Fictional Rosters

[WB1214]

Re: Fictional Rosters

I can do the Braves roster based off of the KG MLB game tomorrow if you? I could probably get it in one day if nothing comes up..

EDIT: Forgot you wanted to wait till you guys had everything straightened out and make the teams more individualized lol

[raleigh mcclure]

Re: Fictional Rosters

I don't know what you guys think, but my thoughts are to wait for Knight to weigh in. Or at least someone that can explain to me how each individual editors' work is compiled into a single roster. I haven't figured out how to do that. Is there some kind of manual or guide on OS here?

Depending on Knight's thoughts about how to proceed, here is how I'm thinking of moving ahead:

TripleTheat is going to get some spreadsheets ready for each team based on some fictional roster generated by (I think) Baseball Mogul. The spreadsheets will be in The Show format.

The problem with starting from looser guidelines is that it will be awfully difficult to coordinate the individual efforts of each editor.

The spreadsheets that TripleThreat creates will already have a diversity of talent and types of players. What the spreadsheets won't offer is a roster tailored to each MLB team as people have suggested. So I think the spreadsheets can be a beginning model. Once someone wants to work on, say, the Colorado Rockies and has the spreadsheet for them, they can take some creative license with the players. For instance, they can emphasize power hitters and sinkerball pitchers in order to account for the thin air. Also, I imagine not all of the names will be in the audio database, in that case, swapping a similar name, e.g. Hispanic names in place of Hispanic names. The spreadsheets will at least get us on the same page as far as how many stellar players we're making and to get enough variety. They'll also provide ratings for all of the back ups and "B" type regulars. Editors can feel free then to take some creative liberties with as many players as they want, so long as the adjustments to the provided ratings are reasonable. But having spreadsheets will cut down on the work per team.

Entering the ratings and editing the players is bound to be time consuming. That's where this project is a bit of an experiment (this is also where Knight's experience is invaluable). With the OSFM rosters about to come out, and some of the enthusiasm for this project bound to wear off a bit, I think it might be a good idea to initially shoot for making a functional roster according to the spreadsheets. At the same time, I wouldn't want the lowered expectations to sap any of the excitement for the project, because that would equally be a motivation killer. I'm just trying to figure out how to keep this fun, keep it simple, and keep it from taking too long.

I'm going to start by getting a roster ready that has all of the MLBPA players removed. I'll have some time early this week and can probably get something done in the next few days.

How does this sound? Any objections? We can also consider leaving the editing much more open ended and we can just see in the end how much people were on the same page. The results might be surprising. On the other hand, I'm afraid that it might just fall apart if it's not more organized.

So, to review, my opinion is that we wait for Knight, TripleThreat will get some spreadsheets ready to share, I'll get a roster ready, we'll figure out how to share the roster, or gather everyone's work into one place when we're done (maybe some of the OSFM guys can lend their expertise here), then we can get a list of available teams up and whoever wants to volunteer can. The spreadsheet ratings can take care of the majority of players, leaving the "fun", "main character" type of players for us to be more creative with.

[WB1214]

Re: Fictional Rosters

I don't know what you guys think, but my thoughts are to wait for Knight to weigh in. Or at least someone that can explain to me how each individual editors' work is compiled into a single roster. I haven't figured out how to do that. Is there some kind of manual or guide on OS here?

The way that we are doing it for the OSFM is by using one of these two methods:

1. One person does a team, such as the Braves, makes them unique, etc. After completing the roster, you place it into the roster vault under a name that you tell the guy with the master roster what it is. He will then EXPORT the fictional players, load the master roster, and IMPORT them in over the players in the master roster.

2. After completing a team, the person that did the roster exports all the players in a folder and sends them to the master roster guy, usually through sendspace, and then the main guy gets the roster and IMPORTs them over the players in the master roster.

P.S. I did the Braves in the OSFM lol

[raleigh mcclure]

Re: Fictional Rosters

The way that we are doing it for the OSFM is by using one of these two methods:

1. One person does a team, such as the Braves, makes them unique, etc. After completing the roster, you place it into the roster vault under a name that you tell the guy with the master roster what it is. He will then EXPORT the fictional players, load the master roster, and IMPORT them in over the players in the master roster.

2. After completing a team, the person that did the roster exports all the players in a folder and sends them to the master roster guy, usually through sendspace, and then the main guy gets the roster and IMPORTs them over the players in the master roster.

P.S. I did the Braves in the OSFM lol

That's interesting. That would mean that I wouldn't have to go to the trouble of creating a generic roster first, since I can just import players over the MLBPA guys as the edited players come in.

Thanks for the explanation. That makes sense. Sounds like it probably takes a bit of time, but nothing outrageous.

What do you think about the rest of the plan? Are you anxious to get started? You could also get some players created, then when we get the spreadsheets from Triplethreat, you can just swap out the "A" type players you've made with the "A" type players on the spreadsheet. Or if you have the entire team done, just compare it to the spreadsheet to see if they are at least close. Does that make sense? We don't have to be strictly loyal to the spreadsheets, but I'm not sure what other methods are available for coordinating our efforts.

And if you get done with the Braves, you can always pick up one of the other NL East teams, since if you know the Braves, you probably know the teams they play against often. Eh? Am I talking you into it?

Once we get going, hopefully within the week, I'll volunteer to take on the AL Central.

The other nice thing, is even if the talent is skewed toward some teams, everyone will be free to tweak the roster on their own and to do a "fantasy draft" to start their franchise and divide up the talent however they want. If we can get a functional fictional roster out without too much time or effort, we can always improve it later, or leave it for people to tweak on their own.

[WB1214]

Re: Fictional Rosters

I can do my best to start on them tomorrow, and could have a Braves roster done by like Tuesday. I'd let you know though. If he has a spreadsheet you want us to go off on by tomorrow that would be cool, if not I'll just try to mix up some of the player types and keep it all balanced.

From doing the roster for the OSFM, pitchers seem to take the longest, and finding a balance for the different types of pitchers would definitely take the longest I would think.

As far as doing the rest of the division, it would be something I could do if I find some more time, just have to see when that time comes

[Bodizzy]

Re: Fictional Rosters

I was going to go ahead with the NL West and try to get some work done, but I have a few questions: 1. What is the CAP limit for a roster set? 2. If every CAP is A potential (correct?), how many CAPs do we need per team, roughly?

I don't want to start on a team and use up a large percentage of the allotted CAPs. Are enough allowed to replace the authentic MLBers? Then again, that creates too many A potential players.

Just to make some headway I am going to begin by doing the faces, names, etc., on all the Minor Leaguers in the division. Maybe make a few CAPs, but only a few 'til we coordinate more. Any suggestions or heads-ups would be appreciated.

[raleigh mcclure]

Re: Fictional Rosters

I was going to go ahead with the NL West and try to get some work done, but I have a few questions: 1. What is the CAP limit for a roster set? 2. If every CAP is A potential (correct?), how many CAPs do we need per team, roughly?

I don't want to start on a team and use up a large percentage of the allotted CAPs. Are enough allowed to replace the authentic MLBers? Then again, that creates too many A potential players.

Just to make some headway I am going to begin by doing the faces, names, etc., on all the Minor Leaguers in the division. Maybe make a few CAPs, but only a few 'til we coordinate more. Any suggestions or heads-ups would be appreciated.

I think this is where Knight's suggestion to replace the MLB players makes sense. The SCEA guys have suggested that keeping the right mix of potential grades is important to keep a balanced league. So Knight's suggestion was to export one generic position player for every potential grade--A through F--and one generic pitcher for every letter grade.

I just loaded the default rosters, went into the "edit player" thing, found an "A" potential generic player, called him "A Player", and then saved him.

I did the same for all the rest. I apologize if you know all of this already, but I'll explain it for anyone that doesn't...

Then I went to the "Roster Control" => "Manage Roster" and exported each of those players I just edited. You can save them under the names "Player A" and "Pitcher A" and so on down the line.

Then, if you're editing the Yankees, you import the generic "A" potential guy under the name "Player A" in place of, say, Derek Jeter. That way, you can replace all of the real MLBPA guys with generic players. I'm still learning this stuff, but I think once you take one of the methods that WB1214 mentioned above, I just grab the players. I don't think I'll encounter any problems with CAP limits.

This does, however, bring up another problem. When editing rosters, we'll be limited to the potential grades that already exist for each team. Or, at least, that was my understanding. Maybe someone would disagree. Is it possible, and necessary, to create a couple of players per team?

My thinking was that we'd just do our best to match players we were editing to potential grade players already on the roster. If you're working from one of the spreadsheets, that would just mean putting the spreadsheet players into the appropriate potential grade. If you're going to start working on players ahead of time, you'd just have to work within the constraints of the extant, or currently available, potential grades.

Does that make sense? Or am I confused here? Maybe that puts undue constraints on player editing. Let me know if you think I'm wrong here.

Also, this hadn't been decided explicitly, but it sounded like most people wanted to limit the players we have to deal with. I think people were OK with only editing twenty-five or thirty guys per team. The roster as is already has fictional players for all of the lower leagues. Don't replace anyone you don't want to. And for all of the real MLBPA players, even guys that are in back-up roles on the MLB squad, if you don't want to deal with them just put in the ratings and names that will come with the spreadsheet, change the skin tone, appearance, and a few of the accessories and call it good.

[TripleThreat1973]

Re: Fictional Rosters

I would think the Brewers would have to have "beer" last names.

Pabst
Miller
Busch
Bud Whyser
Nathan Light (Natty Light)
Coors

[TripleThreat1973]

Re: Fictional Rosters

There was also a lot of great fictitious names from the Ken Griffey Jr. baseball series as well. That'd be a great resource for fake names. I'm all up for helping with this project as well. I agree that we should only rename the major leagues though.

I think giving each team a "theme" or making the names based on things, people, or events based around the city would be great. I think Ken Griffey jr baseball is the template to aim for when naming teams.

It will make the names fun..and since we would stick with themes it would be easier to come up with names as well. It would give it more focus and not leave everything so open ended and make the teams more unique....even though the players are generic.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ken_Griffey,_Jr._Presents_Major_League_Baseball

These are my favorites.

"Imaginary" players in the game are themed with their teammates. Some of the themes include:

* The Atlanta Braves are famous dance DJs, such as Sasha & Digweed. A pitcher for the team is named G. Park, presumably in reference to Atlanta's famed Grant Park. In addition, D. Crime and D. Neon likely refer to Fred "the Crime Dog" McGriff and "Neon" Deion Sanders, respectively.
* The Baltimore Orioles pay tribute to Baltimore native John Waters with B. Divine, P. Flamingo, (Mike Mussina) M. Trasho, and H. Spray, as well as Waters himself standing in for Cal Ripken Jr.
* The Boston Red Sox contain members from the show Cheers. Cliff Claven, Norm Peterson, and Sam Malone are all present. Also included are Boston landmarks (B. Common, M. Harvard) and figures from early American history (J. Adams, J. Hancock, A. Hamilton).
* The California Angels have famous actors on their team (F. Astaire, H. Bogart, J. Wayne).
* The Chicago Cubs has game director Brian Ullrich standing in for Ryne Sandberg. The bullpen has some seemingly generic names, such as P.Drifter, T.Yokel, and R.Steel.
* The Chicago White Sox are former basketball players from St. John's University (M. Sealy, C. Mullin, M. Jackson).
* The Cincinnati Reds are writers (B. Stoker, P. Dick, E. Queen).
* The Cleveland Indians have famous actresses and glamor girls on their team. (A. Margret, A. Hepburn, M. Monroe, G. Garbo).
* The Colorado Rockies contain famous names from horror movies (including G. Romero, B. Lugosi, and T. Savini) .
* The Detroit Tigers are famous Motown singers, (A. Franklin, G. Knight and R. Smokey).
* The Florida Marlins
* The Houston Astros are cartoonists (G. Larson, W. Eisner, S. Lee).
* The Kansas City Royals are based on U.S. presidents (the third batter is D. Ike, whose real-life counterpart is DH Hall of famer George Brett).
* The Los Angeles Dodgers are based on punk rock pioneers from Los Angeles and other areas around California including (Exene Cervenka, John Doe and DJ Bonebrake of X, Poison Ivy and Lux Interior of The Cramps, Jello Biafra and Klaus Flouride of the Dead Kennedys, and Lee Ving of Fear).
* The Milwaukee Brewers have a pitching staff consisting of superhero "secret identities" (P. Parker, K. Kent, B. Wayne), while their position players are fictional secret agents and detectives (J. Rockford, J. Bond).
* The Minnesota Twins are not named for famous sets of twins. The player's names are based on celebrities of various backgrounds, from actor Adam West ([Kent Hrbek]]), guitarist Jimmy Hendrix and pitcher W. Herzog.
* The Montreal Expos are people from the 1980s music scene in Manchester, England, including members of New Order, The Smiths, and Ian Brown of The Stone Roses.
* The New York Mets are based on punk rock pioneers from New York including (Johnny Thunders, Joey Ramone, Tom Verlaine, Jerry Nolan).
* The New York Yankees have the nicknames of famous Yankee greats, such as Bambino and New York boroughs such as S.Island.
* The Oakland Athletics apparently hired more authors with H. Ernest (he replaces Mark McGwire), L. Byron, M. Twain, and L.Tolstoy.
* The Philadelphia Phillies feature a Rocky homage in R. Balboa (Darren Daulton) and A. Creed (Dave Hollins). They also have a Philadelphia landmark (L. Bell) and some of the musicians produced by Phil Spector (D. Love, B. Medley), as well as Spector, himself (John Kruk).
* The Pittsburgh Pirates are named after characters from the soap opera Coronation Street.
* The San Francisco Giants are members of Software Creations, the team that developed the game.
* The San Diego Padres are based on punk rock pioneers from England including (Billy Idol, the members of The Damned, Johnny Rotten, and Sid Vicious).
* The Seattle Mariners have Nintendo of America employees on their team, except Ken Griffey, Jr.
* The St. Louis Cardinals are comedians (H. Moe is actually Bob Tewksbury, O. Hardy is famous shortstop Ozzie Smith).
* The Texas Rangers, appropriately, have a Western theme (their best pitcher, T. Mix, "fills in" for Kevin Brown).
* The Toronto Blue Jays are players from the Wigan Warriors Rugby league team (E. Hanley, M. Offiah, D. Betts).


From Ken Griffey Jr's Winning Run


http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0311393/trivia

I was thinking of this the other day ...

ChiSox = mobsters, real and fictional (movies)
LA = movie stars
SEA = grunge band members
WAS = presidents
MIN = wrestlers (former wrestler as governor)
STL = blues musicians
KC = lots of options, Kings, Negro League stars
BOS = famous patriots
NYY = rich people (Rockefeller, Gates, Trumo, etc)

It can get corny rather quickly.

I'll have the spreadsheet ready by the end of tomorrow. The list includes fictional names, each assigned to a team (same # of players, and at all levels of the organization). Whatever happens after that, happens.

Since each universe starts off with different names, completely different "sets" can be made in 5 minutes. Copy and paste into spreadsheet that already contains the fomrulas (or formula combinations).

[raleigh mcclure]

Re: Fictional Rosters

I'll have the spreadsheet ready by the end of tomorrow. The list includes fictional names, each assigned to a team (same # of players, and at all levels of the organization). Whatever happens after that, happens.

Since each universe starts off with different names, completely different "sets" can be made in 5 minutes. Copy and paste into spreadsheet that already contains the fomrulas (or formula combinations).

TripleThreat,

That's huge. Thanks a bunch for doing this. I'll keep my eye out for the spreadsheets and post a list of available teams on the first page of this thread. After I finish the AL Central, I'll just start taking the unclaimed teams.

[raleigh mcclure]

Re: Fictional Rosters

I just watched the "Tribute to Paste" video on page one of this thread, submitted by EnigmaNemesis. Since it appears that Enigma is a Red Sox fan, and because he first suggested it, whoever does the editing for the Red Sox should make Paste (Carlton Paste? Teddy Paste? Big Papi Paste?) the number three or clean-up hitter, with 60 HR potential, for the Sox.

[BoSoxPujols]

Re: Fictional Rosters

I was thinking of this the other day ...

ChiSox = mobsters, real and fictional (movies)
LA = movie stars
SEA = grunge band members
WAS = presidents
MIN = wrestlers (former wrestler as governor)
STL = blues musicians
KC = lots of options, Kings, Negro League stars
BOS = famous patriots
NYY = rich people (Rockefeller, Gates, Trumo, etc)

It can get corny rather quickly.

I'll have the spreadsheet ready by the end of tomorrow. The list includes fictional names, each assigned to a team (same # of players, and at all levels of the organization). Whatever happens after that, happens.

Since each universe starts off with different names, completely different "sets" can be made in 5 minutes. Copy and paste into spreadsheet that already contains the fomrulas (or formula combinations).

Sounds good to me

I'd rather have the teams have some "individuality" to them even if they are fake players. It will give the naming guys more focus(and save time), less risk of repeat names, and give each team/city some individual character.

I guess I haven't heard on who likes or dislikes the idea as of now. Or what Raleigh thinks since this is his brain child of sorts. IMO that'd be the best and most fun way to do it but not sure what Raleigh thinks.

[TripleThreat1973]

Re: Fictional Rosters

The ratings are easy and IMO very good. I simmer a season so that I could use a combination of Bahnzo's formulas and mine in conjuction with the player's already existing ratings.

What I am working on now ...

Creating realistic "split ratings " based on player types. In other words power hitting lefties generally have the biggest splits, while high contact switch hitters have the least, but I also want to have guys that don't follow the pattern.

I'm also working on pitcher's pitches and have developed a way for pitchers to have good and bad pitches, without it being too systematic or randomized.

The players also have "peak" ratings or potentials, so that won't be an issue.

In the roster the best power hitter is a phyical monster, 6'8 275, but hit 51 HRs and has a general power of 96, so with splits it'll likely look more of 99/90.

I'm coming up with a system that can also assign accessories and different shoe, glove, bat, appearanc types so players can look individual without everyone looking unique.

Looking into things like skin and US born and a way of assigning those so everyone is not a stereotype (all fast guys are black, etc).

I agree on the names without audio. Just select the best fit. I'm not sure if we want to go with the "team theme" or not. But having the classic guys (Paste, Agua, Hendry, etc) will likely be enough "legendary fiction" to suffice.

I'm also making sure that each pitcher's pitch velocities don't follow the same pattern without having a guy throw a 96mph fastball and 68mph change.

I think it will work well, and the guys already in the spreadsheet have diveristy and believability. Most of the power guys are large, but there are some smaller guys with pop. I was glad to see that the fictional database was not just real players with fictional names.

One thing that may need decided is the quality of teams. Some of the worst teams may end up being the best and I don't know if people automatically want NY and BOS to be awesome, and things of that nature.

Dealing with a virus right now, but should be able to upload the complete sheet tonight, with everything (skin, hair, facial hair, accesories, ratings, etc) included. I've done this type of thing before.

I'll also include stances/deliveries with most guys having generic, but still using signatures here and there, but not in a predictable pattern. One thing that bothered me in my RTTS is how many guys used Mussina's delivery. It's so unique that you should see it only once.

[raleigh mcclure]

Re: Fictional Rosters

Sounds good to me

I'd rather have the teams have some "individuality" to them even if they are fake players. It will give the naming guys more focus(and save time), less risk of repeat names, and give each team/city some individual character.

I guess I haven't heard on who likes or dislikes the idea as of now. Or what Raleigh thinks since this is his brain child of sorts. IMO that'd be the best and most fun way to do it but not sure what Raleigh thinks.

BoSox,

Sorry I never responded to your post earlier. I lost it in the shuffle. My thinking on having themed names for all teams is to keep that a matter of preference for people. In order to keep this project simple, so that we can at least get a basic, functional roster done, I don't want to require everyone to develop themed names. Since the rosters that TripleThreat is going to post already have names, I figure it's easier to just have people enter that name if it's in the audio database, or if it's not in the database, enter something similar that is.

I personally like the themed team name idea, but I'm thinking we can wait until the "master roster" is finished, and then those that are interested in doing the themed name thing can do a variation of the basic roster. Once you have ideas for names for all of the players, it won't take that much additional work to enter new names for players. How does that sound?

[raleigh mcclure]

Re: Fictional Rosters

I agree on the names without audio. Just select the best fit. I'm not sure if we want to go with the "team theme" or not. But having the classic guys (Paste, Agua, Hendry, etc) will likely be enough "legendary fiction" to suffice.

This sounds right to me. I would want to encourage making the occasional "Easter egg" name, such as "Paste", in order to keep things interesting. There also might be lots of ideas for naming the league. You've mentioned doing names based on the name of the team. For instance, naming players after president's for the Nationals. BoSox has another good idea with naming players in the fashion of KG Baseball. Once the "master roster" is finished with the basic names, it will be open to do any number of variations that people want to try.

One thing that may need decided is the quality of teams. Some of the worst teams may end up being the best and I don't know if people automatically want NY and BOS to be awesome, and things of that nature.

This is something I've been trying to figure out too. One thing to consider is that when guys go to edit each team, the way it's set up is to replace all of the MLBPA guys but keep the same number of players at each potential grade. So the Yankees are already going to have more highly ranked prospects then the Royals. We can either take steps to rectify that and balance the league, but I'm in favor of following the current ranking of teams. I think Pasta Padre, or someone, posted the list of overall team rankings a little before the game was released. I'm think we should consider following that. If others are in favor of that, I can tweak the rosters at the end to get them at least close to the rankings. Or at least keep the same top 10 teams in the top 10, middle ten teams around the middle 10, and bottom 10 with the bottom 10. Keeping in mind, again, that players are free to manipulate these rosters in any way they want when they get them.

I'm open to objections on this point too. If you want to randomly assign the rosters to teams, I think that could be fine too. In fact, probably easier than it is to try to match the fictional roster to the overall team ranking list. Well, alright, I've talked myself into confusion on this point. What do you, or anyone else, think about assigning rosters?

We can just do it randomly and let people mess with it when they use the roster. Or TripleThreat can try to generally match up what looks like the best rosters with the best historical teams (or the largest market teams). Then I can try and fine tune it a little bit. I guess I don't have much of a preference on this one. Especially since the use of these rosters is so flexible that we're not really forcing anything on anyone just because we happen to do it one way and not another.