilema" lynch them, unless it's Telle on myself.

[Alan T]

I was under the impression RenderR was merely playing devils advocate by answering these questions.

If he claims he is Holden of Holden is alive he is lying.

His post seems pretty clear that he is saying Holden is alive, which directly disputes what you claim.

[Lathum]

His post seems pretty clear that he is saying Holden is alive, which directly disputes what you claim.

then if I die he needs to be target #1

and anyone who claims they were scanned last night will be lying.

[RendeR]

I was under the impression RenderR was merely playing devils advocate by answering these questions.

If he claims he is Holden of Holden is alive he is lying.


Unfortunately, lathum is human and my instincts were totally wrong about him. Though my little gambit here has paid off in finding that out for certain.

Lathum is correct, I was trying a little baiting ploy here to try and get some people thinking outside the box and hopefully help clarify things more than muddy them.

Seems it worked, though it may have cost me the ability to breath :p

[RendeR]

His post seems pretty clear that he is saying Holden is alive, which directly disputes what you claim.

To Be clear Alan:

Cronin was Holden

Telle is Human
Lathum is Human
*I* am Human
Chief is the BodyGuard
TwoThree is Deckard

Wichi leaves a diminishing group of people still in question

You
Lonestargirl
Path12
NTNdeacon

Did I miss anyone?

[RendeR]

And Jonathan Ezarik


So its 5 known good guys and 5 uknowns.

[Telle]

I hate waiting.. where the heck is Tangle?

[Lathum]

And Jonathan Ezarik


So its 5 known good guys and 5 uknowns.

actually one of the good guys is dead and you are putting yourself in that group.

3 goods, 6 unknowns.

[Alan T]

Render, if you supposedly are good, why would you purposely mislead us and put us in a position where two good guys have 1 of them obviously telling a lie, and then leaving the rest of us to try to decide which?

That move barely makes sense for a bad guy to do it, it makes no sense for a good guy to. Best case it ends up with one of you dead and us going after the other one on a witchhunt that ends up with no result.

Right now your posting makes me feel that you are bad, your bluff was called and you are hoping that twothree chose not to go after you.

[RendeR]

actually one of the good guys is dead and you are putting yourself in that group.

3 goods, 6 unknowns.


No at worst you have 4 good 5 unknown. How do you get down to 3? Or are you still hung up on Chief NOT being the bodyguard?

[Lathum]

No at worst you have 4 good 5 unknown. How do you get down to 3? Or are you still hung up on Chief NOT being the bodyguard?

I not 100% sold on CR

[RendeR]

Render, if you supposedly are good, why would you purposely mislead us and put us in a position where two good guys have 1 of them obviously telling a lie, and then leaving the rest of us to try to decide which?

That move barely makes sense for a bad guy to do it, it makes no sense for a good guy to. Best case it ends up with one of you dead and us going after the other one on a witchhunt that ends up with no result.

Right now your posting makes me feel that you are bad, your bluff was called and you are hoping that twothree chose not to go after you.


If thats the case, vote me off today. Simple. Seriously, if the way I did it seems that rediculously insane tell me, I'll vote for myself to go to Mars to prove my trust list is real.

The fact is everyone was circling around lathum/chief and even YOU without giving any real thought to anyone else. The problem with that is two of those three are guarenteed good guys at this point (as far as I'm concerned at least) and I did what I did to try and break the losing cycle you all had fallen into.

Lynch me, it just proves me right.

[twothree]

I did put an attempt at killing RendeR.

[Lathum]

I did put an attempt at killing RendeR.

whew...

[twothree]

I did put an attempt at killing RendeR.

That should be... I did make an attempt at killing RendeR for my night action.

[Lathum]

well if you were succesful that saves us from having to lynch him today

[RendeR]

Thats ok twothree. The only way I survive is if the bodyguard protects me from you too =) if thats the case then I can verify him as well.

If I die then I die and we now know that Lathum is human and you have the scenario I posted above to work with.

I took a gamble and it could have really blown up, but it appears for the loss of one Human *me* that we now have a much more solid circle of trust.

[RendeR]

So where the heck if Tangle =) I hate waiting!

[tanglewood]

This morning there is no such relief of a hospitalised person, but once again more news of death. Ntndeacon was found dead in his home this morning, clearly an act of murder. Condolences go out to his family.

Day 6 ends 9pm EST

[Alan T]

Thats ok twothree. The only way I survive is if the bodyguard protects me from you too =) if thats the case then I can verify him as well.

If I die then I die and we now know that Lathum is human and you have the scenario I posted above to work with.

I took a gamble and it could have really blown up, but it appears for the loss of one Human *me* that we now have a much more solid circle of trust.

I don't see how anything you did helped any CoT. It just delayed us a day here if you are indeed good.

Lathum and Telle trust each other due to the hint Lathum dropped to Telle. Anything you have done hasn't told us anything about Chief Rum at all, and we're still left trying to figure out if he is believable or not. I made my case for why I felt it would be suicide to come out as a bodyguard the way he did if he was a wolf, thus I think he is good.

As far as i can tell, you took heat off of one of the unknowns for today and placed it squarely on yourself.. and if you are a villager, that is a losing move.

[twothree]

The real bodyguard if Chief isn't it, would be able to come out and say he's lying. And since twothree didn't die, we have to assume he was protected somehow. So i think we have to come to the thought that chief rum is the bodyguard, he just doesn't really get much in the way of information at night thus was wrong about stuff that cronin did, was wrong about Lathum, and got lucky with barkeep.

Actually last night I reread almost all posts Chief Rum made, and there was one post where he got his facts messed up which led him to believe Lathum was a replicant, I think. This is what convinced he is probably the human bodyguard. Let me go look it up so I can quote it.

[Alan T]

Well, I think the wolves helped us out some, as ntndeacon was one of the ones not on any cleared list...

Twothree, I would love to hear what happened to your attempt on render.. Wouldnt mind hearing render's side of it as well.

[Lathum]

so I can't wait to hear from twothree

[Alan T]

Actually last night I reread almost all posts Chief Rum made, and there was one post where he got his facts messed up which led him to believe Lathum was a replicant, I think. This is what convinced he is probably the human bodyguard. Let me go look it up so I can quote it.

Yeah, I am pretty convinced that Chief is the bodyguard, and he just doesn't see as much as he assumes he sees at night, thats the only thing I can think of.

If Chief was evil - He would have known Twothree was being attacked that night.
If chef was evil - He woudn't know twothree would have survived the attack and would assume twothree was dying
If chief was evil - he wouldn't come out saying he is the bodyguard and protected someone who ends up dead.

[twothree]

OK. Someone stopped me from killing RendeR last night, and I don't know who. This sucks. :(

[RendeR]

Well THATS a twist...

[twothree]

Well, I think the wolves helped us out some, as ntndeacon was one of the ones not on any cleared list...

Twothree, I would love to hear what happened to your attempt on render.. Wouldnt mind hearing render's side of it as well.

I never got to RendeR's place. Someone attacked me before I got there, and I ran away again. I am such a coward in this game.

[Lathum]

OK. Someone stopped me from killing RendeR last night, and I don't know who. This sucks. :(

unless CR says it was him
I see no reason to not to

VOTE RENDER

[Alan T]

And Chief won't be back until late because of working two jobs today he says... Do we assume as the bodyguard he chose to protect Render?

THis makes a mess of what to do today. I assume Lathum, Telle, Chief , Twothree are all good.

Do we waste a day trying to see if Render is a wolf, or go after Path, LSG or Jonathan.

I'm leaning towards LSG.

[twothree]

And since I can't seem to kill you.

vote RendeR

I don't know if I am right, but for now I want to put my vote on RendeR.

[Lathum]

It seems obvious to me the replicants are looking for Tyrell and Sebastion, otherwise why kill someone who is an unknown?

[RendeR]

I don't see how anything you did helped any CoT. It just delayed us a day here if you are indeed good.

Lathum and Telle trust each other due to the hint Lathum dropped to Telle. Anything you have done hasn't told us anything about Chief Rum at all, and we're still left trying to figure out if he is believable or not. I made my case for why I felt it would be suicide to come out as a bodyguard the way he did if he was a wolf, thus I think he is good.

As far as i can tell, you took heat off of one of the unknowns for today and placed it squarely on yourself.. and if you are a villager, that is a losing move.

Barring some revelation in a PM which I have yet to see, my move was a gamble, Ia gree, but it took teh heat off Lathum, who was gonna get killed if not for me throwing myself under the bus, so to speak.

Its not so much that what I did proved anything, but it broke up the circular arguments you all spent 4 pages having over wether to kill lathum or someone else. Lathum is good, so in effect I kept him alive.

I want to know HOW I lived too. Thats weird. I expected to be dead.

[Lathum]

And Chief won't be back until late because of working two jobs today he says... Do we assume as the bodyguard he chose to protect Render?

THis makes a mess of what to do today. I assume Lathum, Telle, Chief , Twothree are all good.

Do we waste a day trying to see if Render is a wolf, or go after Path, LSG or Jonathan.

I'm leaning towards LSG.

I agree LSG needs to go as well.

[Alan T]

I never got to RendeR's place. Someone attacked me before I got there, and I ran away again. I am such a coward in this game.


Ahh perhaps CR protected you again instead of Render then and just by being attacked prevented you from killing Render.

if this is the case, I guess we just lynch Render today and have no idea who or what he ends up being as we get no information from a lynch.

THen tonight twothree can scan either: myself, Path, Jonathan, or LSG.

[Alan T]

Barring some revelation in a PM which I have yet to see, my move was a gamble, Ia gree, but it took teh heat off Lathum, who was gonna get killed if not for me throwing myself under the bus, so to speak.

Its not so much that what I did proved anything, but it broke up the circular arguments you all spent 4 pages having over wether to kill lathum or someone else. Lathum is good, so in effect I kept him alive.

I want to know HOW I lived too. Thats weird. I expected to be dead.


How would you as a good guy know Lathum was good there before Telle confirmed him?

[RendeR]

Ok, he never got to me to try and kill me, that answers my still breathing.

[Lathum]

Ahh perhaps CR protected you again instead of Render then and just by being attacked prevented you from killing Render.


I don't follow this?

NTN was attacked.

[path12]

actually one of the good guys is dead and you are putting yourself in that group.

3 goods, 6 unknowns.

Interesting how you guys don't want to include yourselves. My breakdown:

Goods:
Telle (human)
Chief (BG)
twothree (Deckard)

Unsure:
Alan
JE
RendeR
Lathum
path
ntn
LSG

[Telle]

The wolves killed NTN. They can only make one attack at night, right? So it couldn't have been them who attacked twothree. And can anyone think of ANY game mechanism that would have stopped twothree from killing RendeR OTHER than the bodyguard protecting RendeR?

[Lathum]

How would you as a good guy know Lathum was good there before Telle confirmed him?

and why would you, as a villager, throw yourself under the bus for another villager?

It makes no sense.

[Lathum]

Interesting how you guys don't want to include yourselves. My breakdown:

Goods:
Telle (human)
Chief (BG)
twothree (Deckard)

Unsure:
Alan
JE
RendeR
Lathum
path
ntn
LSG

Path, I think you need to include me in your good list.

[Telle]

We have a 100% rock-solid COT with me, Lathum, and twothree.

I'm still a little iffy on Chief, but leaning towards good.

Everyone beyond that is still suspect.

[RendeR]

How would you as a good guy know Lathum was good there before Telle confirmed him?


I wasn't convinced totally. What I wanted to force to happen was that everyone would stop chasing their proverbial tails and think about something other than the 4 page argument over who's story sounded better and think about someone else for a bit. It worked, you all looked at me, lathum found a way to prove himself through telle.

I trusted telle based on Cronin's early posts and twothree's scanning of her.

What I did was NOT a normal positive move, but something HAD to be done to make you all stop running in circles.

If it costs me a lynching, so be it, but in my mind I took a gamble and it paid off.

If you really believe I am a replicant, send me to Mars.

[path12]

It seems obvious to me the replicants are looking for Tyrell and Sebastion, otherwise why kill someone who is an unknown?

I suspect after the past couple nights they wanted to find someone unlikely to be guarded, though your theory makes just as much sense.

[Lathum]

Render, when you mde that statement yesterday I was in no danger. It was clear barkeep was getting lynched.

I just don't understand how it makes sense for one supposed villager to throw attention from another suspected villager.

It seems more likely you were hoping to false reveal as holden at some point and it backfired.

[path12]

Lathum is good, so in effect I kept him alive.



How do you know this? There's a lot of definitive statements being tossed around lately without proof. Those are always dangerous assumptions.

So please spell it out for me like I'm an idiot. How do you know Lathum is good?

[path12]

I never got to RendeR's place. Someone attacked me before I got there, and I ran away again. I am such a coward in this game.


If you got attacked, and ntn was killed, does that mean the replicants can make two attempts? It certainly makes it sound like there's still at least two out there, and that casts some doubt on Barkeep's guilt, doesn't it?

[twothree]

st. cronin also did not meet anyone on Night Two. So if he was the other Bladerunner, he chose not to do anything that night. It would have been his scan night (assuming he is opposite of twothree). Why would he not do anything?

My guess is that st. cronin was actually not a Replicant (twothree edit: In a following post he said he meant Bladerunner not Replicant.) as has been suggested. So I would look very closely at Lathum right now. Because he said st. cronin visited him on Night One.

st. cronin did place Lathum in his circle of trust prior to his death, but this was when Replicant scans were being revealed. Lathum was a later "reveal" and basically repeated the same story as st. cronin to gain trust.

Chief Rum stated st. cronin did not meet anyone on night two. Which is correct. However, Chief Rum makes the false assumption that it was st. cronin's scan night (night 2), when it was in fact my scan night. I scan on even nights, and Lathum has stated he was scanned on night 1 by st. cronin.

Chief Rum also wonders why st. cronin did not do anything on night 2. If st. cronin was Holden and was similar to Deckard (myself) in ability, then that is because on the first night that is not your scan night, you can not attempt a kill.

This is where Chief Rum got his facts messed up, and the reason he didn't trust Lathum because of it. At least I think he got his facts messed up.

[path12]

Path, I think you need to include me in your good list.

Telle may be 100% on you, but I still think you're acting differently than usual and I am not ready to put you on my good list yet.

[Lathum]

Telle may be 100% on you, but I still think you're acting differently than usual and I am not ready to put you on my good list yet.

well if you play the same way everytime it's pretty easy to get pegged after a while :)

[twothree]

Barring some revelation in a PM which I have yet to see, my move was a gamble, Ia gree, but it took teh heat off Lathum, who was gonna get killed if not for me throwing myself under the bus, so to speak.

Its not so much that what I did proved anything, but it broke up the circular arguments you all spent 4 pages having over wether to kill lathum or someone else. Lathum is good, so in effect I kept him alive.

I want to know HOW I lived too. Thats weird. I expected to be dead.

How do you think saying Holden is alive takes the heat off Lathum????

If Lathum states Holden is dead. And, then you state Holden is alive. How does that help Lathum???

[Lathum]

How do you think saying Holden is alive takes the heat off Lathum????

If Lathum states Holden is dead. And, then you state Holden is alive. How does that help Lathum???

it doesn't.

He was trying to set up a fake reveal later in the game.

[RendeR]

How do you know this? There's a lot of definitive statements being tossed around lately without proof. Those are always dangerous assumptions.

So please spell it out for me like I'm an idiot. How do you know Lathum is good?


twothree is deckard
Twothree cleared telle
telle cleared lathum by verifying something from their respective PMs that only they would know. *read back a page or three*


I don't dispute that my action could be taken in any number of ways.

A) I'm a wolf, my attempt to claim I am Holden I'm an idiot because of the whole Lathum/Cronin/Telle situation on days 1 and 2, they have enough trust and knowledge from that to completely dispute such a claim. As a wolf it would be idiotic to even TRY this until Lathum at least was gone.

B) I'm Human, Claiming I am holden has the same issues as above but my motives aren't the same, I'm trying to either create doubt and confusion among the wolves and/or break up a faulty arguement that keeps going round in circles amongst the humans.

Either way its BAD for ME to do this, but in the end its better for the Humans as a whole because it makes people stop runing in circles, it brought about a convincing reveal from lathum that got telle to verify him(wether directly or just during the process) and in the end it slolidified a CoT that is at this point 50% of the remaining people.

I can't offer any hard evidence that I'm Human. I CAN say that I was bored out of my mind listening to you all babble on and on in circles making no difference whatsoever and nearly getting lathum killed last night.

If me making a "bad move all around" managed even a little of this, then lynch me, I'll go happily to Mars and hope they do some testing there in the future.

:)

[twothree]

So at this point pretty much everyone is convinced of barkeep and the choice of another replicant is lathum or Chief Rum....

tough choices.

I just wanted to quote this post as it was one of the main ones that made me attempt to kill RendeR last night.

I am guessing, and hope Chief Rum can confirm, that he was the one that stopped me from killing RendeR.

[Lathum]

i'm not sure why Chiefrum would choose Render to protect, although his judgement has been way off this game.

[twothree]

I can't offer any hard evidence that I'm Human. I CAN say that I was bored out of my mind listening to you all babble on and on in circles making no difference whatsoever and nearly getting lathum killed last night.

Just like Barkeep (the Replicant) got bored of us and our talking. That conversation last night convinced me that both Lathum and Chief Rum are human. I needed it.

[RendeR]

Just like Barkeep (the Replicant) got bored of us and our talking. That conversation last night convinced me that both Lathum and Chief Rum are human. I needed it.

I can understand that, and I'm glad it convinced you, but it wasn't doing much for the majority of people. I can't claim my move made it happen, but in the process of lathum/telle/alan questioning me, lathum came up with a way to verify himself that everyone can trust.

Thats all I'm saying really. My ploy wasn't logical, it wasn't even particularly smart, but it helped in the long run. Lynch me if you want, but I'm content that my efforts helped out and if i have to go, I go.

[twothree]

Alan T
Jonathan Ezarik
LoneStarGirl
path12

My scan tonight will be on one of these four. Anyone have any opinions on who I should scan tonight? I am thinking either Jonathan Ezarik or LoneStarGirl.

[twothree]

i'm not sure why Chiefrum would choose Render to protect, although his judgement has been way off this game.

It is also possible that the replicants have some sort of bodyguard or maybe a one time use bodyguard like ability. Can't wait to hear Chief Rum's information, when he logs in, probably right around when the vote will be due.

I think there are still 2 replicants left in the game, since Chief Rum saw two people attack me.

[twothree]

I think there are still 2 replicants left in the game, since Chief Rum saw two people attack me.

Hmmm. Actually Barkeep would have been one of those 2 replicant that attacked me, so there might only be one left.

[Telle]

Alan T
Jonathan Ezarik
LoneStarGirl
path12

My scan tonight will be on one of these four. Anyone have any opinions on who I should scan tonight? I am thinking either Jonathan Ezarik or LoneStarGirl.

I'd go with Alan T. He's been contributing quite a bit to the discussion, and I'd like to know whether or not we can trust him.

[Lathum]

Alan T
Jonathan Ezarik
LoneStarGirl
path12

My scan tonight will be on one of these four. Anyone have any opinions on who I should scan tonight? I am thinking either Jonathan Ezarik or LoneStarGirl.

I say the oppisite.

I say scan AlanT, he has coasted since day 2

[Lathum]

Hmmm. Actually Barkeep would have been one of those 2 replicant that attacked me, so there might only be one left.

then who killed NTNdeacon?

[Lathum]

I just don't see a valid Reason for Render to do wjat he did if he was good.

If we lynch him at worst we lose a normal villager so IMO barring any other info it's the lowest risk proposition.

[RendeR]

I just don't see a valid Reason for Render to do wjat he did if he was good.

If we lynch him at worst we lose a normal villager so IMO barring any other info it's the lowest risk proposition.

What do you consider valid then lathum? Somone had to snap you and chief and alan out of your self imposed privacy dome of an argument. Can you honestly say you'd have come up with the "moral dilemma" remark as a hint for telle without the distraction my post brought about?

[RendeR]

Just to clarify this:

I never received any PM for the night stuff, so whatever stopped twothree from killing me happened before he reached my location. I was oblivious to anything last night it would seem.

[Lathum]

What do you consider valid then lathum? Somone had to snap you and chief and alan out of your self imposed privacy dome of an argument. Can you honestly say you'd have come up with the "moral dilemma" remark as a hint for telle without the distraction my post brought about?

I actualy had been planig that move for quiet some time but had to wait until the time was right.

[RendeR]

I actualy had been planig that move for quiet some time but had to wait until the time was right.


Why? that makes even less sense than my move?? Why would you purposely delay bringing out something that cleared you beyond a shadow of a doubt?

[path12]

I can understand that, and I'm glad it convinced you, but it wasn't doing much for the majority of people. I can't claim my move made it happen, but in the process of lathum/telle/alan questioning me, lathum came up with a way to verify himself that everyone can trust.

Thats all I'm saying really. My ploy wasn't logical, it wasn't even particularly smart, but it helped in the long run. Lynch me if you want, but I'm content that my efforts helped out and if i have to go, I go.

I would feel better about Lathum if cronin had been more sure of his cot, but cronin himself said his cot was only "remotely trusted". I've seen Lathum use a weak trust claim all the way to the end before, so color me skeptical.

[Lathum]

I would feel better about Lathum if cronin had been more sure of his cot, but cronin himself said his cot was only "remotely trusted". I've seen Lathum use a weak trust claim all the way to the end before, so color me skeptical.

so are you also disputing Telle's claim as well?

[Lathum]

Why? that makes even less sense than my move?? Why would you purposely delay bringing out something that cleared you beyond a shadow of a doubt?

a number of reasons the least not wantting to give anyone who is bad information on what happens during scans

[path12]

so are you also disputing Telle's claim as well?


Can someone fill me in as to whether either the book or movie talks about "moral dilemmas"?

[path12]

so are you also disputing Telle's claim as well?

BTW, I'm not saying you're at the top of my suspect list. I'm just saying you are not cleared in my book.

[Lathum]

you didn't answer my question about Telle.


and I have never read the book or seen the movie.

[Alan T]

Twothree, please scan me tonight by all means. The difference between me, LSG, jonathan and path is that I've been much more vocal. Scanning me will clear me and then we just have to decide between three under the radar players in LSG , path or Jonathan.
Also, while LSG has been my most likely vote for tommorrow up till now, Path is quickly moving up that list by adding doubt to people who seem pretty clear to me with Lathum and Chief.
Finally, voting Render, I don't think he sufficiently answered my questions, and I still think if he was good, he did nothing but hamper us which would have been his job if bad. I think he got caught when trying to make a move and it backfired on him.

Vote Render

[RendeR]

Can someone fill me in as to whether either the book or movie talks about "moral dilemmas"?

Yes and it relates directly to the tests for replicants.

Path, If you believe twothree si deckard, then you can't possibly doubt telle, as twothree scanned and cleared her.

If you then trust telle, she has vouched for lathum based on her PM information.

If you still doubt Lathum then I think you're simply sowing discontent and they should scan you.

[Lathum]

well I am out for now and will be until past the deadline and see no reason to change my vote.


Other the Render it's LSG and Path that i am suspiscous of.

[RendeR]

OK, I have kids to put down for naps and then I have to get ready for work.


There is no premise from which what I did was a GOOD idea, it was a gamble to break the deadlock everyone had fallen into of only looking at pathum alan and chief. For that it worked well enough.

You now have a CoT of 4 instead of 3 that you can rely on.

Twothree
Chief Rum
Telle
Lathum

Go ahead and lynch me. I can't convince you I'm Human, I can only wish you luck in figuring out who among the rest are the remaining replicants.

Tanglewood, if you can, please clarify how the replicants managed two attacks at night. Its odd that Deckard was attacked and ran away and ntn got killed on top of it.


So lets make it official:

VOTE RENDER
Maybe after that you all can get on with chasing the real replicants.

[path12]

Twothree, please scan me tonight by all means. The difference between me, LSG, jonathan and path is that I've been much more vocal. Scanning me will clear me and then we just have to decide between three under the radar players in LSG , path or Jonathan.



FUCK, I get tired of this utr crap. You've got 4 more posts than me Alan!!

And say what you want about my not just rolling over about Lathum (not Chief, if you take a look I've said I thought he was likely exactly who he said he was).

Go ahead and scan me. I've got nothing to hide and no role to help with. So pardon me for trying to find out what the hell is going on.

[path12]

Yes and it relates directly to the tests for replicants.

Path, If you believe twothree si deckard, then you can't possibly doubt telle, as twothree scanned and cleared her.

If you then trust telle, she has vouched for lathum based on her PM information.

If you still doubt Lathum then I think you're simply sowing discontent and they should scan you.

I've said it a few times. I trust Telle. I believe twothree is Deckard. I believe there is likely something about "moral dilemmas" in the PM.

I also believe that Lathum is a smart enough player to toss out a gambit like that and see if he got a bite. I'M NOT SAYING HE DID. But my whole point is that you are clearing him completely on that and I say that in itself is not enough for me.

[path12]

The bodyguard would recommend it because the bodyguard didn't want anyone at that point to know he was the bodyguard. I'm not at all convinced that Chief Rum is anything other than what he claims he is.

He also said he didn't want you to scan Barkeep because he already knew he was bad from the attempt on you.

I'm just throwing that out there for you to think about. I don't know what Rum is for sure, but you need to be really careful before possibly offing the only person that can really protect any of us.

Reposted for Alan's sake.

[Alan T]

FUCK, I get tired of this utr crap. You've got 4 more posts than me Alan!!

And say what you want about my not just rolling over about Lathum (not Chief, if you take a look I've said I thought he was likely exactly who he said he was).

Go ahead and scan me. I've got nothing to hide and no role to help with. So pardon me for trying to find out what the hell is going on.

I'm not sure.. did I hit a nerve? :)

[JHandley]

I see JHandley is in thread. Hope you sign up for a game soon.

Yeah, I caught AE's dynasty thread, so I figured I'd try to follow along on one to pick up the game better. It will definitely not be a non-reveal game because from my point of view, you fellas are just grasping at straws and you're 6 days into it.

[Alan T]

Yeah, I caught AE's dynasty thread, so I figured I'd try to follow along on one to pick up the game better. It will definitely not be a non-reveal game because from my point of view, you fellas are just grasping at straws and you're 6 days into it.

No joke :)

[hoopsguy]

Yeah, I caught AE's dynasty thread, so I figured I'd try to follow along on one to pick up the game better. It will definitely not be a non-reveal game because from my point of view, you fellas are just grasping at straws and you're 6 days into it.

The good news is that we only do a game like this (non-reveal) every 6-9 months, so the vast majority don't fall under this category.

Of course, people find themselves grasping at straws in the reveal games as well from time to time :)

[path12]

I'm not sure.. did I hit a nerve? :)

It's just a tiring argument. I'm always in the top half of posts, and yet I'm always considered utr. It bugs me. Nothing personal.

[Alan T]

It's just a tiring argument. I'm always in the top half of posts, and yet I'm always considered utr. It bugs me. Nothing personal.

Maybe you should speak louder! :)

[path12]

Maybe you should speak louder! :)

:) *jumps up and down raising hand* I'm here! I'm here!

[Telle]

Well I'm heading home. Not sure how cooperative the little ones will be towards me getting on here again before deadline. So in case I don't get back...

Vote RendeR

[RendeR]

Well I'm heading home. Not sure how cooperative the little ones will be towards me getting on here again before deadline. So in case I don't get back...

Vote RendeR


Et Tu Telle?


Oh well, lets make it unanimous. EVERYBODY VOTE RENDER!

[RendeR]

Might as well vote nightfall as well.

Tangle is that an option?

[path12]

Just realized I hadn't voted yet.

VOTE RENDER

[LoneStarGirl]

Okay, vote Render

Like I said before, I welcome a scan!

[Chief Rum]

show me where I said I wanted twothree to kill you, /i think I was pretty obvious about him killing LSG.. It is amazing the words you are trying to put in my mouth

Read what you quoted with this post. Read what was quoted in my post there. Take a reading comprehension course. Get back to me.

[Alan T]

Chief, can you speak any on what happened with Twothree's attempt to kill render last night?

[Chief Rum]

I not 100% sold on CR

Oh please! Make the case against me. I dare you.

[Chief Rum]

Chief, can you speak any on what happened with Twothree's attempt to kill render last night?

Still trying to catch up, so I haven't read reaction yet. But here's what happened. I chose to protect render in case he had accidentally outed himself as a seer. It seemed he might have important information. Lathum doesn't know anything beyond what he has already picked up (I mean, he has no role abilities to learn more that I am aware of), so it made no sense to protect him. It was a throw of the dice not protecting myself. I made a lot of daring the wolves to come after. So I figured they wouldn't do that. And I couldn't protect twothree, which would have been my first choice.

So I protected render on the sneaky play, thinking to stop wolves--not twothree. :(

[Chief Rum]

Wow, just got to tangle's post. The wolves went completely safe it seems. They weren't going to touch any of us. And now the only guy I can't protect has admitted he doesn't know squat.

Which, BTW, if Render had said that earlier, before I left for work, I would have pulled my protection of him.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

If you really believe I am a replicant, send me to Mars.

Sounds good to me.

VOTE RENDER

[Chief Rum]

I have to get a quick vote in, but it doesn't seem to matter. I just don't see Render as a Replicant. It was an odd move, but I have seen those made before by perfectly normal villagers. Render did not go anywhere last night as I was BGing him, FWIW.

I know you all question that, but BK was lying about Night Three, and I didn't see him go anywhere, and st.cronin did nothing on Night Two, which twothree said he was unable to do anything that night.

I am going to go with someone not saying much of anything right now.

VOTE LSG

[RendeR]

Wow, just got to tangle's post. The wolves went completely safe it seems. They weren't going to touch any of us. And now the only guy I can't protect has admitted he doesn't know squat.

Which, BTW, if Render had said that earlier, before I left for work, I would have pulled my protection of him.


I'm a little confused here CR.

If they weren't going to touch any of us, how is it that NTN is umm...dead?

And who are you talking about in the next line? who is it you can't protect?

[RendeR]

Since Chief Rum actually defended me last night I'm going to take his lead at least and change my vote.(like it matters)

UNVOTE RENDER

VOTE LSG

[Telle]

I have to get a quick vote in, but it doesn't seem to matter. I just don't see Render as a Replicant. It was an odd move, but I have seen those made before by perfectly normal villagers. Render did not go anywhere last night as I was BGing him, FWIW.

I know you all question that, but BK was lying about Night Three, and I didn't see him go anywhere, and st.cronin did nothing on Night Two, which twothree said he was unable to do anything that night.

I am going to go with someone not saying much of anything right now.

VOTE LSG

I think I'm gonna go along with Chief Rum on this. I think RendeR did something stupid, but I think he would have to unbelievably stupid to try and pull that stunt as a replicant. So I'll jump on the LSG bandwagon. She's been unusually quiet in this game (as compared to the only other WW game that I've followed along on.. so I'm not really going on much here).

Unvote RendeR

Vote LSG

[RendeR]

Ahh well, woulda been nice if more then 3 people whoed up near the deadline to see what was happening.

Which way to mars?

[RendeR]

thats showed up, not who...whatever the fuck I wrote.

[tanglewood]

Voting closed, results shortly.

[tanglewood]

Day 6 Final Vote Count

RendeR 6 - Lathum, twothree, AlanT, path12, LoneStarGirl, Jonathan Ezarik
LoneStarGirl 3 - Chief Rum, RendeR, Telle

RendeR makes his way to the shuttle station under heavy escort. Is he a replicant? Or just a human doomed by his bretheren? Only time will tell.

Night 6 orders in by 10am EST

[Telle]

Well I just went and looked through all of Barkeep's posts, and didn't learn a damn thing from it.

[Lathum]

Read what you quoted with this post. Read what was quoted in my post there. Take a reading comprehension course. Get back to me.

I really hope you didn't mean to sound as harsh as you are because I think I have been more then patient with you this game.

[Chief Rum]

I'm a little confused here CR.

If they weren't going to touch any of us, how is it that NTN is umm...dead?

And who are you talking about in the next line? who is it you can't protect?

I was talking about the key people they could have gone after. The likely choices were me, as the BG; you, with your cryptic message and possible seer; twothree, as a proven seer; and Lathum, as a member of a COT and also to screw with us. Instead, they avoided the possibility of running into me whatsoever and killed ntndeacon, who was on no one's radar (that I am aware of).

I think the second line is fairly evident, but I would rather not spell it out.

[Chief Rum]

I really hope you didn't mean to sound as harsh as you are because I think I have been more then patient with you this game.

And I really hope you don't think what you have been doing is called patience, because frankly, you have been extremely antagonistic and insulting for some time now.

[Lathum]

not really sure how I have been insulting but if I insulted you in any way I apologize

[Chief Rum]

not really sure how I have been insulting but if I insulted you in any way I apologize

If that's sincere (and I have no reason to think it's not), then thank you. I apologize, too, for being harsh or insulting.

[st.cronin]

kumbaya, sings the ghost

[Lathum]

man, not one overnight post

[Alan T]

man, not one overnight post

I was busy hiding.

[tanglewood]

This morning again a fatality to report on the increasingly dangerous streets. This time however it someone who many have heard of before, relatively well known designer for Tyrell Corporation JF Sebastian aka Jonathan Ezarik. Today the city mourns him, as the networks run various specials and obituary programs on his celebrated design feats and works.

Day 7 9pm deadline

[Lathum]

uh oh, not good

[path12]

Bummer. That's half of what they need, isn't it? I really hope DT's hint was that he was the other guy.

[Alan T]

First...

I don't understand what they have to do with those two guys in order to win. Did they only have to kill both of them to win? Ie: if DT was one, sending him off to mars stopped that victory condition?

Second:

Why on earth Jonathan? he was on my very short list of people to go after.. him, Path and LSG really.

Third:

Twothree did you find out anything last night?

[Lathum]

hopefully twothree can give us some information. I am relieved he and chiefrum are still alive.

[Alan T]

Well I got no night PM, so it wasn't me that twothree chose to scan. I'm hoping he scanned LSG or Path.

[Telle]

Well that sucks. Although it does help us narrow down our list of potential wolves. And hopefully twothree will show up soon and let us know what he found out.

[Alan T]

Well that sucks. Although it does help us narrow down our list of potential wolves. And hopefully twothree will show up soon and let us know what he found out.


Thats the thing, does it suck for us? I don't really have any feal for what the bad guys wanted to do with Sebastian anyhows.. Did they want their seer to scan him? Does killing him ruin their chances to use him? Do they have to kill him in order to reach 1/2 of their goal? (if by some chance DT wasn't the other half of that pair)...

I really actually don't feel bad about that night kill at all. It reduced my list of people to vote for today to just 2 (and possibly 1 depending on twothree's scan).

[path12]

I didn't get any PM either, so he didn't scan me.

[Telle]

Well at this point I'm guessing that "finding" them equals killing them. And I'm really hoping that DT was Tyrell.. or that someone else that we sent off to Mars was. And if that's the case, then it really just comes down to eliminating all of the unknowns one at a time.

And if twothree didn't scan path or Alan, then who the heck did he scan? Maybe Chief?

[path12]

The fact that Alan, myself, Chief and Lathum are all still alive makes it very likely that at least one replicant is hiding in that group. I believe Chief is the BG and I know I'm good, so that leaves Alan and Lathum. Though LSG could also be in that group.

[Lathum]

OK, so we are down to 7 left. I see no reason to not think Barkeep wasn't a replicant so we are down to 2 possible replicants.

In order of trust.


Lathum- Obviously I put myself on top. Claimed to be scanned night 1 by holden. Listed in Cronins "loose" COT, trusted by Telle based on PM hint.


Telle- scanned by twothree, PM information matches up with my own.


twothree-Deckard, no one disputes this claim


Chief Rum- Claims BG, again no one disputes this

That leaves:

AlanT
LoneStarGirl
path12

Hopefully twothree can clear one and we lynch the other and twothree kills the last one at night.

[path12]

The humans win when they eliminate all of the replicants, either through violent termination or by shipping them to Mars, or by surviving long enough that the replicants' killswitch activates before deactivivating it. The replicants win either when they gain 1:1 parity with the remaining humans or if they find both the players designated Tyrell and Sebastian.

Couple things. If DT was one of the two it sounds like the replicants then need to get 1:1. That's good for us.

Second thing, I never noticed that killswitch line before. Does that mean there's a time limit or something?

[Alan T]

So this is how I am deciding my vote today (barring any other information coming out):

Cleared:
4. Chief Rum - The twothree block was sign to me that a bodyguard was around, and with no one claiming the role instead of Chief, I believe him. If that night wasn't enough, then the next night blocking twothree's kill of Render should be more then enough to satisfy you. (Unless you don't trust twothree)
17. Twothree - Claimed a role and vouched for by someone he scanned (Telle). No reason to doubt it as no one else came out claiming the role. Tonight's person whom was scanned should add additional verification for him.
12. Telle - Was scanned by twothree, if you believe he is good, you have to believe she is good.

Circumstantially cleared:
7. Lathum - We know that Render's story was made up, he self-admitted that. No real doubt to Cronin being the other bladerunner at this point. Cronin made it clear before leaving the game that Lathum was to be trusted, if you believe Cronin was the other blade runner, he would have known not to say what he did about Lathum as it would have been interpreted wrongly. Also Telle vouches for Lathum now based on PM wording.


That leaves:
6. LoneStarGirl
9. path12


Path says he was not scanned, so if Twothree scanned LSG, and she turned up good, I'll vote Path. if Twothree scanned LSG and she turned up bad, I'll vote her. If twothree scanned someone else and neither of these two, then I'll have to decide, but am leaning towards voting LSG.

[Telle]

Yeah I'd say at this point it comes down to Alan, LSG, and path. Right now I'm just waiting to hear what twothree has to say.

[Lathum]

I dont know if Cronin was the Seer... I really dont think so though, because he had you and Telle in his COT and like you said... who would scan Telle that early in the game?

LSG has quieted considerably since this statement. I think she realized she messed up and hasn't wanted to call further attention to herself.

[Telle]

Yeah when I went back and looked through Barkeep's posts I noticed that she was really active the first couple of days and has been pretty absent since.

[Alan T]

Well the big thing that felt weird to me about LSG earlier on was the way LSG and Barkeep played off of each other. It just has sat with me like a thorn in my side since then and felt like two wolves playing the game of taking the opposite stance from one another.

LSG countered by saying that I always feel that way about her in every game.. and I don't necessarily think that is true, and perhaps some people's play styles make me naturally feel they are guiltier than others.. but I can't help it that this game the way she played with Barkeep just smelled like wolf to me.

[twothree]

I chose to scan Jonathan Ezarik, so there is no help forth coming from me today. :(

[twothree]

vote LoneStarGirl

No reason, except that she had been MIA.

[Lathum]

I chose to scan Jonathan Ezarik, so there is no help forth coming from me today. :(

ugh.

[Lathum]

VOTE LONESTARGIRL

[Lathum]

why JE?

[twothree]

why JE?

utr

[Lathum]

did you see him get attacked?

[twothree]

did you see him get attacked?

No. I just found the body.

[Lathum]

I think twothree needs to kill alan or Path tonight

[twothree]

I think twothree needs to kill alan or Path tonight

or LoneStarGirl.

[path12]

VOTE LSG

[path12]

I think twothree needs to kill alan or Path tonight


I am totally fine with one of those choices. :)

[Alan T]

Actually i am as well. If we vote LSG today and the game continues, then kill me or path tonight.

If you kill me, I will turn up good and everyone vote path tommorrow.

if you kill path, then the game should likely end at that point I imagine.

[LoneStarGirl]

Looks like I am gone tonight. Wish I would have been scanned... I dont understand why JE was scanned when nobody told Twothree to do so. Almost everybody suggested Alant or myself.

[Lathum]

Looks like I am gone tonight. Wish I would have been scanned... I dont understand why JE was scanned when nobody told Twothree to do so. Almost everybody suggested Alant or myself.

I agree JE is an odd choice but if you aren't a wolf then that means one of 2 things.

1. AlanT and Path are both wolves
2. Myself or Chiefrum has played a brilliant wolf game. I know it isn't me and doubt it was chief since his role seems to add up.

[Alan T]

I agree JE is an odd choice but if you aren't a wolf then that means one of 2 things.

1. AlanT and Path are both wolves
2. Myself or Chiefrum has played a brilliant wolf game. I know it isn't me and doubt it was chief since his role seems to add up.


I actually have played through scenerios in my head to why ntn and jonathan both have been killed back to back. It made no sense to me, and one of them is if the entire CoT was bogus.

We KNOW twothree was sent to the hospital for a day unable to post via some game mechanic. So I can't fathom what game mechanic would have allowed for that if he was bad, unless a real blade runner was out there.. and they would have spoken up by now, so the fact there isn't one.. I can't help but believe twothree is good.

Thusly if you feel twothree is good, you have to believe Telle is good. He vouches for her having scanner her.

Also if you believe twothree is good, then you know he was attacked one night, and blocked from killing another night. That tells us that the bodyguard has to be around. Chief has claimed the role.. and no one has opposed it.. so then you have to think he is good..

The only one in the CoT that I can't fully trust is Lathum, as his being in there is due to being vouched for by someone who is dead without further clarification, and being vouched for my someone else who we believe is good based on PM. Thus I feel it highly likely Lathum is good.

I can't help but think that Path and/or LSG therefore are bad.

if Twothree/Chief/Telle are bad, then well.. they deserve to win as I've been completely snowed under.

[twothree]

We KNOW twothree was sent to the hospital for a day unable to post via some game mechanic. So I can't fathom what game mechanic would have allowed for that if he was bad, unless a real blade runner was out there.. and they would have spoken up by now, so the fact there isn't one.. I can't help but believe twothree is good.

Also if you believe twothree is good, then you know he was attacked one night, and blocked from killing another night. That tells us that the bodyguard has to be around. Chief has claimed the role.. and no one has opposed it.. so then you have to think he is good.

Can anyone explain to mean why it was that when Chief Rum guarded me it put me in the hospital? But, when he guarded RendeR, all it did was block the kill?

[Lathum]

My gut says Alan and LSG are the last 2.

[Lathum]

Can anyone explain to mean why it was that when Chief Rum guarded me it put me in the hospital? But, when he guarded RendeR, all it did was block the kill?

Could be the replicants have to pick who does the kill and the more powerfull one tried to kill you.

[Alan T]

Can anyone explain to mean why it was that when Chief Rum guarded me it put me in the hospital? But, when he guarded RendeR, all it did was block the kill?


Good question.. but if chief isn't the bodyguard how did your attack on render get blocked?

[Alan T]

My gut says Alan and LSG are the last 2.

My gut tells me that you are wrong.

[Lathum]

dola- I guess it's possible there is only 1 replicant left also. I know people have mentioned seeing others out at night but it seems nothing concrete has come from that.

[Alan T]

There will be no dolas in WW

[path12]

My gut says Alan and LSG are the last 2.

So does mine. I have the advantage of knowing I don't have a role however.

[Alan T]

dola - just kidding

[Alan T]

And path comes in to ruin my joke

[path12]

Can anyone explain to mean why it was that when Chief Rum guarded me it put me in the hospital? But, when he guarded RendeR, all it did was block the kill?

The only thing I can think of is that a replicant kill attempt is more powerful. :confused:

[path12]

And path comes in to ruin my joke

HA! :)

[twothree]

Good question.. but if chief isn't the bodyguard how did your attack on render get blocked?

I believe Chief is the bodyguard, I am just trying to figure out...why the difference in outcomes...especially since the bodyguard is a human.

[Alan T]

Something I don't get.. It seems the wolves have specific roles outlined for them:

1) Brutal wolf
2) anti-seer
3) Night kill.

So I don't get how we had reports on some nights of multiple attackers? Who was it that reported seeing two at one attack? Also based on this, it seems to me if we get the right one killed or sent to mars, they cant kill at night at all?

[twothree]

Something I don't get.. It seems the wolves have specific roles outlined for them:

1) Brutal wolf
2) anti-seer
3) Night kill.

So I don't get how we had reports on some nights of multiple attackers? Who was it that reported seeing two at one attack? Also based on this, it seems to me if we get the right one killed or sent to mars, they cant kill at night at all?

I reported two people attacked st. cronin. And, Chief Rum reported two people attacked me.

[Alan T]

I believe Chief is the bodyguard, I am just trying to figure out...why the difference in outcomes...especially since the bodyguard is a human.

Since you brought it up, I went looking to try to figure it out as well. Thats when I saw that only one wolf is listed as even being able to be killed. I know we had at least someone say they saw multiple attackers. Was that just barkeep lying to us about that?

My initial thought was maybe more than 1 attacked you allowing them to do that to you.. but the rules seem to indicate only one of them could attack.

So my next thought is that Render was indeed a wolf, and when you attack a wolf who is guarded they dont get put into the hospital, but when a human is attacked and guarded, they are..

Otherwise, I have no clue.

[Alan T]

I reported two people attacked st. cronin. And, Chief Rum reported two people attacked me.


Ok, well then the rules clearly aren't very clear in that regard then. I don't understand the purpose of having one person who can attack at night, if multiple wolves actually can.

Maybe if that stronger wolf does the attacking, he can put you in the hospital?

[twothree]

Still trying to catch up, so I haven't read reaction yet. But here's what happened. I chose to protect render in case he had accidentally outed himself as a seer. It seemed he might have important information. Lathum doesn't know anything beyond what he has already picked up (I mean, he has no role abilities to learn more that I am aware of), so it made no sense to protect him. It was a throw of the dice not protecting myself. I made a lot of daring the wolves to come after. So I figured they wouldn't do that. And I couldn't protect twothree, which would have been my first choice.

So I protected render on the sneaky play, thinking to stop wolves--not twothree. :(

I am going to doing something that is probably stupid here, but...

unvote LoneStarGirl
vote Chief Rum

Chief Rum, could you describe how you stopped me from attacking RendeR? Or where? Or what you saw that night.

I have kept the facts (the description) of how I was stopped from killing RendeR to myself. So, I would like to hear from, Chief Rum, exactly what he saw that night. And, then I will change my vote.

[Lathum]

If chiefrum ISN'T the bodyguard then who is he?

[twothree]

I never got to RendeR's place. Someone attacked me before I got there, and I ran away again. I am such a coward in this game.

And, I am just quoting this for Chief Rum to look at. This is the only information I provided, but I do know more about what happened and/or where it happened.

I wish I would of thought of asking Chief Rum earlier about what he saw/ where he was at.

[twothree]

If chiefrum ISN'T the bodyguard then who is he?

I think he is still the bodyguard. I just want to hear his side of the story about what happened that night, to see if it matches up with what I know.

Did RendeR ever state what happened that night? If he was human, he sure wasn't much help. I know AlanT asked RendeR what happened, I saw that post, but I need to go look if RendeR ever answered.

[Alan T]

If chiefrum ISN'T the bodyguard then who is he?


I guess this is what I have been trying to ask myself... We know -someone- blocked twothree's attack on Render.. and we -assume- someone blocked the attack on Twothree...

That really sounds like a bodyguard is out there.. and if iits not Chief.. then who? I just cant help but think Chief is good here.

[Alan T]

I think he is still the bodyguard. I just want to hear his side of the story about what happened that night, to see if it matches up with what I know.

Did RendeR ever state what happened that night? If he was human, he sure wasn't much help. I know AlanT asked RendeR what happened, I saw that post, but I need to go look if RendeR ever answered.

Render later stated he didn't get a PM at all about that night. So that was his answer to me.

[Alan T]

ie: as far as Render was concerned, he didn't even know you tried to kill him if you hadn't had said so.

[path12]

I guess this is what I have been trying to ask myself... We know -someone- blocked twothree's attack on Render.. and we -assume- someone blocked the attack on Twothree...

That really sounds like a bodyguard is out there.. and if iits not Chief.. then who? I just cant help but think Chief is good here.

I agree with Alan here. There have obviously been blocks, and nobody else has countered his claim. If the bodyguard had been previously sent to Mars/killed, I have to think either twothree would have gotten killed, or RendeR when twothree went after him.

[Telle]

Ok, so shall the plan be to vote off LSG today and have twothree kill his choice of Alan and path tonight?

I think I already put my vote in on LSG, but just in case..
Vote LSG

[twothree]

I have to get a quick vote in, but it doesn't seem to matter. I just don't see Render as a Replicant. It was an odd move, but I have seen those made before by perfectly normal villagers. Render did not go anywhere last night as I was BGing him, FWIW.

I know you all question that, but BK was lying about Night Three, and I didn't see him go anywhere, and st.cronin did nothing on Night Two, which twothree said he was unable to do anything that night.

I am going to go with someone not saying much of anything right now.

VOTE LSG

And, also to help Chief Rum out, here is the information Chief Rum gave about what happened that night. Not much, except that RendeR did not go anywhere.

Also, it is curious to notethat he votes for LSG, and then suddenly RendeR changes his vote to LSG. (I would probably do that also, if I was RendeR, but I just wanted to note it.)

[Alan T]

I don't really understand what you are getting at twothree.. If you think Chief is the bodyguard, why vote for him? I guess I'm not following your thought progression at all.

[twothree]

And, one final question for Chief Rum, who did you protect last night?

[Lathum]

And, one final question for Chief Rum, who did you protect last night?

I don't think this is a wise question, if there is a mechanic where he can't block the same player twice he will put a target on someone's back by answering it.

[twothree]

I don't really understand what you are getting at twothree.. If you think Chief is the bodyguard, why vote for him? I guess I'm not following your thought progression at all.

Like I said it was just a stupid move, so...

unvote Chief Rum
vote LoneStarGirl

[twothree]

Ok, well then the rules clearly aren't very clear in that regard then. I don't understand the purpose of having one person who can attack at night, if multiple wolves actually can.

Maybe if that stronger wolf does the attacking, he can put you in the hospital?

I don't understand that myself. There is quite a bit of information that I don't have and wish I did. The PMs I receive cause more questions than they provide answers.

Things like why do I always run away? Why didn't I kill st. cronin when I had the chance? Is the window in my hotel room broken or not? Will I ever fire my pistol or do I just draw it for fun? Is the pistol even loaded or is the safety permantly stuck? Why do I report somethings to my superiors, but decide not to report other things? Am I a replicant or a human?

[Lathum]

well I am out until after the deadline. I see no reason to change my vote.

[Alan T]

Well the complete lack of defense on LSG's part either tells me she is the last wolf and given up on the game, or is a human, and someone else is the wolf.

Hope its the former.

Vote LSG

[Jonathan Ezarik]

I really actually don't feel bad about that night kill at all.

:mad:

[Alan T]

:mad:

Its good to have you back playing again! :)

[Chief Rum]

I believe Chief is the bodyguard, I am just trying to figure out...why the difference in outcomes...especially since the bodyguard is a human.

There have been a lot of odd things with my role actually, including last night. I guarded someone who didn't do anything last night (according to my PM), and yet evidence suggests he did do something. It's rather annoying when my BG abilities aren't actually BG abilities but "house guard". When I guarded twothree, I made to follow him when he was getting ready to go out. So I don't know why I wouldn't follow my target last night.

Either that, or my target is lying, but that flies against all logic up to this point.

As for why the differences, I think it was already said. You're human, and so am I. Replicants are not human, but tougher to kill. Also, there were two of them, only one of you. Keep in mind, when I popped you going after Render, you got me a good one, too, and stunned me. Even given you're Deckard, I don't seem to be all that terrific a BG.

[Chief Rum]

I am going to doing something that is probably stupid here, but...

unvote LoneStarGirl
vote Chief Rum

Chief Rum, could you describe how you stopped me from attacking RendeR? Or where? Or what you saw that night.

I have kept the facts (the description) of how I was stopped from killing RendeR to myself. So, I would like to hear from, Chief Rum, exactly what he saw that night. And, then I will change my vote.

Sure. I saw a shadowy figure coming over the rooftop alleys (wasn't sure what that meant, figured it was there for color) toward Render's place, so I ambushed him form above. I hit him on the head with my fist and stunned him. He was armed and reached for his pistol, but instead of trying to fire it, he hit me in the chest with it and knocked me down. He then escaped down a rope to a vehicle below. I never was told who it was, but obviously figured it out the next day from what you were saying.

[Chief Rum]

I think he is still the bodyguard. I just want to hear his side of the story about what happened that night, to see if it matches up with what I know.

Did RendeR ever state what happened that night? If he was human, he sure wasn't much help. I know AlanT asked RendeR what happened, I saw that post, but I need to go look if RendeR ever answered.

IIRC, Render said he didn't even get a PM. He had an undisturbed sleep, it would seem.

[Chief Rum]

And, one final question for Chief Rum, who did you protect last night?

I am going to take the fifth on this one in the interest of the villagers.

[Chief Rum]

Make room on the bandwagon.

VOTE LSG

[tanglewood]

Vote count just coming.

[tanglewood]

Day 7 Vote Count

LoneStarGirl 6 - Lathum, path12, Telle, twothree, AlanT, Chief Rum

Did not vote: LoneStarGirl

LoneStarGirl is the player who must be exiled to Mars today. Will she be atonning for her crimes or merely an innocent sent to wither away needlessly?

Night action deadline is 10am EST

[Alan T]

Well, its unfortunate that the game didn't end here.

Twothree, if you choose to kill me then thats fine. I really wish you had scanned me any of the 3 times I asked, but things are what they are I suppose. If you choose to come to kill me tonight, I can't imagine the game would end with a wolf victory from that mistake. I have to guess there can only be one more wolf left, and guess it has to be Path.

I think its pretty clear if you kill me tonight, you will need to lynch Path tommorrow. I'm hoping you go after Path tonight, and I really hope that ends the game.

[Lathum]

Either way Alan/ Path tonight and the other lynch tomorrow.

[path12]

I would second what Alan says, except the other way around. If you want to off me, OK, but it does not win the game for us but you should be able to get that tomorrow with lynching Alan then.

If it turns out to be Lathum I'm gonna be pissed. :)

[Alan T]

1. Alan T
4. Chief Rum
7. Lathum
9. path12
12. Telle
17. twothree

Like I outlined earlier today, I just can't fathom the amount of deception needed to pull off Telle/Twothree being bad, or even for Chief rum to be bad. If any of them are evil, then well hats off.

So I'll assume for this sake that Telle, Chief RUm, Twothree are good, and I know I am good.

That means I will assume there are at least 4 good left, and we outnumber the wolves either 4-2 or 5-1. I assume the wolves will make a kill tonight to bring it to 3-2 or 4-1 depending on how many are left.

The only thing I fear is.. what if both Lathum and Path are evil. They kill someone tonight, and twothree kills me. Suddenly its 2-2 and they win. If only Path is left evil, its 3-1 and no problem.

Just the way both Lathum and Path commented tonight makes me worry that they are about to win the game if I get killed. So trying to think through all possibilities, and I will try to do it from twothree's viewpoint since he does not know I am good..

Twothree knows telle is good, and assumes Chief rUm is good. So Two three has a CoT of 3 of the last 6 left. He knows 3 wolves aren't left as the game woudl be over. If twothree kills no one tonight, and wolves make a kill tonight, then its either 3-2 or 4-1 depending how many wolves are left.. Then the lynch choice tommorrow is virtually the same as twothree's night kill choice tonight.. Who to lynch.. Path or me.. wrong choice ends the game with a wolf win if there are 2 left, if only 1 left, then it is really hard for the wolves to win no matter what at this point.

So based on all of that, I guess it doesnt really matter if twothree does the kill tonight, or if the lynch is done tommorrow.. If there are 2 wolves left, killing me loses the game, if there is only 1 wolf left, then it doesn't really matter who dies tonight, the other can be killed tommorrow.

[path12]

Just the way both Lathum and Path commented tonight makes me worry that they are about to win the game if I get killed. So trying to think through all possibilities, and I will try to do it from twothree's viewpoint since he does not know I am good..

I thought you didn't care one way or the other if either you or I was killed tonight. I guess you changed your mind once I agreed. :)

I trust twothree to make the correct decision. What concerns me more is that Chief gets a good block. My worry is that whoever the replicant(s) left are, they're looking more for Tyrell than anything else at this point.

At the same time, we can't afford to lose either our BG or seer/assassin.

It's a tough call for both of them. I think the natural argument comes down to either you or I being the target tonight. I'm fine with that as long as the humans end up winning.

[Lathum]

I think Tyrell is dead.

[twothree]

Sorry, if this prolongs the game, but I am not killing anyone tonight. Right now, I think it is for the best that I don't do a kill tonight. There are a few reasons for this, none of which I am going to mention. Though, I don't think it will hurt to let everyone know that I am not killing anyone tonight.

Though, it probably doesn't matter, since I haven't killed anyone in this game with my abilities, yet. :D

[twothree]

waves to the ghost of st. cronin

[Lathum]

Sorry, if this prolongs the game, but I am not killing anyone tonight. Right now, I think it is for the best that I don't do a kill tonight. There are a few reasons for this, none of which I am going to mention. Though, I don't think it will hurt to let everyone know that I am not killing anyone tonight.

Though, it probably doesn't matter, since I haven't killed anyone in this game with my abilities, yet. :D

that is a HUGE mistake with no upside!!

The bad guy (s) will get a kill, if you pass up your kill tonight you may be dead.

We have 6 left with 4 cleared or close to it, why wouldn't you kill? We can probably end the game tomorrow!!

[twothree]

that is a HUGE mistake with no upside!!

The bad guy (s) will get a kill, if you pass up your kill tonight you may be dead.

We have 6 left with 4 cleared or close to it, why wouldn't you kill? We can probably end the game tomorrow!!

I can think of two very good reasons not to do a kill tonight. One of which, you may be able to reason out. The second of which is a secret, which I am not telling. :)

The bad guy (s) are free to kill me if they want. The game will probably not end tommorrow that's why I apoligized for prolonging the game.

[st.cronin]

waves to the ghost of st. cronin

/waves back

Hey, you should sign up for my game.