Getting past the frustration and getting a better understanding

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  • ohiost
    Rookie
    • Feb 2003
    • 361

    #31
    Re: Getting past the frustration and getting a better understanding


    "disagree. In ESPN, the strike zone has been fixed this year so that it's the right size. Last year it was too big. But this has been fixed. And most pitches that miss are corner pitches that barely miss outside. In ASB, the reason why walks are difficult other than the pitchers being too accurate is because you don't foul off enough balls to work the pitcher. Using 2D cursor, there are NEVER any fouls down the line (or hits down the line for that matter). The CPU fouls off a lot of balls, but not the user. Thus, you can't really work the count. Walking is more than patience...you have to be able to guard the strike zone by working the count. You can do this in EXPN, not ASB. I like ASB because of its atmosphere, the nice little features that captures baseball, but I am not convinced it is very realistic."

    I have both games and I used to think the exact same thing as you in regards to everything you mentioned. The more time I've spent with ASB, the more I've realized that none of the above is true. I had a bunch of foul balls down the line last nite as well as a couple of hits. I also can work the count. I can't stress enough how much practice and patience this game takes to really appreciate it's brilliance. This year is the first time I've noticed this stuff myself. I thought the exact same way as you until recently. ESPN is a great pick up and play BB game. After cracking the ASB code, however, nothing else compares. Everybody has their preference and I could just not figure out for the longest time what all the hype was about for ASB. I thought it was VERY average at best. Truth be told it is the most frustrating game on the market until you spend enough time with it, and I'm talking a lot of time. I betch you that a lot of people out there will change their tune once they figure it out. The learning curve is just too much for most people. I know because I was one of them.

    ohiost

    Comment

    • jim416
      Banned
      • Feb 2003
      • 10606

      #32
      Re: Getting past the frustration and getting a better understanding

      ohiost,

      Your second paragraph says it. Out of the box I wanted to scream at ASB and swtiched to ESPN. Man, I went back and forth, back and forth. Mainly because I, my opinion, found that the atmosphere in ESPN just didn't get it for me.

      After working with Knight on some tweaks and finally switching to 2d cursor (man it almost took an act of congress to get me to switch to cursor batting), I'm seeing absolutely everything in this game.

      Last night got shut out by Kerry Wood 6-0 and I hit line drives and those deep fly ball outs in Petco. Foul balls, passed balls, surprising errors, they're all there for me.

      I think Knight said it awhile ago. If Acclaim just works on some things this game is a gem.

      Comment

      • jim416
        Banned
        • Feb 2003
        • 10606

        #33
        Re: Getting past the frustration and getting a better understanding

        ohiost,

        Your second paragraph says it. Out of the box I wanted to scream at ASB and swtiched to ESPN. Man, I went back and forth, back and forth. Mainly because I, my opinion, found that the atmosphere in ESPN just didn't get it for me.

        After working with Knight on some tweaks and finally switching to 2d cursor (man it almost took an act of congress to get me to switch to cursor batting), I'm seeing absolutely everything in this game.

        Last night got shut out by Kerry Wood 6-0 and I hit line drives and those deep fly ball outs in Petco. Foul balls, passed balls, surprising errors, they're all there for me.

        I think Knight said it awhile ago. If Acclaim just works on some things this game is a gem.

        Comment

        • jim416
          Banned
          • Feb 2003
          • 10606

          #34
          Re: Getting past the frustration and getting a better understanding

          ohiost,

          Your second paragraph says it. Out of the box I wanted to scream at ASB and swtiched to ESPN. Man, I went back and forth, back and forth. Mainly because I, my opinion, found that the atmosphere in ESPN just didn't get it for me.

          After working with Knight on some tweaks and finally switching to 2d cursor (man it almost took an act of congress to get me to switch to cursor batting), I'm seeing absolutely everything in this game.

          Last night got shut out by Kerry Wood 6-0 and I hit line drives and those deep fly ball outs in Petco. Foul balls, passed balls, surprising errors, they're all there for me.

          I think Knight said it awhile ago. If Acclaim just works on some things this game is a gem.

          Comment

          • ohiost
            Rookie
            • Feb 2003
            • 361

            #35
            Re: Getting past the frustration and getting a better understanding

            jim416,

            I was the same way with cursor batting. Most people, myself included, just don't want to put in the practice time with 2-D that is necessary to succeed at this game. I've said it over and over but I'll say it again: You can't just pick up this game and expect to be a good hitter in a week. Learning curve=steep. Fielding gave me problems as well for a long time, but now I love it. Double plays take timing and are great once you "see the light" so to speak. How about that animation when your shortstop goes deep in the whole and makes the jump throw, outstanding. If you're struggling at hitting remember 3 things.

            1. Be patient, don't go to the plate hacking
            2. Remember the hot zones. I was complaining about not getting good wood on the ball until I started paying attention to my hitters hot zones. You have to make perfect contact in cold zones to have a chance.
            3. Don't always try to put the cursor directly on the ball. If you can move it just inside or outside of the ball it causes you to pull and hit the other way. Most people don't try to do this and this is why the don't see hits down the line. Timing isn't as important as proper sweet spot placement when it comes to hit variety and I don't think most people are aware of this.

            ohiost

            Comment

            • ohiost
              Rookie
              • Feb 2003
              • 361

              #36
              Re: Getting past the frustration and getting a better understanding

              jim416,

              I was the same way with cursor batting. Most people, myself included, just don't want to put in the practice time with 2-D that is necessary to succeed at this game. I've said it over and over but I'll say it again: You can't just pick up this game and expect to be a good hitter in a week. Learning curve=steep. Fielding gave me problems as well for a long time, but now I love it. Double plays take timing and are great once you "see the light" so to speak. How about that animation when your shortstop goes deep in the whole and makes the jump throw, outstanding. If you're struggling at hitting remember 3 things.

              1. Be patient, don't go to the plate hacking
              2. Remember the hot zones. I was complaining about not getting good wood on the ball until I started paying attention to my hitters hot zones. You have to make perfect contact in cold zones to have a chance.
              3. Don't always try to put the cursor directly on the ball. If you can move it just inside or outside of the ball it causes you to pull and hit the other way. Most people don't try to do this and this is why the don't see hits down the line. Timing isn't as important as proper sweet spot placement when it comes to hit variety and I don't think most people are aware of this.

              ohiost

              Comment

              • ohiost
                Rookie
                • Feb 2003
                • 361

                #37
                Re: Getting past the frustration and getting a better understanding

                jim416,

                I was the same way with cursor batting. Most people, myself included, just don't want to put in the practice time with 2-D that is necessary to succeed at this game. I've said it over and over but I'll say it again: You can't just pick up this game and expect to be a good hitter in a week. Learning curve=steep. Fielding gave me problems as well for a long time, but now I love it. Double plays take timing and are great once you "see the light" so to speak. How about that animation when your shortstop goes deep in the whole and makes the jump throw, outstanding. If you're struggling at hitting remember 3 things.

                1. Be patient, don't go to the plate hacking
                2. Remember the hot zones. I was complaining about not getting good wood on the ball until I started paying attention to my hitters hot zones. You have to make perfect contact in cold zones to have a chance.
                3. Don't always try to put the cursor directly on the ball. If you can move it just inside or outside of the ball it causes you to pull and hit the other way. Most people don't try to do this and this is why the don't see hits down the line. Timing isn't as important as proper sweet spot placement when it comes to hit variety and I don't think most people are aware of this.

                ohiost

                Comment

                • bigboi_03
                  Rookie
                  • Mar 2003
                  • 65

                  #38
                  Re: Getting past the frustration and getting a better understanding

                  </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
                  jjoe said:You've got to be kidding. where'd you get this information from? That means the average number of pitches per inning is 9 and the average number of pitches per game is 81. I think it is EXTREMELY rare that a game will end with 81 pitches being thrown on average. In fact if you read this article, you'll see the average number of pitches per game is 285. Divide this number by 2 and then divide it by 27 outs and you get approximately 6 pitches per at bat. REad this: http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp...nguage=printer

                  Keep in mind that everytime a pitcher retires a batter on 1 pitch, he'd have to throw 10 pitches to the next batter to keep up with the average.

                  <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

                  Lol. Think about what you're saying before trying to ridicule me. Unless Randy Johnson pitches every game, you will see a little bit more than 27 batters a game. My info is correct. The average number of pitches per plate appearance IS 3. In fact, EVERY SINGLE PLAYER in the majors last year averaged less than 4 pitches seen per plate appearance.

                  Comment

                  • bigboi_03
                    Rookie
                    • Mar 2003
                    • 65

                    #39
                    Re: Getting past the frustration and getting a better understanding

                    </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
                    jjoe said:You've got to be kidding. where'd you get this information from? That means the average number of pitches per inning is 9 and the average number of pitches per game is 81. I think it is EXTREMELY rare that a game will end with 81 pitches being thrown on average. In fact if you read this article, you'll see the average number of pitches per game is 285. Divide this number by 2 and then divide it by 27 outs and you get approximately 6 pitches per at bat. REad this: http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp...nguage=printer

                    Keep in mind that everytime a pitcher retires a batter on 1 pitch, he'd have to throw 10 pitches to the next batter to keep up with the average.

                    <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

                    Lol. Think about what you're saying before trying to ridicule me. Unless Randy Johnson pitches every game, you will see a little bit more than 27 batters a game. My info is correct. The average number of pitches per plate appearance IS 3. In fact, EVERY SINGLE PLAYER in the majors last year averaged less than 4 pitches seen per plate appearance.

                    Comment

                    • bigboi_03
                      Rookie
                      • Mar 2003
                      • 65

                      #40
                      Re: Getting past the frustration and getting a better understanding

                      </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
                      jjoe said:You've got to be kidding. where'd you get this information from? That means the average number of pitches per inning is 9 and the average number of pitches per game is 81. I think it is EXTREMELY rare that a game will end with 81 pitches being thrown on average. In fact if you read this article, you'll see the average number of pitches per game is 285. Divide this number by 2 and then divide it by 27 outs and you get approximately 6 pitches per at bat. REad this: http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp...nguage=printer

                      Keep in mind that everytime a pitcher retires a batter on 1 pitch, he'd have to throw 10 pitches to the next batter to keep up with the average.

                      <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

                      Lol. Think about what you're saying before trying to ridicule me. Unless Randy Johnson pitches every game, you will see a little bit more than 27 batters a game. My info is correct. The average number of pitches per plate appearance IS 3. In fact, EVERY SINGLE PLAYER in the majors last year averaged less than 4 pitches seen per plate appearance.

                      Comment

                      • mjb2124
                        Hall Of Fame
                        • Aug 2002
                        • 13649

                        #41
                        Re: Getting past the frustration and getting a better understanding

                        </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
                        bigboi_03 said:
                        </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
                        jjoe said:You've got to be kidding. where'd you get this information from? That means the average number of pitches per inning is 9 and the average number of pitches per game is 81. I think it is EXTREMELY rare that a game will end with 81 pitches being thrown on average. In fact if you read this article, you'll see the average number of pitches per game is 285. Divide this number by 2 and then divide it by 27 outs and you get approximately 6 pitches per at bat. REad this: http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp...nguage=printer

                        Keep in mind that everytime a pitcher retires a batter on 1 pitch, he'd have to throw 10 pitches to the next batter to keep up with the average.

                        <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

                        Lol. Think about what you're saying before trying to ridicule me. Unless Randy Johnson pitches every game, you will see a little bit more than 27 batters a game. My info is correct. The average number of pitches per plate appearance IS 3. In fact, EVERY SINGLE PLAYER in the majors last year averaged less than 4 pitches seen per plate appearance.

                        <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

                        Actually it's 4, but close enough. Better hitters see 4.08 P/PA and lesser hitters see 3.45. 3.45 is relevant to a guy like Randall Simon who hasn't seen a pitch he doesn't like....

                        Link

                        Comment

                        • mjb2124
                          Hall Of Fame
                          • Aug 2002
                          • 13649

                          #42
                          Re: Getting past the frustration and getting a better understanding

                          </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
                          bigboi_03 said:
                          </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
                          jjoe said:You've got to be kidding. where'd you get this information from? That means the average number of pitches per inning is 9 and the average number of pitches per game is 81. I think it is EXTREMELY rare that a game will end with 81 pitches being thrown on average. In fact if you read this article, you'll see the average number of pitches per game is 285. Divide this number by 2 and then divide it by 27 outs and you get approximately 6 pitches per at bat. REad this: http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp...nguage=printer

                          Keep in mind that everytime a pitcher retires a batter on 1 pitch, he'd have to throw 10 pitches to the next batter to keep up with the average.

                          <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

                          Lol. Think about what you're saying before trying to ridicule me. Unless Randy Johnson pitches every game, you will see a little bit more than 27 batters a game. My info is correct. The average number of pitches per plate appearance IS 3. In fact, EVERY SINGLE PLAYER in the majors last year averaged less than 4 pitches seen per plate appearance.

                          <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

                          Actually it's 4, but close enough. Better hitters see 4.08 P/PA and lesser hitters see 3.45. 3.45 is relevant to a guy like Randall Simon who hasn't seen a pitch he doesn't like....

                          Link

                          Comment

                          • mjb2124
                            Hall Of Fame
                            • Aug 2002
                            • 13649

                            #43
                            Re: Getting past the frustration and getting a better understanding

                            </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
                            bigboi_03 said:
                            </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
                            jjoe said:You've got to be kidding. where'd you get this information from? That means the average number of pitches per inning is 9 and the average number of pitches per game is 81. I think it is EXTREMELY rare that a game will end with 81 pitches being thrown on average. In fact if you read this article, you'll see the average number of pitches per game is 285. Divide this number by 2 and then divide it by 27 outs and you get approximately 6 pitches per at bat. REad this: http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp...nguage=printer

                            Keep in mind that everytime a pitcher retires a batter on 1 pitch, he'd have to throw 10 pitches to the next batter to keep up with the average.

                            <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

                            Lol. Think about what you're saying before trying to ridicule me. Unless Randy Johnson pitches every game, you will see a little bit more than 27 batters a game. My info is correct. The average number of pitches per plate appearance IS 3. In fact, EVERY SINGLE PLAYER in the majors last year averaged less than 4 pitches seen per plate appearance.

                            <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

                            Actually it's 4, but close enough. Better hitters see 4.08 P/PA and lesser hitters see 3.45. 3.45 is relevant to a guy like Randall Simon who hasn't seen a pitch he doesn't like....

                            Link

                            Comment

                            • jjoe
                              Pro
                              • Feb 2003
                              • 880

                              #44
                              Re: Getting past the frustration and getting a better understanding

                              </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
                              bigboi_03 said:
                              </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
                              jjoe said:You've got to be kidding. where'd you get this information from? That means the average number of pitches per inning is 9 and the average number of pitches per game is 81. I think it is EXTREMELY rare that a game will end with 81 pitches being thrown on average. In fact if you read this article, you'll see the average number of pitches per game is 285. Divide this number by 2 and then divide it by 27 outs and you get approximately 6 pitches per at bat. REad this: http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp...nguage=printer

                              Keep in mind that everytime a pitcher retires a batter on 1 pitch, he'd have to throw 10 pitches to the next batter to keep up with the average.

                              <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

                              Lol. Think about what you're saying before trying to ridicule me. Unless Randy Johnson pitches every game, you will see a little bit more than 27 batters a game. My info is correct. The average number of pitches per plate appearance IS 3. In fact, EVERY SINGLE PLAYER in the majors last year averaged less than 4 pitches seen per plate appearance.

                              <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

                              I wasn't trying to ridicule you. My mistake in calculation (math is not my strongpoint). Nevertheless, even at 4 pitches per at bat, everytime you retire a hitter on 1 or 2 pitches, you have to make up for it with 8-9 pitches on the next hitter to make the average. All I'm saying is that without a good number of foul balls, you can't get this. But I wasn't trying to ridicule you at all.

                              Comment

                              • jjoe
                                Pro
                                • Feb 2003
                                • 880

                                #45
                                Re: Getting past the frustration and getting a better understanding

                                </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
                                bigboi_03 said:
                                </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
                                jjoe said:You've got to be kidding. where'd you get this information from? That means the average number of pitches per inning is 9 and the average number of pitches per game is 81. I think it is EXTREMELY rare that a game will end with 81 pitches being thrown on average. In fact if you read this article, you'll see the average number of pitches per game is 285. Divide this number by 2 and then divide it by 27 outs and you get approximately 6 pitches per at bat. REad this: http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp...nguage=printer

                                Keep in mind that everytime a pitcher retires a batter on 1 pitch, he'd have to throw 10 pitches to the next batter to keep up with the average.

                                <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

                                Lol. Think about what you're saying before trying to ridicule me. Unless Randy Johnson pitches every game, you will see a little bit more than 27 batters a game. My info is correct. The average number of pitches per plate appearance IS 3. In fact, EVERY SINGLE PLAYER in the majors last year averaged less than 4 pitches seen per plate appearance.

                                <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

                                I wasn't trying to ridicule you. My mistake in calculation (math is not my strongpoint). Nevertheless, even at 4 pitches per at bat, everytime you retire a hitter on 1 or 2 pitches, you have to make up for it with 8-9 pitches on the next hitter to make the average. All I'm saying is that without a good number of foul balls, you can't get this. But I wasn't trying to ridicule you at all.

                                Comment

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