Re: You make the call!

[braves_94]

Re: You make the call!

This seems to be the correct answer. Its what i got when i asked other places. It would be nice to get an answer form some of these baseball writers or ESPN analysts but apparently they are to busy to reply.

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/downloads/y2014/official_baseball_rules.pdf

Top of page 64, under rule 7.05:

If a runner is forced to return to a base after a catch, he must retouch his original base even
though, because of some ground rule or other rule, he is awarded additional bases. He may retouch while the ball is dead and the award is then made from his original base



Rule 7.10(b) used on this thread is not applied to the correct situation here. Note it says, "When the ball is dead." What it refers to is once a ball has been ruled dead, through an overthrow, home run, ground rule double, or ect, once a runner misses a base and occupies another, he cannot go back. This doesn't address when the ball is deemed live. So if you miss second on your home run trot, and you hit third, you're SOL if the opposing team appeals.

[HozAndMoose]

Re: You make the call!

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/downloads/y20...ball_rules.pdf

Top of page 64, under rule 7.05:

If a runner is forced to return to a base after a catch, he must retouch his original base even
though, because of some ground rule or other rule, he is awarded additional bases. He may retouch while the ball is dead and the award is then made from his original base



Rule 7.10(b) used on this thread is not applied to the correct situation here. Note it says, "When the ball is dead." What it refers to is once a ball has been ruled dead, through an overthrow, home run, ground rule double, or ect, once a runner misses a base and occupies another, he cannot go back. This doesn't address when the ball is deemed live. So if you miss second on your home run trot, and you hit third, you're SOL if the opposing team appeals.

Yes he has to retouch his original base. But he is still given 3rd. Him having to go back doesnt change the final outcome.

[stantheman08]

Re: You make the call!

the game probably let you score because you had passed second and so it awarded two bases from there

it should have put you at third with 2 out

[kehlis]

Re: You make the call!

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/downloads/y20...ball_rules.pdf

Top of page 64, under rule 7.05:

If a runner is forced to return to a base after a catch, he must retouch his original base even
though, because of some ground rule or other rule, he is awarded additional bases. He may retouch while the ball is dead and the award is then made from his original base



Rule 7.10(b) used on this thread is not applied to the correct situation here. Note it says, "When the ball is dead." What it refers to is once a ball has been ruled dead, through an overthrow, home run, ground rule double, or ect, once a runner misses a base and occupies another, he cannot go back. This doesn't address when the ball is deemed live. So if you miss second on your home run trot, and you hit third, you're SOL if the opposing team appeals.

I still don't have any idea why you keep bringing up a runner missing a base.

[Padgoi]

Re: You make the call!

There is no way the runner is out. If the runner would be out, every single outfielder trying to double off a runner at first would just throw the ball into the stands.

[braves_94]

Re: You make the call!

I still don't have any idea why you keep bringing up a runner missing a base.

I WAS SIMPLY STATING WHY A PREVIOUS MENTIONED RULE IN THIS THREAD HAD NO EFFECT ON THE RULING OF THE PLAY. AND AS FAR AS A MISSED BASE, YES IT'S CONSIDERED TO BE A MISSED BASE IF THE RUNNER DOESN'T TOUCH FIRST BEFORE ADVANCING ON A POP FLY IF HE WAS OFF THE BAG AT TIME OF THE CATCH.

Does that answer your question?

[tessl]

Re: You make the call!

Position of the runner is irrelevant since he is technically on first base regardless of where he physically stands due to leaving early.

Once the ball was thrown out of play before he had a fair chance to retreat to first he gets two bases from the base he owns which at the time is first base.

I'd like to see where you get that from. This is what I'm basing my decision on.

g) Two bases when, with no spectators on the playing field, a thrown ball goes into the stands, or into a bench (whether or not the ball rebounds into the field), or over or under or through a field fence, or on a slanting part of the screen above the backstop, or remains in the meshes of a wire screen protecting spectators. The ball is dead. When such wild throw is the first play by an infielder, the umpire, in awarding such bases, shall be governed by the position of the runners at the time the ball was pitched; in all other cases the umpire shall be governed by the position of the runners at the time the wild throw was made;
APPROVED RULING: If all runners, including the batter-runner, have advanced at least one base when an infielder makes a wild throw on the first play after the pitch, the award shall be governed by the position of the runners when the wild throw was made.

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/official_info/official_rules/runner_7.jsp

What am I missing?

[kehlis]

Re: You make the call!

I'd like to see where you get that from. This is what I'm basing my decision on.

g) Two bases when, with no spectators on the playing field, a thrown ball goes into the stands, or into a bench (whether or not the ball rebounds into the field), or over or under or through a field fence, or on a slanting part of the screen above the backstop, or remains in the meshes of a wire screen protecting spectators. The ball is dead. When such wild throw is the first play by an infielder, the umpire, in awarding such bases, shall be governed by the position of the runners at the time the ball was pitched; in all other cases the umpire shall be governed by the position of the runners at the time the wild throw was made;
APPROVED RULING: If all runners, including the batter-runner, have advanced at least one base when an infielder makes a wild throw on the first play after the pitch, the award shall be governed by the position of the runners when the wild throw was made.

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/official_info/official_rules/runner_7.jsp

What am I missing?

You're missing that the runner never advanced.

He ran to third early and thus is still on first regardless of where he physically is.

In order to "advance" you have to reach legally.

[Heroesandvillains]

Re: You make the call!

I'd like to see where you get that from. This is what I'm basing my decision on.

g) Two bases when, with no spectators on the playing field, a thrown ball goes into the stands, or into a bench (whether or not the ball rebounds into the field), or over or under or through a field fence, or on a slanting part of the screen above the backstop, or remains in the meshes of a wire screen protecting spectators. The ball is dead. When such wild throw is the first play by an infielder, the umpire, in awarding such bases, shall be governed by the position of the runners at the time the ball was pitched; in all other cases the umpire shall be governed by the position of the runners at the time the wild throw was made;
APPROVED RULING: If all runners, including the batter-runner, have advanced at least one base when an infielder makes a wild throw on the first play after the pitch, the award shall be governed by the position of the runners when the wild throw was made.

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/official_info/official_rules/runner_7.jsp

What am I missing?

The baserunner never owned second base in this scenario.

I can't believe over 4 pages over discussion has happened here and people still aren't understanding that part.

[kehlis]

Re: You make the call!

The baserunner never owned second base in this scenario.



I can't believe over 4 pages over discussion has happened here and people still aren't understanding that part.

Eh, someone could ask how to score a groundout to second and it would incite discussion.

I love a good rules question so I'm all for discussion but I have no idea how some of the things were ever brought into this discussion lol.

[ManiacMatt1782]

Re: You make the call!

I WAS SIMPLY STATING WHY A PREVIOUS MENTIONED RULE IN THIS THREAD HAD NO EFFECT ON THE RULING OF THE PLAY. AND AS FAR AS A MISSED BASE, YES IT'S CONSIDERED TO BE A MISSED BASE IF THE RUNNER DOESN'T TOUCH FIRST BEFORE ADVANCING ON A POP FLY IF HE WAS OFF THE BAG AT TIME OF THE CATCH.

Does that answer your question?

And yet your own post regarding flyballs tells you exactly why. Also on a flyball, if you pass 2nd, and go on to tird, but a catch is made, you may return to 1st but you must touch 2nd on your way back, in the event of a flyball out you may return and touch the base under a dead ball.

[tessl]

Re: You make the call!

The baserunner never owned second base in this scenario.

I can't believe over 4 pages over discussion has happened here and people still aren't understanding that part.

I misread the op and didn't realize the batter was out.

[Mrmagoo]

Re: You make the call!

I'm still trying to find the damn popcorn...

[fullmetal2405]

Re: You make the call!

I WAS SIMPLY STATING WHY A PREVIOUS MENTIONED RULE IN THIS THREAD HAD NO EFFECT ON THE RULING OF THE PLAY. AND AS FAR AS A MISSED BASE, YES IT'S CONSIDERED TO BE A MISSED BASE IF THE RUNNER DOESN'T TOUCH FIRST BEFORE ADVANCING ON A POP FLY IF HE WAS OFF THE BAG AT TIME OF THE CATCH.

Does that answer your question?

Not a missed base. The runner legally owned first. you can't "miss" a base you already own. A missed base is just that. MISSED. As in the runner generally has to physically miss the bag while rounding it.

There were exactly zero missed bases in this play. Batter out - fly out. Runner awarded third - two bases on ball out of play (again, the runner legally owned first and he is awarded two bases from the base legally owned at the time the pitch was thrown). In real life he would be required to go back to first while the ball is dead, stepping on second along the way, then returning to third, again stepping on second on the way. Should he not step on second either going from third to first or vice versa, THAT is a missed base and the fielding team can appeal and get the runner out. In the context of The Show, that running back and forth would not happen. Therefore no missed bases. Runner should have been awarded third.

[Godgers12]

Re: You make the call!

Something strange happened in my game last night. Rangers were trying to bunt a player over to 3rd, Leonys Martin was at the plate, he squares around as if to bunt, I threw a changeup low, and he pulls the bat back as he's in the process of pulling it back, the pitch hits him in the arm. However, instead of being awarded 1st on a HBP, the play is ruled a foul, next pitch I struck him out.

So, why wasn't it a HBP, is there some rule I'm overlooking, or a glitch within the game? Made me scratch my head a bit.