Official 2023 College Football Thread

[miami_fan]

No disrespect to Brad Nessler but given this is the last Iron Bowl on CBS, I really wish they have brought back Verne Lundquist to the mic if the game was going to end like this.

[Ghost Econ]

Make Milroe run there. Flush him and get him down before the goal line. Instead you give him all the time in the world to find the guy in the end-zone.

Also, they was a really good throw. Like pinpoint placement. If he can figure out timing routes, that kid may actually have a future as a full QB.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Make Milroe run there. Flush him and get him down before the goal line. Instead you give him all the time in the world to find the guy in the end-zone.

Yeah, Aubie did what they could not do

[JPhillips]

They only rushed two. The CB was twenty yards deep. The safety was 30 yeards deep.

And somehow the WR still got behind everybody.

[Ksyrup]

The safety bit on an inside receiver but then left him when he saw he was covered and sat in no man's land between the insider receiver and the guy who caught it in the end zone so it ended up being 1-on-1.

[Thomkal]

Coastal Carolina had a chance to capture the Sun Belt East today at home against James Madison. Win and they move on to the Sun Belt title game. Instead they showed they were not up to the task, losing 56-14. :( QB #1 McCall did not play again so he must still be recovering from his injuries. It would be a shame if he was not able to play in Coastal's Bowl game and end his career on a sour note.

[Atocep]

WVU and Baylor have about 6 minutes left in the 2nd quarter. WVU has 306 yards of offense. Baylor has 28 yards and hasn't touched the ball since the 3:34 mark in the first. Zero turnovers for either team.

20-14 WVU right now

[JonInMiddleGA]

I really can't defend the decision to kick a field goal there.

I'm not a Key-believer, good opportunity for him to prove me wrong so we shall see.

[miami_fan]

Looks like someone told Key to be more aggressive.

[JPhillips]

OSU might have lots of problems next year. They could lose nine starters on defense, the TE, top 3 WR, and RB. Day has gone all in this year and there aren't a lot of experienced backups ready to step in.

[miami_fan]

What is the rule for when the officials are supposed to blow a play dead? I thought it is supposed to be when the ball carrier's forward motion but I feel like the refs are allowing a lot of pileups that are seemed to be stopped to continue almost with the hope that the ball carrier breaks free.

[albionmoonlight]

#34 for K-State rumbling through the snow while tacklers bounce off him is kind of the Platonic ideal of football.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I almost can't entirely blame the players for the abysmal state of the GT defense.

I mean, some of these players spent 2+ years with no discernible coaching (under the now-dismissed Thacker), that has to limit your ceiling.

[Ksyrup]

Can 2 players be thrown out for targeting on the same play?

[GrantDawg]

Gators going to Gator. Had to get the cheap shot in, and it looks like it will cost them the game.

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[Ksyrup]

That follows one of the DLs getting tossed earlier for spitting in an FSU player's face.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Stoops to A&M?

I mean, on the one hand, he's done a good job with not much.
On the other hand, is his ceiling any higher than Jimbo's?

[GrantDawg]

It will be interesting to see what he can do with real resources.

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[Atocep]

Stoops to A&M?

I mean, on the one hand, he's done a good job with not much.
On the other hand, is his ceiling any higher than Jimbo's?

I think the ultimate ceiling is probably higher than with Jimbo but the floor is lower too. Jimbo at this stage is a good recruiter, decent coach, and a difficult guy to work for that hasn't done a good job making or maintaining the connections needed to keep or hire a solid pool of assistants.

[Ksyrup]

The timing makes sense. Things have been getting a bit stale here as UK has not been able to play with the big boys. But he's such a Midwestern guy that Texas seems like a weird fit. I guess with resources and the right coaches/recruiters, he can be a good CEO.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I think the ultimate ceiling is probably higher than with Jimbo but the floor is lower too. Jimbo at this stage is a good recruiter, decent coach, and a difficult guy to work for that hasn't done a good job making or maintaining the connections needed to keep or hire a solid pool of assistants.

A phrase I saw earlier kinda feels like a major problem, something about "an offense that's felt like it was in decline over most of the past few years"

[Ksyrup]

The Athletic article described his offense as already outdated when Jameis was running it.

[Atocep]

There's a Kentucky alum and former assistant that I couldn't recommend enough as Stoops replacement.

He's an air raid guy, big on culture, and he would be coming home.

[GrantDawg]

There are already counter reports he is staying at Kentucky. I wouldn't be surprised if he does. He might bitch about not have the NIL money of other teams, but he has one of the cushiest jobs in college football. He could win 7 games a year and still get regular raises.

Edit: Yup. Looking confirmed he has pulled out.

[Ksyrup]

Looks like it. I just didn't understand the fit. Timing, yes. I wonder if beating Louisville factored in. Ending the season on a 5 game losing streak and major grumblings versus 7-5 and a win over a top 10 rival. Maybe he was already planning an exit but the win made it complicated and UK came up with some more years/money to keep him.

Or, his agent played the media pretty well...

[Ksyrup]

Stoops statement "... I knew in my heart I couldn't leave the University of Kentucky right now."

Also made sure to confirm he was contacted about a job opening this weekend.

Interesting statement.

[GrantDawg]

From a reporter on Twitter:
Every Coach: Yes Mr Aggie, I’m very interested in your job opening

Texas A&M: We won’t be offering anymore $76 million buyouts.

Every Coach: Bye Felicia

I’ve confirmed this conversation with 2 sources

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[Swaggs]

Houston fires Dana Holgorsen.

Iowa needs to make him their offensive coordinator immediately. He’s from Iowa, too lazy to manage an entire program, but a brilliant offensive mind. Make it so.

[tarcone]

Houston fires Dana Holgorsen.

Iowa needs to make him their offensive coordinator immediately. He’s from Iowa, too lazy to manage an entire program, but a brilliant offensive mind. Make it so.

Im getting the feeling the fan base wants the HC in waiting as the next OC

[bronconick]

Indiana fires Tom Allen with a $20.8 million buyout. If they had waited for 2024 in what, 40 days?, it would have been $8 million.

[Ksyrup]

Yeah but you're throwing away the recruiting class this year, encouraging transfers jumping from a sinking ship, and waiting really long to assemble a staff.

[Atocep]

Houston fires Dana Holgorsen.

Iowa needs to make him their offensive coordinator immediately. He’s from Iowa, too lazy to manage an entire program, but a brilliant offensive mind. Make it so.

Ferentz and Dana together would absolutely require a college Hard Knocks show.

[JPhillips]

Yeah but you're throwing away the recruiting class this year, encouraging transfers jumping from a sinking ship, and waiting really long to assemble a staff.

But in this era would the 12 mil spent on players lead to a better outcome?

[GrantDawg]

But in this era would the 12 mil spent on players lead to a better outcome?
With signing day three weeks away? No. You are playing catch up if you wait till next year, and the best players are gone. Who are you paying?

[JPhillips]

Transfer portal

[JonInMiddleGA]

Who are you paying?

Transfers.

It's the #50 class in the country, nothing above a 3*, only 3 of the 19 commits are in the top 50 at their position. And of those 3, only 1 of them had any other P5 offer.

Not sure how much they'd be risking frankly.

[Atocep]

Signing day isn't that big of a deal for a lot of the mid to lower tier P4/5 schools anymore. The transfer portal is a better bet and it's actually easier to go head to head with the bigger schools for guys that want to play right away and are burning their free transfer.

[GrantDawg]

Your still picking from parts. You may not be competing with upper tier teams for players, but you are competing with the mid-tier for the players willing to play at that level. Having to put that together after all the other teams have gotten their first choice is a pretty big handicap.

[JPhillips]

This from ESPN makes the buyout make sense for both parties.

In announcing Allen's dismissal, the school said it had agreed to a $15.5 million settlement with the coach that will be paid over two installments.

Allen will receive one $7.75 million payment this year and another in 2024, an Indiana spokesman told ESPN. The amount will not be offset by future earnings, a source told ESPN, as his original buyout would have been.

[GrantDawg]

Mike Elko is next up for the Texas A&M gig. He had already shut down discussion earlier this week, so they must have came at him with a bigger bag.

[Ksyrup]

Elko turned down Michigan State, he wasn't offered A&M earlier this week. I assume he doesn't consider A&M to be a similar job to MSU.

[miami_fan]

Computers pick UNLV, Boise St. for Mountain West title game - ESPN (https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/38983959/computers-pick-unlv-boise-st-mountain-west-title-game)

UNLV will host Boise State in the Mountain West championship game Saturday, the conference announced Sunday.

The Rebels and Broncos finished tied with San José State at 6-2 in conference play. Because UNLV and Boise State did not play each other during the regular season, the three-way tie was broken by an average of four computer rankings: Anderson & Hester, Colley Matrix, Massey and Wolfe.

Come on guys, don't hide behind the computers. We know you wanted BSU and UNLV in the title game.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Miss State hires Lebby, the guy Miami should have hired

[Kodos]

Loved Tom Allen as a person, but he had to go. Hopefully Mark Cuban can help IU grab a proven winner. So tired of losing and always knowing we’re going to lose.

[GrantDawg]

Did you see the rumor is Jon Gruden?

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[Kodos]

Yeah, I saw that. It got debunked pretty quickly. I sure hope it is not him. There's buzz about Tom Herman, but with IU football, I'll believe it when I see it. (Ironically, before his scandal, I would have been all aboard with him being the HC.)

[Kodos]

There are also rumors of Antwaan Randle El, who has done a good job with the receivers for the Lions. However, he's never been a head coach. I do love ARE, and it'd be nice to have a guy who might not jump ship if he were to have somehow miraculously have success at IU.

[Kodos]

I guess in my ideal world, we would get a name head coach with Randle El as OC. Then Randle El could take over the program when the head coach inevitably moved on. And while I'm making silly wishes, I'd love to have Tom Allen back as DC. That's where he really shined. (I realize that would never happen.)

Oh, and Jennifer Lawrence could date our tight end so I could see her during our broadcasts.

[RainMaker]

With the massive media deals the Big 10 have, they should be able to pull in a semi-decent name.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Best line I've seen so far "Transfer portal news is starting to feel like watching the Tinder app"

[miami_fan]

With the massive media deals the Big 10 have, they should be able to pull in a semi-decent name.

It is going to be really interesting how schools manage expectations as these mega conferences come together. I am not suggesting that the Indiana fanbase have outsized expectations for their new coach. I am just looking at a conference that has Michigan, Ohio State, Penn State, Michigan State, Iowa, Wisconsin, USC, UCLA, Washington and Oregon and wondering if around 11th place in the conference is good enough for any fan base. Better yet, what does coming in 11th in that sort of conference mean to a fan base?

[Kodos]

At least with the new division-less setup, Indiana doesn't have to play Ohio State-Michigan-Penn State every year. One can hope for a relatively "easy" schedule light on the powerhouses and heavy on the Illinois-Rutgers-Northwestern type of opponents.

Personally, I realize that IU will almost surely never rise to the level of even a Penn State. But maybe an Iowa level of success is possible with the right coaching staff and support of the football program from administration.

[Ksyrup]

It's gonna be like EPL - 5-6 teams compete every year, a bunch in the middle are somewhat happy just to be in a big conference and making good money, and a fraction at the bottom are worried they are going to get dropped for the flavor of the month program looking to move up.

[sovereignstar v2]

Starting next season I just need the Gophers to be better than Indiana.

Haha j/k Kodos.. sort of

[Kodos]

I like your odds, Sov. Basically anyone good has entered the portal for IU.

[Ksyrup]

K-State too, it appears.

Treshaun Ward was 1.B. running back for FSU last year splitting carries with Benson and Toafili and he left to presumably get more carries in a less-full RB room. He ended up running for 15 more yards, lost more than zero games, and is on the move again.

[Atocep]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Mike Elko looks like a man who is already seeing exactly how this is going to end for him. <a href="https://t.co/p41Brl79ER">pic.twitter.com/p41Brl79ER</a></p>&mdash; Heartland College Sports (@Heartland_CS) <a href="https://twitter.com/Heartland_CS/status/1729262121572261993?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 27, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Mike Elko looks like a man that already has regrets.

[JonInMiddleGA]

QB Van Dyke and RB Cheney both enter the portal exiting Miami.

[GrantDawg]

Ummmmm.....what?
<samp class="EmbedCode-container"><code class="EmbedCode-code"><blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Sources: Arkansas is vetting hiring former head coach Bobby Petrino as the school's next offensive coordinator. Petrino has indicated in the recruiting space that he's in the mix for an SEC coordinator job.</p>&mdash; Pete Thamel (@PeteThamel) <a href="https://twitter.com/PeteThamel/status/1729587776390135876?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 28, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script> </code></samp>

[Ghost Econ]

I guess the hogs want to get their motor running and head out of the highway while looking for adventure... or whatever comes their way.

[Edward64]

Ummmmm.....what?


Yeah, let's do this.

[GrantDawg]

I had a feeling you would be on board, Ed. I imagine you wouldn't want to ride on a motorcycle with him, though.

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[sovereignstar v2]

Gophers might not have a QB for their bowl game. QB1 and QB3 have entered the portal, QB2 might be next

[Edward64]

I had a feeling you would be on board, Ed. I imagine you wouldn't want to ride on a motorcycle with him, though.


I would do ... many things ... to ... to ... er ... get back into the Top-10 and Jan 1 Bowl.

[Ksyrup]

QB Van Dyke and RB Cheney both enter the portal exiting Miami.

As well as their leading tackler LB and a 6th year DL.

I assume the dude who started at QB against FSU is too injured to play in a bowl game? So theyre down to #3?

[cartman]

not a bad deal for Elko at A&M. here's the contract details that were released:

Six years, $42 million total value (runs through Jan. 31, 2030)
A flat-rate buyout of 75% of the contract's remaining value in Years 1-3
A flat-rate buyout of 80% of the contract's remaining value in Years 4-6
$11,000,000 staff salary pool

If he hits any of these incentives, then a one year extension is triggered:

$1 million for a CFP appearance
$1.5 million for a CFP Quarterfinals appearance and/or SEC championship
$2 million for a CFP Semifinals appearance
$2.5 million for a CFP National Championship Game appearance
$3.5 million for a CFP National Championship

[JonInMiddleGA]

I assume the dude who started at QB against FSU is too injured to play in a bowl game? So theyre down to #3?

Seems that way, so Jacurri Brown it is. And to my understanding there are no more scholarship QBs behind him.

[RainMaker]

Petrino has the weirdest coaching resumes you'll ever see. Just a little bit of everything.

Props to him for working his way back I guess. Not many people who were at that level would have gone all the way back to a middling FCS school and turned it around. Especially at that age and after all the money he's made.

[RainMaker]

I don't understand the rankings. Is it based on who they think is the best team or how the team performed?

If it's based on performance, Michigan should be #1 since they have had a much tougher schedule than Georgia. If it's based on just how good they think a team is, Alabama should not be #8 behind teams like Oregon.

[Brian Swartz]

It's not perfectly consistent of course, but also some of that is debatable. If you ask me, I think Oregon is probably a better team than Alabama.

[Edward64]

Ummmmm.....what?


A done deal (almost). The majority of Hog forum seem to be positive about this.

Sources: Bobby Petrino to be Arkansas offensive coordinator - ESPN (https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/39000680/bobby-petrino-arkansas-offensive-coordinator)
Bobby Petrino has agreed to become the next offensive coordinator at Arkansas, and the two sides are finalizing the deal, sources told ESPN on Tuesday.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Props to him for working his way back I guess. Not many people who were at that level would have gone all the way back to a middling FCS school and turned it around. Especially at that age and after all the money he's made.

Just think, he has Dan Enos & Sam Pittman to thank for the opportunity to complete the {cough} redemption arc.

[bob]

“oh brother...if you think that Bobby isn't already planning on ways to undermine pittman and make this happen, then you're fooling yourself.”

[JonInMiddleGA]

“oh brother...if you think that Bobby isn't already planning on ways to undermine pittman and make this happen, then you're fooling yourself.”

Or if he can't, he'll just quit midseason.

[SirFozzie]

Ummmmm.....what?
<samp class="EmbedCode-container"><code class="EmbedCode-code"><blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Sources: Arkansas is vetting hiring former head coach Bobby Petrino as the school's next offensive coordinator. Petrino has indicated in the recruiting space that he's in the mix for an SEC coordinator job.</p>&mdash; Pete Thamel (@PeteThamel) <a href="https://twitter.com/PeteThamel/status/1729587776390135876?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 28, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script> </code></samp>


what's old is now new again.

[albionmoonlight]

Ummmmm.....what?
<samp class="EmbedCode-container"><code class="EmbedCode-code"><blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Sources: Arkansas is vetting hiring former head coach Bobby Petrino as the school's next offensive coordinator. Petrino has indicated in the recruiting space that he's in the mix for an SEC coordinator job.</p>&mdash; Pete Thamel (@PeteThamel) <a href="https://twitter.com/PeteThamel/status/1729587776390135876?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 28, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script> </code></samp>

College Football is the craziest sport. I have trained myself to expect anything and be surprised by nothing.

And yet, some things still come across my feed and shock me.

[Edward64]

Petrino lucked out when Ryan Mallett left Michigan.

Our QB1 KJ Jefferson is a big guy, has more mobility, decent but not quite the same arm. He's got another season so hope he comes back. Gives Petrino a chance to recruit the QB he wants.

Have to be fair and manage my expectations. This season has been a stinker. Hog fans need to give Petrino at least 1 rebuilding year.

[tarcone]

No one is mentioning the 0.5 over/under in the 1st half for Iowa?

A little surprised. Our defense scores.

[sovereignstar v2]

weird bunch down there

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Nebraska hasn't been to a bowl game in 2,524 days. <br><br>Matt Rhule was at Temple, P.J. Fleck was at Western Michigan, Rogue One was in theaters, and Apple just released the iPhone 7. <br><br>Nebraska Reporter: <a href="https://t.co/59uCZw6yP5">pic.twitter.com/59uCZw6yP5</a></p>&mdash; GopherHole.com (@GopherHole) <a href="https://twitter.com/GopherHole/status/1729655240968819170?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 29, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[tarcone]

I cant think of a more delusional fanbase than Nebby

[albionmoonlight]

I remember at some point we were asking on here what might be the worst job in CFB weighing fan expectations vs. ability to meet those expectations, and I think I remember Nebraska being the team that came up the most.

[Thomkal]

QB Grayson McCall appears not to be done with college football despite the injury sustained this season for Coastal Carolina. He has one year of eligibility left and enters the portal as a graduate transfer

[Ghost Econ]

If lil USC were smart they'd pony up some NIL.

[Kodos]

It’s sounding like Curt Cignetti from James Madison will be the hire for IU. I don’t know anything about him, but people on the IU boards seem to like him.

[Edward64]

Petrino lucked out when Ryan Mallett left Michigan.

Our QB1 KJ Jefferson is a big guy, has more mobility, decent but not quite the same arm. He's got another season so hope he comes back. Gives Petrino a chance to recruit the QB he wants.

Have to be fair and manage my expectations. This season has been a stinker. Hog fans need to give Petrino at least 1 rebuilding year.

Hog forum is saying Jefferson is headed to the portal.

I’m pretty surprised (and disappointed). I assume he knows he doesn’t fit Petrino’s schemes and/or he’s just PO’d about the past season.

I hope we get him to reconsider.

[Ksyrup]

Riley Leonard in the portal.

[Ksyrup]

Nebraska went 67-27 under Bo Pillini. They are 43-64 since firing him.

[miami_fan]

Nebraska went 67-27 under Bo Pillini. They are 43-64 since firing him.

I did not realize Pelini was the third Nebraska head coach after Tom Osborne retired. Frank Solich's firing might have been more egregious. From Solich (58-19) to Bill Callahan and then from Pelini to Mike Riley. Ouch!

The program was probably going to make a slow decline anyways but man, it is bad when you shitcan to very successful coaches for less successful ones twice in that short amount of time.

[Kodos]

It’s sounding like Curt Cignetti from James Madison will be the hire for IU. I don’t know anything about him, but people on the IU boards seem to like him.

This appears to be a done deal now. He sounds good. Let's hope he can become the rare IU football coach with a winning record.

[Atocep]

It’s sounding like Curt Cignetti from James Madison will be the hire for IU. I don’t know anything about him, but people on the IU boards seem to like him.

He's a difficult one to judge. I think JMU is somewhat similar to UCF, Appy State, and a couple others where it's not necessarily the most difficult job to win at.

Due to his family ties to WVU he's been on the radar for several years but with his age it was time for him to take something if he ever wanted a P5 job.

[Thomkal]

Coastal Carolina gets its bowl game-in Hawaii on Dec 23 against San Jose State. Given how they played their last game, not too much to get excited for at this point.

[bob]

So Notre Dame fired their WR coach and now at least 5 of their WRs are in the portal. I’m not sure how they can run an offense in their bowl game.

[bob]

As to the CFP - let’s say Oregon barely win, Alabama barely win, Texas wins big, Michigan wins big, FSU wins big. Who is your 4?

[BYU 14]

Let's be honest, how awesome would it be if coaches really talked like this?
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-media-max-width="560"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">ᴬᴵJim Harbaugh gives Iowa no chance in Big Ten championship <a href="https://t.co/LA1PD6jWq0">pic.twitter.com/LA1PD6jWq0</a></p>&mdash; Heavens! (@HeavensFX) <a href="https://twitter.com/HeavensFX/status/1730288211669250131?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 30, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[JPhillips]

I saw a fake Iowa hype video that was mostly downing punts inside the ten.

[BYU 14]

I saw a fake Iowa hype video that was mostly downing punts inside the ten.

I'll have to look for that, but the thing I love about this is I could hear all that actually coming out of Harbaugh's mouth.

[Sweed]

I saw a fake Iowa hype video that was mostly downing punts inside the ten.

Probably made by someone who's team didn't win 10 games? :lol:

[JPhillips]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-media-max-width="560"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">New Iowa B1G 10 Championship hype video ��<a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Hawkeyes?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Hawkeyes</a> | <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/GoBlue?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#GoBlue</a> <a href="https://t.co/ihnTKBr5Xg">pic.twitter.com/ihnTKBr5Xg</a></p>&mdash; Cover 3 Film Room (@Cover3FilmRoom) <a href="https://twitter.com/Cover3FilmRoom/status/1730240659901050987?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 30, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[BYU 14]

:lol: :lol:

[RainMaker]

It’s sounding like Curt Cignetti from James Madison will be the hire for IU. I don’t know anything about him, but people on the IU boards seem to like him.

This seems like a really nice hire. Pretty remarkable job at JMU considering it's only their 2nd year in FBS.

[Kodos]

Yeah, I'm pretty excited about it. We'll see if he can overcome the curse of IU football.

[GrantDawg]

Thus ends the career of the legend that never was. There were people predicting he was going to eventually go first overall in the NFL some day. In the end, he had a hard time even getting a college starting job.
<samp class="EmbedCode-container"><code class="EmbedCode-code"><blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Rice quarterback JT Daniels is medically retiring from football after suffering multiple concussions and being advised to retire by his doctors, he tells ESPN. With his retirement, he plans to enter the coaching space now that his playing career is done. <a href="https://t.co/zJQtFSUqMb">pic.twitter.com/zJQtFSUqMb</a></p>&mdash; Pete Thamel (@PeteThamel) <a href="https://twitter.com/PeteThamel/status/1730689626585641299?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 1, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script> </code></samp>

[Edward64]

Thus ends the career of the legend that never was. There were people predicting he was going to eventually go first overall in the NFL some day. In the end, he had a hard time even getting a college starting job.

Always sad to see great potential crashing down.

Wonder if he was just overhyped from the beginning or something happened during college.

Hogs had Mitch Mustain, home bred 5-star QB back in the 2000s. He went 8-0 for us but then some BS happened with Houston Nutt, mom etc. and he left for USC. Never did much there. Many Hog fans never forgave Nutt for that.

Personally, having watched all/most of his games, I remember Mustain was "shaky" in some games, he wasn't stellar (e.g. unlike Mallett). But he was a freshman and he had an 8-0 record. Nutt should have continued on with him.

[RainMaker]

There's a halfway decent documentary on Mustain called The Identity Theft Of Mitch Mustain. It was free on Amazon Prime Video for awhile and worth a watch if you're into college football. Kind of goes into the Malzahn and Nutt feud.

[cuervo72]

WTF, #55 on Washington is basically wearing hot pants and a halter top.

[cuervo72]

Also my wife just referred sartorially to "the lizard people of Oregon."

[GrantDawg]

Oregon not looking good early.

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[GrantDawg]

Penix NFL stock going up. Nix stock dropping.

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[Ksyrup]

That was a horrendous PI call.

[Ksyrup]

That PI call changed this entire game.

[sovereignstar v2]

What are you looking at calling that out of bounds

[bronconick]

Auburn fans went looking for the hard liquor watching Bo Nix shred a 3 man rush there after last week.

[bob]

With Washington’s win over Oregon, this season is guaranteed to be the 27th consecutive season without a first time national champion.

[Honolulu_Blue]

CFP will be:
Washington
Michigan (assuming the best Iowa, which feels like a safe bet, no offense, tarcone)
Winner of Alabama/Georgia

And…

If FSU wins, they have to get in even though they likely shouldn’t.

If FSU loses and Texas wins, Texas gets in. It would be interesting if Alabama wins and Texas wins how that all shakes out given Texas beat Bama at home.

If Georgia wins and FSU and Texas lose, does OSU back door it again? It seems most likely.

[JonInMiddleGA]

If FSU wins, they have to get in even though they likely shouldn’t.


I kinda have the opposite feeling about FSU at this point I think.

If they win with the 3rd string QB (which looks like a definite possibility right now), I think they gotta go in. Hell, if they win with the backup, that's not a bad argument either.

[bob]

Washington is in. Let's say Alabama barely wins, Texas wins big, Michigan wins big, FSU wins big. I think SEC should be left out. 3 undefeated teams are in, Texas beat Alabama who beat UGA.

[Ghost Econ]

I guess running into the kicker isn't called anymore?

Big 12 gonna give Texas every chance to run up the score

[Honolulu_Blue]

Washington is in. Let's say Alabama barely wins, Texas wins big, Michigan wins big, FSU wins big. I think SEC should be left out. 3 undefeated teams are in, Texas beat Alabama who beat UGA.

Texas has definitely won big here. They beat Bama in Bama. If it’s down between those two, hard to pick Bama, but no SEC team would be really odd!

[cartman]

I'll admit I was wrong. I thought Texas was making at best a lateral move when they fired Tom Herman and hired Sark.

[Edward64]

Solid first drive and TD for the Dawgs

[GrantDawg]

Solid first drive and TD for the Dawgs
Georgia scoring first scares me. They haven't scored first in a long time.

[RainMaker]

I'll admit I was wrong. I thought Texas was making at best a lateral move when they fired Tom Herman and hired Sark.

How much does NIL play a role in this? Herman didn't have tye talent Sark has.

[Atocep]

How much does NIL play a role in this? Herman didn't have tye talent Sark has.

Not as much as the fact that Herman was just a shitty coach.

[sovereignstar v2]

Soooooo

Michigan, Washington, FSU, and Alabama?

If Louisville beats FSU, then Georgia backs in

[GrantDawg]

They wanted it more. Georgia loses for the first time in 30 games, and will not make the playoffs.

[dubb93]

Soooooo

Michigan, Washington, FSU, and Alabama?

If Louisville beats FSU, then Georgia backs in

Bama over Texas? Didn’t Texas beat them in Tuscaloosa?

[dubb93]

I would agree though that unless Michigan loses that GA, Ohio State, and Oregon should all be dead. Four of Michigan, Washington, FSU, Texas, and Bama should be in and I’d hate to see an undefeated power conference champ left out.

[sovereignstar v2]

Oof, I forgot about that

[Edward64]

They wanted it more. Georgia loses for the first time in 30 games, and will not make the playoffs.

They did want it more.

[GrantDawg]

They did want it more.
To win championships, you have to have most of the breaks go your way. Nothing went Georgia's way in that game. There is a reason it nearly impossible to win three championships in a row. You are eventually going to hit a bad game at the worst time. Still, those two Championships are still there. Going into next year with a 12 team playoff, Georgia going to be in way more than they won't. Future is bright.

[GrantDawg]

You want to see people's heads explode? And no, I don't agree with this.
<samp class="EmbedCode-container"><code class="EmbedCode-code"><blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">If the CFP committee really wants to put in the best 4 teams and not the most deserving, it’ll be:<br><br>1. Washington<br>2. Texas<br>3. Alabama<br>4. Georgia<br><br>Michigan got caught blatantly cheating. FSU is without at least 1 and possibly 2 QBs.<br><br>Simple.</p>&mdash; Adam Spencer (@AdamSpencer4) <a href="https://twitter.com/AdamSpencer4/status/1731108275112812650?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 3, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script> </code></samp>

[tarcone]

GO HAWKS!!

[tarcone]

Last time Iowa beat a #2 was in 1985. Michigan was ranked 2, guess who was 1.

[sovereignstar v2]

Last time Iowa beat a #2 was in 1985. Michigan was ranked 2, guess who was 1.

Iowa State?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Last time Iowa beat a #2 was in 1985. Michigan was ranked 2, guess who was 1.

UCF

[tarcone]

You guys are killing me

[Atocep]

If Michigan and FSU win:

Michigan, Washington, FSU, Texas


If either Michigan or FSU lose then Alabama likely slides in. I don't see a path for Georgia unless both Michigan and FSU lose.

SEC schools need to stop scheduling 3 non P4/5 schools with one being a FCS school in their non-conference every year expecting the SEC schedule to carry them. When the SEC is down you can't act like it's the end of the world that a SEC team is left out of the playoff.

[JonInMiddleGA]

SEC schools need to stop scheduling 3 non P4/5 schools with one being a FCS school in their non-conference every year expecting the SEC schedule to carry them.

There's a better argument for Bama not scheduling the Texas game.
Sub in any patsy there and they're the easy #1 overall seed this year*

edit to add: * whether they had to lose that game to get to where they are today notwithstanding

[Atocep]

There's a better argument for Bama not scheduling the Texas game.
Sub in any patsy there and they're the easy #1 overall seed this year.

That's actually true as well. However, if you do that and slip up at any point, including your title game, you're likely eliminated.

The SEC can't beat it's chest about how good it is while avoiding teams with a pulse in non-conference.

[SirFozzie]

At least the committee now have their excuse for going to a 12 team field.

[Ksyrup]

If FSU is going to be ranked 5th even if we win, I sincerely hope we lose because I will have a hard time enjoying college FB for a long time. It will be so easy for the committee to build an argument on "eye test" and no QB1 which allows them to sidestep the Alabama/Texas issue and I believe that's what they will do. It doesn't matter if it's unprecedented because we're going to a 12 team playoff next year so that will be no longer relevant in the future.

Just based on the way FSU has played the last half of the season, even if they win, it won't be pretty. So there's your "eye test."

[bronconick]

Brock Glenn is warming up with the 1st string, so Florida State is riding with a true freshman with four career passes. I think I'll be breaking out the vodka and getting offline for a while.

[sovereignstar v2]

This isn't Final Four seeding. The QB situation shouldn't play any role here IMO

[JonInMiddleGA]

The SEC can't beat it's chest about how good it is while avoiding teams with a pulse in non-conference.

Except until their CFP dominance ends, they kinda can.

I agree that it's down, I don't think there's any question about that honestly. Ole Miss went 10-2 with a team that had quite a few glaring flaws is a great example. That's not an exceptionally good team, it simply isn't. (I saw a helluva lot more of them than I saw of Missouri so I'll pick on them for this purpose)

But given where things stood entering the 2023 season, the Bama-Texas game was a mistake.

[Ksyrup]

It expressly plays a role. They've already said so. It's all eye test BS. Might as well hand Derek Jeter another Gold Glove when they announce the final 4 too.

[sovereignstar v2]

Well there should be a riot somewhere if an undefeated FSU doesn't make it

[Brian Swartz]

The CFP dominance run isn't particularly relevant because:

- Most of the conference doesn't play there, and how good a conference is, is about more than how the top team or two in it are.

- How good a conference is varies from year to year. It doesn't matter how much you've won in the past, what's relevant is how good you are this season.

[JonInMiddleGA]

It expressly plays a role. They've already said so. It's all eye test BS. Might as well hand Derek Jeter another Gold Glove when they announce the final 4 too.

And the eye test is what I ultimately hold in the highest regard.

I've seen enough football at this point to feel like I can judge what I see on the field, it's that simple.

It probably gets tougher in the current landscape than it used to be, I'll admit. Barring a fluky injury-free run of epic proportions, we may not ever see another truly great team in college football, there's not enough depth to go around with 1,435 teams playing "D1".

[Brian Swartz]

Last time Iowa beat a #2 was in 1985. Michigan was ranked 2, guess who was 1.

Last time you said something similar, the final score was 42-3.

[cuervo72]

Man, is there anything else you want to fit in OTHER than the actual game, FOX?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Well there should be a riot somewhere if an undefeated FSU doesn't make it

FWIW, I'm on the record for putting them in if they win tonight. Absolutely if they win with the #3 QB, almost certainly if they win with their #2.

But that SoS is ... problematic. It's tough scheduling luck, they can't control that Clemson, Florida, LSU, and Miami were all irrelevant this season. Nor that winning the title game makes an already weak looking opponent look even worse.

But I in no way consider the ACC a "power conference" in its current condition. I didn't when the season started, damned sure nothing has happened during the season to change that. That dents the value of the undefeated mark.

[Atocep]

Michigan kicks a field goal to clinch the Big 10 title.

[Ghost Econ]

I'm fine with Texas and Bama jumping an undefeated FSU.

[GrantDawg]

This is not going to help their playoff argument:
<samp class="EmbedCode-container"><code class="EmbedCode-code"><blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">FSU had 5 yards in total offense in 1st QT.<br><br>5.</p>&mdash; John Fricke (@JohnFricke) <a href="https://twitter.com/JohnFricke/status/1731130237029638650?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 3, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script> </code></samp>

[sovereignstar v2]

.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20231203/483bab15d5bbebccb991dd07d74e7711.jpg

[sovereignstar v2]

Here is Iowa's chance to pounce and kick a field goal

[GrantDawg]

<samp class="EmbedCode-container"><code class="EmbedCode-code"><blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">I made a list of teams I'd take in the CFP over Florida State:<br><br>1. Alabama<br>2. Oregon<br>3. Georgia<br>4. Texas<br>5. Anybody from the warehouse<br>6. Lord Voldemort <br><br>Anyways, happy birthday, Peter Warrick.</p>&mdash; Brennen Rupp (@Brennen_Rupp) <a href="https://twitter.com/Brennen_Rupp/status/1731145412499603857?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 3, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script> </code></samp>

[Edward64]

Something tells me there's going to be some controversy in the final 4 slots.

[sovereignstar v2]

Butt-clenching time in Charlotte

[RainMaker]

Florida State's defense is unreal.

[cuervo72]

I mean, I kind of want FSU to win because eff the SEC, but holy mother of pearl I can't stand four hours of that fucking chant.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Florida State's defense is unreal.

Or is facing a low-ceiling QB helping them look better?

[SirFozzie]

Jon: Am I right in assuming the SEC will announce the "Second War of Northern Aggression" if the CFP locks them out, as it looks like may happen?

Of course, the Aggression in this point isn't slav.. er.. it's about SEC fans believing they have a divine right to CFP playoff spots...

[JonInMiddleGA]

Jon: Am I right in assuming the SEC will announce the "Second War of Northern Aggression" if the CFP locks them out, as it looks like may happen?

Eh, most of the fanbases aren't likely to be tooooo upset about it best I can figure.

I've heard nor seen nary a peep today/tonight from any of the multitude of Auburn or Tennessee people I know.

They'll grouse come playoff time perhaps, simply bored by the prospect of watching uninspiring teams, but in the moment I don't sense much concern beyond the two immediately affected fanbases.

[RainMaker]

Or is facing a low-ceiling QB helping them look better?

Their defensive line was obliterating Louisville. That one DE is one of the best I've seen this year.

I don't think Louosville's offense is good but that's still an i.pressove performance.

[RainMaker]

I don't think there is any chance they leave Alabama out considering how much ESPN has invested in the SEC. The decision would be tougher if Travis didn't break his leg though.

The 4 best teams in the country at the moment are Michigan, Alabama, Georgia, and Texas but I didn't set up this dumb system.

[bronconick]

It's never been about the "best" 4 teams, though they misspeak that every week. They inevitably rank the "most deserving/best resume".

[Brian Swartz]

They don't though. Sometimes it's best. Sometimes it's resume/deserving. Sometimes it's 'let's overrank this team to make others in their conference look better'. Sometimes it appears to be 'we just felt like it'.

As I've said before, this isn't just to crap on the committee - there is no possible ranking which wouldn't make a lot of people mad. I'm looking forward to seeing what they do, because it's a no-win situation for them like never before IMO. But when people say 'I know who the best four teams are and it's these' in this kind of a situation, my response is 'balderdash. You know no such thing'. I think there are 6-7 teams that can make a good argument, depending on what your basis is.

[bob]

4 conference champs, 3 undefeated, and the fourth beat the other conference champ.

The fact that we have a head to head between the two non-undefeated P5 champs should make this really easy.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Just a side note from the official guidelines for the committee

With regard to head to head, conference championships, and strength of schedule ...

We would expect this same set of principles to be applied, particularly at the margins (teams 10‐11‐12).

[JonInMiddleGA]

And after reading both the guidelines and the voting procedure again, I believe I know how it'll end up. It's the combination that gave me my a-ha moment.

First step is for each member to submit 30 teams that they feel are "the best in the country, in no particular order". Next, any team that gets at least 3 (out of 13 possible) votes stays on the list for consideration. Then they'll each submit again "the 6 best teams" from that list, again in no particular order.

Then we get to the part that has given my my best guess of the outcome

"In the first ranking step, each member will rank those six teams, one through six, with one being the best. The best team in each member’s ranking will receive one point; second‐best, two points, etc. The members’ rankings will be added together and the three teams receiving the fewest points will become the top three seeds. The three teams that were not seeded will be held over for the next ranking step."

In other words, they'll pick three from six ... then add three to the holdovers and pick three more ...

I expect the first round of six to be, in no particular order:
Michigan, Washington, Alabama, Georgia, Texas, FSU

I expect the first three chosen to be
1) Michigan 2) Washington 3) Texas

The only head to head games there involve Alabama, who had a win & a loss.
Doesn't really matter who they add to the second round, because I believe they'll then rank as follows

4) Alabama 5) Georgia 6)FSU

My reasoning? The guidelines, which I'll link below in the comments, talk about considering factors such as head to head competition, conference championships, and strength of schedule particularly within groups of similar teams. I believe they'll use h2h to put Texas at #3.

And that they'll then use h2h to rank Alabama 4th, giving them the h2h advantage over Georgia and the massive SoS difference the edge over FSU. Same SoS makes Georgia the 5th ahead of FSU.

I'm not saying that is or isn't what I'd do ... I'm just talking about the process and what I think it'll lead to.

[JPhillips]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Where is the portal?? #4 got that Dawg in him! �� Wow… <br><br> <a href="https://t.co/6W43B4JNfJ">pic.twitter.com/6W43B4JNfJ</a></p>&mdash; Bobby (@BobbyWilson1004) <a href="https://twitter.com/BobbyWilson1004/status/1731315879684555248?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 3, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[dubb93]

I’m with you on the logic, Jon, but it falls apart for me when Texas would have to jump from 7 to 3 and FSU fall from 3 to 6 when FSU beat the higher ranked team in their championship game. Your logic works if you ignore the existing rankings, and maybe they do, but they will take a beating for it if that is their logic.

[bob]

I was listening to the radio this morning and the entire conversation was that Michigan, Wash, and FSU were in and they were 95% sure Alabama gets in over Texas.

[Ksyrup]

All I know is, I'm glad I didn't watch, turned on Forensic Files, and fell asleep at some point around 10pm. As I get older, I have learned to stop doing things that make me unhappy and unnecessarily stressed out and watching what sounds like a car wreck of a game would have been exactly that. I also have little hope FSU makes the playoff, but if they do, great. If not, I still avoided a 4 hour unpleasant experience.

I will say, the SECs best non-conference win was UK over... Louisville, a team FSU beat with a 3rd string QB. The ACC had a winning record against the SEC this year. I don't know why, other than TV contracts and ratings, the SEC has to get in this year.

I also see that Michigan, with it's QB1 against a lower ranked opponent than FSU played, put up less yardage than FSU with a true freshman QB.

But I'm fairly convinced they get left out because this is the last year of the 4 team playoff so they aren't setting bad precedent by screwing over FSU. Starting next year, it's simply a seeding issue in the playoff. I hope I'm wrong but I don't feel good about it at all.

[PilotMan]

NDSU won their road playoff game against Montana St on a blocked extra point in OT. The MSU kicker had missed 2 FG's in the game earlier and the loss snapped the longest home win streak in the nation at 26 games.

[Vegas Vic]

The ACC had a winning record against the SEC this year.

Yeah, that Wake Forest win over Vanderbilt back in September is the deciding game, and should put the matter to rest.

The good news is that this is the last year of this train wreck. There will be outrage over whoever gets left out in the top six. Next year it will be a moot point, as all of them would be in. You would have, at most, a minor squabble among Ole Miss, Oklahoma and Penn State fans that would barely register outside of their respective fan bases. Hell, with the dismantling of the Pac-12, even Liberty and SMU would get berths, so you wouldn't have to listen to the poor old "UCF" argument from years ago. Liberty would be then be able to go to Athens, GA and get obliterated in the first round.

[sovereignstar v2]

I can understand tempering expectations, but I still think FSU are nearly a lock

[Thomkal]

NDSU won their road playoff game against Montana St on a blocked extra point in OT. The MSU kicker had missed 2 FG's in the game earlier and the loss snapped the longest home win streak in the nation at 26 games.


Woohoo NDSU! Did I see correctly that its South Dakota State in the Finals?

[PilotMan]

No finals yet, I think we're up to the quarter finals this week.

SDSU is still super odds on favorites to win it all. They just blow everyone out.

We need to beat USD on the road this week, and that's a team we lost to in the regular season.

[sovereignstar v2]

SDSU have turned the tables on the Bison. They look unbeatable like NDSU did in year's past. Entz has supervised the end of that dynasty.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I’m with you on the logic, Jon, but it falls apart for me when Texas would have to jump from 7 to 3 and FSU fall from 3 to 6 when FSU beat the higher ranked team in their championship game. Your logic works if you ignore the existing rankings, and maybe they do, but they will take a beating for it if that is their logic.

FWIW, AP poll just released with Texas moving from 7 to 3.
FSU held steady at 4.

Last week the first 13 spots in the CFP rankings & the AP poll were identical.

One other interesting change in the AP worth watching (tho I don't believe it'll happen in the CFP): SMU jumped over Liberty after beating Tulane, moving 25 --> 17 while Liberty only moved 20 --> 18

[Ksyrup]

Being vindicated never felt so bad.

[sovereignstar v2]

Fucking dumb

[Ksyrup]

Moving beyond wins and losses as the primary factor was always dumb, at least in comparing P5 teams. It's like tiers. No losses is its own tier and should never be compared to 1 loss teams. Why are we fucking playing the games if a loss doesn't matter?

[Ksyrup]

Also - I blame Auburn.

[Ghost Econ]

This kinda shows that they don't really think the ACC is a top league. Everyone in the playoffs are big 10/sec next year. The powers that be clearly see this as a 2 league FBS from here on out.

[sovereignstar v2]

The cheaters vs the team that had no business being in. How intriguing

[dubb93]

Well...they better give FSU someone in a bowl game that they can't beat or it's going to be really awkward. If I was FSU and won my bowl game I'd hang a banner. There was literally nothing else they could have done. They might as well have not even played football this season. They had no chance from the start.

[Atocep]

Moving beyond wins and losses as the primary factor was always dumb, at least in comparing P5 teams. It's like tiers. No losses is its own tier and should never be compared to 1 loss teams. Why are we fucking playing the games if a loss doesn't matter?

FSU is probably the 3 seed if Travis is healthy. If the Travis injury was being used as a tie breaker I'd be ok with that, but this selection is entirely because he got hurt. SoS or anything else has absolutely nothing do with it because we wouldn't be having this discussion if he played last night.

[Ksyrup]

Also, FSU is not the same without its QB but FSU had 7 fewer passing yards in the last 3 games than Michigan.

My daughter is bawling her eyes out. Feel so bad for her. She's taken my fandom and run with it the past 5-6 years like only a teenager can. I saw this coming a mile away. When Auburn blew Alabama's second loss, it opened this door.

[Ksyrup]

Well...they better give FSU someone in a bowl game that they can't beat or it's going to be really awkward. If I was FSU and won my bowl game I'd hang a banner. There was literally nothing else they could have done. They might as well have not even played football this season. They had no chance from the start.

We'll see who actually plays. I expect half our defense to declare and not suit up. I think it would be UGA in Orange? I'm flying so I have no idea.

[Ghost Econ]

The amusing thing is, 8f Georgia had won FSU would have still missed the playoffs.

[dubb93]

It kills me that ksyrup is actually right. FSU has so many potential pros that probably won’t play. That makes it even more silly I was looking at a mock draft of the first couple rounds and I think FSU had like 6 players in there (none were the hurt QB.) Also, even FSU’s third string QB is a projected future pro….and they have continued to beat teams, even teams ranked higher than other teams that leaped them, without said QB.

[JonInMiddleGA]

This kinda shows that they don't really think the ACC is a top league. Everyone in the playoffs are big 10/sec next year. The powers that be clearly see this as a 2 league FBS from here on out.

In its current state, the ACC not a Power anything conference.

It might theoretically get back to a meaningful 3rd or 4th spot, but in 2023 there just really wasn't much there.

Sagarin (I know, I know, it's not perfect ... but it's an easy to find metric) shows the gap between the Big 10 East and the ACC as the same as the gap between the ACC and the Sun Belt East.

The closest parallel? The Big 10 West.

[Ksyrup]

It kills me that ksyrup is actually right. FSU has so many potential pros that probably won’t play. That makes it even more silly I was looking at a mock draft of the first couple rounds and I think FSU had like 6 players in there (none were the hurt QB.) Also, even FSU’s third string QB is a projected future pro….and they have continued to beat teams, even teams ranked higher than other teams that leaped them, without said QB.

Even better - our best DL transfer, Darrell Jackson from Miami who transferred to be closer to his sick mom, was declared ineligible until now. He was rated better than Fiske! He would have been added to this roster for the playoff game.

[Ksyrup]

I texted my daughter Go Broncos to get her mind off college and onto the NFL and like a 60-something college graduate and lifelong donor she texted back, "It's just not the same, man."

[RainMaker]

Sagarin also shows that Michigan and Florida State had a nearly identical strength if schedule this year.

[Edward64]

Nice!

College Football Playoff will feature Michigan v. Alabama and Washington v. Texas, while undefeated Florida State is left out

[sovereignstar v2]

Nice what?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Sagarin also shows that Michigan and Florida State had a nearly identical strength if schedule this year.

2-0 vs (his) Top 10 for one, 1-0 in the season opener for the other

When a 3-loss LSU is your best opponent, that's a tough sell for having an SoS.

[dubb93]

The reality is we are talking about the difference between 1 ranked team. Alabama beat one more ranked team this year than FSU did. The unranked games dont and shouldn’t matter. What is the difference between playing Michigan State and Ivy Tech if you are one of the top teams in the county? Basically zero. You are beating both soundly.

[JonInMiddleGA]

What is the difference between playing Michigan State and Ivy Tech if you are one of the top teams in the county? Basically zero. You are beating both soundly.

Except when you don't. As Bama nearly found out against Auburn. (granted, rivalry games are a different animal)

But what it adds up to is Bama playing (Sagarin's) #2 schedule and FSU playing his #62 schedule.

[RainMaker]

The ACC was one of the main conferences that prevented the 12 team playoff so they really only have themselves to blame. Enjoy the Tostitos Fiesta Bowl or whatever you chose over playing for a national title.

[dubb93]

Isn’t LSU Alabama’s 2nd best win? Their best win before yesterday? Bama’s non conference schedule besides Texas was shameful.

[RainMaker]

Except when you don't. As Bama nearly found out against Auburn. (granted, rivalry games are a different animal)

But what it adds up to is Bama playing (Sagarin's) #2 schedule and FSU playing his #62 schedule.

Sagarin has Michigan at 56 so I don't think SOS mattered in this decision.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Sagarin has Michigan at 56 so I don't think SOS mattered in this decision.

Go back and read the criteria I posted earlier.

It mattered in the 4/5/6 slots, i.e. when comparing teams of the same level (2nd group of three teams in this case).

And that's exactly when the published criteria call for it to carry it's weight.

edit to add: along with other factors naturally.

[dubb93]

Why did that criteria not matter until now though? FSU had a better win than Texas yesterday. They started ranked SIGNIFICANTLY higher. Why just now does that criteria matter?

[Ksyrup]

Because it's a TV show.

The entire criteria is preposterous if the undefeated P5s are not grouped together. Period. This is essentially a decision made as if CFB had already moved to 2 16-20 team CFP divisions. I get it, the ACC sucks. But it's still a P5 and winning the conference as an undefeated team matters more than SOS or comparing resumes against teams that lost a game. You will never make a good argument against zero losses >>>>>> 1 loss.

[kingfc22]

Because it’s all about the dollar bills

[GrantDawg]

Because it's a TV show.

The entire criteria is preposterous if the undefeated P5s are not grouped together. Period. This is essentially a decision made as if CFB had already moved to 2 16-20 team CFP divisions. I get it, the ACC sucks. But it's still a P5 and winning the conference as an undefeated team matters more than SOS or comparing resumes against teams that lost a game. You will never make a good argument against zero losses >>>>>> 1 loss.
Because it’s all about the dollar bills

It always has been, and they really don't deny it. They base these decisions on viewership and money to the involved Bowls. They also love the engagement a controversy gives them. While people are super upset, they are laughing their way to the bank with all the engagement they get to cash in on.

System working as intended.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I get it, the ACC sucks. But it's still a P5 and winning the conference as an undefeated team matters more than SOS or comparing resumes against teams that lost a game.

You're apparently operating under the delusion that "P5" is still a realistic thing.
That's not reality right now.

FSU needed Clemson, Miami, or even Florida (i.e. their regular OOC opponent) to be relevant this year. None of them were.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Why did that criteria not matter until now though? FSU had a better win than Texas yesterday. They started ranked SIGNIFICANTLY higher. Why just now does that criteria matter?

And the sportswriters (AP poll) who weren't in the committee room AND the committee itself saw it the exact same way.

Massey has Texas higher (+3), Sagarin has Texas higher (+7), Howell has Texas higher (+1), Colley has Texas higher (+2). Only Wolfe (FSU +2) has it differently, and it has Liberty vs a mediocre HS schedule ranked 11th.

That's the committee, sportswriters, and all but one major computer poll from the BCS era (I don't think Anderson & Hester still exists?) that all agree.

edit to correct: Billingsley was an original BCS, not Howell. Billingsley has FSU +4 over Texas. Fair is fair, so I'm correcting myself without erasing the original.

[cartman]

So happy the Horns made it in, but feel horrible for FSU. I would have had FSU at 3 and Texas at 4. Texas was the closest of the one loss teams to a perfect season, having a lead with 75 seconds left against Oklahoma.

[dubb93]

Saw this on ESPN and thought it fitting. All credit to David Hale.

In the olden days, we had a beauty contest. The top team in the nation was decided entirely by the voters.

Then we moved to a better system, one determined in part by computers but one that allowed the top two teams to decide it on the field.

Then we moved to a four-team playoff, and the whole point was to eliminate the hypotheticals and let a champion be crowned by the actual results on the field. If you won your games, you had a chance to win a national title.

Turns out, all of that was a charade. None of it mattered. The games are pointless. What happens on the field is less important than what a committee thinks might happen in a future matchup.

It is an absolute slap in the face to every player who has ever put on a helmet, laced up cleats and marched onto the field to battle for a victory, because a bunch of folks in a conference room in Texas decided their sacrifice was not as important as the Las Vegas line on a potential playoff matchup.

It's a joke……

Let's be real about what happened here: The committee members couldn't leave the SEC out of the playoff. They didn't care that Alabama needed a miracle to avoid a loss to 6-6 Auburn two weeks ago. They didn't care that Georgia's own injuries -- playing with a banged-up Ladd McConkey and Brock Bowers -- likely played a large part in why the Tide won Saturday. They didn't care that the ACC has a winning record, head-to-head, against the SEC this season. They didn't care that Alabama beat 2023 Georgia, not 2021 or 2022 Georgia. They cared that Alabama and the SEC had to have a spot in the playoff by birthright. And as a result, they sent a message that what happened on the field -- the blood, tears and sacrifice that players made all season to win every game on their schedule -- was less important than getting the most compelling TV matchup.

[Atocep]

I thought the playoff was bad for the sport from the start and the data has shown it's at best a minimal improvement and more likely a step backwards.

The top two selling points for the playoff was expanded access and better games. Margin of victory between the BCS and playoff really haven't changed and the semi's have had a lot of blowouts. Access has actually shrunk under the playoff format when compared to the BCS.

The only thing the playoff has really accomplished is accelerated the destruction of conferences, traditional rivalries, helped funnel talent to a handful of schools, and made non-playoff bowls mostly pointless.

What's frustrating is that most that had a solid understanding of what made college football work could see it coming. Not some of the finer details of how the sport has evolved during the playoff era, but some of this stuff was very predictable.

[Ksyrup]

I do find it curious that many of the same people who bemoaned the end of the BCS because it was going to render the regular season meaningless and ruin what was most special about CFB are largely the same people going out of their way to explain all the technicalities of why an undefeated team should be bypassed by two 1-loss teams as the most just outcome of the CFP.

[RainMaker]

2-0 vs (his) Top 10 for one, 1-0 in the season opener for the other

When a 3-loss LSU is your best opponent, that's a tough sell for having an SoS.

Michigan - 13-0 (56th SoS)
Florida State - 13-0 (62nd SoS)

At the end of the day it comes down to this. If we're cherrypicking top-10 as criteria, Alabama only has one. So why wouldn't they get dinged for that too?

I think Alabama deserves being in because I don't think you should be punished for scheduling tough games. And I do think conference titles should matter. But Michigan and Florida State have very similar resumes and one is seen as the clear cut #1 and the other is #5. That's a decision based on pedigree and not resume.

[Ksyrup]

I wanted to let this go and get my head on straight for a week of work but (a) I just got home and I'm listening to 10 hours of pent up frustration from my daughter, (b) I saw the clip of Greg McElroy, a former Alabama QB, providing arguments in favor of Alabama over FSU - including an apparently un-ironic statement that you can't win a championship with subpar QB play, as a QB who absolutely won a championship as a subpar QB! - and (c) I have to relive the entire thing with Louisville fans tomorrow morning anyway.

[JonInMiddleGA]

But Michigan and Florida State have very similar resumes

Michigan beat Ohio State and Penn State. And put a season high on Iowa.
FSU beat LSU and ... Louisville?

Those two things are not the same. I

'm not even sure they're the same to Stevie Wonder, but they're certainly not the same to anyone with eyes that's ever seen football.

[tarcone]

PSU put 41 on Iowa, but the point is valid as Iowa's defense is elite.

[Brian Swartz]

The thing that makes the resumes different to my mind is that it's not just about winning and losing, but how you win. Computers don't care about pedigree, and Sagarin has Michigan 1st and Florida State 10th. Howell has Michigan 1st by a sizable margin, and Florida State 5th. SP+ has had Michigan first basically all year.

I expect Michigan to lose to Alabama, but the point is if you look at how they handled inferior teams compared to how Florida State did ... they just aren't the same. Michigan had one game where they really underperformed; against Maryland. Florida State had Boston College, Clemson, Duke, and Miami. Yes the wins are the same, but the overall performances are decidedly not.

Looking at stuff like ACC head to head with SEC in the non-conference is just a poor way of comparing the conferences as well, as is bowl comparisons when those are made. I detest the strong pro-SEC bias that exists, but it is still the best conference in football though not by as much as in previous years.

On the larger controversy, I think there are at least six teams with an argument for making the playoffs this year, and only two (Michigan and Washington) that I'd put as automatic. This is not an issue that will go away with the expanded playoffs. The only possible solution - which almost nobody wants - is a proper competitive structure with enforced balanced conferences, a much smaller amount of teams competing in each level/division/whatever. As long as we have the current situation with conferences and teams doing basically whatever they want in terms of who they play during the season, it's not going to get much better regardless of the playoff format. And given that college football is more popular than ever, it's not really something they have any compelling motive to shake up.

[RainMaker]

Michigan beat Ohio State and Penn State. And put a season high on Iowa.
FSU beat LSU and ... Louisville?

Those two things are not the same. I

'm not even sure they're the same to Stevie Wonder, but they're certainly not the same to anyone with eyes that's ever seen football.

Just saying every strength of schedule calculation has them pretty close.

[RainMaker]

The thing that makes the resumes different to my mind is that it's not just about winning and losing, but how you win. Computers don't care about pedigree, and Sagarin has Michigan 1st and Florida State 10th. Howell has Michigan 1st by a sizable margin, and Florida State 5th. SP+ has had Michigan first basically all year

Sagarin also has Penn State ahead of Alabama.

If it's about how you win, then Alabama should not be in. A miracle hailmary to beat Auburn and being taken to the wire against South Florida and Arkansas is pretty bad.

[Edward64]

I agree Alabama should not have been invited to the party and the SEC got a pass here because of "legacy".

But yeah, wouldn't surprise me if Alabama beat Michigan (and wins it all). I'll be rooting for Michigan, I know they've been waiting for a while now.

[GrantDawg]

I agree Alabama should not have been invited to the party and the SEC got a pass here because of "legacy".

But yeah, wouldn't surprise me if Alabama beat Michigan (and wins it all). I'll be rooting for Michigan, I know they've been waiting for a while now.
I'm all in on Washington. Go you purple Dawgs!

[Ksyrup]

Bowl season never really meant much, but it was a nice way to consume a ton of CFB and put a bow on the season. Now, with everyone either pulling out to prepare for the draft or hitting the portal, bowl season is becoming nothing more than a televised preview of your school's spring scrimmage.

Dillon Gabriel and Kyle McCord both hit the portal this morning. I expect eventually at least 8-10 FSU guys will (Keon Coleman all but said so), as will some bit players looking for a headstart on their next gig (FSUs 4th string QB hit the portal).

I'm all for players doing what's best for them but it's absolutely at odds with what makes CFB so much fun. Reality is sucking the life out of the sport and there's no good fix.

[dubb93]

What’s with all the idiots online arguing that Georgia should be in over Washington? College football is really becoming hard to watch. I agree with bowls. They used to be one of the best times of the sports year. Now it’s all backups besides the CFP and I’m wondering how long before people start sitting that out too.

[albionmoonlight]

Reality is sucking the life out of the sport and there's no good fix.

That's the tension. What's best/fair for the players is at odds with what is most fun for the fans.

I also miss how New Year's Day used to have, like, 4 bowls all going at the same time all day long. At some point they realized that was bad for maximizing eyeballs, so we are stuck with pretty much one game at a time, which just does not feel right.

[cartman]

I remember one time in the early 80s, don't remember which year, but New Year's Day ended up being a school day. My parents let me stay home and watch football all day.

[Kodos]

They really should have a portal dead period between the final game of the regular season and the last bowl game. Players leaving before the season is over sucks.

[cartman]

I remember one time in the early 80s, don't remember which year, but New Year's Day ended up being a school day. My parents let me stay home and watch football all day.

I think it might have been 1984. New Year's Day was a Sunday, so the bowls would have been pushed to the 2nd on Monday to not conflict with NFL games.

[Ksyrup]

I see ESPN is doubling down on the SEC lovefest. On their college football rankings page, they have FSU and UGA tied for 5th. The committee's official rankings have UGA 6th. And it's not a typo - it shows UGA dropping 4 spots, not 5.

This shit is unreal and out of control. SEC should just be a subsidiary of ESPN at this point.

[cartman]

If Texas beats Washington, they will have avenged this year all 5 of their losses from last year.

[Ksyrup]

Looks like ESPN got enough bad press from the 5th/6th ranking thing that they changed it. Fuckers.

[dubb93]

Why does the transfer portal open up before the season ends. So bizarre. That seems like a pretty easy fix.

[Brian Swartz]

What’s with all the idiots online arguing that Georgia should be in over Washington?

Sports fandom has a large proportion of blind emotionalism.

[Ghost Econ]

So if Georgia had won, would the committee have still seeded Texas above FSU? I think by having two 1 loss conference champs in Bama and Texas it gave them cover to jump a crippled FSU team.

I'm not sure the committee would have just jumped Texas over FSU if UGa won. That would have been 4 undefeated P5 champs and would have been better symmetry than 3+1 with an undefeated left out.

[Ksyrup]

I think they would have had the SEC champ in so FSU would have had a far better shot at #4 going up against Texas. Texas was put at #3 strategically so the argument was FSU/Alabama and not Texas/Alabama because that didn't favor the SEC.

And by the way, ESPNs own Strength of Record/Resume metric had FSU #3 and Alabama #4 yesterday. Guess what disappeared from their website?

[Atocep]

Why does the transfer portal open up before the season ends. So bizarre. That seems like a pretty easy fix.

Dillon Gabriel transferring just highlights one of the major problems with college football right now. I don't have any info so I could be wrong, but I doubt this is happening without a nice NIL deal already lined up somewhere.

[sovereignstar v2]

Can Dillon Gabriel go to FSU this month and then Alabama can be kicked the fuck out?

/s

[miami_fan]

Why does the transfer portal open up before the season ends. So bizarre. That seems like a pretty easy fix.

So that the coaches that were hired to be head coaches before the season ended to allow them to get an early start on recruiting can know what is available in the transfer portal which is now a huge part of recruiting.

[Ksyrup]

Dillon Gabriel transferring just highlights one of the major problems with college football right now. I don't have any info so I could be wrong, but I doubt this is happening without a nice NIL deal already lined up somewhere.

Possible, but it also may be simply to get a headstart on his choice of schools. The earlier you start the more offers you get to field and more options you have. But yeah, some of these guys already know where they are going. The backdoor recruiting is the same as it was in HS/travel ball.

[rjolley]

Why does the transfer portal open up before the season ends. So bizarre. That seems like a pretty easy fix.

So that the students can enroll in their new school and be ready for classes in January.

Yes, I laughed as typed that out.

[Cuckoo]

Possible, but it also may be simply to get a headstart on his choice of schools. The earlier you start the more offers you get to field and more options you have.

This. It's always been known this would be his last year at Oklahoma, as they're going with 5-star freshman Jackson Arnold next year. Gabriel has one year left, so it was either draft or transfer. Good college QB but not much of a pro prospect.

[miami_fan]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">🚨 BREAKING: I am demanding answers and transparency from the <a href="https://twitter.com/CFBPlayoff?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@CFBPlayoff</a> Selection Committee following its unprecedented exclusion of <a href="https://twitter.com/FSUFootball?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@FSUFootball</a> from the playoffs.<br><br>Read my letter to Chairman Boo Corrigan ⬇️ <a href="https://t.co/D554J82c4S">pic.twitter.com/D554J82c4S</a></p>&mdash; Rick Scott (@SenRickScott) <a href="https://twitter.com/SenRickScott/status/1731705892087750834?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 4, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[albionmoonlight]

One thing that still unites politicians across party lines is loyalty to the area sports team.

[GrantDawg]

They really should have a portal dead period between the final game of the regular season and the last bowl game. Players leaving before the season is over sucks.
The problem is the early signing period. That would put teams at a disadvantage not knowing how many players they will lose. As it is, it mostly a disadvantage to the playoff teams because players that are getting play time on those teams tend to hang on longer, and that is fair.

[Noop]

The decision regarding the college football rankings unfairly disadvantaged Florida State. It appears to prioritize popularity over actual season performance. Florida State had an undefeated season, whereas Texas and Alabama did not. Therefore, the debate should have focused on whether Texas or Alabama deserved the number 4 spot, rather than questioning Florida State's standing.

[Thomkal]

Saw Trump blamed DeSantis for not lobbying the Committee enough on FSU's behalf.