It seems to me that starters rarely make it out of the 5th inning. I was thinking of upping stamina by 20 to 30 pts. for each pitcher. Thought this might be a fun discussion to have.
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Re: MLB PP Low pitch counts
I just don't use effort on my pitches. I had Wang go a complete game on 95 pitches and he never tired.
Most of my starters have gone 6+, assuming they pitch well enough to last that long and then get tired.
I also don't see much advantage to using the full effort. I still strike out hitters. The only bad thing is seeing pitchers throw 88. But that's just a number."It may well be that we spectators, who are not divinely gifted as athletes, are the only ones able to truly see, articulate and animate the experience of the gift we are denied. And that those who receive and act out the gift of athletic genius must, perforce, be blind and dumb about it -- and not because blindness and dumbness are the price of the gift, but because they are its essence." - David Foster Wallace
"You'll not find more penny-wise/pound-foolish behavior than in Major League Baseball." - Rob Neyer -
Re: MLB PP Low pitch counts
I feel like if I don't put some extra on my pitches, my pitchers will get shelled worse than they normally do.
I can get my good starters through the sixth, but that's about it.Comment
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Re: MLB PP Low pitch counts
The problem also exists for the CPU. I have only seen Halliday make it over 5 innings, and he was tired at 65 pitches.
So far I upped starters 30 pnts. and CPU now tires around 80 - 100 pitches. As do I. I am still testing it, but I like it for now.Comment
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Re: MLB PP Low pitch counts
After a little more testing, the 30 pts. seem to also even out the sim stats. I will test this more, but I like what I see.Comment
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Re: MLB PP Low pitch counts
I only increase velocity on fastballs and even then not every fastball because the guy will get gased after 60 pitches or so.Goozex
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Re: MLB PP Low pitch counts
Well, the game seems to be designed so that if you throw low-effort pitches most of the time you can go pretty deep into a game. I threw 90+ with the Marlins' Scott Olsen last night and he only has B stamina. Only a couple times did I dial up a pitch but I didn't get into much trouble with him either - 8.1 IP, 2 ER, 9K.
I'm not convinced that the throwing high-effort pitches consistently is a winning strategy either. My gut feeling is that when you mix a few in the AI gets tricked a bit but just throwing them consistently allows an adjustment. Either way, if you do like throwing them then bumping up the stamina across the board is probably a good idea.
I think it's out of whack for a lot of starters anyway since the roster formula seems to have only taken into account innings pitched last year and not whether an injury had impacted them in any way.Comment
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Re: MLB PP Low pitch counts
It's confusing for the CPU.
I saw Halladay get tired after 5 (I think he threw 60 pitches) but then I've seen guys throw 90 pitches against me into the 8th and not get tired.
I'm thinking that their status face has something to do with this as well.
Joba is an E in stamina and after throwing a full inning, he was at full health the next day and his status face (or whatever you call it) has been jumping around during the last few games.
Then, Sanchez and I forget the other pitcher, threw one inning, had the red sad face, and had half their stamina the next day.
I'm gonna keep looking out for this to see if it has a huge affect on stamina."It may well be that we spectators, who are not divinely gifted as athletes, are the only ones able to truly see, articulate and animate the experience of the gift we are denied. And that those who receive and act out the gift of athletic genius must, perforce, be blind and dumb about it -- and not because blindness and dumbness are the price of the gift, but because they are its essence." - David Foster Wallace
"You'll not find more penny-wise/pound-foolish behavior than in Major League Baseball." - Rob NeyerComment
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Re: MLB PP Low pitch counts
It might also depend on the pitcher.
I don't use full effort with Wang and he's given up only one run in 15 innings on the mound. But he also has a 5 rated sinker and it's nasty. Mix that with a 3 slider and 3 split with a plus fastball that hits 91 without even putting effort and he's good to go in this game.
But I've found that if you don't mix your pitches you'll get hit hard. And when you have less pitches to throw and most aren't rated well enough, you'll have a tough time on the mound.
I pitched five strong innings with Mussina in his first start and only gave up one run. His status looked depressed and emotionally drained. Then in the sixth, he got rocked. The hitters finally realized that he didn't have much behind his pitches and they knew how to react to everything he threw. All this and he never showed he was tired. His status just finally caught up to him."It may well be that we spectators, who are not divinely gifted as athletes, are the only ones able to truly see, articulate and animate the experience of the gift we are denied. And that those who receive and act out the gift of athletic genius must, perforce, be blind and dumb about it -- and not because blindness and dumbness are the price of the gift, but because they are its essence." - David Foster Wallace
"You'll not find more penny-wise/pound-foolish behavior than in Major League Baseball." - Rob NeyerComment
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Re: MLB PP Low pitch counts
The status face does in fact have an effect on stamina. I'll take a look around and see if I can find the modifier but basically bouncing magenta is the best, then red, then yellow, then blue, and finally there's one for injured/depressed. Yellow is normal I believe. If you go into practice mode with a pitcher you'll notice that it lets you choose what their status is - try each one and you'll notice velocity and movement is marginally better or worse for each. When guys are blue there's a good chance they're going to get rocked.
Here it is:
Pink = Best Form
Red = Good Form
Yellow = Normal
Blue = Bad Form
Purple = Worst Form
Green = InjuredLast edited by ComfortablyLomb; 08-05-2008, 02:18 PM.Comment
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Re: MLB PP Low pitch counts
Increasing starters 30 pts. seems to have done a great deal of good. CPU starters actually go into the 6th, 7th, and later innings.(I am a very patient hitter) I've seen 70 -100 pitches from starters.Comment
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Re: MLB PP Low pitch counts
Yeah, as I'm playing my season, this is a major source of frustration for me, even moreso than the lack of a bullpen. It's pretty absurd when I can't even get a starter through the 5 innings he would need to qualify for a "win" without getting him absolutely shelled b/c he's exhausted. I will try not using extra effort on pitches, but I doubt that will fully correct the problem.
It's not just the fact that starters get tired that sucks, but how little difference there is between a guy who has "A" stamina vs. an "E" stamina guy. An "E" stamina reliever can probably make it about 2 innings and then gets tired, whereas an "A" starter makes it 4 or 5 innings and then should probably be pulled, what a joke!Comment
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Re: MLB PP Low pitch counts
Half of my starting rotation is on the DL because of this problem as I frequently get the "left game because of elbow pain" trying to stretch a pitcher through 5 so he can qualify for a win. That's a little silly. It also compounds the problem as my rotation order becomes a complete mess with guys coming and going from the DL. I've really redcued my extra effort use as well and still can't get through 5 with the 4th or 5th starter.
I'm going to try the stamina bump up.Comment
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Re: MLB PP Low pitch counts
Actually, the CPU through a complete game against me last night. I'm not sure if it has to do with the difficulty level but I had just raised it to Expert.
But if fairness how often to pitchers go the distance these days? I hear it all the time from broadcasters and so called experts talking about how in modern baseball starting pitchers are only expected to go 6 innings.
And what do you guys mean when you are talking about 'putting extra effort' on pitches?Comment
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