Video of pinpoint accurate meter pitching with Carlos Marmol

[Russell_SCEA]

Re: Video of pinpoint accurate meter pitching with Carlos Marmol

I just don't like pitching from the outfield cam, I'm sure it's a bit harder. However, I also think it's just something I would get used to over time and in the long run, I'll be back to pitching as good as I usually do. I made the topic because just about no one believed my claims in the other topic and to hopefully get SCEA to re-tune the meter or create a new pitching interface for next year.




I play with the ball marker on because (1) I SHOULD be able to play with it on; it's basically equal to real life where a pitcher knows exactly where he wants to throw the pitch whether a catcher sets his mitt there as a marker for the pitcher or not, and (2) you will learn to exactly where to point the left stick for that pitch on the corner with enough practice, I did that in 06, and it just doesn't change how well you can pitch in the long run.




I don't really think I'm THAT great at the meter. Everyone complained how easy the MVP meter was, and in my opinion, this game's meter is about the same difficulty; it was much easier to spot breaking balls in MVP though. How would lowering my pitchers' control attributes help, Marmol probably has some of the lowest attributes in the game and it's still much too easy.

I feel that where I set velocity is how a pitcher throws his normal pitch as the speed of the fastball at that point seems to represent the pitcher's average fastball speed in real life. I use more velocity when I'm going for the K, reaching back for some extra velocity.

Nice analysis on the pitching locations, but I should not be able to throw accurately to the corners of the plate with a pitcher with no control. Marmol hit within 3 inches quite a few times as you noted, he should be able to do that like once an outing at best. I did throw some full velocity pitches but they did all get put into play, but they were thrown pretty accurate if you check the video.

And, a lot of times when Marmol did miss, he missed on the corner. At the 2:02 point that I marked, and one other time I remember aiming high and out, and he threw it low and out. He only missed like once over the plate, that is what I find most troubling. The misses don't at all seem realistic to me.

I'm pretty sure you are the exception and not the rule however I'll show this thread to B ma when he gets back

[Phoenixmgs]

Re: Video of pinpoint accurate meter pitching with Carlos Marmol

In this game Marmol ranks in the bottom 20% on fastball control. If you feel he has "no control" perhaps you should put him in the bottom 5%. To do this change his attribute to 37-42, wherever you want. If you want him in the bottom 1% change it to 36 or less.

I'll admit I'm not all that familiar with Marmol, I mainly follow American League/Angel games. What does this guy do, just rear back and throw? If that's the case how can the game simulate this because it requires the user to aim?

I really don't feel attribute changing will help that much, his attributes are already pretty low. Pitchers can throw accurate fastballs just as long as their confidence is high enough to have a sweet spot on the meter, low pitch confidence in the pitch makes just about no difference in accuracy either. Confidence is merely there to tell you how likely it is for the CPU to crush the pitch. Marmol pretty much has no control over his fastball. He throws his slider to get strikes and strikeouts. He mixes in the fastball to give the hitter something different to look at and to hopefully get a free strike since he can't throw it for strikes. I don't know how the game could simulate Marmol pitching since you should not have much control at all over his fastball. His slider is more accurate.

[Phoenixmgs]

Re: Video of pinpoint accurate meter pitching with Carlos Marmol

What difficulty are you playing on for pitching?

I was on Legend difficulty. You can see in the beginning of the video, and I had the pitcher consistency slider zeroed out.

[Dreifort]

Re: Video of pinpoint accurate meter pitching with Carlos Marmol

Using Clayton Kershaw last night in pitching practice, it was nearly impossible to hit the bottom left corner of the strike zone (Kershaw is a lefty).

Out of the 20 pitches, I would say I would be lucky to even hit the bottom left corner once....(and that is even when hitting the meter in the correct spots).

[phant030]

Re: Video of pinpoint accurate meter pitching with Carlos Marmol

So Marmol in weak in control, perfect meter should mean he throws this pitch the best his attruibutes and confidence allows. However, the pitch is more accurate than you think it should be (With every pitcher i assume being that Marmol is at the bottom). So, is this really a meter issue? Accuracy Attribute Issue? How inaccurate is defined in the game?

Do u think he should be more wild on misses even w/ perfect meter? Wouldnt that make it impossible to pitch with anyone but the greats? It would seem as if the user had no input at all. Just throw and hope. So results should a perfect meter yield?

In my opinion, you weren't trying to paint the corners so can we really 'question" his accuray? (how about that for a test. 2player, paint the corners) And being that you were 'pitching' to contact, and they were hitting into outs..his confidence rose. Also, he was fresh, not tired.

Last, it seems that pitching is just too easy for u. If you can change camera, turn off ball marker, and zone vibrations...its just too easy for u. Yet you say your not that good at the meter...lol. To each his own i guess.

[Phoenixmgs]

Re: Video of pinpoint accurate meter pitching with Carlos Marmol

So Marmol in weak in control, perfect meter should mean he throws this pitch the best his attruibutes and confidence allows. However, the pitch is more accurate than you think it should be (With every pitcher i assume being that Marmol is at the bottom). So, is this really a meter issue? Accuracy Attribute Issue? How inaccurate is defined in the game?

Do u think he should be more wild on misses even w/ perfect meter? Wouldnt that make it impossible to pitch with anyone but the greats? It would seem as if the user had no input at all. Just throw and hope. So results should a perfect meter yield?

In my opinion, you weren't trying to paint the corners so can we really 'question" his accuray? (how about that for a test. 2player, paint the corners) And being that you were 'pitching' to contact, and they were hitting into outs..his confidence rose. Also, he was fresh, not tired.

Last, it seems that pitching is just too easy for u. If you can change camera, turn off ball marker, and zone vibrations...its just too easy for u. Yet you say your not that good at the meter...lol. To each his own i guess.

I think hitting the sweet spot should result in maybe like a 5 point bonus in accuracy attributes. Like if someone's control is 70. Then, hitting the meter should result in like 75 accuracy. I think the meter is far too much based of user skill.

In 06, I pitched with all aids off, and I just got used of where to point the left stick to point the corners. Turning off aids doesn't making pitching more difficult in the long run.

[Two Seamer]

Re: Video of pinpoint accurate meter pitching with Carlos Marmol

If one doesn't want to have much control over the execution of pitches, Classic is the way to go. That's what it's designed for. Pitch execution is determined almost exclusively by the character's ratings.

If one does want to influence the execution of pitches, Meter is the way to go. Meter determines the release point of the pitch. Because the game does not randomize other pitching mechanics, release point alone determines precision. Master your release point timing and you'll almost always be locate pitches effectively -- just like you would in real life.

This can seem unrealistic because it is so difficult for pitchers to actually consistently master their mechanics and release points in real life. But this is not a malfunction of the meter system. The meter is working as it was designed to and is very effective in -- terms of realistic simulation -- for the majority of its users.

In short, the meter does exactly what it is supposed to do, exactly how it was planned to.

You don't like what it does.

/thread

Maybe start a new one in which to flesh out your idea for a new pitching system next year. More options can't hurt.

It seems like you'd most enjoy a system with greater room for error: additional variables for timing and mechanics (truer to real life) over which the player has control.

[kehlis]

Re: Video of pinpoint accurate meter pitching with Carlos Marmol

I play with the ball marker on because (1) I SHOULD be able to play with it on; it's basically equal to real life where a pitcher knows exactly where he wants to throw the pitch whether a catcher sets his mitt there as a marker for the pitcher or not, and (2) you will learn to exactly where to point the left stick for that pitch on the corner with enough practice, I did that in 06, and it just doesn't change how well you can pitch in the long run.

Not really.

A pitcher has their target, yes, but they have no way of using a starting point like you do when you use the cursor. With the cursor, you have the exact starting point you are looking for on every pitch. Even pitchers who have great control don't have that luxury.

A pitchers control relies heavily on the mechanics of his delivery.

Without the cursor, you still have your target the catcher gives you, you move the left stick appropriately but the results are based more on your instincts and mechanics.

I'm not telling you you are wrong (it's nothing more than opinion either way) but if you are having the issue, why not try it?

[Phoenixmgs]

Re: Video of pinpoint accurate meter pitching with Carlos Marmol

If one doesn't want to have much control over the execution of pitches, Classic is the way to go. That's what it's designed for. Pitch execution is determined almost exclusively by the character's ratings.

If one does want to influence the execution of pitches, Meter is the way to go. Meter determines the release point of the pitch. Because the game does not randomize other pitching mechanics, release point alone determines precision. Master your release point timing and you'll almost always be locate pitches effectively -- just like you would in real life.

This can seem unrealistic because it is so difficult for pitchers to actually consistently master their mechanics and release points in real life. But this is not a malfunction of the meter system. The meter is working as it was designed to and is very effective in -- terms of realistic simulation -- for the majority of its users.

In short, the meter does exactly what it is supposed to do, exactly how it was planned to.

You don't like what it does.

/thread

Maybe start a new one in which to flesh out your idea for a new pitching system next year. More options can't hurt.

It seems like you'd most enjoy a system with greater room for error: additional variables for timing and mechanics (truer to real life) over which the player has control.

I do want to influence the execution of my pitcher's pitches. I don't see a reason why the pitching system can't be similar to the hitting system. The zone hitting has a good balance of user skill and batter attributes, why not the pitching system? The meter might not have any malfunction, and I probably shouldn't have used the word "Broken" in the other topic. I just really want an interactive pitching system that allows for REALISTIC pitching results. I guess I'll make a topic about my idea for a new pitching system that, I think, would work well. I posted it earlier in this thread:

Possibly do a pitching interface akin to hot shots golf where it's basically the same meter system but the meter itself is invisible. You would set velocity by the leg kick and then press X at the pitch's release point to set accuracy. It would go completely off visual cues by looking at the pitcher's animation. Since you wouldn't be able to see the sweet spot, it would pitch much more realistically.

Not really.

A pitcher has their target, yes, but they have no way of using a starting point like you do when you use the cursor. With the cursor, you have the exact starting point you are looking for on every pitch. Even pitchers who have great control don't have that luxury.

A pitchers control relies heavily on the mechanics of his delivery.

Without the cursor, you still have your target the catcher gives you, you move the left stick appropriately but the results are based more on your instincts and mechanics.

I'm not telling you you are wrong (it's nothing more than opinion either way) but if you are having the issue, why not try it?

I never pitched in organized baseball, but I play several sports. And, whether it's dart throwing, bowling, basketball, etc., you have in your mind the exact spot you want the ball, dart, or whatever to go.

I did the absolutely no aids pitching in 06, and I just got to learn over time where to move the left stick for pitches right on the corners. In the long run, taking aids off doesn't lower your pitching ability.

[Two Seamer]

Re: Video of pinpoint accurate meter pitching with Carlos Marmol

Possibly do a pitching interface akin to hot shots golf where it's basically the same meter system but the meter itself is invisible. You would set velocity by the leg kick and then press X at the pitch's release point to set accuracy. It would go completely off visual cues by looking at the pitcher's animation. Since you wouldn't be able to see the sweet spot, it would pitch much more realistically.

I'm game. Because I think it works so well for so many, I don't think the Meter system should be replaced. But I think it would be excellent to develop another pitching system that required players to actually perform the windup & delivery -- with room for error.

I'd love to see a thread full of ideas from experienced players & fans on how such a system might best work.

[kehlis]

Re: Video of pinpoint accurate meter pitching with Carlos Marmol

Possibly do a pitching interface akin to hot shots golf where it's basically the same meter system but the meter itself is invisible. You would set velocity by the leg kick and then press X at the pitch's release point to set accuracy. It would go completely off visual cues by looking at the pitcher's animation. Since you wouldn't be able to see the sweet spot, it would pitch much more realistically.

I've never tried it so I am not sure, but to my knowledge, what you describe here is classic pitching.

I'm assuming you've looked into that though, what is the difference?

[Phoenixmgs]

Re: Video of pinpoint accurate meter pitching with Carlos Marmol

I've never tried it so I am not sure, but to my knowledge, what you describe here is classic pitching.

I'm assuming you've looked into that though, what is the difference?

With classic pitching all you can influence is velocity. You have no say over the accuracy of the pitch, which is all determined by the pitcher's attributes.

[kehlis]

Re: Video of pinpoint accurate meter pitching with Carlos Marmol

With classic pitching all you can influence is velocity. You have no say over the accuracy of the pitch, which is all determined by the pitcher's attributes.

Ahh, I see. For some reason I thought the timing of when you hit x not only controlled velocity but accuracy as well...

[afyeamon]

Re: Video of pinpoint accurate meter pitching with Carlos Marmol

Having suffered through Marmol's inconsistencies last season, my memory is that he spots his fastball just fine. The problems are: A) He doesn't throw it enough, and B) His preferred slider, while nearly impossible to hit, is all over the place.

[SA1NT401]

Re: Video of pinpoint accurate meter pitching with Carlos Marmol

HAVE yet TO "MASTER" THE METER....and have no expectation in doing so any time soon.....

I have Good/Bad/Great/awful games all the time....very realistic for me.