Icon debate..part 17

[HMcCoy]

MVP has me very interested this season, but their are two things that puzzle me.

If you have to swing at WHERE the pitch is, how is that different from icon batting

People bash icons, but in effect you're doing the exact same thing. Ball is low and away, I press low and away. Same thing.

Without a visual representation of the icon, the actual margin for error to make contact is 4x's more forgiving because if a game awards the player contact in an entire zone, its like hitting with one of those humongous plastic to bats we all had as kiddies. You don't actually have to hit the ball, but simply swing the bat in the general area. Its a gameplay crutch, but favored heavily, and for the life of me I can't understand how a hardcore gamer or baseball fan would prefer to dumb down the most difficult feat in sports.

Its been said that an icon system forces you to concentrate on the icons and not the path of the ball, but ANY hardcore ASB guy will tell you that if you watch the cursor instead of the ball you'll strike out every time. To be succesful on a consistent basis, you absolutely MUST pick up the ball out of the pitchers hand. Maybe thats the problem. The icons force new-to-ASB gamers' eyes AWAY from what they SHOULD be paying attention to.

Also, how is shifting the player model to pull or go opposite field in MVP "realistic" but shifting the icon to do the exact same thing is unrealistic.

This isn't a flame post against MVP, personnally I'm more amped for it than ASB, it'll be refreshing to get into something new, but I'm just curious. Can someone debate this without this thread becoming a flamer?

[Heelfan71]

Re: Icon debate..part 17

Cursor never bothered me in ASB, Only thing that concerns me about MVP is that it will be too easy to make contact.

[Heelfan71]

Re: Icon debate..part 17

Cursor never bothered me in ASB, Only thing that concerns me about MVP is that it will be too easy to make contact.

[Heelfan71]

Re: Icon debate..part 17

Cursor never bothered me in ASB, Only thing that concerns me about MVP is that it will be too easy to make contact.

[pfunk]

Re: Icon debate..part 17

i remember when World Series Baseball '95 for Sega Genesis came out when i was in High School, it was considered revolutionary because it had a batting cursor, or icon if you will. I thought it was the best baseball game I had ever played, finally video game baseball was somewhat as difficult as it was in real life. Since then, only two games I have played have been better. WS '96 for Sega Saturn (My roomates and I wasted lots of good studying time playing that game against each other in college) and ASB '04. I am psyched for '05 and I can't understand why anyone would want to play without the icon, might as well stay on Rookie level. Is there an option to use the icon on MVP?

[pfunk]

Re: Icon debate..part 17

i remember when World Series Baseball '95 for Sega Genesis came out when i was in High School, it was considered revolutionary because it had a batting cursor, or icon if you will. I thought it was the best baseball game I had ever played, finally video game baseball was somewhat as difficult as it was in real life. Since then, only two games I have played have been better. WS '96 for Sega Saturn (My roomates and I wasted lots of good studying time playing that game against each other in college) and ASB '04. I am psyched for '05 and I can't understand why anyone would want to play without the icon, might as well stay on Rookie level. Is there an option to use the icon on MVP?

[pfunk]

Re: Icon debate..part 17

i remember when World Series Baseball '95 for Sega Genesis came out when i was in High School, it was considered revolutionary because it had a batting cursor, or icon if you will. I thought it was the best baseball game I had ever played, finally video game baseball was somewhat as difficult as it was in real life. Since then, only two games I have played have been better. WS '96 for Sega Saturn (My roomates and I wasted lots of good studying time playing that game against each other in college) and ASB '04. I am psyched for '05 and I can't understand why anyone would want to play without the icon, might as well stay on Rookie level. Is there an option to use the icon on MVP?

[Rules]

Re: Icon debate..part 17

Icon batting is the only option for me as any other method just becomes way too easy. This is why I am not buying MVP 2004 cause I can see batting becoming too easy after a few games.

[Rules]

Re: Icon debate..part 17

Icon batting is the only option for me as any other method just becomes way too easy. This is why I am not buying MVP 2004 cause I can see batting becoming too easy after a few games.

[Rules]

Re: Icon debate..part 17

Icon batting is the only option for me as any other method just becomes way too easy. This is why I am not buying MVP 2004 cause I can see batting becoming too easy after a few games.

[Metman24]

Re: Icon debate..part 17

While I somewhat agree with your points. I have to say that alot of the issues with cursor batting was the lack of responsiveness of the cursor and the implementation of the system. The 3D cursor in ASB allows for way to much exact control of where the will be hit. The 2D cursor is more realistic, but it still entails an almost "Missile Command" type feeling to hitting.

[Metman24]

Re: Icon debate..part 17

While I somewhat agree with your points. I have to say that alot of the issues with cursor batting was the lack of responsiveness of the cursor and the implementation of the system. The 3D cursor in ASB allows for way to much exact control of where the will be hit. The 2D cursor is more realistic, but it still entails an almost "Missile Command" type feeling to hitting.

[Metman24]

Re: Icon debate..part 17

While I somewhat agree with your points. I have to say that alot of the issues with cursor batting was the lack of responsiveness of the cursor and the implementation of the system. The 3D cursor in ASB allows for way to much exact control of where the will be hit. The 2D cursor is more realistic, but it still entails an almost "Missile Command" type feeling to hitting.

[JRod]

Re: Icon debate..part 17

I don't think it's that close at all. I'm not talking about how cursor batting and zone batting mimic baseball but rather in cursor batting I think there's less flexibity to chase pitches you weren't really expecting. Sometimes with the cursor I'll have it sit somewhere and if the pitch is a strike but not close to where my cursor is it's more difficult than change than in zone-batting.

Cursor system puts most of the technique on the human. Where zone hitting is influenced less by the excact precision of fast fingers but how the CPU determines were you should hit the ball.

Now as for realism that's a debate for another thread.


I also think that there's a better system than just zone or cursor. I don't know what it is. With MVP you might never see someone swing right over the top of a pitch or under it. That's a big problem for zone hitting because the CPU determines where the bat is going to meet the ball. I don't think the answer is WSB First person baseball view. How are you supposed to mimic the movements of a real batter. Let's say you see curveball but it has more bite to it. Real batters can adjust somewhat to it. Sure you might swing right over the top of it but you also can make an adjustment to make contact. This happens during the whole second or less it takes for a ball to cross the plate. I don't know how you capture that in a videogame.

[JRod]

Re: Icon debate..part 17

I don't think it's that close at all. I'm not talking about how cursor batting and zone batting mimic baseball but rather in cursor batting I think there's less flexibity to chase pitches you weren't really expecting. Sometimes with the cursor I'll have it sit somewhere and if the pitch is a strike but not close to where my cursor is it's more difficult than change than in zone-batting.

Cursor system puts most of the technique on the human. Where zone hitting is influenced less by the excact precision of fast fingers but how the CPU determines were you should hit the ball.

Now as for realism that's a debate for another thread.


I also think that there's a better system than just zone or cursor. I don't know what it is. With MVP you might never see someone swing right over the top of a pitch or under it. That's a big problem for zone hitting because the CPU determines where the bat is going to meet the ball. I don't think the answer is WSB First person baseball view. How are you supposed to mimic the movements of a real batter. Let's say you see curveball but it has more bite to it. Real batters can adjust somewhat to it. Sure you might swing right over the top of it but you also can make an adjustment to make contact. This happens during the whole second or less it takes for a ball to cross the plate. I don't know how you capture that in a videogame.