Directional Hitting Guide

[nunogomes]

Re: Directional Hitting Guide

The only thing that i never got was understanding how people recognize pitches by looking at the pitcher motion or the pitcher´s hand. I just can´t. I don´t know if with a 4K TV and PS4 Pro i would be able to, but i highly doubt it.

I can only recognize the pitch whe it´s midway distance to me. And when i say recognize i mean, i can most of the times recognize a curveball or fastball but only by the time the ball reaches that midway point between me and the pitcher...

[ruxpinke]

Re: Directional Hitting Guide

The only thing that i never got was understanding how people recognize pitches by looking at the pitcher motion or the pitcher´s hand. I just can´t. I don´t know if with a 4K TV and PS4 Pro i would be able to, but i highly doubt it.

I can only recognize the pitch whe it´s midway distance to me. And when i say recognize i mean, i can most of the times recognize a curveball or fastball but only by the time the ball reaches that midway point between me and the pitcher...

Its more about trying to pick the ball up the second it leaves the hand, sometimes you can get a feel right away for where its headed. It sounds weird but it works. Try going to batting practice, dont swing at all. Just try to focus on the pitchers hand as soon as you can see it, then the ball as soon as it comes out. If you do it enough you should start to notice some things that will help you.

[Glenn33]

Re: Directional Hitting Guide

This thread convinced me to give Directional hitting a try. I really like it. Thank you.

Sent from my VS990 using Operation Sports mobile app

[nunogomes]

Re: Directional Hitting Guide

Its more about trying to pick the ball up the second it leaves the hand, sometimes you can get a feel right away for where its headed. It sounds weird but it works. Try going to batting practice, dont swing at all. Just try to focus on the pitchers hand as soon as you can see it, then the ball as soon as it comes out. If you do it enough you should start to notice some things that will help you.

Seems like worth a try definitely. I tried to do it but not in practice mode, i tried in game and what i found was that if i focused on the hand of the pitcher, by the time i moved my eyes to plate the ball was past me!

Thanks!

[engrishbwudd]

Re: Directional Hitting Guide

Threads like this are why I keep coming back to this site. Great stuff, man.

[ruxpinke]

Re: Directional Hitting Guide

WW, took your advice and bumped up solid hits slider, went up to 6 for now. Smallest of sample size as I played one game, but the bat just felt more alive.

I guess i was worried Id start hitting everything (like pitches on the black) with it bumped up. As frustrating as it gets, i like fouling back the pitch i should hit sometimes, that's baseball. I did feel it was happening a bit too often on default, for my liking.

Going to roll with solid contact at 6 for 20-30 games on AS. I was on vet but i was having to tinker too much with the pitching sliders to get balls and strikes right, imo. Working with Armors set on AS now, with the only change being solid hits up to 6.

Thanks again for the input

[TheWarmWind]

Re: Directional Hitting Guide

Seems like worth a try definitely. I tried to do it but not in practice mode, i tried in game and what i found was that if i focused on the hand of the pitcher, by the time i moved my eyes to plate the ball was past me!

Thanks!

Yeah definitely sounds like you could use some batting practice. Pick a pitcher who you have particular trouble with and just concentrate on seeing the ball without the pressure of a game situation. If you have the time, study a few pitchers, and make sure to throw a sidearmer in there as well if you want the full training regime. I'm not going to talk to much more on discipline and pitch recognition in this thread though since I want to try and keep things specific to directional.

[nunogomes]

Re: Directional Hitting Guide

Yeah definitely sounds like you could use some batting practice. Pick a pitcher who you have particular trouble with and just concentrate on seeing the ball without the pressure of a game situation. If you have the time, study a few pitchers, and make sure to throw a sidearmer in there as well if you want the full training regime. I'm not going to talk to much more on discipline and pitch recognition in this thread though since I want to try and keep things specific to directional.

I will definitely try it for sure. Just for clarificatin purposes, i do not have a problem in recognizing strikes vs balls. Im in the top 5 of the league in walks and im the 3rd least striked out in the league, so discipline is not an issue. Im just trying to identifying the pitch by looking at the pitcher delivery and hand.

Now, back to directional! I learned from Armor and Sword on his sliders thread that we are supposed to hold the left stick through the swing? Don´t know why but i was sure that i just needed to press once, see the blue arrow, and done: influence was on! I guess i was wrong on that one...

[TheWarmWind]

Re: Directional Hitting Guide

Now, back to directional! I learned from Armor and Sword on his sliders thread that we are supposed to hold the left stick through the swing? Don´t know why but i was sure that i just needed to press once, see the blue arrow, and done: influence was on! I guess i was wrong on that one...

Yes, Armor and Sword is correct, you have to hold the stick through the swing. I'll make a post on how to hold the controller, after my post on scouting and adjusting. I swear I'll be done this thread one day.

[cripes]

Re: Directional Hitting Guide

I get that. You might be right. All I can tell you is that I've tried it your way and have overall gotten worse results.

It does make sense that it would be worse when you think about it. Your asking your player to change his swing as the ball is coming at him. If, say, you were set up for a pull and you notice the pitch is on the outside and you switch to a push, you're asking your player to drop his shoulders and adjust his swing on the fly.

Could just be a placebo effect, but even on swings where I was overly indecisive before the pitch was released I've noticed lower averages and weaker overall contact.

If you feel that reacting and adjusting is better for you, you might want to consider a switch to zone. While both interfaces have both elements, zone is a little more reliant on mechanical skill and reactions whereas Directional is a little more like the chess game.

It would make sense if you were holding pull then as the pitch was coming in switched to push and made weak contact. But A LOT of hitters in the major leagues do not try to push or pull a pitch before it is thrown, that is crazy. Exceptions being trying to beat a shift, move a runner or in say a 2-0 count sitting on a fastball middle in etc...

I have never had great luck with zone on this because I like holding up to try and hit the ball in the air opposed to trying to hit a ball high in the zone. I would think the best way would be to maybe do a full reward for selecting pull pre-pitch and maybe once the ball is released if you pick you get maybe 50% reward and selecting wrong or switching from pull-push gets a penalty.

Edited to add: This wasn't meant as an attack toward you, more to the mechanics of the "directional" style in the game. This thread was the driving force behind me switching from zone to directional and your guide is EXTREMELY helpful. Cheers.

[TheWarmWind]

Re: Directional Hitting Guide

Scouting, Adjusting to Pitchers and Slumps

Scouting

I know I've said it before but the post I made about Player archetypes is a starting point. It's up to you to figure out what works, even if it goes completely against the archetype. I'm going to post images of a couple young players on my team, the archetypes they fall under and how I plan to adjust if they start to struggle. Keep in mind that this is from a carry over from 14, so attributes are a little inflated compared to the modern roster.

MLB(R) The Show(TM) 17 Ken Pinckney.jpg

First up is Ken Pinckney. He definitely fits the Power Hitter profile, especially when facing right handed pitching. His card says he's a balanced hitter, but that hot cold chart plus my on field experience confirm that he wants to pull the ball. This is where he is getting the most solid contact vs righties, and as we know from previous posts we want to maximize that solid contact.

However, when we look at his left handed stats and zones, we see a possible push hitter. His power has dropped significantly, ruining a lot of the potential benefit of a pull swing, and his contact is actually higher. He still has some pop, but it's what I would call itinerant. Remember in most cases you want to enhance your players strengths. Right now I play a balanced approach at the plate vs lefties, but if he struggles the next step is to do a more push focused approach, and also add in some Drive swings.

MLB(R) The Show(TM) 17 Jeremy Funk.jpg

Now there is Jeremy Funk, a man who I can only assume has a cousin named Jeremy Noise. This guy personifies the leadoff/speedy batter archetype. His hitter tendency claims he's a push hitter, and it's true through most of spring training and even to begin the year push hitting was his bread and butter. Then he started to struggle, especially vs righties, hitting a lot of easy popouts to left field even on ideal swings. Adding some pull swings when ahead helped a little, but the real problem was his vision. He was struggling to square up the ball, and his vision attribute is far from all-star quality. Even though I was using downward influence already with him in late counts, I started adding it earlier, and sure enough he seems to be righting the ship. He has the speed to be able to rely on a Drive swing, so I can stick with this strategy even after his bat comes alive again.

Fast Adjustments vs Slow Adjustments

There are two types of adjustments you want to make.

One is where you adjust to a pitcher. My strategies up until now will help you overall, but won't help you in that one game where the pitcher is just humiliating your team. If you need to adjust to a particular pitcher it needs to happen ASAP. These adjustments are temporary and should be thrown away as soon as the pitcher changes.

Pitchers with nasty sinking pitches that keep pounding the bottom of the strike zone? I lick my chops when they appear now, because that's when I introduce my scoop swing (upwards influence).

Pitcher got a deceptive combo that is keeping your players off balance and producing a ton of pop/flyouts? Try doing a drive swing (downward influence) more often to try and increase solid contact while also making it easier to check swing to try and and force a few more baserunners.

Just can't catch up to that fireballer? Throw a few more push swings in to give yourself that extra fraction of a second timing window. A downward influence wouldn't hurt either if you're struggling to make contact.

Sometimes you just have to go full bore and do a pull/scoop hybrid though. Desperate times do call for desperate measures.

Meanwhile adjusting to slumps should happen slowly.

Slumps will happen to all of your players, it's as inevitable as death and taxes. The key is to recognize the difference between your average slump and one that calls for an adjustment in batting approach. Generally, you're looking for patterns that last for more than two weeks, though I usually wait at least three.

Things to look for: Consistently weak contact. Awkward looking swings. An increase in swings and misses. Month long power drought (power hitters only).

Things that are not a Slump: Consistent bad luck. If they are hitting the ball hard they are not slumping, just unlucky. Decreasing average with an increasing walk rate. One bad game (no matter how awful it was).

How much you want to stick with your changes depends on the batter. If they are a pull hitting power hitter, odds are you want to go back to a standard approach once they get out of their funk. However, a more balanced hitter may want to keep the changes you've made. Like I said before, it's a good idea to stick with what works.

[rjackson]

Re: Directional Hitting Guide

It would make sense if you were holding pull then as the pitch was coming in switched to push and made weak contact. But A LOT of hitters in the major leagues do not try to push or pull a pitch before it is thrown, that is crazy. Exceptions being trying to beat a shift, move a runner or in say a 2-0 count sitting on a fastball middle in etc...

I have never had great luck with zone on this because I like holding up to try and hit the ball in the air opposed to trying to hit a ball high in the zone. I would think the best way would be to maybe do a full reward for selecting pull pre-pitch and maybe once the ball is released if you pick you get maybe 50% reward and selecting wrong or switching from pull-push gets a penalty.

I feel like you are getting into the guess pitch mechanic now.


I tend to work the count and look for good pitches to hit, specifically those that catch a lot of the plate and good height (deep pitches if you look at the batter analysis screen). I might guess fastball if I'm ahead. I don't contact swing unless I've got a hitter prone to striking out at the plate. I don't power swing without someone having decent pop and getting a guess pitch bonus (I use classic guess pitch to minimize bonuses). I don't influence unless I'm trying to do something specific like hit to the right side and hit on the ground during a hit and run.


I think OP is right that influence affects ratings a bit like choking up on the bat for better bat control (vision) at the expense of power. I also feel that our timing compared to the pitch location affects how well the hitter goes with the pitch and I think that is what you mean. I do that 95% of the time. Each hitter has their own tendencies as well. So a pull hitter already has an earlier timing window and adding a pull influence might be putting us too far down the line, sometimes. There are exceptions like down 0-2 with a hitter that K's a lot and runner on third with less than 2 outs (time for contact swings).


Situation and history plays a part as I just alluded. Imagine a runner on 1st with 0 outs. Think it through...The 1B holds the runner which opens a hole on the right side, yet the pitcher wants a grounder and chance at a double play. So, with your right-handed batter, expect ground ball inducing pitches but not outside. He doesn't want you exploiting the hole. I'll guess pitch down and in (hitter looking for a pitch in his location) and will power swing with scoop and possibly pull if I get it. That's likely where he wants to be as we figured out. This increases my odds at a favorable result. Once I've been caught doing it one AB, history means now I'll start getting high and outside pitches the next time it comes up! Or like OP has mentioned, scoop if they live low in the zone.


Thinking like this is what has improved my results the most. Regardless of what happens, I consider good timing on a good pitch to hit to be a successful AB (or running up a pitch count otherwise when not getting a good pitch).


Hope this helps someone like Gagnon, maybe. You'll get more doubles in the alleys this way. It still feels sweet to recognize a hanging curve and give it the old orange crush.

[TheWarmWind]

Re: Directional Hitting Guide

Edited to add: This wasn't meant as an attack toward you, more to the mechanics of the "directional" style in the game. This thread was the driving force behind me switching from zone to directional and your guide is EXTREMELY helpful. Cheers.

Hey man I don't mind a little discourse, especially if it helps unravel the mysteries of Directional hitting (and as long as it doesn't get nasty). I appreciate the input.

If it's true that you can choose as the pitch comes in I want people reading this thread to know. Heck I want to know. Just because I haven't had success doing that doesn't make my word gospel.

Therefore, I encourage posts like yours.

[TheWarmWind]

Re: Directional Hitting Guide

Yeah, I should probably say at some point that I don't use guess pitch.

Man it's awesome the number of options available to the player. No wonder we need the forums to suss it all out.

Edit: By the way if someone wants to do a write-up on guess pitch and how to integrate in with the Directional hitting strategy and post it in this thread that would be great. I don't personally use guess pitch because I find it usually just ends up messing my timing up since I'm jumping all over my pitch when I get it as opposed to waiting and watching.

[rjackson]

Re: Directional Hitting Guide

I use classic guess pitch and like I said, not that often. It adds a bit to the hitter/pitcher duel but I thought the other guess pitch options added too much bonuses. In real life and in the game, you know a certain pitch is coming and can afford to sit on it. Classic guess pitch gives the smallest bonuses so more often than not, it is like that hitter that got what he was looking for and fouled it straight back (just missed it). For me, I get excited and speed up the bat so I foul it off. But, when I remember to sit on it and do get that result...I feel like Kirk Gibson when he knew the Eck was throwing that slider. Sometimes I end up feeling more like Miggy when it was a fastball and I was sure it would be a slider (against Romo I think?). It just adds to the game. But yeah, 95% of the time is looking for a pitch deep in the zone.